Thread: FWORDS

When I first came to this site I thought it was going to be a place to settle in. A place where I could meet up with intelligent people with like interests, have fun, talk about science, religion, and politics. In my short stay here I have to say I began to like some of the people here a lot.

Today I was shocked to see the fword popping up and I find it offensive. I have always viewed those people who use the fword in normal conversations as low lifes and I was visibly upset at profahmfaw for using it. This was a person who I especially respected for his passionate views but no more.

I need to know if this language is accepted here. If it is, fine, I will respect your decision and will find another board to go to....

Bettina

That's overreacting a bit, now. However swearing isn't generally acceptable on the forums. The problem is there are no active moderators or admins to do jack about it. At best you can report it to a few of them and *HOPE* it gets settled. -.-

However you can e-mail some of them. They tend to get at it faster if you mention the forum via e-mail.

I absolutely agree with you Bettina, it spoils the ambience of the forum and those that use it are just showing themselves for what they are, what has happened to the moderators anyway???

I have no idea. I think they went south for the winter.

Originally Posted by Bettina

When I first came to this site I thought it was going to be a place to settle in. A place where I could meet up with intelligent people with like interests, have fun, talk about science, religion, and politics. In my short stay here I have to say I began to like some of the people here a lot.

Today I was shocked to see the fword popping up and I find it offensive. I have always viewed those people who use the fword in normal conversations as low lifes and I was visibly upset at profahmfaw for using it. This was a person who I especially respected for his passionate views but no more.

I need to know if this language is accepted here. If it is, fine, I will respect your decision and will find another board to go to....

Bettina

I've seen some mods about, does Islam forbid women to read Fwords then?
Its funny how you respected someone who advocates repression to women and hatred towards differences , but only when he used the fword was he "a lowlife".

Bettina, hopefully you'll stick with us. Its nice to have the female point of view on these posts and the fact a female view also tends to neutralise some of the testosterone thats flying about.

I dont think ive personally used the fword, but if i have then i apologise and will refrane from the future

I personally have no problem with swearing(as a rule) but can respect that its not necessary on this forum

hopefully you'll decide to stay and hopefully the fword will cease :-D

Originally Posted by captaincaveman

Bettina, hopefully you'll stick with us. Its nice to have the female point of view on these posts and the fact a female view also tends to neutralise some of the testosterone thats flying about.

Yeah its nice to have some pretty aswell in these hirsute, sweat ridden halls.

Guys being moderator is hard work. We've had many spam-attacks allready, and every day tons of junk have to be removed. So we have to set priorities. My priority is to prevent pseudoscience, nonsense and do-my-homework threads from crowding out the quality discussions. That's a lot of work, and I really appreciate members who assist by sending a pm when they spot something. So I hereby urge everyone to just pm a moderator when they see something that seems unacceptable, it's impossible for us to find everything ourselves.

Now about the use of swear words. It is my personal opinion that words like 'fuck' and 'shit' are not nearly as damaging as ad-hominem attacks or nonsense. So it's not my first priority. Other moderators may have a different opinion, and they may focus more on it.
So again: send us pm's when something is really bothering you. I come from a country in which swear words can freely be used on television, so it's not a natural thing for me to see them as problematic. I'll start a poll about this, to see what the general opinion is.

Hmmm...touche.

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

I've seen some mods about, does Islam forbid women to read Fwords then?
Its funny how you respected someone who advocates repression to women and hatred towards differences , but only when he used the fword was he "a lowlife".

You don't know me very well. I only respected him in the sense of how he respected me... which he did. As a person, I think he is ok, but his religion is evil. He just doesn't see it like I do as I mentioned in another thread.

The outcome of the poll about the Fword is favoring using it so I won't be here much longer. I view fwords with low class and thats what I would apply to this forum.

Your Ok with me, so if I don't see you again, have a good life...

Bettina

Originally Posted by Bettina

The outcome of the poll about the Fword is favoring using it so I won't be here much longer. I view fwords with low class and thats what I would apply to this forum.

TBH, I think you're being a bit petty.

I'm an engineer (or so I'd like to think) and as such deal with people working in a shop floor environment with heavy machine tools and such.
A lot of banter and joking goes on and involved with this is a lot of swearing.
It's just something you get used to.

Now I'm not generalising and saying that all shop floor environments like this one will be the same (though I bet they are! :wink: ) but I'm sure lots of other working environments will be similar.

What would you do then? Refuse to talk to anyone?

Perhaps when you leave school and enter the wonderful world of work you'll feel slightly differently and not let it bother you so much.
Just because people throw the odd swear word around, it doesn't mean they're a bad person.

Edit:- Someone has just explained a problem to me and used 'the f word' 3 times in 2 sentences.

Well, I'm a bit surprised by this. I've never met someone who is so allergic to swear words. Well one of my aunts is deeply religious, and she wouldnt like to hear it. But she wouldn't walk away if I used one. But maybe these things are different in the US.

I have to agree, pen. This is a tad extreme. And no, they're fairly lenient in the USA. Especially in certain occupations like carpenters, engineers, etc. even moreso in jobs where physical pain is part of the job (nothing says "AAAAAGGGHHHHH! like slipping with a wrench and slicing off a chunk of skin)

Bettina,

Swearing seems to be as much a part of language as any other words these days, if you are unhappy with those who use profanities excessively why not add them to your ignore list?

