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Thread: How do atheists get married?

  1. #101  
    Malignant Pimple shlunka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexG View Post
    Mistakenly?

    Married for 25, divorced for 10. The latter has been better than the former.
    You married 25 women, but only divorced with 10 of them?
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  2. #102  
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    And I'm not even Mormon.
    Its the way nature is!
    If you dont like it, go somewhere else....
    To another universe, where the rules are simpler
    Philosophically more pleasing, more psychologically easy
    Prof Richard Feynman (1979) .....

    Das ist nicht nur nicht richtig, es ist nicht einmal falsch!"
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  3. #103  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zunc View Post
    People will not change their mind because you think they are wrong.

    Telling someone that what they think is stupid is not going to get you anywhere. It is counterproductive.

    Discussing your views, without being IN THEIR FACE, might be much more condusive for them to listen and think about what you said.

    Frankly, your approach, would not convince me, or make me listen. It would leave me cold and uninterested.

    Diplomacy is a wisely learned approach in most aspects of life.
    I think you misunderstand me. I don't mean telling people to their face that what they believe is stupid. That would be to argue with the intention to offend / insult them. But I think that it's important to argue in a civilized manner with factual arguments against opinions that you concider as stupid and making the one you argue with realize that the belief is stupid with evidence. And not letting it go because you are afraid of offending them. For example creationists that teach their children that dinosaurs and humans lived together and that denies evolution. That offends me because I think it's very ignorant, but they are welcome to voice their opinion anyway. I listen to their arguments and challenge them with facts, and I want them to do the same even if they are scared to offend me. It's free speech and we can't be afraid to discuss with eachother because it might offend them. That does not benefit anyone.
    I still hold to that there are bounderies, that you can cross that will make people not listen to you. Sometimes you have to respect a person, regardless if you agree with them or not. Causing an argument, does not win a debate, nor does offending someone. There is a time to talk, and a time to back off.
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  4. #104  
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexG View Post
    Mistakenly?

    Married for 25, divorced for 10. The latter has been better than the former.

    Married for 39.....we only live together five months a year now....due to circumstances.

    Married way way way too young.

    He's a good man.
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  5. #105  
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    I agree that we should always treat eachother with respect. I can be the one who is wrong without realizing it. But maybe we have to agree to disagree because I don't think there's any situation to not discuss something as long as it's an important discussion. As I said, it needs to be done under the right circumstances. I can only think of situations when people should have protested rather than kept silent through history. But I don't blame them because usually it's for their own safety. But maybe you can prove me wrong? But for example I wouldn't argue with someone over something that's not really important just to boost my own ego and make them feel bad. But then again, that's not what I said we should do either..
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  6. #106  
    has lost interest seagypsy's Avatar
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    Holy necrothreads, Batman!!
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  7. #107  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zunc View Post
    I agree that we should always treat eachother with respect. I can be the one who is wrong without realizing it. But maybe we have to agree to disagree because I don't think there's any situation to not discuss something as long as it's an important discussion. As I said, it needs to be done under the right circumstances. I can only think of situations when people should have protested rather than kept silent through history. But I don't blame them because usually it's for their own safety. But maybe you can prove me wrong? But for example I wouldn't argue with someone over something that's not really important just to boost my own ego and make them feel bad. But then again, that's not what I said we should do either..
    Then we understand each other, perfectly!

    Mahalo for taking the time to make your position clearer to me.
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  8. #108  
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    Also I want to thank you for having a nice discussion with me online without using personal attacks (which is very common on other sites) it gives me hope and it's much more interesting and fun to discuss without it.
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  9. #109  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zunc View Post
    Also I want to thank you for having a nice discussion with me online without using personal attacks (which is very common on other sites) it gives me hope and it's much more interesting and fun to discuss without it.
    I agree.

    Sometimes, without voice inflections and instant clarifications, this medium can misconstrue.

    I do not believe in demeaning any individual. I am more apt to ask another question to obtain clarity, and frankly people who are demeaning earn their way to my iggy bin pretty quickly.

    Thanks for taking the time to clarify with me also. It is a two way street.....Mahalo.
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    Yeah I agree. What does Mahalo mean?
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  11. #111  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zunc View Post
    Yeah I agree. What does Mahalo mean?
    Thank you. It is what we say in Hawai'i.
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  12. #112  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quantime View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Neutrino
    Where it "derives from" really doesn't matter, what matters is how it works today. I'm not convinced it has a religious origin anyway, I'd tend to think it was more a social institution or political tool than something that sprang from religion.
    Nope its religious. Anyone atheist who gets married is contradictory, sort of. I've struck a nerve haven't I. No offense again :wink:.
    Marriage is a lot of things to different people. But should an atheist only marry other atheist outside of a church setting? As an atheist I've had very religious girlfriends that wouldn't consider any marriage outside of their church. If I really love the woman and want to be married to her. What would you recommend I do?

    Personally from an emotional POV a committed relationship does not require a legal marriage. But if you are committed and confident in your partner and the relationship you have, a legal marriage does convey extra benefits from many government agencies and insurance companies.

    Most religions won't perform gay marriages, yet in states where it was legalized they lined up and waited for days to get married ASAP. However I will say if given a choice of how I wanted to be married it wouldn't be in a church.
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  13. #113  
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    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zunc View Post
    Yeah I agree. What does Mahalo mean?
    Thank you. It is what we say in Hawai'i.
    Yahoo best answer. (I like it)

    What is the meaning of ? " MAHALO "? - Yahoo! Answers
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  14. #114  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Quantime View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Neutrino
    Where it "derives from" really doesn't matter, what matters is how it works today. I'm not convinced it has a religious origin anyway, I'd tend to think it was more a social institution or political tool than something that sprang from religion.
    Nope its religious. Anyone atheist who gets married is contradictory, sort of. I've struck a nerve haven't I. No offense again :wink:.
    Marriage is a lot of things to different people. But should an atheist only marry other atheist outside of a church setting? As an atheist I've had very religious girlfriends that wouldn't consider any marriage outside of their church. If I really love the woman and want to be married to her. What would you recommend I do?

    Personally from an emotional POV a committed relationship does not require a legal marriage. But if you are committed and confident in your partner and the relationship you have, a legal marriage does convey extra benefits from many government agencies and insurance companies.

    Most religions won't perform gay marriages, yet in states where it was legalized they lined up and waited for days to get married ASAP. However I will say if given a choice of how I wanted to be married it wouldn't be in a church.
    Ditto!
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  15. #115  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zunc View Post
    Yeah I agree. What does Mahalo mean?
    Thank you. It is what we say in Hawai'i.
    Yahoo best answer. (I like it)

    What is the meaning of ? " MAHALO "? - Yahoo! Answers
    It was fine till I got to the "You got a kapuna." Then I started howling!

    Mahalo is used frequently.

    So is Aloha.

    Aloha means many things.....Mahalo is principally used as "thank you".


    BRAT!
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  16. #116 Ah a zombie thread.. 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quantime View Post
    If they don't believe in God why perform a religious act? Marriage derives from religion. Can atheists get married in chruch without being contradictory, can they get married at all without being contradictory? If marriage comes from religion shoudl atheists be taken seriously if they want to get married? By that I mean should those who don't believe in something be able to use something from that which they don't believe? No offense here folks :wink:.
    Marriage does not derive from religion. Far from it.

    It was all about ensuring the protection and acquisition of property and preserving the male heritage or family line.
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  17. #117  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tranquille View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Quantime View Post
    If they don't believe in God why perform a religious act? Marriage derives from religion. Can atheists get married in chruch without being contradictory, can they get married at all without being contradictory? If marriage comes from religion shoudl atheists be taken seriously if they want to get married? By that I mean should those who don't believe in something be able to use something from that which they don't believe? No offense here folks :wink:.
    Marriage does not derive from religion. Far from it.

    It was all about ensuring the protection and acquisition of property and preserving the male heritage or family line.
    Sounds rather boring! *L*

    You are correct. One of the reasons for arranged marriages. So and so gets so and so for his daughter.
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  18. #118  
    ...matter and pixie dust wegs's Avatar
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    How marriage has changed over centuries - The Week It didn't start off as a religious ceremony, that ''attachment'' came many moons later.
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  19. #119  
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    " Anyone atheist who gets married is contradictory"
    My 2 cents. No because its also a part of Culture in some(most) regions. I'm using the date "2013" even if Im not a theist, its not contradictory, its just a artefact/heritage that remains useful and a heritage/token from history. To me marriage is an outdated relic, (some aspects can be nice), but like any old book, old furniture, it can be valid if the people like it. An Old book from Jules Verne can be great to have in a library if someone likes that, people should not be pressured into having "20,000 leagues under the sea" if they dont like that, nor should someone that likes this book be pressured not to have it because its old.
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  20. #120  
    has lost interest seagypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zunc View Post
    Yeah I agree. What does Mahalo mean?
    Thank you. It is what we say in Hawai'i.
    Yahoo best answer. (I like it)

    What is the meaning of ? " MAHALO "? - Yahoo! Answers
    It would seem from the best answer, which seems to be from a native Hawaiian, not some rich white move in that wants to make resorts and golf courses, that the words have already been over used and cheapened if they are being printed on trash can lids. Sometimes I wish Natives would have never taught their sacred words to us Caucasians. We claim everything for our own and ruin everything we touch.

    http://www.southparkstudios.com/clip...re-from-hawaii
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  21. #121  
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    ... We claim everything for our own and ruin everything we touch.
    What do you mean "WE" white woman?
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  22. #122  
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    Quote Originally Posted by icewendigo View Post
    " Anyone atheist who gets married is contradictory"
    My 2 cents. No because its also a part of Culture in some(most) regions. I'm using the date "2013" even if Im not a theist, its not contradictory, its just a artefact/heritage that remains useful and a heritage/token from history. To me marriage is an outdated relic, (some aspects can be nice), but like any old book, old furniture, it can be valid if the people like it. An Old book from Jules Verne can be great to have in a library if someone likes that, people should not be pressured into having "20,000 leagues under the sea" if they dont like that, nor should someone that likes this book be pressured not to have it because its old.
    Very well said.
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  23. #123  
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    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    ... We claim everything for our own and ruin everything we touch.
    What do you mean "WE" white woman?
    LOL, if you aren't a pasty face it doesn't apply to you.
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  24. #124  
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    Making promises to a god you don't believe exists is like writing a check you don't believe will ever be cashed. Why not?

