Notices
Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Christians are closet astrologers

  1. #1 Christians are closet astrologers 
    Forum Freshman Medicine*Woman's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Right here in your face!
    Posts
    66
    *************
    M*W: The NT is based on astrological movements, and Christians don't even realize it! Take John the Baptist for example. Was he a real live human being or was he a constellation on the zodiac? Did he really baptize Jesus or was Jesus just another name for the sun=god?

    http://www.usbible.com/astrology/joh...39;s_stars.htm


    "Baby, you don't have to live like a refugee."

    ~ Tom Petty
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Forum Freshman craterchains's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Tacoma, WA, usa
    Posts
    58
    Muddy waters are yours to drink M*W.

    Thank God I have an artesian well for water.


    It's not what you know or don't know, but what you know that isn't so that will hurt you. Will Rodgers 1938
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Forum Bachelors Degree
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    London, England
    Posts
    405
    Wow.

    Here are the subtitles on the top page there.

    • A voice of reason reveals the sins of omission and commission in the Bible
    • In defense of reality


    I can't really see a great deal to that theory - they start by talking about Genesis, and then they talk about astrology's view. Because they're talking about the same thing (like Spring and stuff) there's a facile assumption that they are the same thing, but of course they're not at all. When Isaiah had god "sitting on the circle of the earth", that's the disk which formed the world as the ancients knew it. Of course, astrological signs are also formed in a circle. That does not really mean that the "circle of the earth" and the astrological circle are the same thing. Likewise, Genesis says that the sky is a tent over the earth. This is how an ancient would see it. So what is the link with Capricorn exactly?

    It appears to be an anti-Christian site - it refers to "another of Christianities insanities" - but making a big connection with astrology, without any real back up to it, seems to me to be insane. I can't work out whether these guys are in favour of astrology itself!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Sophomore spidergoat's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    165
    Some Christians are aware of it, KRS ONE mentions it in one of his recent albums. He talks about the fishes being a sign of Pisces. I think the bible might make more sense this way, although a direct relationship between the positions of stars and human actions seems unlikely.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    101
    The site ref. by M*W is from an atheist. I don't doubt that you may doubt it's claim, suspicious as you theist are.

    However the following site is from MSU.

    http://www.esoteric.msu.edu/VolumeIV/astrology.htm

    Have a nice read, and determine your own conclusions.

    Godless.
    Don't count your money while your sitting on the table.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Forum Freshman Marc A.C.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    12
    "Scientific platforms" at their best.

    2. John was conceived by divine conception.

    13But the angel said to him, “Do not be afraid, Zechariah, for your prayer is heard, and your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you shall call his name John. (Luke 1:13)

    3. Christians make a big deal about virgin conception as if once a woman has been penetrated, she is no longer clean. The miracle that supposedly gave Jesus his innocence was his divine conception. But Luke tells us that John’s parents were also free of sin and that his mother Elizabeth conceived John through the Holy Spirit. This would mean that both men were born without sin.
    That's why I shall never trust an atheist site. They sneak all kinds of little misinterpretations into their matrix... "doping" I'd call it. If you read it gullibly you'll end up in problems - something akin to "swatting".

    Very confused the author is. I still don't see where anything he's referenced from the Bible states that "John was conceived by divine conception". John's father was human. Christ's Father Is not.
    Marc

    Creation, Cause, Free Will, Truth, Faith, Love; God
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Forum Freshman Marc A.C.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    12
    Quote Originally Posted by Godless
    However the following site is from MSU.

    http://www.esoteric.msu.edu/VolumeIV/astrology.htm

    Godless.
    I do hope the gullible shall read it... it is a useful read... in large part forces you to decide on your own (as opposed to making errant conclusions). The author generally allows conclusions to be drawn by presenting the information. That's more of a "scientific platform".
    Marc

    Creation, Cause, Free Will, Truth, Faith, Love; God
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Freshman craterchains's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Tacoma, WA, usa
    Posts
    58
    Yes, let the readers decide for themselves.
    But I would recommend reading the bible, and not someone's rehash of it.
    Many people quote bible "commentary" as if it were scripture.
    Big mistake.
    It's not what you know or don't know, but what you know that isn't so that will hurt you. Will Rodgers 1938
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9 Re: Christians are closet astrologers 
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by Medicine*Woman
    *************
    M*W: The NT is based on astrological movements, and Christians don't even realize it! Take John the Baptist for example. Was he a real live human being or was he a constellation on the zodiac? Did he really baptize Jesus or was Jesus just another name for the sun=god?

    http://www.usbible.com/astrology/joh...39;s_stars.htm
    Astrology is spoken of as being a sin in the bible. Christianity is not based on astrology. You are wrong about that.
    Observers of times = astrologers

    Deuteronomy 18:10 There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch.
    11 Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
    12 For all that do these things [are] an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Forum Freshman Crimson_Scribe's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    39
    MW is just pointing out a site with intresting correlations between how the bible was written and astrology. Take it for what you will.
    Theatre is the laboratory of the human soul. – Peter Brook
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    101
    I do hope the gullible shall read it... it is a useful read... in large part forces you to decide on your own (as opposed to making errant conclusions)
    Basically I've based my conclusions on fact, not on doctrine.

    Christianity has to protect it's kind of mysticism too, it literally wiped all astrollegers for half a century, burned as witches, and executed for paganism. Thus your so called rightious religion was not so rightious it only protected its self interest from a competing dogma.

    * And how did "the seed of Abraham", this "specially chosen vehicle", the Jews, oppose astrology? By matching their own crazy notions against it, by substituting the astrologer's divination of the stars with their own prophecies through "dreams" and "visions". The Jewish Daniel, you may recall, "had understanding in all visions and dreams", and, at the court of Nebuchadnezzar, foretold the future by interpreting the king's dream. "And in all matters of wisdom and understanding", says the Bible, "that the king inquired of them [Daniel and his fellow seers], he found them ten times better than all the magicians and astrologers that were in all his realm."

    "The seed of Abraham was never distinguished for its knowledge of the stars. As well expressed in that monumental work, Dr. William Smith's "Dictionary of the Bible", "the Hebrews are not known to have made much advance in astronomical science, though there are many allusions in the Scriptures to the visible heavens," The Biblical "heavens" were about all the patriarchs knew, and their ridiculous cosmology was a stumbling block to science for thousands of years. It was, in fact, the chief obstacle to the advance of astronomy in Christian times.*
    http://www.edwardtbabinski.us/essays/astrology.html

    Truly it's arrogance to think that one kind of mysticism is rightious while others are merely paganism. How do we forget that at the birth of Christianity it was called an "atheist" religion, because the Christian didn't believe in the gods of the Romans.


    Astrology is spoken of as being a sin in the bible. Christianity is not based on astrology. You are wrong about that.
    Read the article above, and perhaps you are right Christianity may perhaps not be "based" on astronomy, but seen that some religious stories told in the bible were borrowed in some fashion from Babyloninans mythology and re-worded to fit their agenda there's no doubt that astrology may play a small role. But truly what is it that the christian faith base their beliefs on? Dreams and visions of illusion, schizophrenia, dementia and hallusinations.

    Godless.
    Don't count your money while your sitting on the table.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12  
    Forum Freshman Crimson_Scribe's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    39
    The reason Daniel can and does interpret dreams (and the reason Christ says that some are gifted with said interpretation) is that it is ‘from God’. The passage ghost quoted from Deuteronomy is a passage where Moses is expanding on the ‘no God but God’ commandment. The main idea can be summarized as ‘trust in God over tea leaves’.

    A bit off topic, but I’d also like to point out that there were Christian scientists who were also astrologers and alchemists – many were building the ‘Clock and Clockmaker’ idea Christians still use today. An excellent example is John Dee, a physicist and ‘diviner’ and possibly also an English spy (guys in those days apparently liked to cover their bases in the occupation department) – he was possibly the basis of Prospro in Shakespeare’s Tempest.

    Just thought I’d point that out.
    Theatre is the laboratory of the human soul. – Peter Brook
    Reply With Quote  
     

Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •