Notices
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 100 of 114
Like Tree17Likes

Thread: Made in who's image?

  1. #1 Made in who's image? 
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Rather than what's traditionally taught, could man have made God(concept) in his image? If so, wouldn't the transitive property imply that we created ourselves? (Paradox?)


     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Anti-Crank AlexG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,809
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Rather than what's traditionally taught, could man have made God(concept) in his image?
    Ya think?


    shlunka likes this.
    Its the way nature is!
    If you dont like it, go somewhere else....
    To another universe, where the rules are simpler
    Philosophically more pleasing, more psychologically easy
    Prof Richard Feynman (1979) .....

    Das ist nicht nur nicht richtig, es ist nicht einmal falsch!"
     

  4. #3  
    Forum Professor scoobydoo1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    1,240
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Rather than what's traditionally taught...
    Are you referring specifically to the abrahamic tradition? If not, perhaps it would be clearer to readers which cultural/religious mythology and/or traditions you have in mind.
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Sophomore Eleven11's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    118
    White people usually see God, and Jesus, as being white...
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Yes, abrahamic. They seem more widespread.
     

  7. #6  
    Forum Masters Degree pavlos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    liverpool
    Posts
    715
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider
    Rather than what's traditionally taught indoctrinated, could man have made God(concept) in his image?
    (Fify.) Most definitely. Who else's image could man use, unless man wished to worship an animal god.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider
    If so, wouldn't the transitive property imply that we created ourselves? (Paradox?)
    No! Elements "a" and "b" are not related, That would be like saying the invisible and the visible are the same, one is but an imagined concept.
    We just evolved, no paradox there. Evolution is why man exists at all.
    LuciDreaming likes this.
    A logician saves the life of a tiny space alien. The alien is very grateful and, since she's omniscient, offers the following reward: she offers to answer any question the logician might pose. Without too much thought (after all, he's a logician), he asks: "What is the best question to ask and what is the correct answer to that question?" The tiny alien pauses. Finally she replies, "The best question is the one you just asked; and the correct answer is the one I gave."
     

  8. #7  
    New Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by pavlos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider
    Rather than what's traditionally taught indoctrinated, could man have made God(concept) in his image?
    (Fify.) Most definitely. Who else's image could man use, unless man wished to worship an animal god.
    Wouldn't that make Abrahamic god just a twisted form of humanism? It essentially rid western civilization of Animal gods, unless you count Angels.
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Masters Degree pavlos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    liverpool
    Posts
    715
    Quote Originally Posted by Zirconian_Zygote View Post
    Wouldn't that make Abrahamic god just a twisted form of humanism?
    How so! Humanism is a completely different thing entirely, humanism isn't a religion to start with. Humanism simply states that man looks after himself and his fellow man and doesn't look to an imaginary concept for help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zirconian_Zygote View Post
    It essentially rid western civilization of Animal gods, unless you count Angels.
    Why is that relevant? People can believe in whom or what they wish, it doesn't make their beliefs true in any way, shape or form. At the moment on British TV there is a woman who believes she can converse with Flies. Go figure. People can and will believe in crazy outrageous things.
    A logician saves the life of a tiny space alien. The alien is very grateful and, since she's omniscient, offers the following reward: she offers to answer any question the logician might pose. Without too much thought (after all, he's a logician), he asks: "What is the best question to ask and what is the correct answer to that question?" The tiny alien pauses. Finally she replies, "The best question is the one you just asked; and the correct answer is the one I gave."
     

  10. #9  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
    White people usually see God, and Jesus, as being white...
    My son michael joined the peace corp, went to the amazon basin of Ecuador. We went to visit him and 'his' village. Their concept of the devil was a tall white guy with a beard. I had raided goodwill, and brought down toys and tennis balls for the children. They took one look at me and ran away screaming.

    (sigh)
    Neverfly and babe like this.
     

  11. #10  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Rather than what's traditionally taught, could man have made God(concept) in his image? If so, wouldn't the transitive property imply that we created ourselves? (Paradox?)
    Reason is god's worst enemy. You are not helping fictional matters of the spirit.
     

  12. #11  
    Forum Professor scoobydoo1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    1,240
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Yes, abrahamic. They seem more widespread.
    Is the abrahamic genre/account more valid than other traditions for any particular reason other than being "more widespread"? Wouldn't it make more sense to look at different traditions found worldwide instead?

    There are accounts far older than the abrahamic genre, and not all of them depict their deities in humanoid form. There are even other traditions that describe them (deities) as anthropomorphic; ascribing emotions such as anger, jealousy, delight, and even humour to their behaviour. With so many cultural/religious belief systems both past and present, it would be a flawed approach to focus on a single tradition whilst ignoring the rest.

    Does your cultural upbringing subconsciously instill the more popular tradition as a default setting when wondering about "god"? I've once replied KALSTER's "Misconceptions made by..." thread earlier this year with the following; perhaps it might shed some light on why I said what I did then.

    Quote Originally Posted by scoobydoo1 View Post
    Some misconceptions or mistakes I've personally encountered online by those who hold an athestic stance often (either consciously or unconsciously; and as a byproduct of their culture and their limited exposure other religions/theistic belief systems) have a specific range of religions in mind when they speak of their atheism. And that seems more often than not; to be the abrahamic religions; the monotheistic variant. If religions are fruits, and the abrahamic genre are oranges; the manner in which they speak often gives me the impression that the only fruit they can think of are oranges. Gone are the apples, pears, and grapes, etc from how they formulate the way they both think and speak. It is either oranges or there are no fruits.

    How odd.
    sampson likes this.
     

  13. #12  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Why on earth would Isaiah 1:18 be in the bible, Torah, and Koran (google it in king James)- all those years of Sunday brainwashing have finally payed off.
     

  14. #13  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Quote Originally Posted by scoobydoo1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Yes, abrahamic. They seem more widespread.
    Is the abrahamic genre/account more valid than other traditions for any particular reason other than being "more widespread"?
    I choose to view it as a religious natural selection. Setting the scene: we all spread out from some part of east Africa, essentially finding different people,animals, and things to mindlessly worship. Over centuries; wars, famine, migration occur forcing humanity to adapt (in some cases to survive) which dropped certain religions while extolling others. In 2013, we have lost the majority of our original religions. Some become more dominant which give us the big three(Islam, Christianity, Judaism)and a few less dominant religions. Hinduism, Buddhism, legalism, etc... If you choose another way of validation beside population, you might use influence which would still give you the same list.
     

  15. #14  
    Forum Masters Degree pavlos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    liverpool
    Posts
    715
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Why on earth would Isaiah 1:18 be in the bible, Torah, and Koran (google it in king James)- all those years of Sunday brainwashing have finally payed off.
    Because they copy each other. look up Mithra. look up the epic of gilgamesh and then tell me you don't see any similarities. It's just one religion copying or following on from the other, there are after all 38.000 different version of Christianity, is it really that hard to comprehend why they are similar.
    A logician saves the life of a tiny space alien. The alien is very grateful and, since she's omniscient, offers the following reward: she offers to answer any question the logician might pose. Without too much thought (after all, he's a logician), he asks: "What is the best question to ask and what is the correct answer to that question?" The tiny alien pauses. Finally she replies, "The best question is the one you just asked; and the correct answer is the one I gave."
     

  16. #15  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    ...Reason is god's worst enemy. ... .
    Isaiah 1:18
    Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord
    So too in islam, "GOD" made us thinking animals so that we could reason.

    Worst enemy? perhaps, only for the narrow minded? Perhaps, reason is the ultimate key to understanding.
    Why waste it on negatives?
     

  17. #16  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Quote Originally Posted by pavlos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Why on earth would Isaiah 1:18 be in the bible, Torah, and Koran (google it in king James)- all those years of Sunday brainwashing have finally payed off.
    Because they copy each other. look up Mithra. look up the epic of gilgamesh and then tell me you don't see any similarities. It's just one religion copying or following on from the other, there are after all 38.000 different version of Christianity, is it really that hard to comprehend why they are similar.
    you misunderstand my point. That verse was referring to the post made by Sampson on reason. - I believe the consensus on abrahamic religions is that the three main versions, Christianity, Islam, and Judaism, hit a fork along the road Judaism was following. Christianity went left, while Islam bloomed to the right. Judaism just stayed as it was, unable to make a decision.
     

  18. #17  
    Forum Professor scoobydoo1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    1,240
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    I choose to view it as a religious natural selection. Setting the scene: we all spread out from some part of east Africa, essentially finding different people,animals, and things to mindlessly worship. Over centuries; wars, famine, migration occur forcing humanity to adapt (in some cases to survive) which dropped certain religions while extolling others. In 2013, we have lost the majority of our original religions. Some become more dominant which give us the big three(Islam, Christianity, Judaism)and a few less dominant religions. Hinduism, Buddhism, legalism, etc...

    If you choose another way of validation beside population, you might use influence which would still give you the same list.
    As I understand it, the religiosity of converted adherents depends on the (for lack of a more appropriate word) appeal, if not, the indoctrination of a belief system should adherents be born into it culturally. Former adherents who had left their religions do so because it no longer holds any appeal to them (from what I am able to gather).

    Since that is the case, the appeal or influence these traditions hold over their numbers isn't the most suitable means of evaluating the validity about the claims they make. I tend to view it as how popular and appealing a particular sport matters to fans of them. Soccer to my knowledge is currently the most popular sport in the world, but that does not make it more valid than other sports played both past and present.

    Validity in the context of this thread requires us to look beyond a single tradition even if it is currently the most dominant. Are the claims of the abrahamic tradition any more valid than the hindu tradition? Or are they both equally (in)valid?
     

  19. #18  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Quote Originally Posted by scoobydoo1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    I choose to view it as a religious natural selection. Setting the scene: we all spread out from some part of east Africa, essentially finding different people,animals, and things to mindlessly worship. Over centuries; wars, famine, migration occur forcing humanity to adapt (in some cases to survive) which dropped certain religions while extolling others. In 2013, we have lost the majority of our original religions. Some become more dominant which give us the big three(Islam, Christianity, Judaism)and a few less dominant religions. Hinduism, Buddhism, legalism, etc... If you choose another way of validation beside population, you might use influence which would still give you the same list.
    As I understand it, the religiosity of converted adherents depends on the (for lack of a more appropriate word) appeal, if not, the indoctrination of a belief system should adherents be born into it culturally. Former adherents who had left their religions do so because it no longer holds any appeal to them (from what I am able to gather).Since that is the case, the appeal or influence these traditions hold over their numbers isn't the most suitable means of evaluating the validity about the claims they make. I tend to view it as how popular and appealing a particular sport matters to fans of them. Soccer to my knowledge is currently the most popular sport in the world, but that does not make it more valid than other sports played both past and present.Validity in the context of this thread requires us to look beyond a single tradition even if it is currently the most dominant. Are the claims of the abrahamic tradition any more valid than the hindu tradition? Or are they both equally (in)valid?
    I'm curious, how do you determine validity, and validity in what context?
     

  20. #19  
    Forum Professor scoobydoo1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    1,240
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    I'm curious, how do you determine validity, and validity in what context?
    In a discussion or contemplation about a deity (singular) or deities (plural), to evaluate which the many traditions both past and present are (more?) valid requires us to put them all equally side by side to determine which can present more compelling evidence if belief is to be expected. If either side can provide equally compelling evidence for belief, then they are equally valid. If neither side can provide sufficiently compelling evidence for belief, then they are equally invalid. The appeal, indoctrinativeness, or influence of numbers by a tradition isn't the best way to do this, because it relies heavily on preference (for appeal) and/or susceptibility (for indoctrination).

    This is one of the reasons why I asked what makes the abrahamic tradition more valid than other traditions found across the world; both past and present. More valid in that the abrahamic tradition being the only one considered when thinking about god(s) and "made in who's image".
    pavlos likes this.
     

  21. #20  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    ...Reason is god's worst enemy. ... .
    Isaiah 1:18
    Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord
    So too in islam, "GOD" made us thinking animals so that we could reason.

    Worst enemy? perhaps, only for the narrow minded? Perhaps, reason is the ultimate key to understanding.
    Why waste it on negatives?
    One is only fooling themselves when they try and pull a single verse out of the context it was written in order to back a flawed agenda. They are double fooling themselves when pulling it out of a religious book. If you want to educate yourself go read the Book of Isaiah...or at least the chapter 1 , then you will realize the fool you have made of yourself. Then, you may one day recognize,not one god has ever made anything without the imagination of mankind. What are we talking here, ...reality or fairytales? ...............................................Nar row minded? Well it is your call, it was a Martin Luther quote. The whole quote,
    “Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but more frequently than not struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God.”
    Is the mother of all IRONY that Martin Luther considered Reason an enemy.
     

  22. #21  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    ...Reason is god's worst enemy. ... .
    Isaiah 1:18
    Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord
    So too in islam, "GOD" made us thinking animals so that we could reason.Worst enemy? perhaps, only for the narrow minded? Perhaps, reason is the ultimate key to understanding.Why waste it on negatives?
    One is only fooling themselves when they try and pull a single verse out of the context it was written in order to back a flawed agenda. They are double fooling themselves when pulling it out of a religious book. If you want to educate yourself go read the Book of Isaiah...or at least the chapter 1 , then you will realize the fool you have made of yourself. Then, you may one day recognize,not one god has ever made anything without the imagination of mankind. What are we talking here, ...reality or fairytales? ..............................................Narr ow minded? Well it is your call, it was a Martin Luther quote. The whole quote,
    “Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but more frequently than not struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God.”
    Is the mother of all IRONY that Martin Luther considered Reason an enemy.
    what you say is true, in a logical world, but we do not live in that world. We are arguing about the Abrahamic gods on their territory. Every verse is irrevocable and holds truth independently as well. (God's holy word clause)I trust that you've sat through at least one half wit sermon? Preachers throw around disembodied references left and right . (Divine interpretation)
     

  23. #22  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    [QUOTE=Dreamraider;436370][QUOTE=sampson;436368]
    what you say is true, in a logical world, but we do not live in that world. We are arguing about the Abrahamic gods on their territory. Every verse is irrevocable and holds truth independently as well. (God's holy word clause)I trust that you've sat through at least one half wit sermon? Preachers throw around disembodied references left and right . (Divine interpretation)
    Hmmm... I do not have the cerebrum switch to disconnect (as the duck says). I am forced to live in the logical world. As Scooby has told you, one can not study the Geologic history of the Grand Canyon by only analyzing the Kaibab Limestone top layer.
     

  24. #23  
    Malignant Pimple shlunka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Dogbox in front of Dywyddyr's house.
    Posts
    1,786
    I feel sorry for God if it looks like me, poor ugly bastard.
    "MODERATOR NOTE : We don't entertain trolls here, not even in the trash can. Banned." -Markus Hanke
     

  25. #24  
    Forum Masters Degree pavlos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    liverpool
    Posts
    715
    Quote Originally Posted by shlunka View Post
    I feel sorry for God if it looks like me, poor ugly bastard.
    Mix you and me and all the fugly bastards on this planet, and you'll get what gods image actually is. Frightening!
    A logician saves the life of a tiny space alien. The alien is very grateful and, since she's omniscient, offers the following reward: she offers to answer any question the logician might pose. Without too much thought (after all, he's a logician), he asks: "What is the best question to ask and what is the correct answer to that question?" The tiny alien pauses. Finally she replies, "The best question is the one you just asked; and the correct answer is the one I gave."
     

  26. #25  
    AI's Have More Fun Bad Robot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Washington state
    Posts
    6,114
    Quote Originally Posted by shlunka View Post
    I feel sorry for God if it looks like me, poor ugly bastard.
    As far as I know, no God has ever talked to any human. But if I was a God, I'd probably use a human avatar to help facilitate communication with humans. Only makes sense. But would I choose just a few humans to deliver my most important message about how all humans can save their immortal souls? That doesn't seem reasonable as any God would know, humans are not very reliable and most of them lie about many things everyday and they die after a relatively short life.

    Again if I was the God to all humans, I would make sure each and every human knew me personally. Knew what I expected of them and how I want them to live their lives.

    Well I've never had that conversation with a God, and neither has anybody else I know.
     

  27. #26  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    IMHO: The concept of an interactive god that participates in the lives of (wo)men is insanity.
    By extension, those who (have) claim(ed) such interaction/communication are also insane.
    (but, then again, I could be wrong)
     

  28. #27  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    IMHO: The concept of an interactive god that participates in the lives of (wo)men is insanity.
    By extension, those who (have) claim(ed) such interaction/communication are also insane.
    (but, then again, I could be wrong)
    Someone is wrong ...or insane. Either you or Robot, ...or the popes, bishops, and cardinals John Paul II on brink of sainthood after second miracle approved, report says - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) There really is no doubt which.
     

  29. #28  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Hell man, I talk to "GOD" on a regular basis
    but then again, I just may be insane, (I also talk to myself, but neither me nor "GOD" talks back)
    and the pope is employed by millions of loonies
    If you gotta be nuts, it's nice to be able to make a living at it
     

  30. #29  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Hell man, I talk to "GOD" on a regular basis
    That's a supposition on your part.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  31. #30  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    actually, just a subjective activity
    if
    I thought "GOD" was hanging on my every word, that would be a supposition
     

  32. #31  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    actually, just a subjective activity
    if
    I thought "GOD" was hanging on my every word, that would be a supposition
    No, it's a supposition.
    You may well be talking, but you're just assuming that there's a god and that he's listening.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  33. #32  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    actually, I make no such supposition
    I started yelling at god as a spoof
    and found it fun
    so
    i ofttimes make weather recommendations
    and the often "thanks for another great day"

    though a theist, i have no expectations of interaction
    If "GOD" is listening, I just may have pissed her off, but I ain't gonna change based on fear
    (this ain't gotta make sense to you)
    hell man, i ain't got a logical justification, for my art nor for my actions as/re "GOD"
    I do it because I like to do it
     

  34. #33  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    actually, I make no such supposition
    I started yelling at god as a spoof
    Oops, supposition again.
    You weren't yelling "at god", just yelling.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  35. #34  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    subjective!
    If i refuse to define "GOD" then supposition is meaningless
    I also talk to the clay when I'm sculpting/modeling
    Do I expect an interaction?, or just a reformulating of expectations?
    I always expect the clay to do what my hands force upon it. When I tlk to the clay, I am indirectly talking to my neural connections to my hands.
    Sometimes, the hands do their thing with little conscious input(and that is where art is born). I imagine what i want to see, and they facilitate the desire. Sometimes it just ain't working like I want it to, and rather than talk to my neural pathways and muscles controlling the hands, I talk to the clay, demanding it's cooperation. or asking it what it has in mind. I do not think the clay thinks. It is mearly a way for me to understand what is happening. The best communication happens when I stop demanding communication and just be--in the moment--no thought--no control, and yet completely in control.
    "GOD" is an understanding of proclivity toward pattern. When I feel the pattern, all makes sense and yet no sense is made.