    If I fall in love with a religious lady and she wants to get married according to her religion's tradition, I'll do it for her. She'll have to be ok with the fact I'm not a Christian, and the ceremony doesn't mean anything to me. But it also doesn't offend me.

    If, instead of taking our vows before God and all his holy angels, she wanted us to take our vows before Santa Clause and all his holy elves, I'd do that too. It's her day.
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    Well NF and I are both atheist. How did we get married. One day he said,"Will you marry me?" I said yes and we have called ourselves married since that day. And been living together longer than that. Luckily the state we live in considers that good enough.
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  26. #126  
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    Quote Originally Posted by kojax View Post
    Making promises to a god you don't believe exists is like writing a check you don't believe will ever be cashed. Why not?

    If I fall in love with a religious lady and she wants to get married according to her religion's tradition, I'll do it for her. She'll have to be ok with the fact I'm not a Christian, and the ceremony doesn't mean anything to me. But it also doesn't offend me.

    If, instead of taking our vows before God and all his holy angels, she wanted us to take our vows before Santa Clause and all his holy elves, I'd do that too. It's her day.
    I didn't care.

    He didn't care.

    Our parents cared.

    It's YOUR day as in both of you, not just HER DAY!
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  27. #127  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kojax View Post
    Making promises to a god you don't believe exists is like writing a check you don't believe will ever be cashed. Why not?

    If I fall in love with a religious lady and she wants to get married according to her religion's tradition, I'll do it for her. She'll have to be ok with the fact I'm not a Christian, and the ceremony doesn't mean anything to me. But it also doesn't offend me.

    If, instead of taking our vows before God and all his holy angels, she wanted us to take our vows before Santa Clause and all his holy elves, I'd do that too. It's her day.
    Do it for the in-laws, peace and harmony.

    The Catholic church also made me sign a paper that said we would raise our kids to be Catholic also. Since in Canada people are allowed their religious freedom we felt this contract wasn't worth the paper it was written on nor did it mean anything legal. We signed it just to avoid more red tape. Actually the priest who was scheduled to marry us was excommunicated two weeks before the big day because of his predilection for hookers and the female parishioners, some who's age of consent may have been in question. We also had to sit through several classes in which some married folks would tell us the Catholic way. Not sure but I think the classes were called Pre-Cana or something like that. I preferred pre-carnal. I'll tell ya, these people had that glazed look in their eye, not sure if that's a symptom of being a believer or not but seems to me at least to be a real issue.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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  28. #128  
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    Through history, marriage has existed in all cultures. Through history, marriage has existed independent of religion. It is not a function of religion, it is a function of being human, and it co-exists with religion. It was not invented by religion. Marriage-as-property may well be a function of religion, but I do not live as property so I choose not to include religion or chattelhood into my concept of marriage, and that is my right.
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  29. #129  
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    Marriage is a legal contract that implies legal rights and responsibilities. Where in the bible does it say that if you need a hip replacement, you can use your wife's medical insurance?
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  30. #130  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alec Bing View Post
    Where in the bible does it say that if you need a hip replacement, you can use your wife's medical insurance?

    There will be at least one verse in the Bible that states exactly that when you interpret it via far-fetched reasonings.
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  31. #131  
    has lost interest seagypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alec Bing View Post
    Where in the bible does it say that if you need a hip replacement, you can use your wife's medical insurance?

    There will be at least one verse in the Bible that states exactly that when you interpret it via far-fetched reasonings.
    Silly willy, that is in Genesis. Remember Adam gave of his body (health) via a rib to create Eve and that was insurance of the day back then. So that means when you are married you have to take care of each other's health. (don't worry, I'm kidding. but I bet if I can see it as a possible funny, the faithers can see it as a possible actuality)
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  32. #132  
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alec Bing View Post
    Where in the bible does it say that if you need a hip replacement, you can use your wife's medical insurance?

    There will be at least one verse in the Bible that states exactly that when you interpret it via far-fetched reasonings.
    Silly willy, that is in Genesis. Remember Adam gave of his body (health) via a rib to create Eve and that was insurance of the day back then. So that means when you are married you have to take care of each other's health. (don't worry, I'm kidding. but I bet if I can see it as a possible funny, the faithers can see it as a possible actuality)

    I am glad you have included that you are being humorous, otherwise I had to consult Poe's Law.
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  33. #133  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alec Bing View Post
    Where in the bible does it say that if you need a hip replacement, you can use your wife's medical insurance?

    There will be at least one verse in the Bible that states exactly that when you interpret it via far-fetched reasonings.
    Silly willy, that is in Genesis. Remember Adam gave of his body (health) via a rib to create Eve and that was insurance of the day back then. So that means when you are married you have to take care of each other's health. (don't worry, I'm kidding. but I bet if I can see it as a possible funny, the faithers can see it as a possible actuality)

    I am glad you have included that you are being humorous, otherwise I had to consult Poe's Law.
    The irony is I never remember anything about Adam and Eve actually getting married. They just got to multiplying without a wedding. Those hedonistic bastards! They obviously weren't raised right. (yes more humor)
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  34. #134  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alec Bing View Post
    Where in the bible does it say that if you need a hip replacement, you can use your wife's medical insurance?

    There will be at least one verse in the Bible that states exactly that when you interpret it via far-fetched reasonings.
    KJV:
    Judges 15:8
    And he smote them hip and thigh with a great slaughter: and he went down and dwelt in the top of the rock Etam.
    The only time hip is mentioned in the KJV according to the list I Googled. I shall try and interpret it.....

    If you've been smote at the hip then you are definitely experiencing some problems with that joint. The word smote could actually mean smitten. So being smitten by the hip is probably an indication that God has definitely included that part of the human anatomy as one that's in need of attention. God mentioning 'great slaughter' is an obvious reference to Louise Slaughter, who in 2009 spoke to US Congress about providing health care to millions of Americans. There are also insurance companies that dot the landscape that go by the name Slaughter, go ahead and google if you wish, they are there. So as we can see, God has actually predicted that things such as needing a new hip will soon be covered by medical insurance, if not already. What about the wife's coverage you ask? Well take a look at the quoted verse again and notice the ''dwelling in the top of the rock Etam' reference. If you look closely you will notice that Etam spelled backwards is 'mate', God is making the connection but so must you. Therefore one can obviously see that God has given His blessing to using the wife's medical coverage. People, you must peel back the skin of the orange to reveal its sweetness, thus in the same manner, you must attempt to find the true meaning in God's words. Bless you all and thank you.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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  35. #135  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    KJV:Judges 15:8
    And he smote them hip and thigh with a great slaughter: and he went down and dwelt in the top of the rock Etam.

    The only time hip is mentioned in the KJV according to the list I Googled. I shall try and interpret it.....

    If you've been smote at the hip then you are definitely experiencing some problems with that joint. The word smote could actually mean smitten. So being smitten by the hip is probably an indication that God has definitely included that part of the human anatomy as one that's in need of attention. God mentioning 'great slaughter' is an obvious reference to Louise Slaughter, who in 2009 spoke to US Congress about providing health care to millions of Americans. There are also insurance companies that dot the landscape that go by the name Slaughter, go ahead and google if you wish, they are there. So as we can see, God has actually predicted that things such as needing a new hip will soon be covered by medical insurance, if not already. What about the wife's coverage you ask? Well take a look at the quoted verse again and notice the ''dwelling in the top of the rock Etam' reference. If you look closely you will notice that Etam spelled backwards is 'mate', God is making the connection but so must you. Therefore one can obviously see that God has given His blessing to using the wife's medical coverage. People, you must peel back the skin of the orange to reveal its sweetness, thus in the same manner, you must attempt to find the true meaning in God's words. Bless you all and thank you.

    Have you ever considered to become a televangelist?
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  36. #136  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Have you ever considered to become a televangelist?
    I would have trouble keeping a straight face. You make it big in that business by looking serious.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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  37. #137  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Have you ever considered to become a televangelist?
    I would have trouble keeping a straight face. You make it big in that business by looking serious.
    Maybe we can find you a more serious avatar.
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  38. #138  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Have you ever considered to become a televangelist?
    I would have trouble keeping a straight face. You make it big in that business by looking serious.
    Maybe we can find you a more serious avatar.
    LOL

    Earlier I had mentioned that the Catholic church basically told me to sign an agreement saying that I would raise our children as Catholics or get married elsewhere. I wonder if they were saying that any other religion was a load of crap. As I've said before, theists who feel they are acting on God's behalf, attack theists of different faiths in a manner that's far worse than any atheist who really couldn't care less.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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  39. #139  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Have you ever considered to become a televangelist?
    I would have trouble keeping a straight face. You make it big in that business by looking serious.
    Maybe we can find you a more serious avatar.
    LOL

    Earlier I had mentioned that the Catholic church basically told me to sign an agreement saying that I would raise our children as Catholics or get married elsewhere. I wonder if they were saying that any other religion was a load of crap. As I've said before, theists who feel they are acting on God's behalf, attack theists of different faiths in a manner that's far worse than any atheist who really couldn't care less.
    When one of the sons of an ex-brother in law was getting married in a Catholic wedding. He asked me to go, so I said okay and met his best man who asked me if I had a ideas on how to make this event memorable. It didn't take me long to come up with something that worked much better than expected.

