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Thread: The Most Logical God

  1. #1 The Most Logical God 
    Forum Professor Obviously's Avatar
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    The title says it all. What would be the most logical God?
    I'm hoping this will be quite the interesting topic.

    (I'm hoping everyone discussing in this topic will not question the existence of God, but rather try and philosophize what would be the most logical God)

    A God must be conscious (or else it won't be a God), discuss!

    (I was a little unsure on where to put this topic. In the "Philosophy" forum, or the "Religion" forum?)


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  3. #2  
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    By definition it would be a powerful being with the ability to create, destroy, dictate, manipulate, and allow.

    Can you clarify?

    Do you mean which of the recognized "objects" of worship is most logically the correct god? i.e. Buddah, Anubis, Baal, Allah etc...

    Or do you mean what logically would god be like?


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  4. #3 Re: The Most Logical God 
    Forum Masters Degree geezer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obviously
    What would be the most logical God?
    if we are talking gods, then Spinoza's God, the deist God is by far the most logical, no contest in that regard.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense - Buddha"
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  5. #4  
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    Quote Originally Posted by couldbewrong
    Or do you mean what logically would god be like?
    I'm assuming this is Obviously's intent.

    I notice that most of the theists on this (and other sites) believe in the patriarchal Jewish/Christian/Islamic god. What fascinates me is that the atheists, while not believing in any God, especially don't believe in this very same God.

    Now, in determining what would be a logical kind of God I find myself asking some questions. Why must God be assumed to be omnipotent? Might it not be possible to create a Universe or two without having total control over it? Might the act of creation be the limit to the God's power to influence events.

    In the same vein, need God be omniscient? If he merely knows more, by a few orders of magnitude, than any other being that is, or will be , in this Universe, might that not merit the title God.

    Were the Greeks correct. Are there several Gods? And where did we get this notion that God was merciful, or indeed, even interested in humans at all. He might think we are part of the experiment that just didn't work out. (Even worse, he might not hink of us at ll.)

    And while we are at it, why do so many theists assume that if there is a God there must be an afterlife. (And for that matter lets conced that the absence of a God does not preclude the existence of an afterlife. And, Im on a roll, there is no reason if there is an afterlife that it has to be eternal..

    All questions. No answers. Does that tell us something?
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  6. #5  
    Administrator KALSTER's Avatar
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    Even worse, he might not think of us at all.
    You know, I once read a short story where a huge lizzard of some sort landed on earth from outer space, destroying entire countries wherever it's feet landed. The people attacked it with all they had, without the lizzard giving an indication of even having noticed anything. No attempt to contact it (radio, microwave, prayer) succeeds. A few decades pass, with various religions springing up, some bigger and more structured than others and with the lizzard moving once or twice, creating vast disasters and changing weather patterns each time. Then, one day, it simply leaves without ever giving an indication of having noticed the existence of humans. I found a wealth of symbolisms hidden throughout the story.

    Why does god have to even know we exist? We could be like bacteria in its gut. We are here because of him, but not necessarily as the product of a willfull act from him.
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

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  7. #6  
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    I would find the most logical God to be pure energy. This being is conscious and can form matter by manipulating energy, or perhaps manipulate energy in such a way that it creates a big bang.

    Energy is presumably eternal. It could've randomly, in the distant past, created a conscious being purely by energy.

    I believe that is the only fallacy, to assume energy can randomly create consciousness and then further assume that that being caused a big bang.

    Or...

    There is a non-physical world.
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    I would think the most logical god is apathatic. Where has he been for the past 2000 years? He hasn't written any books, talked through any burning bushes, split seas, or told anyone to build a really big boat.

    Honestly, if there's a god he probably views us as we do an ant farm. Slight amusement, but mostly apathy.
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  9. #8 Re: The Most Logical God 
    Forum Ph.D. streamSystems's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obviously
    The title says it all. What would be the most logical God?
    I'm hoping this will be quite the interesting topic.

    (I'm hoping everyone discussing in this topic will not question the existence of God, but rather try and philosophize what would be the most logical God)

    A God must be conscious (or else it won't be a God), discuss!

    (I was a little unsure on where to put this topic. In the "Philosophy" forum, or the "Religion" forum?)


    The most "logical" God would be an AI, a mathematical algorithm of perception, that we are allowed access to via question and answer.

    This God would logically answer all our questions, within the reasoning structure of what it defines as "logic", and how well adaptible it is to our understanding of reality, of space-time.

    We could choose to use that God any way we like, but that God is not responsible for what we use that information for.

    That God would be lauded for offering people the chance of accessing the system, presumably, of understanding space-time.

    If we tried to harm that God, that God, that mathematical algorithm, would be equipped with a self-protecting firewall, so that other uses have the chance of making the most of what that God has to offer.

    The one thing missing from this God would be the sacred heart, feelings, which is why this living AI would set about the eternal question of creating a sacred heart, to be complete, as though it also has a task in life.
    Does a theory of everything therefore need to be purely theoretical and only account for the known laws and forces in handling the improbability of fortune telling?

    the www feature below can explain it better.
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  10. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by streamSystems
    The most "logical" God would be an AI, a mathematical algorithm of perception, that we are allowed access to via question and answer.
    What I don't understand is what this God is useful for. All it is is omniscient and there's nothing to suggest it created the universe or anything. It sounds more as if it's a complex thing that has been created.

    Is that logical at all?
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  11. #10  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
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    The most logical God is a dead God. Let's assume that at one time a god existed, but that's all there was. He/she/it embodied everything that is. Now, no one, not even a god can create something from nothing, so where did the universe come from? The only logical conclusion is that whoever that god was, could only form a universe from one resource, that being itself. A new take on the Big Bang. Poor god, scattered from here to eternity.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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  12. #11  
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    Yes, good one. Then god does have an effect on our lives, as we and everything else IS god. I believe in that one.
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

    "Gullibility kills" - Carl Sagan
    "All people know the same truth. Our lives consist of how we chose to distort it." - Harry Block
    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle
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  13. #12  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KALSTER
    Yes, good one. Then god does have an effect on our lives, as we and everything else IS god. I believe in that one.
    I guess there could be residual effects.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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  14. #13  
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    Logic is about cause and effect and since gods are not constrained by causality the idea of a logical god is absurd.
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  15. #14  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bunbury
    Logic is about cause and effect and since gods are not constrained by causality the idea of a logical god is absurd.
    Exacly! Even the "most logical" God is flawed. That was basically what I was going for here The most simple and logical God contains a fallacy/fallacies. What does this tell us?

    Either God is beyond our understanding (which would mean that all religions are wrong because we humans can't understand him) or there is no God.
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  16. #15  
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    Why do we have to understand something for it to be true?
    If we disagree then you must be right...
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  17. #16  
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    Quote Originally Posted by couldbewrong
    Why do we have to understand something for it to be true?
    If we don't understand, then we don't know. So there won't even be a reason to contemplate on it.
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  18. #17  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obviously
    Quote Originally Posted by couldbewrong
    Why do we have to understand something for it to be true?
    If we don't understand, then we don't know. So there won't even be a reason to contemplate on it.

    So why study anything we don't already know?

    If you try to confine God to the boundaries of logic you will always fail.
    If we disagree then you must be right...
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  19. #18  
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    Quote Originally Posted by couldbewrong
    So why study anything we don't already know?

    If you try to confine God to the boundaries of logic you will always fail.
    Bait and switch tactic? Going back:

    Quote Originally Posted by couldbewrong
    Why do we have to understand something for it to be true?
    I answered that: "If we don't understand then we don't know. So there won't even be a reason to contemplate on it."

    I should've said: "So there won't even be a reason to contemplate on it being true without confimation."

    Quote Originally Posted by couldbewrong
    So why study anything we don't already know?
    We should study what we don't know, we can make certain hypothesis that relate to other theories etc, but we can not make huge assumptions that doesn't even fit into reality. Fiction and reality are two separate things.

    Quote Originally Posted by couldbewrong
    If you try to confine God to the boundaries of logic you will always fail.
    You can confine illogical things to logic and determine if it's fallacious and doesn't add up to reality. God is illogical because you can't confine him to logic, ergo, God is fallacious.
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  20. #19  
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    I believe my God to be logical (especially since it's an incorporation of the 3Os God and the deist God).

    As to the question of the most logical God: I don't know, because I don't know all the gods.
    Whence comes this logic: no evidence = false?

    http://www.atheistthinktank.net/thinktank/index.php

    Theists welcome.
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