    This is something that eludes description. Ergo always the quotes "______ " fill in the blanks as your heart dictates.
    Do not do it with the "conscious" mind. Just do without doing!
     

  36. #35  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Hell man, I talk to "GOD" on a regular basis
    but then again, I just may be insane, (I also talk to myself, but neither me nor "GOD" talks back)
    and the pope is employed by millions of loonies
    If you gotta be nuts, it's nice to be able to make a living at it
    Which god do you think you were talking to? Now, question yourself as to why you chose that particular god out of millions. It will be interesting to see if the new pope buy's the fraud. He should label it as what it is, a fraud, the action of greed to take advantage of the gullible. If he goes along with this, then he will become the top dog and the most guilty. Meanwhile 25% of the world population cheer the shamanism on.
     

  37. #36  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Hell man, I talk to "GOD" on a regular basis
    but then again, I just may be insane, (I also talk to myself, but neither me nor "GOD" talks back)
    and the pope is employed by millions of loonies
    If you gotta be nuts, it's nice to be able to make a living at it
    Which god do you think you were talking to? Now, question yourself as to why you chose that particular god out of millions. It will be interesting to see if the new pope buy's the fraud. He should label it as what is, a fraud, the action of greed to take advantage of the gullible. If he goes along with this, then he will become the top dog and the most guilty. Meanwhile 25% of the world population cheer the shamanism on.
    The pope is the head of a church which comforts the dying and cares for the sick. He has a demanding position as a ceo of a multinational collective/
    I may deride the collective from time to time as I eschew the concept theism through an established clergy. I think they have found a way to comfort their fellow man. But think no intercession between man and "god" is meaningful as an understanding of "god", and may well actually preclude that understanding.

    When I "talk to god" I am not talking to anything that you would imagine as "god". It is an idiosyncratic communication between me and my inderstanding of that which I see as "god" which eludes definition.
    Hell man, If I could explain it, I'd write a new "bible" and let future generations debate the words.
    I find it entertaining that the word "Bible" comes from the greek word biblos, which is from a city of the jews' long time enemies(phoenecians-philistines). Kind of a peculiar irony there.
     

  38. #37  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    14,168
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
    White people usually see God, and Jesus, as being white...
    And speaking English.
     

  39. #38  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by John Galt View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
    White people usually see God, and Jesus, as being white...
    And speaking English.
    What language does a dead pope speak when asking god for miracles? The vatican cult shamans speak to the dead in what language? Why do other gov'ts tolerate this primitive BS from the vatican, when any other gov't would be laughed out of existence? Saint my @ss.
     

  40. #39  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by John Galt View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
    White people usually see God, and Jesus, as being white...
    And speaking English.
    What language does a dead pope speak when asking god for miracles? The vatican cult shamans speak to the dead in what language? Why do other gov'ts tolerate this primitive BS from the vatican, when any other gov't would be laughed out of existence? Saint my @ss.
    its a matter of relativity, since they look at most modern sciences the same way you described their "cult".
     

  41. #40  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by John Galt View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
    White people usually see God, and Jesus, as being white...
    And speaking English.
    What language does a dead pope speak when asking god for miracles? The vatican cult shamans speak to the dead in what language? Why do other gov'ts tolerate this primitive BS from the vatican, when any other gov't would be laughed out of existence? Saint my @ss.
    its a matter of relativity, since they look at most modern sciences the same way you described their "cult".
    No, they don't. They (the vatican)take full advantage of modern science. Look at the popemobile. They know that their god that they lie can cure the ill and make saints can not protect them from bullets.
     

  42. #41  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamraider View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sampson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by John Galt View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Eleven11 View Post
    White people usually see God, and Jesus, as being white...
    And speaking English.
    What language does a dead pope speak when asking god for miracles? The vatican cult shamans speak to the dead in what language? Why do other gov'ts tolerate this primitive BS from the vatican, when any other gov't would be laughed out of existence? Saint my @ss.
    its a matter of relativity, since they look at most modern sciences the same way you described their "cult".
    No, they don't. They (the vatican)take full advantage of modern science. Look at the popemobile. They know that their god that they lie can cure the ill and make saints can not protect them from bullets.
    there is a clear difference between engineering and modern "science".here is some work by an acquaintance of mine. Engineering Is Not Science - IEEE Spectrum. Show the pope some cloning, GMO (s), stem cell research, gene splicing between humans and animals, a star system farther than six thousand light years away, the true fossil record, etc... ,and he will have a "holy" seizure. Hell, his whole cult won't touch anything by Dawkins, let alone Darwin.
     

  43. #42  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Why do atheist feel this almost constant need to discuss "GOD" and Religion?

    Maybe it's akin to old men talking about sex?
     

  44. #43  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Why do atheist feel this almost constant need to discuss "GOD" and Religion?
    Source please... :P
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  45. #44  
    Forum Freshman Dreamraider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga(US)/ Zurich, Switzerland
    Posts
    59
    Im not sure if that's a reference to me, Dawkins, or Darwin. As for me, I consider myself an agnostic. After reading some of Dawkins' work I'm pretty sure it's an envy. He seeks the bliss of ignorance religion causes, but is too enlightened to take part in it. It's a sort of , "if I can't have it, most of the population shouldn't either".
     

  46. #45  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Why do atheist feel this almost constant need to discuss "GOD" and Religion?
    Source please... :P
    Is that "request" your concept of humor?
     

  47. #46  
    Anti-Crank AlexG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,809
    Most threads on atheism I've seen have been opened by theists wanting to bash atheists.
    Its the way nature is!
    If you dont like it, go somewhere else....
    To another universe, where the rules are simpler
    Philosophically more pleasing, more psychologically easy
    Prof Richard Feynman (1979) .....

    Das ist nicht nur nicht richtig, es ist nicht einmal falsch!"
     

  48. #47  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Why do atheist feel this almost constant need to discuss "GOD" and Religion?
    Source please... :P
    Is that "request" your concept of humor?
    Perhaps it was too highbrow for you.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  49. #48  
    Forum Junior sampson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Why do atheist feel this almost constant need to discuss "GOD" and Religion?