    I made sure the groom was renting suit and dress shoes. I then made sure that they were in fact going to kneel down in front of the priest.

    I had the best man find a bottle of white out and told him to print a large about two inches just behind the heel of the shoe (that part that doesn't come into contact with the ground.) HE (left shoe) & LP (right shoe).

    There was more than a 100 people watching this wedding and they all cracked up laughing and couldn't stop. It took them about 5 minutes before they figured it out. I still laugh whenever I think about it.
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  40. #140  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Have you ever considered to become a televangelist?
    I would have trouble keeping a straight face. You make it big in that business by looking serious.
    Maybe we can find you a more serious avatar.
    LOL

    Earlier I had mentioned that the Catholic church basically told me to sign an agreement saying that I would raise our children as Catholics or get married elsewhere. I wonder if they were saying that any other religion was a load of crap. As I've said before, theists who feel they are acting on God's behalf, attack theists of different faiths in a manner that's far worse than any atheist who really couldn't care less.
    When one of the sons of an ex-brother in law was getting married in a Catholic wedding. He asked me to go, so I said okay and met his best man who asked me if I had a ideas on how to make this event memorable. It didn't take me long to come up with something that worked much better than expected.

    I made sure the groom was renting suit and dress shoes. I then made sure that they were in fact going to kneel down in front of the priest.

    I had the best man find a bottle of white out and told him to print a large about two inches just behind the heel of the shoe (that part that doesn't come into contact with the ground.) HE (left shoe) & LP (right shoe).

    There was more than a 100 people watching this wedding and they all cracked up laughing and couldn't stop. It took them about 5 minutes before they figured it out. I still laugh whenever I think about it.
    That would have been youtube worthy right there.

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  41. #141  
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    That would have been youtube worthy right there.

    When I did it his shoes had dark brown soles and the white letters were bigger. Nobody had to strain to see it clearly. I was actually shocked at how visible it was.
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  42. #142  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    That would have been youtube worthy right there.

    When I did it his shoes had dark brown soles and the white letters were bigger. Nobody had to strain to see it clearly. I was actually shocked at how visible it was.
    Would have been funnier if there were sparkly stones in her veil in the back that said the same thing.
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  43. #143  
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    Would have been funnier if there were sparkly stones in her veil in the back that said the same thing.
    Yeah! But one expects that attitude from a man (stereotypes can be very funny). But I do get where you are coming from.
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  44. #144  
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    lol yes, it's definitely a stereo type these days. not all women wish to get married...some are fine to just date and see where things lead. there are men out there who push it more than some women do....juuuust sayin. so yeah. that's a pretty outdated steretype, as far as stereotypes go.
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  45. #145  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    lol yes, it's definitely a stereo type these days. not all women wish to get married...some are fine to just date and see where things lead. there are men out there who push it more than some women do....juuuust sayin. so yeah. that's a pretty outdated stereotype, as far as stereotypes go.
    Well that event happened about 30 years ago, so it wasn't yet dated.

    I wouldn't be surprised if that picture that SG posted actually originated from my event. After all it made quite an impression.
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  46. #146  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    lol yes, it's definitely a stereo type these days. not all women wish to get married...some are fine to just date and see where things lead. there are men out there who push it more than some women do....juuuust sayin. so yeah. that's a pretty outdated stereotype, as far as stereotypes go.
    Well that event happened about 30 years ago, so it wasn't yet dated.

    I wouldn't be surprised if that picture that SG posted actually originated from my event. After all it made quite an impression.
    haha maybe! that is funny
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alec Bing View Post
    Marriage is a legal contract that implies legal rights and responsibilities. Where in the bible does it say that if you need a hip replacement, you can use your wife's medical insurance?
    Medicus One Chapter 2 Verse 13

    *cough*
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  48. #148  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    That would have been youtube worthy right there.

    When I did it his shoes had dark brown soles and the white letters were bigger. Nobody had to strain to see it clearly. I was actually shocked at how visible it was.
    http://sphotos-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hp...11255538_n.jpg

    THE DID my husband's in silver tape *laughing
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  49. #149  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quantime View Post
    If they don't believe in God why perform a religious act? Marriage derives from religion. Can atheists get married in chruch without being contradictory, can they get married at all without being contradictory? If marriage comes from religion shoudl atheists be taken seriously if they want to get married? By that I mean should those who don't believe in something be able to use something from that which they don't believe? No offense here folks :wink:.
    I agree, marriage is absolute garbage. It derives from religion, nationalism, and everything/anything else non-secular. Just about all activities derived from religion end up being fail; marriage, (in my opinion)circumcision, or the pledge of allegiance where you worship a fucking flag even though most did not choose to be born here. Blind loyalty, bondage, whatever. Stupid people do stupid shit. I'll have no part in it.
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  50. #150  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I agree, marriage is absolute garbage. It derives from religion
    No it doesn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    nationalism
    Huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    and everything/anything else non-secular.
    At least you've narrowed it down.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Just about all activities derived from religion end up being fail
    Evidence?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    marriage, (in my opinion)circumcision, or the pledge of allegiance where you worship a fucking flag even though most did not choose to be born here. Blind loyalty, bondage, whatever. Stupid people do stupid shit. I'll have no part in it.
    In my opinion, you weren't banned long enough.

    Do you have anything of substance to bring to any thread? All you do is barge in and rage and insult and stomp around like an angry little kid. It's tiresome.
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  51. #151  
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    Unfortunately for you, unpopular opinion is not misconduct on its own. I have a hunch some people are on an agenda to play the role as 'neutralists' and defend these practices just to go say "We're not anti-religious, we're too smart for that". Earlier I saw the same thing in the thread where I said I thought Galileo Galilei was imprisoned for saying the Earth wasn't flat, I actually did look at the provided evidence from a few posters and agreed there was no way to know whether people thought the Earth was flat or not, but now I know their motivation for doing so.

    This will sound personal but circumcision has negatively impacted me, a fact that annoys me since I had absolutely no choice in the matter, being a baby and all. I masturbate(as all men do) a lot, and without that extra bit of skin my foreskin seems to be permanently damaged. Basically cells have stopped repairing themselves after the constant friction. If you've gone through what I had, you'd be dead set against it too.

    As for marriage? Look at the people with the highest marriage rate. Most are religious, if that tells you anything. Especially if you count re-marriage.
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  52. #152  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Unfortunately for you, unpopular opinion is not misconduct on its own. I have a hunch some people are on an agenda to play the role as 'neutralists' and defend these practices just to go say "We're not anti-religious, we're too smart for that". Earlier I saw the same thing in the thread where I said I thought Galileo Galilei was imprisoned for saying the Earth wasn't flat, I actually did look at the provided evidence from a few posters and agreed there was no way to know whether people thought the Earth was flat or not, but now I know their motivation for doing so.

    This will sound personal but circumcision has negatively impacted me, a fact that annoys me since I had absolutely no choice in the matter, being a baby and all. I masturbate(as all men do) a lot, and without that extra bit of skin my foreskin seems to be permanently damaged. Basically cells have stopped repairing themselves after the constant friction. If you've gone through what I had, you'd be dead set against it too.

    As for marriage? Look at the people with the highest marriage rate. Most are religious, if that tells you anything. Especially if you count re-marriage.
    Think again …’’Religious people’’ are divorcing at nearly a 50%rate, as well…so, your stat is wrong. I agree with you about marriage though,no argument there. Your other um…arguments, well…I have nothing to say. Lol Youare entitled to your opinion, though, and agree with the gist of your comments. I don’t believe people need to ‘getmarried’ to be happy. I don’t believe people need to be part of a couple, to behappy. If two people find that, and they want that, great. But, there is thisnotion (dating websites are making a small fortune off this notion for example)that one must be in a relationship or something is wrong with him/her. I’minvolved now with someone and so far so good, but many people feel like it’ssomething they must do, in order to feel complete. If a person doesn’t feelwhole and happy outside of a relationship, he/she won’t feel whole and happyonce they’re in one. (which is most likely why the divorce rate is so high,because people are looking to another person to make them happy, and they becomequickly disillusioned when they realize that marriage is designed to do thatand/or they realize that it takes a lot more work, than they thought.)
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  53. #153  
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    Correction to the above, I see what you were saying, Moon. Sorry, I misinterpreted. You are saying that religious people get married at a higher rate than non religious. True, gotcha.
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  54. #154  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Think again …’’Religious people’’ are divorcing at nearly a 50%rate, as well…so, your stat is wrong.

    [citation needed]
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  55. #155  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Think again …’’Religious people’’ are divorcing at nearly a 50%rate, as well…so, your stat is wrong.

    [citation needed]
    Christians question divorce statistics | Star Tribune (and that's being conservative) I'll find other sources for you.
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  58. #158  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Think again …’’Religious people’’ are divorcing at nearly a 50%rate, as well…so, your stat is wrong.

    [citation needed]
    Christians question divorce statistics | Star Tribune (and that's being conservative) I'll find other sources for you.

    Well, if you meant that religious people in the U.S. displayed a divorce rate of 50%, then this source suffices.