It'd be sad to see you go....

However you can e-mail some of them. They tend to get at it faster if you mention the forum via e-mail.

I'm always available through e-mail and will deal with the matter asap.

As for swearing words, if someone calls you names - email me, and I'll see what can be done. However, someone using 'fuck' by itself is not an offense. It might be in bad taste, which is often accomponied by offenses that ARE against the rules, but people are free to use what language they want to convey a message.

It is the message that we mainly look at and that we moderate. This is a science forum, not Stormfront.

Mr U

Swearing as a spur of the moment thing we can all accept, but why commit it to writing what point are you trying to make???,
Spoken and written language is different, do you swear at home ?? To your Wife?? To your children?? When you apply for a job??
you can use #%**+ then we can insert our own words.

Originally Posted by Bettina

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

I've seen some mods about, does Islam forbid women to read Fwords then?
Its funny how you respected someone who advocates repression to women and hatred towards differences , but only when he used the fword was he "a lowlife".

You don't know me very well. I only respected him in the sense of how he respected me... which he did. As a person, I think he is ok, but his religion is evil. He just doesn't see it like I do as I mentioned in another thread.

The outcome of the poll about the Fword is favoring using it so I won't be here much longer. I view fwords with low class and thats what I would apply to this forum.

Your Ok with me, so if I don't see you again, have a good life...

Bettina

Lame thread.

No.
Wait.
Fucking lame thread.

Originally Posted by Megabrain

Bettina,

Swearing seems to be as much a part of language as any other words these days, if you are unhappy with those who use profanities excessively why not add them to your ignore list?

It'd be sad to see you go....

Megabrain, I never gave the ignore list a thought and although its against my nature, I will give it a try. I'm 18, have no mother, and live with my dad who I love very much. I'm not a prude, but I grew up with him and he taught me a set of principles I live by. I won't change them to satisfy a few lowlifes. I may be an atheist, but I live a very christian life.

I know the difference between someone who used it in anger and those like invert_nexus who said it to....well make himself big. I just hope that since the administrator has allowed it that it won't get out of hand because my ignore list will begin to grow and I may reconsider my stay.

There are great people here that I learned a lot from and it would only hurt me if I left. So, I will try it and use the ignore feature.

So far Nexus is my first.

Thanks for the tip.....

Bettina

Yay!

Wait.

Fuckin' yay!!

Seriously.
Incredibly lame.

Anyway.
Welcome to the bragging about who's on your ignore list set. Very exclusive bunch.
Bravo.

Now now now, be a good lowlife now.

Personally, I view the heads in the sand folk as lowlifes. They also tend to be the people who just love the emperor's new clothes. In fact, many rush out to get themselves garbed in the wonderful fashion of the emperor.

I also don't like people who judge others on superficial and irrelevant criteria.

But, that's just me.
Don't mind me. Just one lowlife's opinion.

Wait.
Fucking opinion.

I quite agree. I grew up swearing in about every sentence. Some of us arent lucky enough to go to eton so the habitual swearing is hard to shake off.

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Now now now, be a good lowlife now.

The ignore feature is Kool and it works!! I see his name but nothing else so I think this may work out for me.

Imaplanck..... I like that signature you have. I love Einsteins works and read as much as I can about him.

Bee

I wonder if Einstein ever said fuck?
Do you think he had a porn collection?

Originally Posted by invert_nexus

I wonder if Einstein ever said fuck?
Do you think he had a porn collection?

He sometimes had 7 girlfriends at one time. He didn't *NEED* a porn collection.

Originally Posted by Bettina

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Now now now, be a good lowlife now.

The ignore feature is Kool and it works!! I see his name but nothing else so I think this may work out for me.

Imaplanck..... I like that signature you have. I love Einsteins works and read as much as I can about him.

Bee

Thanksees. Do you understand relativity?

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Originally Posted by Bettina

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Now now now, be a good lowlife now.

The ignore feature is Kool and it works!! I see his name but nothing else so I think this may work out for me.

Imaplanck..... I like that signature you have. I love Einsteins works and read as much as I can about him.

Bee

Thanksees. Do you understand relativity?

I read enought about it to feel comfortable. I have read "The fabric of the cosmos" and am reading "the elegant universe". I have read "warped passages" too plus many others.

I see nexus got through to me with his quote from Jerhemy. Hopefully I can get around that too...

Bee

Originally Posted by Bettina

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Originally Posted by Bettina

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Now now now, be a good lowlife now.

The ignore feature is Kool and it works!! I see his name but nothing else so I think this may work out for me.

Imaplanck..... I like that signature you have. I love Einsteins works and read as much as I can about him.

Bee

Thanksees. Do you understand relativity?

I read enought about it to feel comfortable. I have read "The fabric of the cosmos" and am reading "the elegant universe". I have read "warped passages" too plus many others.

I see nexus got through to me with his quote from Jerhemy. Hopefully I can get around that too...

Bee

Cool, so youre versed with general then.

I wouldnt let people get to you , they cant toy with you if you dont acknowledge.

I see nexus got through to me with his quote from Jerhemy. Hopefully I can get around that too...

I am insidious.
"There is no escaping here." (Quote from an anonymous lowlife on a mass-murder spree.)

Wait.
Fucking insidious...

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Cool, so youre versed with general then.

I wouldnt let people get to you , they cant toy with you if you dont acknowledge.

And special too... I have always been amazed at how Einstein came to the conclusions that he did and to ignore certain theorys.... One particular passage that I thought was really cool was how he wrote a letter to his friends who were looking for the aether....saying "You cannot find the aether because there is no aether" and in just that one stroke of his pen, the aether theory was gone.

I would have given anything to be in the same room with him. He was cute too when he was young. I also watch the videos here...

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/elegant/program.html

Bettina

Oh, I will take pretty much any kind of abuse and disrespect except for the fword but I will respect the rights of those to use it as long as they respect my right to immediately add them all to my ignore list. I just hope it doesn't grow to big.

I just think a science forum should be open to young kids too and they shouldn't have to be subjected to that sort of lower mentality...

So What’s next the C word ??

Why accept this lowering of standards , if you can’t control your self how can you criticise others, I don’t know how old some of you F**^#@s are but at a guess still in your teens.

Originally Posted by Bettina

Originally Posted by Imaplanck.

Cool, so youre versed with general then.

I wouldnt let people get to you , they cant toy with you if you dont acknowledge.

And special too... I have always been amazed at how Einstein came to the conclusions that he did and to ignore certain theorys.... One particular passage that I thought was really cool was how he wrote a letter to his friends who were looking for the aether....saying "You cannot find the aether because there is no aether" and in just that one stroke of his pen, the aether theory was gone.

I would have given anything to be in the same room with him. He was cute too when he was young. I also watch the videos here...



...

Impressive. I thought you were just another girl here to talk about pretty flowers and fluffy animals. JK

I dare say if I am not already on Bettina's ignore list (for occasional use of the F word) I shall be by the end of this post. I have two distinct points to make:

Point 1:
I suspect it is more hurtful (and perhaps even harmful) to comment on a post in this way:
This writing is wholly lacking in structure, grammar, direction, clarity, or obvious purpose. The absence of these characteristics, combined with a trite, juvenile, supeficial, disjointed analysis of the problem, renders the entire post as a waste of time and effort on the part of the writer, and certainly the reader. I recommend the poster take several courses in logic, writing, punctuation, spelling and English usage, before moving on to gaining a modicum of basic knowledge in the topic area that is beyond that held by intellectually challenged agricultural workers in rural France of the thirteenth century.
Than to say this:
Your writing and your theories are fucking crap.

Bettina, if the writer of the second version should be placed on Ignore, should that no also be done for the former?

Point 2:
I shall tend to use a style more akin to the former than to the latter. This tendency is revoked when I wish to convey the depth of anger/frustration/digust with a particular viewpoint. It is my hope that those familiar with my style will recognise the departure from the norm and equally recognise that it represents such strongly held feelings.

Humans are emotional creatures. The stength and passion of these emotions are, to my mind, important ingredients in our humanity. At times I can best express such emotions through the selective use of what is a word of great power, derived from my own Anglo-Saxon roots. That it has been corrupted by overuse by mental dullards will not, should not, stop me from making appropriate use of it.

Ooops, there is a Point 3:I am always going to be more upset, or movedd, or motivated, by the ideas behind the words than by the words themselves.

Ophiolite, I would like to respond to your last post [above]

Quote: I dare say if I am not already on Bettina's ignore list
Its nice to know that we can put moderators on an ignore list. LOL

Regarding your comment at the end of point 1
Quote Your writing and your theories are fucking crap.
You are being bloody minded, you could have just as easily have said
[total, complete, utter] or plain crap.

Quote Bettina, if the writer of the second version should be placed on Ignore, should that no also be done for the former?
No, you put your point of view in a civilised manner in the first version
In the second you reverted to gutter slang.

Quote I shall tend to use a style more akin to the former than to the latter. This tendency is revoked when I wish to convey the depth of anger/frustration/digust with a particular viewpoint. It is my hope that those familiar with my style will recognise the departure from the norm and equally recognise that it represents such strongly held feelings.
We all recognise your style, that is you, but you should try to control your feelings.

Quote At times I can best express such emotions through the selective use of what is a word of great power, derived from my own Anglo-Saxon roots. That it has been corrupted by overuse by mental dullards will not, should not, stop me from making appropriate use of it.
The power of the word can also cause offence, why not use the Gaelic word?,

I realise that I may be a loan voice but feel strongly against the lowering of what I consider important standards, consideration and respect of others is necessary in any community


Remember
You agree not to post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, sexually-oriented or any other material that may violate any applicable laws.

I whole heartedly agree with the flying mouse, I'd venture to suggest that as a parent if I saw my kid(s) using a forum where a blind eye was turned to profanity, I'd find them another forum, where, contributors were sufficiently educated to express themselves in more than single syllable four letter words.

Originally Posted by Megabrain

I whole heartedly agree with the flying mouse, I'd venture to suggest that as a parent if I saw my kid(s) using a forum where a blind eye was turned to profanity, I'd find them another forum, where, contributors were sufficiently educated to express themselves in more than single syllable four letter words.

That doesn't compute, seeing as you profess to not swear but are an ill educated buffoon.

You agree not to post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, sexually-oriented or any other material that may violate any applicable laws.

What is obscene is entirely up for interpretation, aye?
And what of applicable laws? Is it illegal to say fuck now?

In the second you reverted to gutter slang.

See the power of words?
The use of the term 'gutter slang' completely frees you from actually judging the content and/or use of the word. Instead, you make the snap judgement upon the mere sight of the word.
That is pure laziness.

It is also incorrect.
Do you really believe that only low-class people use the word?
Do you really believe that it is only used in the gutter?
I find the ignorance in such a belief to be incredibly contemptible.



Do you think that to maintain your high standards of communication we should also ban any use of slang?

Should all uses of 'ain't' be banned?
Lol?
What of emoticons? What of the use of the word 'smiley' to denote an emoticon?
What of emoticon itself? Fuck is surely more time-honored than emoticon.

What of poor grammar?
What of misspellings?
What of ideas that you simply don't agree with?

Should we perhaps truly show our highbrow status and converse in latin rather than the vulgar english?

Or, perhaps we should judge content on content rather than our silly and emotional biases?
Do you think this might be a good idea?


As to children, guess what? If you're trying to protect them from the use of the word fuck, then you've got problems. There's far more vulgar things in the world than profanity. Profanity is the least of our problems.

This obsession with profanity evinced by uptight Americans is nothing but funny. Except that it is also dangerous as it is often the first step towards something far more insidious.

Huck Finn has been banned from many libraries for its vulgar content, as well.
Bettina is on the road to book burnings. Fitting that she hails from the land of witch burnings.

Shunning (ignoring) was also a common practice in puritan communities.

Is it illegal to say fuck now?

That may depend on your nationality. The keyword in that sentence is illegality. If something is illegal in your country, don't do it here.

Huck Finn has been banned from many libraries for its vulgar content, as well.

What is Huck Finn?

Mr U

What is Huck Finn?

A literary classic written by one Samuel Clemens.
http://etext.virginia.edu/twain/huckfinn.html

If something is illegal in your country, don't do it here.

It's illegal in GreatBend, Kansas for women to drink coffee after 9 a.m. Would I be breaking the site rules if I posted a short story which featured a woman drinking coffee at noon. That is, assuming that I am posting from Great Bend, Kansas (which I am not.)

Ophiolite...

I tried many ways to respond to your question but I threw them all away because I just don't know what to say. What I do know is that your a moderator who should be setting an example of how a forum should be like. I have never been in a forum before that both the administrator and some moderators are in agreement that profanity is acceptable in their science forum, so I'm at a loss of what to say about that except I intend to use the ignore feature to its fullest until I'm banned. I never peek so when it asks to press here to view the ignored post... I don't. That person is gone.

I graduated high school in June and am now in my first year college. All through those years not one of my teachers used the fword when dealing with kids, bullies, and those who just didn't want to learn. Some teachers, who would finally lose their cool would put down a student by using a clever academic put down that made the student feel about a foot tall while the rest of us would snicker and be amazed at the verbal talent the teacher had. You had that at the first part of your point one.

The second part of your point one is just sub standard trash that anyone can say. Nothing clever, and some like nexus go out of their way to nail it in hard because it makes them feel more important I guess. Anyway, the day we graduated, one of my teachers talked about character and gave each of us the link I attached below and told us to use that as a guide through life. I really didn't need it because my dad already gave them to me.

I haven't put you on my ignore list....yet... because you were explaining your point of view, not like nexus who nailed his decision several times to me. I'm not a prude and people can swear some if they must, but the fword crosses the line. I came here to learn and talk about things that I am passionate about not to have to listen to gutter talk.

Just to show you that I'm not perfect either, I will tell you that I've been singing christian songs solo in two churches every Sunday for the last five years, including church outings and concerts, yet I'm a closet 100% atheist.

I respect everyones right to cuss all they want and will abide by the forums rules as long as they respect my right to ignore.

http://www.charactercounts.org/defsix.htm

Bettina

Originally Posted by Bettina

What I do know is that your a moderator who should be setting an example of how a forum should be like.

I agree completely. That is why I am arguing that what is said is more important than how it is said. You appear to be favouring the Marshal McCluhan sound bite: the medium is the message. That may be true, but if it is, then it is a sad reflection on the state of our society.

Of the two options I presented earlier the first (free from profanity) is a vicious, focused, deliberate attempt to demean and demoralise an individual. The second (with the F-word) is a gritty, direct, honest experession of an opinion, that in some contexts could even take on a jocular character. I repeat, I am disappointed that you favour looking at the form of a communication, rather than the content.

Please note that I am not speaking in favour of regular, persistent and gratuitous use of the F-word. I am speaking of deliberate selective use of said word when it is the appropriate word to use in those circumstances.

Last week I came close to being beaten up because I objected to several drunk male passengers on a commuter train using the word repeatedly and loudly in the presence of children. Such usage does fit the descriptor 'gutter language', not because of the word itself, but because of the demeanour, character and condition of the users.

Originally Posted by Bettina

so I'm at a loss of what to say about that except I intend to use the ignore feature to its fullest until I'm banned.

I can think of absolutely no reason why you should ever be banned. I followed many of your threads in the other place and have always been impressed by your honesty and sensitivity. Usually I have also been impressed by your sense of balance. It is my opinion (and yes, that means it is only an opinion) that this balance has deserted you in this matter.

Originally Posted by Bettina

I never peek so when it asks to press here to view the ignored post... I don't. That person is gone.
..................... yet I'm a closet 100% atheist.

