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Thread: Behemoths, satyrs, cockatrice, unicorns, dragons.

  1. #1 Behemoths, satyrs, cockatrice, unicorns, dragons. 
    ox
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    Any scientific explanations for these mystical beasties from the Bible?
    Reason I ask is because of a debate with creationists. One guy is even convinced that there are still unicorns in the world today.

    The behemoth could be a fossilised dinosaur.
    The satyr is a virile man with beard.
    The cockatrice is a sort of winged serpent with a cock's head.
    The unicorn could be an antelope, but only if viewed sideways.


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    Well fact has been said to be stranger than fiction. These beasties will no doubt exist in our future if "we" ever get there.

    A scientific explanation for imagination itself would be a fine thing though ,as usual it would be an ersatz creature.

    Edit :"behemoths" is one of those words that makes me cringe when I hear it pronounced "be hee moths"


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    So how do you pronounce Behemoth?

    Just noticed this interesting page:
    Monsters in the Bible - FreeThoughtPedia

    What disturbs me is that creationists believe these to have been real creatures. They will believe anything stated in the Bible. In the case of the cockatrice they say it was an adder, but other references do not support this.
    Rational explanations must include interpretations of fossilised creatures, like we have already discussed.
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    I pronounce the "e" short.

    I have a friend who went on a working holiday to US . She is called "Benig" (Ben eeg -its a French name) but they called her "Been ig" and I haven't stopped chortling since.

    (snobbery becomes me )

    Religious types don't worry me. My mother was one such but she kicked the habit and at the end was able to see off the "dying patient chasers" in the hospital who wanted to spread their salvation/consolation and told me she had realized there was "nothing to fear"

    It didn't stop her sister performing a religious ceremony as she passed away but she was unconscious at that point.
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    Moby Dick, reflecting much of the sensibilities and culture of the 19th century, had several references to whale bones in the mountains and poetic verses inferring the great flood when Leviathan's (aka whales) traveled than the entire globe.

    Ancient Greeks mistook dinosaur bones found in Egypt to be monsters, some tied and probably accounting for their wonderous mythology--some, along with other tales, probably being incorporated into Hebrew mythology which of course we find in the bible.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    Ancient Greeks mistook dinosaur bones found in Egypt to be monsters, some tied and probably accounting for their wonderous mythology--some, along with other tales, probably being incorporated into Hebrew mythology which of course we find in the bible.
    This fills a gap in my knowledge, and it seems there are less gaps in the fossil record than I thought.

    https://worldnewsdailyreport.com/pyr...-egyptologist/

    So the Flintstones cartoon series is based on fact! Humans really did walk with dinosaurs.
    I know, they died out 66 million years ago, but some could have survived, and were reared by the awesome Egyptians who turned them into gods. If the asteroid strike was on the Yucatan peninsula, then where was Africa at the time? Some could have survived by scavenging on the forest floor. The birds apparently did this, so why not bigger beasts.
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    I love the headlines at the side of this page. I could read them for days. I mean who would attempt oral sex on a rhino? Funniest stuff I've read in a while. The disclaimer at the bottom tells it all. These guys at World News rival the National Enquirer for ingenuity.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    I love the headlines at the side of this page. I could read them for days. I mean who would attempt oral sex on a rhino? Funniest stuff I've read in a while. The disclaimer at the bottom tells it all. These guys at World News rival the National Enquirer for ingenuity.
    Melania? (surely an improvement and she is used to both thick and thin skinned collaborators)

    Was wondering what a cockatrice was.
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    Melania? (surely an improvement and she is used to both thick and thin skinned collaborators)
    Stormy?

    . Cockatrice?
    Is that one more than a cockatoo?
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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    Look ,it's "cock a treece". I'm getting fed up now. (I won't have a word said against Stormy;she is doing the state some service now and I don't care if she is thick or thin skinned)
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    Cockatrice?
    Is that one more than a cockatoo?
    No, that's a Cockathrice as in Thrice Perfect Hermes.

    Further ahistorical evidence that humans walked with dinosaurs was found in the movie 1 Million Years BC, memorably starring Raquel Welch. Don't spoil it for me.
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    Don't know what point you are making Ox.

    I'm referring to many articles and books such as this that describe ancient Greece's attempt to recogncile fossil bones: https://press.princeton.edu/titles/9435.html
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    Lynx... By putting wings on some of these beasts, did our ancient palaeontologists put the connection between dinosaurs and birds together before modern day scientists did? Maybe there's something to be learned from these ancient fossil hunters and their concepts/ideas. Is Greece one of the places where evidence of feathered dinosaurs have been discovered? Then again, flying reptiles evidence?
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    Don't know what point you are making Ox.

    I'm referring to many articles and books such as this that describe ancient Greece's attempt to recogncile fossil bones: https://press.princeton.edu/titles/9435.html
    Elsewhere, I debate with creationists. These people do believe that humans and dinosaurs co-existed. They believe that carbon dating is flawed, evolution is a lie and unicorns are still around today. They believe that pairs of all animals found their way to Noah's Ark, but they are a bit reticent to confirm dinosaurs on board.
    I can't disprove anything they say. If human bones were found in the same undisturbed beds of rock as dinosaur bones, or fossil rabbits were found in the Carboniferous, then evolution might be wrong. So far it's always proved to be right, but they know it takes only one thing to cast doubt and then they will jumping up and down with joy.

    The book you mention doesn't always have good reviews.
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/customer-r...SIN=0691089779

    It does seem a big call to link fossils with all the gods of antiquity. Fossils are not easy to find unless they had dedicated hunters.
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    My inclination has always been the Behemoth is a beast that exists today. I'm torn between it being an elephant /hippo and a lion.
    You need to take in to account the mistakes in translation when reading bible passages.

    Take this line.. ​
    Behold, he drinketh up a river, and hasteth not: he trusteth that he can draw up Jordan into his mouth.
    He taketh it with his eyes: his nose pierceth through snares

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    Job 40:15 “Behold, Behemoth, which I made as I made you; he eats grass like an ox."

    Not sure when the Nile hippo became extinct, but the behemoth could also be a composite beast.
    I think you're right about translation mistakes when you consider that most people were illiterate, hearsay was relied upon and we don't have any original manuscripts.
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