    Your second source merely restates the findings of the Barna Research Group, although I like last paragraph of Mr. Cline's report:
    "The difference in divorce rates is particularly interesting given the fact that the Christians getting divorced in the highest numbers are among the same Christians who are most likely to raise an alarm about the state of marriage in society. They also tend to be the same Christians who want to deny gays the right to marry on the assumption that gay marriage is a "threat" to the institution of marriage. If marriage is in any danger in America, perhaps the threat comes from the unstable marriages of conservative Christians, not the relationships of gays or the marriages of godless atheists."
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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    That's why I laugh when I read or hear the news reports whereby heterosexual married religious folks are jumping up and down, enraged over the gay marriage law. Um, maybe they should get busy figuring out why their divorce rate is so dang high...ya think?
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    That's why I laugh when I read or hear the news reports whereby heterosexual married religious folks are jumping up and down, enraged over the gay marriage law. Um, maybe they should get busy figuring out why their divorce rate is so dang high...ya think?
    It's because they are too busy paying attention to the activities in other people's bedrooms and are neglecting their own.
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  61. #161  
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    That's why I laugh when I read or hear the news reports whereby heterosexual married religious folks are jumping up and down, enraged over the gay marriage law. Um, maybe they should get busy figuring out why their divorce rate is so dang high...ya think?
    It's because they are too busy paying attention to the activities in other people's bedrooms and are neglecting their own.
    zing! I think u be right, girlie.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    That's why I laugh when I read or hear the news reports whereby heterosexual married religious folks are jumping up and down, enraged over the gay marriage law. Um, maybe they should get busy figuring out why their divorce rate is so dang high...ya think?

    Given the fact that I live in a country where same-sex marriages are allowed since 2003 (2nd country in the world to legalize it),
    I do not pay attention to religious hysteria and hypocrisy at the other side of the Atlantic.
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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    No surprise at the studies. Marriage isn't about Jesus(in fact he's curiously rather silent on the subject), Allah or any other divinity. It's about toiling away to maintain a strong friendship, acceptance that people grow and change, willing to being satisfy each other in the bedroom--including getting a bit kinky or romantic as required, forgiveness when someone screws up and gets sex outside the marriage, and being humble enough to adapt to changes about who makes the bread, bed and does the cooking through the years. Right now a close friend of mine who got a dear John letter while on his 3rd deployment to Afghanistan is going through a divorce--I know his unwillingness to forgive is based on his religious thinking and think it's such as damn shame. Three kids lives are being destroyed mostly out of religious based intolerance and in large part unrealistic expectations about enduring faithfulness despite years of separation. Well at least he's not going to have her stoned, as a tribal elder in Afghanistan might recommend if that's any consolation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    No surprise at the studies. Marriage isn't about Jesus(in fact he's curiously rather silent on the subject), Allah or any other divinity. It's about toiling away to maintain a strong friendship, acceptance that people grow and change, willing to being satisfy each other in the bedroom--including getting a bit kinky or romantic as required, forgiveness when someone screws up and gets sex outside the marriage, and being humble enough to adapt to changes about who makes the bread, bed and does the cooking through the years. Right now a close friend of mine who got a dear John letter while on his 3rd deployment to Afghanistan is going through a divorce--I know his unwillingness to forgive is based on his religious thinking and think it's such as damn shame. Three kids lives are being destroyed mostly out of religious based intolerance and in large part unrealistic expectations about enduring faithfulness despite years of separation. Well at least he's not going to have her stoned, as a tribal elder in Afghanistan might recommend if that's any consolation.
    Stoned? Don't forget eaten too.
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    Been married for 39 years.......didn't get married because I was religious......and I will not say it's been a bed of roses.......and that probably goes both ways.

    However, he loves me and my wacky sense of humor, and I love him and his very conservative Nowegianess. Though I have put on my Christmas list that I wanted two 40 year olds under the tree.

    He also knows if I put my little red headed foot down about something, that he is really going to have to convince me and vice versa with his BIG Norwegian foot.

    Marriage is about partnership, love, passion, though it ebbs, caring, FORGIVENESS, without ire, learning how to fight, tease, spend time together, and mostly learn to laugh with and at each other in a very human and comfortable way.

    We don't live together 7 months a YEAR and haven't for almost 10 years now. Relationship unusual...probably to most, but it is what was needed, and we do it.

    It has nothing to do with Jesus. Sheesh.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    Right now a close friend of mine who got a dear John letter while on his 3rd deployment to Afghanistan is going through a divorce--I know his unwillingness to forgive is based on his religious thinking and think it's such as damn shame. Three kids lives are being destroyed mostly out of religious based intolerance and in large part unrealistic expectations about enduring faithfulness despite years of separation.

    That is just sad.
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  67. #167  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    No surprise at the studies. Marriage isn't about Jesus(in fact he's curiously rather silent on the subject), Allah or any other divinity. It's about toiling away to maintain a strong friendship, acceptance that people grow and change, willing to being satisfy each other in the bedroom--including getting a bit kinky or romantic as required, forgiveness when someone screws up and gets sex outside the marriage, and being humble enough to adapt to changes about who makes the bread, bed and does the cooking through the years. Right now a close friend of mine who got a dear John letter while on his 3rd deployment to Afghanistan is going through a divorce--I know his unwillingness to forgive is based on his religious thinking and think it's such as damn shame. Three kids lives are being destroyed mostly out of religious based intolerance and in large part unrealistic expectations about enduring faithfulness despite years of separation. Well at least he's not going to have her stoned, as a tribal elder in Afghanistan might recommend if that's any consolation.
    While in theory what you say is true, I disagree that relationships/marriage is about incorporating room for cheating. Nope, have to disagree there. I understand forgiveness, but forgiveness doesn't mean you 'must' stay with a cheater. Yeah, people screw up, but people who don't stay with cheaters, are not 'unforgiving.' Maybe they just want to find a partner who won't cheat. Cheating isn't something we should grow to expect, and accept just to keep the boat floating. I agree with everything else you said, but that just caught my eye. You might have meant it entirely different than how I'm interpreting it...
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  68. #168  
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    And you are stereotyping people of faith to say that they are intolerant of cheating. It's actually quite the opposite. Many religious types forgive over and over, adultery of their spouses, when they should walk away, with what's left of their dignity. That is not an accurate portrayal of people of faith, Lynx.
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  69. #169  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Unfortunately for you, unpopular opinion is not misconduct on its own.
    It is when your opinions are inflammaroty, derogatory, or downright racist. A lesson I hoped you would have learned.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I have a hunch some people are on an agenda to play the role as 'neutralists' and defend these practices just to go say "We're not anti-religious, we're too smart for that".
    Why does it have to be an agenda? I'm not anti-religion. Granted, I don't think God is really relevant anymore and I think he is, as Neil deGrasse Tyson said, "A dwindling pocket of scientific ignorance." Why does that have to suggest some hidden agenda?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Earlier I saw the same thing in the thread where I said I thought Galileo Galilei was imprisoned for saying the Earth wasn't flat, I actually did look at the provided evidence from a few posters and agreed there was no way to know whether people thought the Earth was flat or not, but now I know their motivation for doing so.
    This comment sounds absolutely pregnant with conspiracy undertones.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    This will sound personal but circumcision has negatively impacted me, a fact that annoys me since I had absolutely no choice in the matter, being a baby and all. I masturbate(as all men do) a lot, and without that extra bit of skin my foreskin seems to be permanently damaged. Basically cells have stopped repairing themselves after the constant friction. If you've gone through what I had, you'd be dead set against it too.
    What. The. Hell.

    Seriously? If you damaged your John Thomas because you too much time doing the ole five-on-one, then maybe you should slow it down. When you feel the need to arm wrestle the one-arm vessel, try doing something like working out instead.

    On a positive note for circumcision, not having it done can lead to some hygiene issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    As for marriage? Look at the people with the highest marriage rate. Most are religious, if that tells you anything. Especially if you count re-marriage.
    Evidence?

    Simply because they have adopted marriage into their religion (and now try to claim completely) does not indicate that it is a religious practice. It's just been grandfathered in.
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  70. #170  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    And you are stereotyping people of faith to say that they are intolerant of cheating. It's actually quite the opposite. Many religious types forgive over and over, adultery of their spouses, when they should walk away, with what's left of their dignity. That is not an accurate portrayal of people of faith, Lynx.
    Am I? I'm sharing one anecdotal (that actually is one of about a half dozen I've seen), not suggesting that all religious people can't past their spouse being unfaithful.

    But consider that nearly every study, depending on how you define it, shows somewhere between a quarter and half people that get married cheat on at least one spouse in their lives. It's also consistently given as one of the most common reasons for divorce (usually #1). Genetic studies on families suggest sex outside of marriage has been common for at least several centuries. Whether we care to admit it or not, its part of the human condition, and not really realistic to expect complete fidelity. And of course most of us want to find a partner that won't cheat--there's simply no reliable way to tell other than perhaps a past failed marriage. I'd argue it's even more so the case between younger spouses frequently separated for months at a time, usually removed from their supporting extended family structure such as military life. It's also no secret that religious conservatives also make up a large part of the military. What I could not find is a study that directly links a causal relationship between religious conservatism and divorce for infidelity--we are left with correlations perhaps more related to other factors such as socio-economic. On the other hand, given the strong language and severe penalities against infidelity in the Bible and Koran, it's quite consistent and reasonable to assume it would be taken more seriously and considered unforgivable among religious conservatives. Pointing out that general relationship across groups is not stereotyping until it's applied to individuals.
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  71. #171  
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    Lynx - Reason I disagree, is that for many religious people, they believe God will 'frown' on divorce. I'm speaking mainly for ''Christians.'' It's rather sad actually how many abused women who are also religious, make excuses for their abusive husbands because they fear disappointing God. Theyalso view forgiveness as a mainstay of Christianity, which it is, but thatdoesn’t transcend to accepting chronic cheating. I was raised in a devout Christian home…so, Iknow how this all goes. I’m not justspeaking out of turn. But, I’m sure you have seen the flip side, too. So, tothat end, somewhere in the middle is the accurate picture. Lol Now, relating to what your opinion is ofcheating. Eek, that’s a rather grim outlook. I don’t believe that people are programmedto cheat, as you seem to be inferring. There are plenty of people who don’tand won't cheat. I hear you though, it can happen and what should someone do?It’s up to the individual. In my lastrelationship, I was cheated on, and I ended it pretty quickly, thereafter. Itwasn’t that he wasn’t remorseful, and it wasn’t that I couldn’t forgive. It wasthat I totally lost trust in someone I cared deeply for, and thought he feltthe same. I knew I would always be wondering if he was telling lies, and soforth, from that point onward. So, to save us both angst, it had to end. Ithink a lot of people feel that way, Lynx. It might have nothing to do withbeing unforgiving, or being religious. It might have everything to do with notbeing able to fully trust again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    While in theory what you say is true, I disagree that relationships/marriage is about incorporating room for cheating. Nope, have to disagree there. I understand forgiveness, but forgiveness doesn't mean you 'must' stay with a cheater. Yeah, people screw up, but people who don't stay with cheaters, are not 'unforgiving.' Maybe they just want to find a partner who won't cheat. Cheating isn't something we should grow to expect, and accept just to keep the boat floating. I agree with everything else you said, but that just caught my eye. You might have meant it entirely different than how I'm interpreting it...
    There are many kinds of cheating and for a lot of people it wouldn't happen if the current relationship didn't already have some serious problems. But the cheating will get all the blame in the divorce. It's an easy cop out. However I'm not saying some people out there are not going to cheat no matter how good their marriage might be, but they are not going to be 50% of any married population.

    I think marriage is mostly an attempt to provide a stable environment to raise children in. Without children what do you have? A domestic worker with benefits. Maybe it doesn't start out that way, but if only one side of that marriage is the bread winner, sooner or later the stresses will become to much.
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  73. #173  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    While in theory what you say is true, I disagree that relationships/marriage is about incorporating room for cheating. Nope, have to disagree there. I understand forgiveness, but forgiveness doesn't mean you 'must' stay with a cheater. Yeah, people screw up, but people who don't stay with cheaters, are not 'unforgiving.' Maybe they just want to find a partner who won't cheat. Cheating isn't something we should grow to expect, and accept just to keep the boat floating. I agree with everything else you said, but that just caught my eye. You might have meant it entirely different than how I'm interpreting it...
    There are many kinds of cheating and for a lot of people it wouldn't happen if the current relationship didn't already have some serious problems. But the cheating will get all the blame in the divorce. It's an easy cop out. However I'm not saying some people out there are not going to cheat no matter how good their marriage might be, but they are not going to be 50% of any married population.

    I think marriage is mostly an attempt to provide a stable environment to raise children in. Without children what do you have? A domestic worker with benefits. Maybe it doesn't start out that way, but if only one side of that marriage is the bread winner, sooner or later the stresses will become to much.
    I wholeheartedly agree!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    I think marriage is mostly an attempt to provide a stable environment to raise children in. Without children what do you have? A domestic worker with benefits. Maybe it doesn't start out that way, but if only one side of that marriage is the bread winner, sooner or later the stresses will become to much.
    I got married 6 years ago and don't have kids. For me, it was about the symbolic nature of marriage. I can't speak for everyone, but I still appreciate what marriage represents. I publicly declared that I wanted to be with no other woman for as long as we're alive. I dedicated myself to her completely. It might be sappy, but my ring is a constant reminder that her family and mine are now joined. I think it's a really beautiful thing.

    I completely understand why some people want no part of it. It's not necessary and you can still have a relationship as happy as mine without the ceremony (though you should definitely get a cake), but it was important to me and my wife. Without being married, I don't know. It would be like driving a rental.
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  75. #175  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    I think marriage is mostly an attempt to provide a stable environment to raise children in. Without children what do you have? A domestic worker with benefits. Maybe it doesn't start out that way, but if only one side of that marriage is the bread winner, sooner or later the stresses will become to much.
    I got married 6 years ago and don't have kids. For me, it was about the symbolic nature of marriage. I can't speak for everyone, but I still appreciate what marriage represents. I publicly declared that I wanted to be with no other woman for as long as we're alive. I dedicated myself to her completely. It might be sappy, but my ring is a constant reminder that her family and mine are now joined. I think it's a really beautiful thing.

    I completely understand why some people want no part of it. It's not necessary and you can still have a relationship as happy as mine without the ceremony (though you should definitely get a cake), but it was important to me and my wife. Without being married, I don't know. It would be like driving a rental.
    That's a beautiful thing, you've said here. May you have many wonderful years together. You give me hope.
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  76. #176  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    I think marriage is mostly an attempt to provide a stable environment to raise children in. Without children what do you have? A domestic worker with benefits. Maybe it doesn't start out that way, but if only one side of that marriage is the bread winner, sooner or later the stresses will become to much.
    I got married 6 years ago and don't have kids. For me, it was about the symbolic nature of marriage. I can't speak for everyone, but I still appreciate what marriage represents. I publicly declared that I wanted to be with no other woman for as long as we're alive. I dedicated myself to her completely. It might be sappy, but my ring is a constant reminder that her family and mine are now joined. I think it's a really beautiful thing.

    I completely understand why some people want no part of it. It's not necessary and you can still have a relationship as happy as mine without the ceremony (though you should definitely get a cake), but it was important to me and my wife. Without being married, I don't know. It would be like driving a rental.
    The best relationship I ever had was with another woman that supported herself and we each had our own places to live. We spent most of our personal time together then we had our personal space back for a few more days, and in this case absence does make the heart grow fonder.
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    That works for some people. Me? I like nothing more than snuggling up with my wife on the couch, drinking a nice dark roast, and watching Voyager. I want to go to be next to her at night and wake up next to her in the morning. I want to hear about the good and bad parts of her day. Basically, I want to be there for her when she needs me. I love cooking for her, tucking her in when she's sick, fixing her stuff when it breaks. While I agree that seeing her after a while away is an emotional thing, I don't feel a need for the separation in the first place.

    It just boils down to people all behaving differently. I'm lucky I'm with someone who is like me. I know what it's like to have a long-term relationship fall apart in a bad way so that makes me all the more thankful I ended up with my wife.
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    Flick, that's truly a heart warming story. I actually believe you, too. I appreciate you sharing, because there's so many people bad mouthing their spouses these days, HOW NICE to see someone praising their spouse. Loving their spouse. You are blessed. I have just started dating someone, who I actually...trust. I never thought I'd trust again, after my last breakup. This guy has been a friend for a time, and he 'gets' me. I 'get' him. He is a little nerdier than I go for...but, a cutie pie. He's a total math wiz...and I'm so not a math wiz. He appreciates me. I respect him. I don't know where it may lead, but I can 'see' what you are saying, Flick. This time last year, or even six months ago, I would have scoffed at reading your post. But, now, I can read it and be genuinely happy for you and your wife. Does anyone here still believe that opposites attract?
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  79. #179  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Flick, that's truly a heart warming story. I actually believe you, too. I appreciate you sharing, because there's so many people bad mouthing their spouses these days, HOW NICE to see someone praising their spouse. Loving their spouse. You are blessed. I have just started dating someone, who I actually...trust. I never thought I'd trust again, after my last breakup. This guy has been a friend for a time, and he 'gets' me. I 'get' him. He is a little nerdier than I go for...but, a cutie pie. He appreciates me. I respect him. I don't know where it may lead, but I can 'see' what you are saying, Flick. This time last year, or even six months ago, I would have scoffed at reading your post. But, now, I can read it and be genuinely happy for you and your wife.
    To be more neutral about the issue, I was not a great partner to the first woman I was with. The only reason I do not take my wife for granted, the only reason I appreciate how amazing she is, is due to the failure of my first relationship.

    The key to a happy relationship, from my experience, is mutual respect. If someone is saying bad things about their spouse on the internet, things are not well at the core of their relationship. That is a fundamental lack of respect for that other person and it won't heal itself.

    My opinion toward women is skewed, though. I don't view them as equals. I think women are to be raised up. I open doors for her, I cook most of our meals, I drive wherever we go. I do this with the inherent knowledge that someday I may have to ask her to push another human being through a relatively small orifice. In retrospect, I'm sure making a few salmon fillets won't seem so bad.

    I'm glad you're not too cynical about relationships. Most of my male friends have been divorced and they just want to sleep with girls half their age and party like they're still 19. I think everyone out there can find a relationship that suits them. You just have to do what works for you and not conform to what society tells you is an appropriate relationship (so long as it's legal, mind you).
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  80. #180  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Flick, that's truly a heart warming story. I actually believe you, too. I appreciate you sharing, because there's so many people bad mouthing their spouses these days, HOW NICE to see someone praising their spouse. Loving their spouse. You are blessed. I have just started dating someone, who I actually...trust. I never thought I'd trust again, after my last breakup. This guy has been a friend for a time, and he 'gets' me. I 'get' him. He is a little nerdier than I go for...but, a cutie pie. He appreciates me. I respect him. I don't know where it may lead, but I can 'see' what you are saying, Flick. This time last year, or even six months ago, I would have scoffed at reading your post. But, now, I can read it and be genuinely happy for you and your wife.
    To be more neutral about the issue, I was not a great partner to the first woman I was with. The only reason I do not take my wife for granted, the only reason I appreciate how amazing she is, is due to the failure of my first relationship.

    The key to a happy relationship, from my experience, is mutual respect. If someone is saying bad things about their spouse on the internet, things are not well at the core of their relationship. That is a fundamental lack of respect for that other person and it won't heal itself.

    My opinion toward women is skewed, though. I don't view them as equals. I think women are to be raised up. I open doors for her, I cook most of our meals, I drive wherever we go. I do this with the inherent knowledge that someday I may have to ask her to push another human being through a relatively small orifice. In retrospect, I'm sure making a few salmon fillets won't seem so bad.

    I'm glad you're not too cynical about relationships. Most of my male friends have been divorced and they just want to sleep with girls half their age and party like they're still 19. I think everyone out there can find a relationship that suits them. You just have to do what works for you and not conform to what society tells you is an appropriate relationship (so long as it's legal, mind you).
    This is really incredible, Flick. Like a second chance or something? You know? That's great. I have tears in my eyes, because as an independent woman, I have been very guarded with men, since my last relationship. This new guy, he likes my independence, but...he also does a lot of things for me, to make me feel...feminine? And what I've learned is...it wasn't so much that I had a hard time liking someone, or allowing my heart to be open...I needed to let someone like/love me. That's what I have struggled with all this time until this new guy. I'm letting him...do kind and loving things. And...it's actually pretty damn cool! I also enjoy making him feel...masculine. I can't believe I'm saying this gushy stuff...ugh. But...your post inspired me to share, too. I can be very cold with men, and perhaps, I needed to go through bad relationships as you say...to appreciate a good one. I'm happy for you, Flick. I really am. I used to think love was stupid, a waste of emotion and time. But...not anymore. He just better not hurt me! Thank you so much for sharing this with us.
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  81. #181  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Flick, that's truly a heart warming story. I actually believe you, too. I appreciate you sharing, because there's so many people bad mouthing their spouses these days, HOW NICE to see someone praising their spouse. Loving their spouse. You are blessed. I have just started dating someone, who I actually...trust. I never thought I'd trust again, after my last breakup. This guy has been a friend for a time, and he 'gets' me. I 'get' him. He is a little nerdier than I go for...but, a cutie pie. He appreciates me. I respect him. I don't know where it may lead, but I can 'see' what you are saying, Flick. This time last year, or even six months ago, I would have scoffed at reading your post. But, now, I can read it and be genuinely happy for you and your wife.


    To be more neutral about the issue, I was not a great partner to the first woman I was with. The only reason I do not take my wife for granted, the only reason I appreciate how amazing she is, is due to the failure of my first relationship.

    The key to a happy relationship, from my experience, is mutual respect. If someone is saying bad things about their spouse on the internet, things are not well at the core of their relationship. That is a fundamental lack of respect for that other person and it won't heal itself.

    My opinion toward women is skewed, though. I don't view them as equals. I think women are to be raised up. I open doors for her, I cook most of our meals, I drive wherever we go. I do this with the inherent knowledge that someday I may have to ask her to push another human being through a relatively small orifice. In retrospect, I'm sure making a few salmon fillets won't seem so bad.

    I'm glad you're not too cynical about relationships. Most of my male friends have been divorced and they just want to sleep with girls half their age and party like they're still 19. I think everyone out there can find a relationship that suits them. You just have to do what works for you and not conform to what society tells you is an appropriate relationship (so long as it's legal, mind you).
    This is really incredible, Flick. Like a second chance or something? You know? That's great. I have tears in my eyes, because as an independent woman, I have been very guarded with men, since my last relationship. This new guy, he likes my independence, but...he also does a lot of things for me, to make me feel...feminine? And what I've learned is...it wasn't so much that I had a hard time liking someone, or allowing my heart to be open...I needed to let someone like/love me. That's what I have struggled with all this time until this new guy. I'm letting him...do kind and loving things. And...it's actually pretty damn cool! I also enjoy making him feel...masculine. I can't believe I'm saying this gushy stuff...ugh. But...your post inspired me to share, too. I can be very cold with men, and perhaps, I needed to go through bad relationships as you say...to appreciate a good one. I'm happy for you, Flick. I really am. I used to think love was stupid, a waste of emotion and time. But...not anymore. He just better not hurt me! Thank you so much for sharing this with us.
    This sounds a lot like me with Neverfly (Time to embarrass him). He is never chauvinistic at all but very chivalrous. He enjoys having me help him take engines apart or drop transmissions. Never tells me I can't get greasy or dirty or turn a wrench just because I am female, but still insists on carrying in the groceries (even if it is just a loaf of bread), opens doors for me, does most of the driving, and goes anywhere with me that I ask him too, even if he doesn't expect to enjoy any of it. Like to doctor appointments or nights out for karaoke. He will even go clothing shopping with me, but I don't do that often.

    I especially like it when he throws his arm around me or gives me a kiss (a modest one) in public if he thinks some guy is checking me out or if some girl attempts to flirt with him.
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  82. #182  
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Flick, that's truly a heart warming story. I actually believe you, too. I appreciate you sharing, because there's so many people bad mouthing their spouses these days, HOW NICE to see someone praising their spouse. Loving their spouse. You are blessed. I have just started dating someone, who I actually...trust. I never thought I'd trust again, after my last breakup. This guy has been a friend for a time, and he 'gets' me. I 'get' him. He is a little nerdier than I go for...but, a cutie pie. He appreciates me. I respect him. I don't know where it may lead, but I can 'see' what you are saying, Flick. This time last year, or even six months ago, I would have scoffed at reading your post. But, now, I can read it and be genuinely happy for you and your wife.


    To be more neutral about the issue, I was not a great partner to the first woman I was with. The only reason I do not take my wife for granted, the only reason I appreciate how amazing she is, is due to the failure of my first relationship.

    The key to a happy relationship, from my experience, is mutual respect. If someone is saying bad things about their spouse on the internet, things are not well at the core of their relationship. That is a fundamental lack of respect for that other person and it won't heal itself.

    My opinion toward women is skewed, though. I don't view them as equals. I think women are to be raised up. I open doors for her, I cook most of our meals, I drive wherever we go. I do this with the inherent knowledge that someday I may have to ask her to push another human being through a relatively small orifice. In retrospect, I'm sure making a few salmon fillets won't seem so bad.

    I'm glad you're not too cynical about relationships. Most of my male friends have been divorced and they just want to sleep with girls half their age and party like they're still 19. I think everyone out there can find a relationship that suits them. You just have to do what works for you and not conform to what society tells you is an appropriate relationship (so long as it's legal, mind you).
    This is really incredible, Flick. Like a second chance or something? You know? That's great. I have tears in my eyes, because as an independent woman, I have been very guarded with men, since my last relationship. This new guy, he likes my independence, but...he also does a lot of things for me, to make me feel...feminine? And what I've learned is...it wasn't so much that I had a hard time liking someone, or allowing my heart to be open...I needed to let someone like/love me. That's what I have struggled with all this time until this new guy. I'm letting him...do kind and loving things. And...it's actually pretty damn cool! I also enjoy making him feel...masculine. I can't believe I'm saying this gushy stuff...ugh. But...your post inspired me to share, too. I can be very cold with men, and perhaps, I needed to go through bad relationships as you say...to appreciate a good one. I'm happy for you, Flick. I really am. I used to think love was stupid, a waste of emotion and time. But...not anymore. He just better not hurt me! Thank you so much for sharing this with us.
    This sounds a lot like me with Neverfly (Time to embarrass him). He is never chauvinistic at all but very chivalrous. He enjoys having me help him take engines apart or drop transmissions. Never tells me I can't get greasy or dirty or turn a wrench just because I am female, but still insists on carrying in the groceries (even if it is just a loaf of bread), opens doors for me, does most of the driving, and goes anywhere with me that I ask him too, even if he doesn't expect to enjoy any of it. Like to doctor appointments or nights out for karaoke. He will even go clothing shopping with me, but I don't do that often.

    I especially like it when he throws his arm around me or gives me a kiss (a modest one) in public if he thinks some guy is checking me out or if some girl attempts to flirt with him.
    You two ROCK. I'm happy for you both, as well. We read a lot of threads on here about physics, and theories of the universe. But, what are the odds of two people...from totally different backgrounds and families...different outlooks on life...different worldviews...coming together? A lot of dominoes had to fall...to bring two people...who didn't know one another at all at one point...to a place of love. It's more incredible and mysterious than the BIG BANG!
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  83. #183  
    has lost interest seagypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Flick, that's truly a heart warming story. I actually believe you, too. I appreciate you sharing, because there's so many people bad mouthing their spouses these days, HOW NICE to see someone praising their spouse. Loving their spouse. You are blessed. I have just started dating someone, who I actually...trust. I never thought I'd trust again, after my last breakup. This guy has been a friend for a time, and he 'gets' me. I 'get' him. He is a little nerdier than I go for...but, a cutie pie. He appreciates me. I respect him. I don't know where it may lead, but I can 'see' what you are saying, Flick. This time last year, or even six months ago, I would have scoffed at reading your post. But, now, I can read it and be genuinely happy for you and your wife.


    To be more neutral about the issue, I was not a great partner to the first woman I was with. The only reason I do not take my wife for granted, the only reason I appreciate how amazing she is, is due to the failure of my first relationship.

    The key to a happy relationship, from my experience, is mutual respect. If someone is saying bad things about their spouse on the internet, things are not well at the core of their relationship. That is a fundamental lack of respect for that other person and it won't heal itself.

    My opinion toward women is skewed, though. I don't view them as equals. I think women are to be raised up. I open doors for her, I cook most of our meals, I drive wherever we go. I do this with the inherent knowledge that someday I may have to ask her to push another human being through a relatively small orifice. In retrospect, I'm sure making a few salmon fillets won't seem so bad.

    I'm glad you're not too cynical about relationships. Most of my male friends have been divorced and they just want to sleep with girls half their age and party like they're still 19. I think everyone out there can find a relationship that suits them. You just have to do what works for you and not conform to what society tells you is an appropriate relationship (so long as it's legal, mind you).
    This is really incredible, Flick. Like a second chance or something? You know? That's great. I have tears in my eyes, because as an independent woman, I have been very guarded with men, since my last relationship. This new guy, he likes my independence, but...he also does a lot of things for me, to make me feel...feminine? And what I've learned is...it wasn't so much that I had a hard time liking someone, or allowing my heart to be open...I needed to let someone like/love me. That's what I have struggled with all this time until this new guy. I'm letting him...do kind and loving things. And...it's actually pretty damn cool! I also enjoy making him feel...masculine. I can't believe I'm saying this gushy stuff...ugh. But...your post inspired me to share, too. I can be very cold with men, and perhaps, I needed to go through bad relationships as you say...to appreciate a good one. I'm happy for you, Flick. I really am. I used to think love was stupid, a waste of emotion and time. But...not anymore. He just better not hurt me! Thank you so much for sharing this with us.
    This sounds a lot like me with Neverfly (Time to embarrass him). He is never chauvinistic at all but very chivalrous. He enjoys having me help him take engines apart or drop transmissions. Never tells me I can't get greasy or dirty or turn a wrench just because I am female, but still insists on carrying in the groceries (even if it is just a loaf of bread), opens doors for me, does most of the driving, and goes anywhere with me that I ask him too, even if he doesn't expect to enjoy any of it. Like to doctor appointments or nights out for karaoke. He will even go clothing shopping with me, but I don't do that often.

    I especially like it when he throws his arm around me or gives me a kiss (a modest one) in public if he thinks some guy is checking me out or if some girl attempts to flirt with him.
    You two ROCK. I'm happy for you both, as well. We read a lot of threads on here about physics, and theories of the universe. But, what are the odds of two people...from totally different backgrounds and families...different outlooks on life...different worldviews...coming together? A lot of dominoes had to fall...to bring two people...who didn't know one another at all at one point...to a place of love. It's more incredible and mysterious than the BIG BANG!
    In our case our childhood experiences and family mores were quite similar and we have a lot of similar experiences beyond childhood. That is what makes us so close. We relate to each other on many levels and we understand each other. Our traditions are the same and so we don't have any sort of culture clash, and yes that can happen between two people from the supposedly same culture. We were both raised by realists. We both appreciate the "old school" approach to life. We are both atheist after having been damn near religious fundies in the past. We have both been overseas. And we have both experienced varying economic statuses. As a result we have the same humor, same tastes in music, and same broad minded opinions on very narrow subjects .. or is it narrow minded opinions on broad subjects.... i think it is the first one but it depends on who you ask. Though we are not intellectual/psychological twins. We don't agree on everything.

    On a side note, I thought the Big Bang was a place of love.....I could have it confused with something else.
    wegs likes this.
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  84. #184  
    ...matter and pixie dust wegs's Avatar
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    The other thing too that I wonder if this causes the demise of some marriages...is a lack of chemistry. It's neat to see people married for a long time, who still have that special spark, physically. I'm not a shallow person, but I have to feel attracted to the guy I'm dating, physically. I have to feel chemistry. The guy I'm dating now, reminds me a bit of Leonard from the Big Bang sitcom....only my guy is taller. But, adorable. Swoon. I asked him to join this website...hehe He looked at it the other night, and really liked it. We shall see. Here's to many years ahead for you and Neverfly, seagypsy...
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  85. #185  
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    That's sweet SG...be sure to tell him Mac said he looked cute holding your purse.

    ...and there ain't a damn thing wrong with it.

    Fixin' shit that ain't broke.
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  86. #186  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    No surprise at the studies. Marriage isn't about Jesus(in fact he's curiously rather silent on the subject), Allah or any other divinity. It's about toiling away to maintain a strong friendship, acceptance that people grow and change, willing to being satisfy each other in the bedroom--including getting a bit kinky or romantic as required, forgiveness when someone screws up and gets sex outside the marriage, and being humble enough to adapt to changes about who makes the bread, bed and does the cooking through the years. Right now a close friend of mine who got a dear John letter while on his 3rd deployment to Afghanistan is going through a divorce--I know his unwillingness to forgive is based on his religious thinking and think it's such as damn shame. Three kids lives are being destroyed mostly out of religious based intolerance and in large part unrealistic expectations about enduring faithfulness despite years of separation. Well at least he's not going to have her stoned, as a tribal elder in Afghanistan might recommend if that's any consolation.
    My heart goes out to your friend.
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  87. #187  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    And you are stereotyping people of faith to say that they are intolerant of cheating. It's actually quite the opposite. Many religious types forgive over and over, adultery of their spouses, when they should walk away, with what's left of their dignity. That is not an accurate portrayal of people of faith, Lynx.
    Am I? I'm sharing one anecdotal (that actually is one of about a half dozen I've seen), not suggesting that all religious people can't past their spouse being unfaithful.

    But consider that nearly every study, depending on how you define it, shows somewhere between a quarter and half people that get married cheat on at least one spouse in their lives. It's also consistently given as one of the most common reasons for divorce (usually #1). Genetic studies on families suggest sex outside of marriage has been common for at least several centuries. Whether we care to admit it or not, its part of the human condition, and not really realistic to expect complete fidelity. And of course most of us want to find a partner that won't cheat--there's simply no reliable way to tell other than perhaps a past failed marriage. I'd argue it's even more so the case between younger spouses frequently separated for months at a time, usually removed from their supporting extended family structure such as military life. It's also no secret that religious conservatives also make up a large part of the military. What I could not find is a study that directly links a causal relationship between religious conservatism and divorce for infidelity--we are left with correlations perhaps more related to other factors such as socio-economic. On the other hand, given the strong language and severe penalities against infidelity in the Bible and Koran, it's quite consistent and reasonable to assume it would be taken more seriously and considered unforgivable among religious conservatives. Pointing out that general relationship across groups is not stereotyping until it's applied to individuals.
    I remember my Belgian exchange student, during the Clinton scandal, looking at me and asking me "WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL? Why do American's have such a problem with all that?"

    She simply found it stupid.
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  88. #188  
    ...matter and pixie dust wegs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    And you are stereotyping people of faith to say that they are intolerant of cheating. It's actually quite the opposite. Many religious types forgive over and over, adultery of their spouses, when they should walk away, with what's left of their dignity. That is not an accurate portrayal of people of faith, Lynx.
    Am I? I'm sharing one anecdotal (that actually is one of about a half dozen I've seen), not suggesting that all religious people can't past their spouse being unfaithful.

    But consider that nearly every study, depending on how you define it, shows somewhere between a quarter and half people that get married cheat on at least one spouse in their lives. It's also consistently given as one of the most common reasons for divorce (usually #1). Genetic studies on families suggest sex outside of marriage has been common for at least several centuries. Whether we care to admit it or not, its part of the human condition, and not really realistic to expect complete fidelity. And of course most of us want to find a partner that won't cheat--there's simply no reliable way to tell other than perhaps a past failed marriage. I'd argue it's even more so the case between younger spouses frequently separated for months at a time, usually removed from their supporting extended family structure such as military life. It's also no secret that religious conservatives also make up a large part of the military. What I could not find is a study that directly links a causal relationship between religious conservatism and divorce for infidelity--we are left with correlations perhaps more related to other factors such as socio-economic. On the other hand, given the strong language and severe penalities against infidelity in the Bible and Koran, it's quite consistent and reasonable to assume it would be taken more seriously and considered unforgivable among religious conservatives. Pointing out that general relationship across groups is not stereotyping until it's applied to individuals.
    I remember my Belgian exchange student, during the Clinton scandal, looking at me and asking me "WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL? Why do American's have such a problem with all that?"

    She simply found it stupid.
    yeah, unless she was married to clinton. then it might not have been so 'stupid.' i've never met anyone who upon finding out that their partner has cheated on them, has uttered the words...'what is the big deal?'
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  89. #189  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Unfortunately for you, unpopular opinion is not misconduct on its own.
    It is when your opinions are inflammaroty, derogatory, or downright racist. A lesson I hoped you would have learned.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I have a hunch some people are on an agenda to play the role as 'neutralists' and defend these practices just to go say "We're not anti-religious, we're too smart for that".
    Why does it have to be an agenda? I'm not anti-religion. Granted, I don't think God is really relevant anymore and I think he is, as Neil deGrasse Tyson said, "A dwindling pocket of scientific ignorance." Why does that have to suggest some hidden agenda?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Earlier I saw the same thing in the thread where I said I thought Galileo Galilei was imprisoned for saying the Earth wasn't flat, I actually did look at the provided evidence from a few posters and agreed there was no way to know whether people thought the Earth was flat or not, but now I know their motivation for doing so.
    This comment sounds absolutely pregnant with conspiracy undertones.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    This will sound personal but circumcision has negatively impacted me, a fact that annoys me since I had absolutely no choice in the matter, being a baby and all. I masturbate(as all men do) a lot, and without that extra bit of skin my foreskin seems to be permanently damaged. Basically cells have stopped repairing themselves after the constant friction. If you've gone through what I had, you'd be dead set against it too.
    What. The. Hell.

    Seriously? If you damaged your John Thomas because you too much time doing the ole five-on-one, then maybe you should slow it down. When you feel the need to arm wrestle the one-arm vessel, try doing something like working out instead.

    On a positive note for circumcision, not having it done can lead to some hygiene issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    As for marriage? Look at the people with the highest marriage rate. Most are religious, if that tells you anything. Especially if you count re-marriage.
    Evidence?

    Simply because they have adopted marriage into their religion (and now try to claim completely) does not indicate that it is a religious practice. It's just been grandfathered in.
    I'll make this quick because I know I'm pretty hated here(a fact I enjoy).

    Conspiracy undertone? More like psychology 101...01.

    Yes, I yank my chains 7 times a day occasionally, it's so damaged I can't even do it with my hands anymore. That pinkish area is far more sensitive than, well, the skin that could've been around.

    Evidence? I won't bother, I hate bringing up evidence for religion sucking, it does that on its own.

    I don't like it when people make a conscious effort to be non-religious instead of anti-religious, that's what I meant. It comes across as snobby... Kinda.