In combination I guess this means you don't believe in redemption then.

Originally Posted by Bettina

I'm not a prude and people can swear some if they must, but the fword crosses the line. I came here to learn and talk about things that I am passionate about not to have to listen to gutter talk.

I return, for the third time, to my concern that you are focusing on the form and not the content.
I am vastly more concerned by, for example, the persistent, continuous disregard for proper spelling, typing and grammar displayed by some native English speakers. Not only does this make understanding their posts difficult it is, to my mind, far ruder and disrespectful to the audience than a very occasional well targeted cuss word.

I don't believe I have seen Invert Nexus, on this or any other forum, use the F-word before. As far as I can see he is using it here to make a point. You may not agree with that point, but I think you are losing more than you are gaining by placing him on ignore. That, obviously, is your decision. If we all felt exactly the same way on every topic there would be nothing to discuss.

Regards,
Ophiolite

Invert_nexus,

I am not sure that Bettina is likely to become a book burner, probably like me, the use of profanity in a forum is simply not to her taste, if I turn on the radio and they are playing a style of music not to my taste I will re-tune, this does not mean I'd like to see it banned, it means it is not to my taste, same with profanities in a science forum.

If a post is described as "f*****g s**t" then I say it is neither brown smelly biological waste nor does it fornicate. If it is described as "ill thought out nonsense" or "rubbish" then fine. In ophiolite's first response it seems to me he did not need to sprinkle his post with profanities to get his point across, his sprinkling of profanities was, in my opinion gratuitous.

As for the kids, I am well aware that they are exposed to swear words, I simply choose not to expose them to it as far as I have control.

Where posts contain [in my opinion] unnecessary profanities I generally choose not to reply to that particular post (and very often, not even read it) - in the same way as I have said above I would not listen to particular types of music. Where a poster decides to insult, and continues to do so, I add them to my ignore list, something that is only done where that person does not contribute anything to a thread, other than insults.

Finally [and this is an opinion I hold] the use of ad-hom/insults or profanities suggests to me that the author has lost the argument, just as the first guy to throw the punch has.

Edit:

And yes, I myself can be eloquently profane - but only where it's appropriate, and certainly not in any puplic place - including the internet.
As for the authors of post's I might think of a suitable descriptive but it goes no further than my mind.

I don't believe I have seen Invert Nexus, on this or any other forum, use the F-word before.

Actually, I say it quite often. I have no fear of words. In fact, I rather think that every word should be used as far as it is useful. 'Fuck' is a useful word in many cases.

Although, I definitely tend to use it more when people speak against it or make idiotic judgement of people based on such lazy criteria as the use of a single word.

Or when I give up on a person altogether.
I've recently decided to limit my conversations with a certain Valich to calling him a fucking retard, for instance. He's at last proven himself to be a dishonest little creep and I've given up on him entirely.
A polite man might just walk away, but I prefer to piss on the little bastard as he deserves.

I am not sure that Bettina is likely to become a book burner, probably like me,

And you don't seem to understand the power you instill in the word by your policy of ignoring and/or marginalizing any who utter the word in whatever context it may be uttered.

The word 'fuck' is not an indicator of anything. It is simply a symbol like any other. It is available for use, and it has its place in our language.

To deny the usefulness of a word, to deny the morality of a word, to proclaim the evil nature of a word.
Is the first step to book burning.

Just because you are too short-sighted to recognize the end result of your puritanical proclamations, don't think that all people are so rabbit-like.

If a post is described as "f*****g s**t" then I say it is neither brown smelly biological waste nor does it fornicate.

Then you'd show yourself to be an idiot and would purposefully subject your language to translation errors and category changes.

The word 'fuck' does not solely relate to 'fornication'.
You do realize this, don't you?
Do you realize how asinine your translation would be?

In ophiolite's first response it seems to me he did not need to sprinkle his post with profanities to get his point across, his sprinkling of profanities was, in my opinion gratuitous.

Are you referring to the ad hom? The ad hom that is free of profanity? The ad hom which was freely admitted by Ophiolite to be both an ad hom and not nice?
Is that the post you're referring to?
So, you have no problem with ad homs, just profanity.

Do you think you're lazy? I think you are.

Finally [and this is an opinion I hold] the use of ad-hom/insults or profanities suggests to me that the author has lost the argument, just as the first guy to throw the punch has.

Then shouldn't you equate Ophiolite's first statement with his second? As one is ad hom and the other is profanity?

But you don't.

So. You are lying.
You probably don't even realize it.
Your bias prevents you from perceiving reality in a balanced manner.
This is a natural human tendency. Making judgements is a difficult thing to do and is expensive as far as metabolism goes. It is far more cost-effective to posit certain criteria which free the individual from the need to constantly weigh pro's and con's of each situation he comes across.
In this quest, even improper criteria are placed on the scales. These improper criteria are still cost-effective, because even though they cause you to make wrong choices, they still speed up the decision making process.
In a world where nutrients and time is a scarcity. Where resources are something to fight for. Then perhaps we can forgive such improper criteria and biases.

However. Don't you think our civilization has risen above such animal-like behavior?

Fucking animal-like behavior?

And you do realize that I'm not talking about fornication, yes?


As to your point about ad-hom/profanity indicating a surrender to the debate, it could actually indicate many things. Surrender is one of them. But only one.

You've just stated, beyond a doubt, the nature of your laziness.

Keep your shirt on, I said, as with music, if it is not to my taste I'll find something else, that's what we ALL do.

I have nothing against anybody using as many four letter single syllable words as they like, I am not campaigning to get it barred. Perhaps if I may speak in your own launguage It is simply not my fucking style.

Also if a post is really badly worded, full of ad-homs, nosensensical - or (again to borrow a word from your dictionary) crap I will probably also ignore it.

Hell, life's too short to read all the shite in this or any other forum, so I filter it, I choose to filter out post's as described above. Now I'll leave you to have the last (four-letter) word. :wink:

Excellent response.
You would perhaps have done better to merely say, "Fucking shit! I bet you have really hairy balls!"

What you did do was not address anything I mentioned.
It's ok though, I forgive you.
I hope you've learned your lessons on the bestial nature of the instillation and worship of irrelevant criteria.

again to borrow a word from your dictionary) crap

I wonder if you realize that this is a poorly-veiled ad hom?
You seek to marginalize and label me as an idiot, not for my argument (which you never touched) but rather because of a word.
A word which I never used, by the way.

Here. I'll do the same to you.

You are, to use a word from your dictionary, a nigger.

Better?


(However. Oddly enough. Crap is in my dictionary. It's also in Websters. And any other dictionary you can think of. http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=crap )

You are, to use a word from your dictionary, a nigger.

Hmm.
On second thought, this is not truly analogous to your ad hom.
Far too direct and to the point.
Let me try again.

Your treatment of me is worse than how you'd treat, to use a term from your dictionary, a nigger.

There. That's better.


Speaking of 'crap', did you know that the word derives from the name of the man who invented the first flush toilet?

Interesting how your 'distaste for certain kinds of music' leads directly to the assigning of use of a person's name as a sign of inferiority.

As I have said, irrelevant criteria. I do hope that someday you rise above your bestial nature. Mankind is free to choose rather than simply act on instinct.
Yes. It is a taxing proposition, this constant judgement of one's environment. But it is rather worthwhile. I hope that you someday experience the rewards of such a path. Humanity awaits you.

Originally Posted by invert_nexus

You seek to marginalize and label me as an idiot,

Bollocks.

Originally Posted by invert_nexus

Speaking of 'crap', did you know that the word derives from the name of the man who invented the first flush toilet?

Wrong, it has F'All to do with THomas Crapper - that IS a myth.

Hmm:

"Despite urban legend, Crapper did not invent the flush toilet (the myth being helped by the surname). However, Crapper put in much effort to popularise it and did come up with some related inventions. He was noted for the quality of his products and received several Royal Warrants. The noun "crap" was in use long before he was born."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Crapper

Well.
I stand corrected, although wikipedia is hardly a definitive source.

It's rather ironic that Crapper would enter the field he entered then, considering the amount of shit he must have gotten from his peers as a youth (and older).

Bollocks.

Perhaps not an idiot, per se, but definitely something inferior to one in who's dictionary the word 'crap' is not to be found.

Originally Posted by invert_nexus

I don't believe I have seen Invert Nexus, on this or any other forum, use the F-word before.

Actually, I say it quite often. I have no fear of words. In fact, I rather think that every word should be used as far as it is useful. 'Fuck' is a useful word in many cases..

The Pen is might……………………etc.

You say it quite regularly?? Then I am glad that you are not in my company. Can you not find a word that is just as useful?? Do you use the C word just as frequently and is it just as useful??.
It really comes down to how you were brought up, the company that you keep and your own personal standards and where you set them.

Do you use the C word just as frequently and is it just as useful??.

Copraphagia?
Absolutely!

As I've said, I simply prefer to judge based on relevant issues rather than silly emotional biases.
As you say, it's all how you're raised I guess.

The Pen is might……………………etc.

I fail to see how this is relevant.
The Pen is used to write the word fuck just as it is used to not write the word fuck.
The sword is not an issue in either case.

Perhaps you're a touch confused?



Hmm.

Death sucks, dont die

Do you believe that the word 'sucks' is adequate here? Isn't this a touch of gutter slang on your part?
Shame shame.

Maybe the oops I swore ing mods should add a oops I sworeing filter, because they are so up their oops I sworeing oops I sworees!

Originally Posted by Ophiolite

I repeat, I am disappointed that you favour looking at the form of a communication, rather than the content.

No, I don't but I can see where you arrived at that because I'm very much an empathic person by nature meaning that I can become as exited, upset, or even sick depending on what I'm reading. I can feel the emotion that a writer puts into a response so yes, the form of communication matters a great deal because thats what makes the content of the post worth reading. An example is the monotone teacher. No matter how smart he is, his content can either put you to sleep or keep you highly interested depending on how he communicates it.

Please note that I am not speaking in favour of regular, persistent and gratuitous use of the F-word. I am speaking of deliberate selective use of said word when it is the appropriate word to use in those circumstances.

That word is never appropriate in a forum. Go to an open air lecture, look at the online lectures on Nova from intelligent people. Not once do you hear it.

Last week I came close to being beaten up because I objected to several drunk male passengers on a commuter train using the word repeatedly and loudly in the presence of children. Such usage does fit the descriptor 'gutter language', not because of the word itself, but because of the demeanour, character and condition of the users.

That tells me you have character. The fword being said in front of young people bothered you. It makes no difference if they were low lifes or businessmen in suits. Something tells me if you were built like arnold shwartzenegger neither of the types mentioned would have been left standing. :wink:

Originally Posted by Bettina

I never peek so when it asks to press here to view the ignored post... I don't. That person is gone.
..................... yet I'm a closet 100% atheist.

In combination I guess this means you don't believe in redemption then.

Sometimes I do. Sometime someone will lose their cool, apologize, and thats that. No problem with me at all.

Originally Posted by Bettina

I'm not a prude and people can swear some if they must, but the fword crosses the line. I came here to learn and talk about things that I am passionate about not to have to listen to gutter talk.

I return, for the third time, to my concern that you are focusing on the form and not the content.
I am vastly more concerned by, for example, the persistent, continuous disregard for proper spelling, typing and grammar displayed by some native English speakers. Not only does this make understanding their posts difficult it is, to my mind, far ruder and disrespectful to the audience than a very occasional well targeted cuss word.

I rather see ten missspellllings than one fword. Just my own opinion

I don't believe I have seen Invert Nexus, on this or any other forum, use the F-word before. As far as I can see he is using it here to make a point. You may not agree with that point, but I think you are losing more than you are gaining by placing him on ignore.

I felt him much differently than you did and wish him no ill will. I just prefer to keep my distance.

Looking forward to learning things from you.

Bettina

You are so sweet and innocent Bettina. No disrespect, but have you ever heard of the real world?

In case you dont know the real world is where kids swear at 7 know more about sex than their parents and show them how to surf the internet.

Pshaw.
That only happens to lowlife scum. They should all be euthanized for their own benefit.
Sterilized at the very least.
Use of the word fuck should result in immediate sterilization.
The logic is inescapable.


Hmm.
I wonder.
Since I'm on Bettina's ignore list and everything. Can I say incredibly profane and hurtful things to her and not get banned?
Not that I want to or am planning to. But, just curious.

After all, I wouldn't be saying them to her since she doesn't peek...

You lowlife scum you.


I dont think she's very happy with any of us at the momento.

I respect her principles though. I hope she doesnt leave for good.

invert_nexus
Your reply to my post confirms what I said, your verbal litany changes not one thing, you are grasping at straws, thank you.

If you say so, personally, I'll still continue to judge on merit rather than silly emotional bias. But to each his own. I can't help it if you like being lazy.

your verbal litany changes not one thing

Nor does your failure to address a simple point.
Emotional bias is a strong thing.
I find it sad how people are unable to escape their preconceptions.



Just for shits and giggles:

You say it quite regularly??

I never said that. I said 'quite often'. There is a difference.
You did know that different words apply different shades of meaning, yes?
That's why we have such a superfluity of words.

Then I am glad that you are not in my company.

Such a gentle soul, are you?

Can you not find a word that is just as useful??

Why should I?
I can find many words that are useful. Each in their own context. Sometimes I'll use one word, sometimes I'll use another.
This is how language works.

Do you use the C word just as frequently and is it just as useful??.

I use a large number of C words.
Honestly, I can't imagine what word you're referring to.
I assume you mean some type of profanity, so that limits my guessing.

Cock?
Cunt?
Crap?

How about racist terms?

Coolie?
Coon?

Are there others?
I'm sure there are.

And, yes, I've used them all at one time or another.

It really comes down to how you were brought up, the company that you keep and your own personal standards and where you set them.

And back to my 'verbal litany'.
Why do you feel that the use of a word is relevant criteria as opposed to actually interpreting the content of the message?
I think this is pure laziness.

Just like walking past a third grade playground this, "oh look I can swear" says one "Yeah I'm up to four letters as well" - replies another. When you go for a job interview would you swear every second word? - well that's probably why you've got the time to spend all day on a forum.

Originally Posted by Megabrain

Just like walking past a third grade playground this, "oh look I can swear" says one "Yeah I'm up to four letters as well" - replies another. When you go for a job interview would you swear every second word? - well that's probably why you've got the time to spend all day on a forum.

edited for sexual orientation reference. Also to be considered along the lines of flaming. It's against the rules to make racist, sexual, etc, comments towards another. -jeremyhfht

Plank,

Whatever it is you post I see only this:-

You have added this person to your Ignore List. Click HERE to view this post.

I do not 'click here'

Megabrain
If you add some one to an ignore list are they made aware of this??
They should be or it really does not send the message.

invert_nexus
You are rambling again, so many words, so little meaning!!
What is acceptable in your circles, is not acceptable in mine, and I wonder if you use this language to your Wife, Children and all those that you respect and love?? Simple consideration of others is not hard.

From you postings on this subject you seem have a propensity for this type of language so it is pointless trying to reason with you.

You are rambling again, so many words, so little meaning!!

Sad.
You have nothing to say, eh?
What an empty wind blows from your quarters.

"Naughty words are bad," declares the flying mouse, "This I decree and I shall hear no more. All who speak against me shall be soundly ignored and insulted."

Why even bother posting if you have nothing to say?
Just to pipe in your zero cents?

Or course, I shouldn't be surprised you have nothing substantive to add to the discussion. After all, you only have a silly emotional bias.


And, if you think that's a lot of words? You've got problems.
But, that's obvious, I suppose.

From you postings on this subject you seem have a propensity for this type of language so it is pointless trying to reason with you.

Once again you make a serious category mistake. You're quite the intellectual slob.
A mouse indeed.

If you add some one to an ignore list are they made aware of this??

Why should you care?
Sounds petty to me.
And that doesn't surprise...

Steady on, invert, calm down, take deep breaths!!

Still nothing to say then?

Exactly.
Just a silly emotional bias.
And a typical emotional ploy as the sole means of response.
Very unsurprising, Maus.

*sneers*

Originally Posted by invert_nexus

Still nothing to say then?

Exactly.
Just a silly emotional bias.
And a typical emotional ploy as the sole means of response.
Very unsurprising, Maus.

*sneers*

I have said all that I need to say, I am not going to repeat myself time after time just to give you something to fill your spare time with, but I did notice that you did not say whether you use these words to your Wife, children or loved ones ??,

Why should I give a response to any of your posts when you have ignored all mine?

Anyway. Face it. You've failed to respond, because you simply have no response. Irrational emotional biases are not based in objective reality. They are arbitrary and stubborn. Although, I am sure you could squeeze out some convoluted rationalizations should you find yourself put on the spot. In truth, I was hoping to squeeze such a rationalization out of you. You have done well to avoid answering me. That is, you have prevented yourself from looking foolish in this regard. Still, six of one. Half a dozen of another. Foolishness is difficult to avoid when all you have is emotional bias.

I hope someday you move beyond your emotional bias. Nothing worse than a lazy intellect.


By the way:

...something to fill your spare time with

Interesting passive aggressive jab.
Nothing but ad hom, are you?
Heh.
Funny stuff.

Originally Posted by Megabrain

Plank,

Whatever it is you post I see only this:-

You have added this person to your Ignore List. Click HERE to view this post.

I do not 'click here'

Its actually Planck, as in Maxwell Plank.


Megan,

It was an item befitting of your emotional response basis , but the overexcited new mod(with a grudge) chose to remove it.

It was just a picture of a handbag.

Originally Posted by Die Fledermaus

Regarding your comment at the end of point 1
Quote Your writing and your theories are fucking crap.
You are being bloody minded, you could have just as easily have said
[total, complete, utter] or plain crap.

First, et me very clear on apoint that I suspect at least one reader has misunderstood. Earlier I gave two alternative reactions to a hypothetical situation. One belligerent and cruel. The other direct and containing the F word. Neither of these posts related to the opening post or to any susbsequent posts in this thread.

So, to address your point: I could not simply have said total, complete, utter instead of the F-word. In that hypothetical sistuation the depth of my passion on the subject could only be adequately conveyed with the F-word. At last count I had a vocabulary of some sixty thousand words, which is somewaht above the average. The F-word is one of them. I do wish you would trust me that when I use this word, it is precisely because none of the other fifty nine thousands nine hundred and ninety nine carry the sense which I wish to communicate.

Originally Posted by Die Fledermaus

Quote Bettina, if the writer of the second version should be placed on Ignore, should that no also be done for the former? No, you put your point of view in a civilised manner in the first version
In the second you reverted to gutter slang.

As I have already pointed out to Bettina in the first I pursued an aggressive, angry, disrespectful, high handed, patronising attack on an individual, designed to humiliate and denigrate them.
In the second I was robust and direct, but did not attack the inidividual.

Since I write much as a method actor acts, with the emotion of the topic alive in my breast, I can tell you that the first of these contains vitriol and hatred and intense disrespect for the individual so attacked. The second, which you decry as being gutter language, is more of an amused exclamation of 'bollocks'.

Originally Posted by Die Fledermaus

We all recognise your style, that is you, but you should try to control your feelings.
.

My feelings are always under control. I may allow them to rampage a little, as described above, when I write a post, but I never post it until I have returned to balance and inner peace. Many of my posts are consigned to the wastebasket because I judged them too emotional too cruel, or too profane.

Originally Posted by Die Fledermaus

I realise that I may be a loan voice but feel strongly against the lowering of what I consider important standards, consideration and respect of others is necessary in any community

Which point I completely agree with. Where we disagree is that I focus on what is said (and meant). You appear to wish to focus on how it is said. These two different perspectives liklely produce irreconcilable differences.
Regards
Ophiolite

Originally Posted by Die Fledermaus

Megabrain
If you add some one to an ignore list are they made aware of this??
They should be or it really does not send the message.

Not sure but the last post I write in reply to any craphead or person I choose to ignore is "welcome to my ignore list"

Originally Posted by Die Fledermaus

Megabrain
If you add some one to an ignore list are they made aware of this??
They should be or it really does not send the message.

Hem, the Ignore function is to spare a poster from words and ideas they find too offensive or disturbing to be borne, such as 'your' instead of 'you're', or defenses of censorship.

If you wish to send a message to someone, you can post it.


[Aside]
And why are people using 'F-word'?
Is it B-word we are all too A-word of C-word to T-word like F-word'ing A-words now?
[/Aside]

Originally Posted by Megabrain

Originally Posted by Die Fledermaus

Megabrain
If you add some one to an ignore list are they made aware of this??
They should be or it really does not send the message.

Not sure but the last post I write in reply to any craphead or person I choose to ignore is "welcome to my ignore list"

Another suggestion, but only if it is ok by forum rules, is to list the people who you are ignoring in your signature. That way they know they are invisible to you.

Bee