    Maybe it's akin to old men talking about sex?
    I admit it is one of my favorite subjects to "deep" discuss with a knowledgeable religious person. Probably two reasons, 1) It is illogical, yet so many have fell and continue to fall for the hoax. It would shock you, and you will not believe me that a high % of religious leaders will admit to that under questioning. A lot are in it for the easy money. 2) Having studied the human nature of the subject for 50 odd years, I know a great deal about the subject, and get a mental rush from the exercise. However sex, tennis , and fishing, are better.
     

  50. #49  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Why do atheist feel this almost constant need to discuss "GOD" and Religion?
    Source please... :P
    Is that "request" your concept of humor?
    Perhaps it was too highbrow for you.
    fersure dadio
    if'n y'all didn't see it in the myriad threads on the subject in these forums,
    then, yeh, fersure dadio, way over my head.

    ---------------------- it has been said that "GOD" createn man in "GOD's" own image
    and i always add
    Man, completely incapable of understanding 'GOD" created gods in man's own image.

    ---------------
    I consider myself a theist, and have been called "a sacriligious son of a bitch" by a baptist chaplin whose faith i challenged.
    As sampson has indicated, many of the clergy really do not have faith in their professed/professional faith.
    All that aside, IMHO the question remains unanswerable if only viewed by the logic of the conscious mind.

    I too, enjoy watching the philosophical discussions, and appreciate the peculiarity of certain responses to certain points within the discussion.

    thanx
     

  51. #50  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    fersure dadio
    if'n y'all didn't see it in the myriad threads on the subject in these forums,
    then, yeh, fersure dadio, way over my head.
    No worries - I didn't realise that you have....problems.
    In future, I'll dumb it down even further for you.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  52. #51  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    fersure dadio
    if'n y'all didn't see it in the myriad threads on the subject in these forums,
    then, yeh, fersure dadio, way over my head.
    No worries - I didn't realise that you have....problems.
    In future, I'll dumb it down even further for you.
    As you like.
    dumb it down. intillectualize it up. humm it or sing it, rant and rave, or sit in the mute silence of awe
    You'll never be able to communicat that which is incommunicatable.
    But, go ahead and try anyway.
     

  53. #52  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Man, completely incapable of understanding 'GOD" created gods in man's own image.
    You'd have to show that there is a god for this to be true.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  54. #53  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    no
    this is a science forum
    You must prove the null hypothesis


    jeez dadio
    follow the bouncing ball wouldja
     

  55. #54  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    no
    this is a science forum
    You must prove the null hypothesis
    Sheer nonsense.
    There's a claim implicit in your statement - that claim being that god exists.
    It's on YOU (having made the claim) to support this.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  56. #55  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    implicit? fersure in your warped egomaniacal mind \

    Let us examine the claimed above-------placed back in context for those interested in truth and accuracy.

    What I actually keyboarded in:
    it has been said that "GOD" created man in "GOD's" own image
    and i always add
    Man, completely incapable of understanding 'GOD" created gods in man's own image.
    Has it not indeed been said that "God created man in GOD's own image?

    Is it not also true that man has created "gods' in man's own image?

    If anyone in here is capable of understanding "GOD", or the concept "GOD";
    let him speak now or forever hold his speech.

    Wherein the above does your warped contrarian mind find fault?
     

  57. #56  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    implicit?
    Yes:
    Man, completely incapable of understanding 'GOD"
    For something to be understood (or even require understanding) it first needs to exist (in some form or another).

    Has it not indeed been said that "God created man in GOD's own image?
    Is it not also true that man has created "gods' in man's own image?
    If anyone in here is capable of understanding "GOD", or the concept "GOD";
    let him speak now or forever hold his speech.
    Wherein the above does your warped contrarian mind find fault?
    I've already pointed out the fault: god has not been shown to exist.
    If there is no god then he/ it/ she/ whatever doesn't require understanding.
    pavlos likes this.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  58. #57  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    You are still making broad assumptions to what it is that you thought I had keyboarded in instead of actually taking the entirety of what it is that i am communicating into account.

    Perhaps, that suits your arguementative nature. Or it may just be a really warped style of non communication.
    The problem arises that if we do cherry pick partial communications and focus our(your) feeble intellects on those bits and pieces, You essentially end up argueing with your own fantasies.

    Where, exactly did I ever claim that your perverted concept "GOD" actually exists?
    You seem to have a ready made definition of that which you would consider "GOD"

    Perhaps, then You are the one(and only) human who actually understands "GOD" or the concept "GOD".
    Which I doubt.

    So, as I understand it, You have created some concept called "GOD" which you then deny the existence of.
    Are you not, in so doing creating an internal mentalmasturbatory game wherein you are arguing with yourself?
    And seemingly haveing some perverted desire to get me involved in your internal arguement> caveat--I only have a bachelors degree in psychology.

    If you would stylize yourself as an atheist. Follow through with that self definition, and be completely without "GOD"s.
    In your speech, in your keyboarded words, and in your thoughts, You betray yourself by creating then denying your own fantasies.

    Included among which, are your fantasies of(and about) what it is that my words actually signify.

    If you would seek "GOD" start by throwing out any of your prejudiced concepts of "GOD".
    or
    wallow in your delusional fantasies to your mind's contentment.
    ..................................
    In all likelyhood:
    No matter what definition you can come up with for your concept "GOD", I would deny the accuracy of your definition.
    That being said:
    define away and let us wander down this thorny path, hand in hand and mind to mind.
     

  59. #58  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    You are still making broad assumptions to what it is that you thought I had keyboarded in instead of actually taking the entirety of what it is that i am communicating into account.
    Then you should express yourself with clarity.

    Where, exactly did I ever claim that your perverted concept "GOD" actually exists?
    You seem to have a ready made definition of that which you would consider "GOD"
    Let me try again:
    For something to be understood (or even require understanding) it first needs to exist (in some form or another).

    So, as I understand it, You have created some concept called "GOD" which you then deny the existence of.
    Wrong again.
    YOU put the word "god" into your sentence.

    If you would stylize yourself as an atheist. Follow through with that self definition, and be completely without "GOD"s.
    And your point here is...?

    In your speech, in your keyboarded words, and in your thoughts, You betray yourself by creating then denying your own fantasies.
    Oops, wrong.

    If you would seek "GOD" start by throwing out any of your prejudiced concepts of "GOD".
    There you go again: this presupposes that there is a god to search for 1.
    And that has yet to be shown.

    Oh, by the way:
    If anyone in here is capable of understanding "GOD", or the concept "GOD";
    let him speak now or forever hold his speech.
    What makes you think that no one understands the concept of god?
    Especially since, evidence to the contrary lacking, that concept is entirely a human construct.