    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance I was black(even though I'm not) which would make my comment towards Africa not racist. I mostly meant to criticize Muslim extremism(it's among the dumbest kind of religion). Technically what I just said here is hate speech, kinda a paradox of sorts. But I'm certain nobody really cares for Islam anyways.
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  90. #190  
    ...matter and pixie dust wegs's Avatar
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    Oh my ^^ what my eyes hath seen, can't be undone.Moon...TMI!! :-PP
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  91. #191  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    And you are stereotyping people of faith to say that they are intolerant of cheating. It's actually quite the opposite. Many religious types forgive over and over, adultery of their spouses, when they should walk away, with what's left of their dignity. That is not an accurate portrayal of people of faith, Lynx.
    Am I? I'm sharing one anecdotal (that actually is one of about a half dozen I've seen), not suggesting that all religious people can't past their spouse being unfaithful.

    But consider that nearly every study, depending on how you define it, shows somewhere between a quarter and half people that get married cheat on at least one spouse in their lives. It's also consistently given as one of the most common reasons for divorce (usually #1). Genetic studies on families suggest sex outside of marriage has been common for at least several centuries. Whether we care to admit it or not, its part of the human condition, and not really realistic to expect complete fidelity. And of course most of us want to find a partner that won't cheat--there's simply no reliable way to tell other than perhaps a past failed marriage. I'd argue it's even more so the case between younger spouses frequently separated for months at a time, usually removed from their supporting extended family structure such as military life. It's also no secret that religious conservatives also make up a large part of the military. What I could not find is a study that directly links a causal relationship between religious conservatism and divorce for infidelity--we are left with correlations perhaps more related to other factors such as socio-economic. On the other hand, given the strong language and severe penalities against infidelity in the Bible and Koran, it's quite consistent and reasonable to assume it would be taken more seriously and considered unforgivable among religious conservatives. Pointing out that general relationship across groups is not stereotyping until it's applied to individuals.
    I remember my Belgian exchange student, during the Clinton scandal, looking at me and asking me "WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL? Why do American's have such a problem with all that?"

    She simply found it stupid.
    yeah, unless she was married to clinton. then it might not have been so 'stupid.' i've never met anyone who upon finding out that their partner has cheated on them, has uttered the words...'what is the big deal?'
    I believe in several European countries, it is not unusual of either spouse to have a lover....
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  92. #192  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wegs View Post
    Oh my ^^ what my eyes hath seen, can't be undone.Moon...TMI!! :-PP
    It isn't always good having a very very vivid imagination!! *L*
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  93. #193  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I'll make this quick because I know I'm pretty hated here(a fact I enjoy).

    Conspiracy undertone? More like psychology 101...01.

    Yes, I yank my chains 7 times a day occasionally, it's so damaged I can't even do it with my hands anymore. That pinkish area is far more sensitive than, well, the skin that could've been around.

    Evidence? I won't bother, I hate bringing up evidence for religion sucking, it does that on its own.

    I don't like it when people make a conscious effort to be non-religious instead of anti-religious, that's what I meant. It comes across as snobby... Kinda.

    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance I was black(even though I'm not) which would make my comment towards Africa not racist. I mostly meant to criticize Muslim extremism(it's among the dumbest kind of religion). Technically what I just said here is hate speech, kinda a paradox of sorts. But I'm certain nobody really cares for Islam anyways.
    Well Moon I think religion is the root of all evil, but trying to have any kind of reasonable conversation about it with the religious is about as much fun as talking to a drunk. I prefer not to.
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  94. #194  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I'll make this quick because I know I'm pretty hated here(a fact I enjoy).

    Conspiracy undertone? More like psychology 101...01.

    Yes, I yank my chains 7 times a day occasionally, it's so damaged I can't even do it with my hands anymore. That pinkish area is far more sensitive than, well, the skin that could've been around.

    Evidence? I won't bother, I hate bringing up evidence for religion sucking, it does that on its own.

    I don't like it when people make a conscious effort to be non-religious instead of anti-religious, that's what I meant. It comes across as snobby... Kinda.

    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance I was black(even though I'm not) which would make my comment towards Africa not racist. I mostly meant to criticize Muslim extremism(it's among the dumbest kind of religion). Technically what I just said here is hate speech, kinda a paradox of sorts. But I'm certain nobody really cares for Islam anyways.
    Well Moon I think religion is the root of all evil, but trying to have any kind of reasonable conversation about it with the religious is about as much fun as talking to a drunk. I prefer not to.
    Hey, one of the few times (literally) I had too much to drink, I managed to entertain an entire restaurant, and they wanted to hire me! *L*
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  95. #195  
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    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I'll make this quick because I know I'm pretty hated here(a fact I enjoy).

    Conspiracy undertone? More like psychology 101...01.

    Yes, I yank my chains 7 times a day occasionally, it's so damaged I can't even do it with my hands anymore. That pinkish area is far more sensitive than, well, the skin that could've been around.

    Evidence? I won't bother, I hate bringing up evidence for religion sucking, it does that on its own.

    I don't like it when people make a conscious effort to be non-religious instead of anti-religious, that's what I meant. It comes across as snobby... Kinda.

    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance I was black(even though I'm not) which would make my comment towards Africa not racist. I mostly meant to criticize Muslim extremism(it's among the dumbest kind of religion). Technically what I just said here is hate speech, kinda a paradox of sorts. But I'm certain nobody really cares for Islam anyways.
    Well Moon I think religion is the root of all evil, but trying to have any kind of reasonable conversation about it with the religious is about as much fun as talking to a drunk. I prefer not to.
    Hey, one of the few times (literally) I had too much to drink, I managed to entertain an entire restaurant, and they wanted to hire me! *L*
    I guess being drunk means off-topic posting.
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  96. #196  
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooncanvas View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bad robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mooncanvas View Post
    i'll make this quick because i know i'm pretty hated here(a fact i enjoy).

    Conspiracy undertone? More like psychology 101...01.

    Yes, i yank my chains 7 times a day occasionally, it's so damaged i can't even do it with my hands anymore. That pinkish area is far more sensitive than, well, the skin that could've been around.

    Evidence? I won't bother, i hate bringing up evidence for religion sucking, it does that on its own.

    I don't like it when people make a conscious effort to be non-religious instead of anti-religious, that's what i meant. It comes across as snobby... Kinda.

    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance i was black(even though i'm not) which would make my comment towards africa not racist. I mostly meant to criticize muslim extremism(it's among the dumbest kind of religion). Technically what i just said here is hate speech, kinda a paradox of sorts. But i'm certain nobody really cares for islam anyways.
    well moon i think religion is the root of all evil, but trying to have any kind of reasonable conversation about it with the religious is about as much fun as talking to a drunk. I prefer not to.
    hey, one of the few times (literally) i had too much to drink, i managed to entertain an entire restaurant, and they wanted to hire me! *l*
    i guess being drunk means off-topic posting.
    what?????????
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  97. #197  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I'll make this quick because I know I'm pretty hated here(a fact I enjoy).
    I don't hate you. I doubt many people here hate you. If anything, I don't have much respect for you because you haven't done anything to earn it. The fact that you enjoy being the target of many forum members' irritation isn't going to earn you any friends. Basically, your attitude is sh*t.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Conspiracy undertone? More like psychology 101...01.
    Any support for this? Just opinion again?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Yes, I yank my chains 7 times a day occasionally, it's so damaged I can't even do it with my hands anymore. That pinkish area is far more sensitive than, well, the skin that could've been around.
    If you're playing a solo on the flute seven times a day, I would reconsider blaming circumcision for your issues. That's not a healthy amount of time to spend with the old bishop.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Evidence? I won't bother, I hate bringing up evidence for religion sucking, it does that on its own.
    Yet another comment that makes me wonder why you're even on this forum.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    I don't like it when people make a conscious effort to be non-religious instead of anti-religious, that's what I meant. It comes across as snobby... Kinda.
    And that's somehow worse than how you come off?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonCanvas View Post
    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance I was black(even though I'm not) which would make my comment towards Africa not racist. I mostly meant to criticize Muslim extremism(it's among the dumbest kind of religion). Technically what I just said here is hate speech, kinda a paradox of sorts. But I'm certain nobody really cares for Islam anyways.
    More pointless bigotry from the peanut gallery. Not even worth a response.
    "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." -Calvin
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  98. #198  
    Cooking Something Good MacGyver1968's Avatar
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    Dude, if you're polishing the mahogany 7 times a day....whew! You might want to throttle back a bit, or one arm is going to be bigger than the other.
    Fixin' shit that ain't broke.
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  99. #199  
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    Mooncanvas: please stop talking about how much you jerk off. We don't want to know. And your remarks about religions and other cultures are in poor taste to put it mildly. Stop it right now if you want to continue around here. Tread lightly.

    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance I was black(even though I'm not) which would make my comment towards Africa not racist.
    You're not black, so it was racist. It was obvious that you weren't.
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

    "Gullibility kills" - Carl Sagan
    "All people know the same truth. Our lives consist of how we chose to distort it." - Harry Block
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  100. #200  
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    Quote Originally Posted by KALSTER View Post
    Mooncanvas: please stop talking about how much you jerk off. We don't want to know. And your remarks about religions and other cultures are in poor taste to put it mildly. Stop it right now if you want to continue around here. Tread lightly.

    Inflammatory remarks? There was a chance I was black(even though I'm not) which would make my comment towards Africa not racist.
    You're not black, so it was racist. It was obvious that you weren't.
    It doesn't help matters you ease this thread further off topic, I see the need to address my statements but you should've done so by personal message.

    Adding onto the thread; I think a theorem for deciding whether a practice sucks is by seeing if religion condones it. Marriage is a big religion thing, and so is circumcision. The reason I'm against circumcision is because I think everyone has the right to decide what they want to do with their body. Likewise, it's for this same reason that we disagree with religion's condonement of anti-abortion and their efforts to control what someone wants to do with their body, even at the cost of a mother and child. Obeying parents? Most here are probably neutral on it. But religion condones it; so in some way, shape or form, it'll coincidentally end up being a poor philosophy. And we also notice how some kids are born into drug-abuse families whose parents would sooner get their children to do drugs than support them.
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