    1 Unless, of course, you're prepared to grant that it's a wild goose chase...
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  60. #59  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    No matter what definition you can come up with for your concept "GOD", I would deny the accuracy of your definition.
    How about: an as yet (despite millenia of claims) not shown to exist supernatural entity, supposedly (according to some believers) responsible for the creation of Earth, life and much else.
    Believed in, to varying degrees, by many, with not one shred of actual evidence to support those beliefs.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  61. #60  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    much else
    perhaps, just a tad vague?
     

  62. #61  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    much else
    perhaps, just a tad vague?
    Nice diversion...
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor
    No matter what definition you can come up with for your concept "GOD", I would deny the accuracy of your definition.
    I don't have a concept of god - all I'm going on is publicly-stated stated claims.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  63. #62  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    publicly
    ------------
    There was a rather peculiar fellow many years ago, who wore off-white robes and stood on a wooden box haranging passersby to repent and save their souls.

    OK so you formulated your concept/opinion of "GOD" from the public ravings, of whom, may I ask?

    ....................
    incidentially, I've never bought into the "supernatural" rap.
    I woul'd invision(if anything) something more closely described as "supreemly or pithily natural".
    ..............
    as/re
    For something to be understood (or even require understanding) it first needs to exist (in some form or another).
    Neither you nor I am/are the final arbiters as to what does or does not exist. Of which, I've adapted a rather insouciant approach(as, I believe so should you as/re "GOD")
    ...........
    as/re:
    What makes you think that no one understands the concept of god?
    I have yet to find a definitive declaritive concept with which I concure.

    I think the early TAOist had something close. And, have an as yet undifferentiated notion that one understandable aspect would best be defined as a proclivity toward pattern.
     

  64. #63  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    OK so you formulated your concept/opinion of "GOD" from the public ravings, of whom, may I ask?
    And another diversion.

    incidentially, I've never bought into the "supernatural" rap.
    I woul'd invision(if anything) something more closely described as "supreemly or pithily natural".
    Ah right.
    And you got this from... where, exactly?
    BTW, inventing your own terminology - "supreemly or pithily natural" - doesn't help your case. WTF does that actually mean?

    Neither you nor I am/are the final arbiters as to what does or does not exist. Of which, I've adapted a rather insouciant approach(as, I believe so should you as/re "GOD")
    Bullshit.
    YOU have made claims about "god".
    For these claims to have ANY validity then this "god" thing has to be shown to conform to these claims.

    I have yet to find a definitive declaritive concept with which I concure.
    So what?
    Your particular interpretation doesn't appear to tally with the generally accepted ones.
    Bearing in mind, of, course, that neither your version nor the "regular" one has yet been shown to exist.

    I think the early TAOist had something close. And, have an as yet undifferentiated notion that one understandable aspect would best be defined as a proclivity toward pattern.
    So what?

    You persist in making claims (however vague) about god, yet have not shown that either A) this god exists nor B) that it actually matches your claims.
    Last edited by Dywyddyr; July 10th, 2013 at 04:02 PM.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  65. #64  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    you do understand the word "pithy" ?
     

  66. #65  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    you do understand the word "pithy" ?
    You do know you're talking bollocks?

    I'll ask again:
    BTW, inventing your own terminology - "supreemly or pithily natural" - doesn't help your case. WTF does that actually mean?
    Last edited by Dywyddyr; July 10th, 2013 at 04:31 PM.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  67. #66  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    I invented none of those words dadio
    honest
    But, I am literate
    and, it means precisely what it means.

    shall i rephrase?
    bear in mind that any rephrasing diminishes the breadth and depth of the original.

    Think that all is at its' core and origins and proclivities and evolution of/for and within all of reality including nature.
    Using meaningless words like "supernatural" is the hallmark of a lazy mind.

    Of course, you could find something, anything that you could describe as supernatural,(but, you'd of necessity be wrong)
    because
    We are all natural, each and every deluded one of us is natural. How then can we supersede that essential nature into the silly concept supernatural?
    Is not all(including our thoughts, language, maths, etc...)derived from nature and thereby natural?
    So too our religions.

    Magic only seems magical to those who are ignorant.
     

  68. #67  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    I invented none of those words dadio
    Ah, sorry, I didn't realise that your comprehension was so poor.
    I asked about the terminology, not the individual words.

    But, I am literate
    Given your numerous misspellings, lousy punctuation/ capitalisation and contorted usage of English I'm not sure.

    and, it means precisely what it means.
    I'll try again.
    What makes it anything other than "merely" natural?
    If it's anything OTHER than "merely" natural then, by definition it's supernatural.
    In other words what the f*ck does "supremely or pithily natural" mean?

    shall i rephrase?
    Please do so.

    bear in mind that any rephrasing diminishes the breadth and depth of the original.
    Will it reduce the inane meaninglessness?

    Think that all is at the core and origins and proclivities and evolution of all reality including nature.
    What?
    Could you employ your literacy and rewrite that in English?

    We are all natural, each and every deluded one of us is natural. How then can we supersede that essential nature into the silly concept supernatural?
    Is not all(including our thoughts, language, maths, etc...)derived from nature and therby natural?
    So too our religions.
    Magic only seems magical to those who are ignorant.
    Oh wait, you may have rephrased something, but you certainly haven't rephrased your meaningless term "supremely or pithily natural".
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  69. #68  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    and, it means precisely what it means.
    ...says Humpty Dumpty.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  70. #69  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    lol
     

  71. #70  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    as/re
    In other words what the f*ck does "supremely or pithily natural" mean?

    again, a simplified rephrasing loosing much of the meaning
    "of necessity, natural" and the fountainhead of nature, and beyond perceived nature in an all inclusive embrace of all that we do know and all that we do not know. But not in the least defined by the meaningless word "supernatural".
    how about using supercalifragilisticexpialidocious instead of supernatural?

    .......................
    spelling, caps, punctuation etc... yeh yeh yeh, ain't none of that my strong suite.
    live with it or put me on ignore.
     

  72. #71  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    as/re
    Please stop using this non-literate and pretentious "phrase".

    and beyond perceived nature in an all inclusive embrace of all that we do know and all that we do not know.
    Er...
    But not in the least defined by the meaningless word "supernatural".
    Bullshit.
    Supernatural:
    Adjective

    (of a manifestation or event) Attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature.

    how about using supercalifragilisticexpialidocious instead of supernatural?
    How about you learn English?

    spelling, caps, punctuation etc... yeh yeh yeh, ain't none of that my strong suite.
    In other words literacy isn't your strong "suite".
    Oh, and neither is grammar.

    Regardless, there's just as much evidence for "supremely or pithily natural" as there is for the supernatural.
    One meaningless invented term is just as good as another. (Except that the one-word variant is more readily fitted into context).
    Please support your claim.
    Last edited by Dywyddyr; July 10th, 2013 at 05:54 PM.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  73. #72  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by Dywyddyr View Post
    ... Attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature. ... .
    beyond the laws of nature
    ok
    name one
    name something
    name anything that is beyond the laws of nature
     

  74. #73  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dywyddyr View Post
    ... Attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature. ... .
    beyond the laws of nature
    ok
    name one
    name something
    name anything that is beyond the laws of nature
    Smaug.
    Dywyddyr likes this.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  75. #74  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    purely natural
    air inversion trapping polutants whether they be natural directly from nature or man made(another form of natural)
     

  76. #75  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    beyond the laws of nature
    ok
    name one
    name something
    name anything that is beyond the laws of nature
    Oh, you missed the point.
    Again.
    YOUR OWN DEFINITION equates to exactly that:
    You: beyond perceived nature
    Definition of supernatural: Attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding

    How does your "supremely and pithily natural" differ from actual nature?
    By requiring (or being given) a different definition.
    If it's natural it's natural.
    If it's anything other then it's not f*cking natural.
    Ergo supernatural.
    And, by your own "logic" 1 doesn't exist.

    1 Well, half of it anyway - you persist in arguing two mutually exclusive positions at the same time (on more than one subject).
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  77. #76  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    purely natural
    You want an example of a purely natural supernatural being?!?
    And since when has that been part of the definition of 'supernatural'?

    "Attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature..."
    Nope. No mention of requiring it to be natural.

    You wanted an example of something supernatural.
    I provided one.


    I misunderstood your reply.
    Last edited by RedPanda; July 10th, 2013 at 07:13 PM.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  78. #77  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    purely natural
    air inversion trapping polutants whether they be natural directly from nature or man made(another form of natural)
    What?
    WTF does this post refer to?
    Oh, wait.
    It's your phenomenal literacy coming into play again, isn't it?
    You thought Red Panda meant smog.
    (And your "explanation" is incomplete to the point of being wrong).

    Try these: smog, Smaug.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  79. #78  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by Dywyddyr View Post
    You thought Red Panda meant smog.
    Aaahh...yes. I think you're correct. I hadn't realised.

    I just thought his second sentence was another of his elaborate 'typos'.

    Maybe Smaug was too esoteric......despite the book being translated into 40 languages, sold over 35 million copies and been made into 4 films.
    PhDemon likes this.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  80. #79  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    yer right
    I had thought he misspelled smog

    what is smaug?

    is not "scientific understanding" increasing exponentially?

    so todays "beyond"
    is tomorrows old hat

    Is the internal combustion engine supernatural?
    It was once beyond scientific understanding
     

  81. #80  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    what is smaug?
    The word was linked. Read that link.

    is not "scientific understanding" increasing exponentially?
    And the relevance of this would be... what?

    so todays "beyond"
    is tomorrows old hat
    So what?
    Your claim stated specifically beyond perceived nature.
    The definition of supernatural gave beyond scientific understanding.

    Going further, are you now claiming that science will understand (or even verify the existence of) god?

    Is the internal combustion engine supernatural?
    It was once beyond scientific understanding
    Er, if there had been an internal combustion engine available before there was any scientific explanation of it were possible then it would have been regarded as supernatural. For the simple reason that is would have been (one more time) beyond scientific understanding.
    And STILL waiting for you to support your claim...
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  82. #81  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    what is smaug?
    Are Dywyddyr's links not good enough?
    Is Google broken?
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  83. #82  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    naw
    just finding it difficult to actually care enough to take the link
    ............
    ok curiousity got the better of me
    a fictional character
    (sigh)
    is fiction un-natural?
    Last edited by sculptor; July 10th, 2013 at 08:59 PM.
     

  84. #83  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Go to bed - your comprehension is deteriorating rapidly.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  85. #84  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    yeh
    dream of something, anything that violates the "laws of nature"
    lemme know if you find one
    ouzo might help?
     

  86. #85  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    a fictional character
    (sigh)
    is fiction un-natural?
    Smaug is a supernatural being.
    Smaug fits the definition: "Attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature."
    There is no part of the definition that says "It must exist."

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    lemme know if you find one
    Smaug.
    Last edited by RedPanda; July 11th, 2013 at 06:11 AM.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  87. #86  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    14,168
    Moderator Pre-warning: Several posts in this thread are verging on containing or being ad hominems. Please tread carefully. Sculptor and Dywyddr, this means you.
     

  88. #87  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    So, red, even if intended as a fictional creation for the entertainment of children a story can have "supernatural" characters.
    So too the assumed fictional personalities presented on these forums?

    Whereas, I had assumed the position that all creations of "natural" beings, by being derived from nature would be natural.

    It seems that we have come back around to "gods" created in man's own image, which would then be naturally supernatural.
    The imprecision of the language ofttimes astounds me. Naturally un-natural, supernaturally natural, un-naturally supernatural, supernaturally un-natural...etc...
    Jeez

    Once again, it would seem that perspective rears it's ugly head delinating realistic fantasies from fantastic realities.

    This horse may not be dead, but it certainly is covered with flies and stinking to high heaven. Maybe we should stop flogging it?
     

  89. #88  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    So, red, even if intended as a fictional creation for the entertainment of children a story can have "supernatural" characters.
    If they fit the defintion of 'Supernatural' then yes. Of course.

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    So too the assumed fictional personalities presented on these forums?
    If they fit the defintion of 'Supernatural' then yes. Of course.

    Seriously, have you still not read the definition of 'supernatural' yet?
    It has been posted many times.
    Are you still unable to grasp its meaning?

    Where does it say that supernatural beings MUST exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Whereas, I had assumed the position that all creations of "natural" beings, by being derived from nature would be natural.
    So, since Smaug was created by a (natural) man, you think that a fire-breathing, 400 year old, jewel encrusted, talking dragon is also natural.

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    It seems that we have come back around to "gods" created in man's own image, which would then be naturally supernatural.
    Only if you intentionally equivocate on the meaning of the word 'naturally' - which is seems you do.

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    The imprecision of the language ofttimes astounds me. Naturally un-natural, supernaturally natural, un-naturally supernatural, supernaturally un-natural...etc...
    It would probably help if you were literate.

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Once again, it would seem that perspective rears it's ugly head delinating realistic fantasies from fantastic realities.
    So, you think that dragons are realistic, do you.

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    This horse may not be dead, but it certainly is covered with flies and stinking to high heaven. Maybe we should stop flogging it?
    If you are so bored of being wrong, then why don't you stop?
    Dywyddyr likes this.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  90. #89  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    So, red, even if intended as a fictional creation for the entertainment of children a story can have "supernatural" characters.
    So too the assumed fictional personalities presented on these forums?
    Whereas, I had assumed the position that all creations of "natural" beings, by being derived from nature would be natural.
    I keep reading this and I've come to the conclusion that my browser is suffering some sort of glitch.
    It's apparent that Sculptor is replying to a post that isn't available to me.
    If someone would do me the favour of quoting the post that Sculptor is referring to (since it has zero relevance to anything that I can see) I'd be grateful.
    PS I'm not ruling out the possibility that Sculptor is replying to a post or point that's only visible in his own head, but I thought it worth asking...
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  91. #90  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    duck
    did you not get the memo?
    you were supposed to "clean it up"
    (no, duck, it ain't your browser, it's your brain)

    follow the bouncing ball would'ya

    red
    I do not actually beleive smaug exists beyond the realm of fiction and story telling
    which segues us into the position duck will find comfortable as regards "GOD"

    (psst, that's why I eschew definitions, excepting potential views of proclivity toward pattern)
    Last edited by sculptor; July 11th, 2013 at 01:50 PM.
     

  92. #91  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Your reply barely makes sense and in no way addresses my post.

    Your grasp of English is as tenuous as your grasp of reality.
    PhDemon likes this.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  93. #92  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    lol

    I do not actually beleive smaug exists beyond the realm of fiction and story telling
    makes no sense to you?

    hahahaha

    You are one funny dude. You know that?
    Last edited by sculptor; July 11th, 2013 at 04:18 PM.
     

  94. #93  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    makes no sense to you?
    Your reading comprehension is as poor as your reasoning.
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  95. #94  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    all right
    "barely makes sense"

    still
    You are either an idiot(which I doubt)
    or
    You are being really silly in your arguement.

    Hell man, a gradeschooler could understand.
    zing
     

  96. #95  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    Hell man, a gradeschooler could understand.
    I know.
    But you seem unable to.
    I guess you just hate been wrong.

    You wanted an example of something supernatural.
    I provided an example.

    Nothing you have said in anyway invalidates my example.
    Smaug is supernatural.

    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor
    I do not actually beleive smaug exists beyond the realm of fiction and story telling
    No-one said he does.
    This is just something you've made up.
    This is you trying to change the definition of 'supernatural'.

    If you have a reason (apart from denial) to not accept Smaug as being supernatural then perhaps you could post it.
    Which aspects of the "fire-breathing, 400 year old, jewel encrusted, talking dragon" do you think are natural?
    SayBigWords.com/say/3FC

    "And, behold, I come quickly;" Revelation 22:12

    "Religions are like sausages. When you know how they are made, you no longer want them."
     

  97. #96  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    red: you seem to think that feigning ignorance is your best form of argumentation.

    You wrote:
    "you think that a fire-breathing, 400 year old, jewel encrusted, talking dragon is also natural."
    I answered in the negative
    You wrote:
    "Attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature."
    For your argument to work, you need to define a fictional character as "some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature"

    That is silly.
    Do us both a favor and stop pretending that you are stupid, ignorant and lacking a memory.

    "force"
    Noun
    Strength or energy as an attribute of physical action or movement...

    You are using a fictional force for a fictional argument.


    ergo
    You are one funny dude dadio.
    (meaning--"not to be taken seriously")
    If silly and irrelevant is your personal goal, congratulations you have made it.
     

  98. #97  
    Genius Duck Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    12,030
    Sorry RP, you're on your own.
    I can only take so much dumb in any given week and that limit's been reached.
    It appears that Sculptor is arguing simply to avoid accepting (or, perhaps, realising) that he's completely lost the plot.

    Got some bad news for you Sculptor...
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
     

  99. #98  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    喫茶店
    Posts
    17,036
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    You wrote:
    "you think that a fire-breathing, 400 year old, jewel encrusted, talking dragon is also natural."
    I answered in the negative
    I would never have known that. Quite the opposite, in fact.

    You see, that's the trouble with deliberately choosing to write in a pretentiously incomprehensible style: your answer may be incomprehensible. Stop acting like an immature art school dropout and write properly. You have demonstrated that you are quite capable of doing it, but you apparently prefer your affected style because it demonstrates how "creative" you are. If so, stop whinging when people are unable to make sense of your gibberish.

    Or, in a form you might prefer:

    as/re
    u truble
    ---
    its ... "art"
    see
    (-- man)

    GROW UP.
    PhDemon likes this.
    ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat
     

  100. #99  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    bye duck
    you will not be missed
     

  101. #100  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    Strange
    I write as the subject matter dictates.
    This ain't science
    this is a rambling meandering silly journey into philosophy.

    when I stated that I responded in the negative please reference:
    I do not actually beleive smaug exists beyond the realm of fiction and story telling
    above
    I don't understand why/how that would confuse anyone!

    "gods in man's own image"
    c'mon
    seriously
    If you prefer science please see the environmental issues, anthropology, and earth sciences threads.
    There a few questions which I had posed therein which remain unanswered.
    I could use your keen mind.

    this crap is just an idle passtime
    Last edited by sculptor; July 11th, 2013 at 06:45 PM.
     

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. please I need help about image steganography
    By reem-akk in forum Computer Science
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: October 30th, 2012, 03:39 AM
  2. So God made His Eden. Michaelangelo made his David.
    By westwind in forum Pseudoscience
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: October 10th, 2012, 09:16 AM
  3. Why does man perceive god made Man in his image
    By Genesis in forum Scientific Study of Religion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: December 13th, 2011, 06:25 AM
  4. virtual image
    By aminasisic in forum Physics
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: March 17th, 2011, 11:26 AM
  5. Image
    By Heinsbergrelatz in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: May 12th, 2010, 07:55 PM
Tags for this Thread

View Tag Cloud

Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •