Notices
Results 1 to 32 of 32
Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By bezoar

Thread: What is right and wrong

  1. #1 What is right and wrong 
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    57
    Are their any sacred texts or what are the first texts that we can read this day that tell you about what is right and wrong that everyone would agree on?

    No incest, no...


    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    I know The Kibalyon, Barbara Marziniak books on teosophy, not sure if they are truly based on ancient texts.

    La cuarta dimension - Bob Frissell this book examines the duality good-wrong.

    beyond failed attemts of new age, i ask there exists sins ans sinners or just people trapped in a ultra-complex dynamic (i.e. people with psychopathic traits, among other much odd tendences, odd fears, etc) , puppets of this abstruse reality?
    In the other hand, people like Mother Teresa of Calcuta, are not triggered by his irresitible inner (uncounciously or not) need to calm their own demons? thru benevolent acts + social recognition.


    westwind likes this.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    57
    Right and wrong has been around a long time. Do we just go by our conscience?
    Last edited by PaulMichael; June 18th, 2012 at 02:14 PM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    57
    Im just saying that, there might be people who question everything.
    Last edited by PaulMichael; June 18th, 2012 at 02:15 PM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    It is a phylosophical mistery, the fact that Incest and Pedophilia are the only sexual sins (for liberal, open minded people, of course). why?
    Why our nature allow it? What could be the origin of these 'errors of our nature'? If i were a genetist/educator, how i could design/educate men for not develop these 2 tendences?
    Why women are biologically designed to never commit sexual sins? (They have no penis, ergo, cant commit Auto-Incest [unless her victim has an erection, but he could inhibit it by using a sexual technique] neither Pedophilia).
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Moderator Moderator
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    city of wine and roses
    Posts
    6,222
    Women commit lots of sexual sins, unfortunately. They may not have the personal biological equipment for penetrative rape - but that's not the only sexual 'sin' anyway. Unfortunately.

    As for incest and paedophilia, most societies have rules against such behaviours, but different perceptions of what counts as family and what counts as a violation of the rules are all over the place. It's quite common in journals of 19th century explorers to see horror and disgust at some practices which seem to amount to incest, rape or paedophilia. In some groups, the practices would still be regarded as abhorrent. But in many groups, modern anthropologists would be able to untangle the 'family' structures and concepts that made it acceptable for certain sexual relationships to be considered OK within that group but not for outsiders to comprehend.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    14,168
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulMichael View Post
    Are their any sacred texts or what are the first texts that we can read this day that tell you about what is right and wrong that everyone would agree on?

    No incest, no...
    Everyone? I think you would be hard pressed to get 90% agreement on anything, other than it being difficult to get 90% agreement on anything. Don't you agree?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Quote Originally Posted by adelady View Post
    Women commit lots of sexual sins, unfortunately. They may not have the personal biological equipment for penetrative rape - but that's not the only sexual 'sin' anyway. Unfortunately.
    Which sexual transgressions (referring to which are penalized by laws) can commit women?
    I guess the only one could be sexual stimulation of younger boys/children, using psychologycal and physical methods, in order to become boys into her sexual slaves.
    But im not sure if penetration is possible with 9 years old boys, or less; and probably a boy of 10 years old or more is yet pychologically shrewd enought to inhibit and control his sexual impulse.

    But in many groups, modern anthropologists would be able to untangle the 'family' structures and concepts that made it acceptable for certain sexual relationships to be considered OK within that group but not for outsiders to comprehend
    Sure, but im talking about ortodox massive societies. The most of societies of occident will never ever legalize incest and paedophilia, it is simply impossible.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    57
    Yes. I guess, everyone. Tis what I thought. People, "over there" , possibly in africa, believe in incest dont they?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Steff
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Ireland
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulMichael View Post
    Yes. I guess, everyone. Tis what I thought. People, "over there" , possibly in africa, believe in incest dont they?
    It depends on what level of incest you're talking about-marraiges between cousins have been common in all society's at some stage-just look at the Royal Family(or probably any royalty for that matter)
    Facts don't care if you believe in them or not...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Adelady please try to ask my questions, it intrigues me a lot.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12  
    Steff
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Ireland
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    Adelady please try to ask my questions, it intrigues me a lot.
    well i'm not "Adelady" but alot of societies and religions think that a woman becomes "stained" by sex, where-as a man doesn't and throughout history women have been persecuted for being sexual. Even in modern days women are "sluts" for doing the same thing as a man who is thought of as a "stud"
    And of course it's no longer persecutable by law-but "sins" have nothing to do with the law anyway?
    Facts don't care if you believe in them or not...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #13  
    Forum Bachelors Degree dmwyant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    456
    In Kentucky Alabama and Mississippi it is legal to marry your first cousin. In the state of Missouri bestiality is legal
    Not all who wander are lost... Some of us just misplaced our destination.

    I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet. The proper function of a man is to live, not to exist.
    -Jack London
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #14  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Quote Originally Posted by Supervixen View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    Adelady please try to ask my questions, it intrigues me a lot.
    well i'm not "Adelady" but alot of societies and religions think that a woman becomes "stained" by sex, where-as a man doesn't and throughout history women have been persecuted for being sexual. Even in modern days women are "sluts" for doing the same thing as a man who is thought of as a "stud"
    And of course it's no longer persecutable by law-but "sins" have nothing to do with the law anyway?
    No my dear, i clearly stated im referring to sexual transgresions penalized by law. The other 'sins' are ambiguos, subjetive, what REAL social consequences can affect slutty women beyond her own feelings of guilt.

    Adelady please manifest.

    Positivists, Biologycists, Pragmatists give some light to my question.

    Postscript:
    Do something witchy!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #15  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Non-penalizable 'sexual sins' are ambiguos, subjective, what REAL social consequences can affect slutty women beyond her own feelings of guilt?.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #16  
    Steff
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Ireland
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    Non-penalizable 'sexual sins' are ambiguos, subjective, what REAL social consequences can affect slutty women beyond her own feelings of guilt?.
    Actually my point was that they USED to be punishable by law, I just mentioned that there are still gender inequalities-it was nothing to do with your question, I added it because I think it's relevant to this thread
    Facts don't care if you believe in them or not...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  18. #17  
    Time Lord
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    8,036
    I've read in some travel journals that pedophilia is widely accepted in Turkey. Probably the main issue with sexual based crimes is the humiliation it inflicts on the victim. If society had no stigma about a certain act, then probably there would be no humiliation experienced, and so no psychological pain.

    However, clearly it is wrong to cause harm to others. Deliberately humiliating another person using the standards of any society is wrong if they would experience psychological pain as a result. Most of the sexual deviants we send to prison are doing what they do out of a desire to be sadistic, more than out of a desire to be perverted. If the rules of society were different, they would find another way to inflict pain. If it were seen as humiliating for someone to walk up and place a flower on top of your head, then they would put flowers on top of their victims' heads. Or whatever silly ritual we invent. They'll use what is available.
    Some clocks are only right twice a day, but they are still right when they are right.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  19. #18  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Quote Originally Posted by Supervixen View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    Non-penalizable 'sexual sins' are ambiguos, subjective, what REAL social consequences can affect slutty women beyond her own feelings of guilt?.
    I just mentioned that there are still gender inequalities-it was nothing to do with your question, I added it because I think it's relevant to this thread
    why it could be relevant to this ultra-positivistic thread? Focusing on questions is the only way to solve them.
    I dont understand why some guys are allowed to disrespect the sacred space-time-energy of this forum, to say non-senses like there are known 800 fullfilled biblical prophecies...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  20. #19  
    Steff
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Ireland
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by kojax View Post
    I've read in some travel journals that pedophilia is widely accepted in Turkey.
    when you say "widely accepted", are you sure you don't mean like many places in the world where western people go to molest children- "Sex-Tourism"? or did it actually say "turkish people accept pedophiles"?
    Facts don't care if you believe in them or not...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  21. #20  
    Steff
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Ireland
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Supervixen View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    Non-penalizable 'sexual sins' are ambiguos, subjective, what REAL social consequences can affect slutty women beyond her own feelings of guilt?.
    I just mentioned that there are still gender inequalities-it was nothing to do with your question, I added it because I think it's relevant to this thread
    why it could be relevant to this ultra-positivistic thread? Focusing on questions is the only way to solve them.
    I dont understand why some guys are allowed to disrespect the sacred space-time-energy of this forum, to say non-senses like there are known 800 fullfilled biblical prophecies...
    this thread is called-"what is right and wrong"...nobody said in the description anything else about "ultra-positivistic"
    Facts don't care if you believe in them or not...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  22. #21  
    Moderator Moderator
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    city of wine and roses
    Posts
    6,222
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    Adelady please try to ask my questions, it intrigues me a lot.
    Happy to. But I won't drag myself out of bed at silly o'clock just for that.

    If you re-read my comment I said They may not have the personal biological equipment to commit rape. Being explicit, women can be just as violent and cruel as men - in this case - just like men, they can use any object they find to inflict sexual violence.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
    Reply With Quote  
     

  23. #22  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Quote Originally Posted by adelady View Post
    women can be just as violent and cruel as men - in this case - just like men, they can use any object they find to inflict sexual violence.
    Which object? a penis of gum? against a young boy/girl? please explain
    Reply With Quote  
     

  24. #23  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    8,795
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulMichael View Post
    Are their any sacred texts or what are the first texts that we can read this day that tell you about what is right and wrong that everyone would agree on?

    No incest, no...
    If you have come to the science forum for an answer to what is right and what is wrong, I am afraid you will be disappointed. All you will get is the sort of opinions you can get anywhere else, There are plenty of sacred texts, but not everybody will agree on any of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bezoar
    It is a phylosophical mistery, the fact that Incest and Pedophilia are the only sexual sins (for liberal, open minded people, of course). why?
    It is strictly fashion, nothing more. There is no more mystery about it than why people wear a certain kind of shoes.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  25. #24  
    Moderator Moderator
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    city of wine and roses
    Posts
    6,222
    Which object?
    Any horrible thing that might cause pain and distress.

    Seems I really do have to get far too graphic and specific here. Apart from hands, maybe drink bottles, broom handles, any household or other object that a vicious person might decide they want to use.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
    Reply With Quote  
     

  26. #25  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Quote Originally Posted by adelady View Post
    Which object?
    Any horrible thing that might cause pain and distress.

    Seems I really do have to get far too graphic and specific here. Apart from hands, maybe drink bottles, broom handles, any household or other object that a vicious person might decide they want to use.
    This forum is rematch of Galileo & Giordano Bruno, for compassion don't silence them again. You do have to be graphic and specific, it does not have to hurt the feelings of anyone.

    Why a woman could experience sexual gratification by forcing a bottle on a girl's vagina? I'm wondering if the act would not produce lacerations or other evidence perceptible by forensic examination. Could you quote any known case published in newspaper?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  27. #26  
    Moderator Moderator
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    city of wine and roses
    Posts
    6,222
    I'm wondering if the act would not produce lacerations or other evidence perceptible by forensic examination
    We're talking children here. "Ordinary" rape of both boys and girls can be excruciatingly painful as well as producing tears and other tissue injuries easily perceptible by any inspection, not just specialist forensic examination. That's how many cases are identified - when children have to go for medical attention of any kind, the evidence of past injury is there.

    As for newspaper reports, I can't remember enough details of times and places to track down specifics. I do remember one nasty murder here some years ago by a group of teenagers where the girl/s involved used objects to sexually assault the victim as well as the boys doing various ghastly things before the poor tortured girl was eventually killed.

    As for 'sexual gratification'. What you have to bear in mind is that sexual gratification is secondary in many rapes. The real objective is the exercise of power and dominance. For the deeply vicious, sexual assault is just an avenue for mental or physical torture, any sexual release or gratification is just a bonus.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
    Reply With Quote  
     

  28. #27  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    8,795
    Quote Originally Posted by bezoar View Post
    This forum is rematch of Galileo & Giordano Bruno, for compassion don't silence them again. You do have to be graphic and specific, it does not have to hurt the feelings of anyone.

    Why a woman could experience sexual gratification by forcing a bottle on a girl's vagina? I'm wondering if the act would not produce lacerations or other evidence perceptible by forensic examination. Could you quote any known case published in newspaper?
    Galileo? Really? No, I don't think we are breaking any scientific ground here with this kind of discussion.

    I read a story yesterday about a woman who forced her 11 year old daughter into prostitution in order to buy drugs and alcohol. At the age of 16 the daughter had 3 children. Is that bad enough for you?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  29. #28  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold14370 View Post
    Galileo? Really? No, I don't think we are breaking any scientific ground here with this kind of discussion.
    You prefer convergent discussions on kantian ethics?

    I read a story yesterday about a woman who forced her 11 year old daughter into prostitution in order to buy drugs and alcohol. At the age of 16 the daughter had 3 children. Is that bad enough for you?
    It was no a rape, neither a paedophile act. You cant refute of my claim that women aren't psychologically & physically designed to commit penalized sexual transgressions.

    Yes!, i won!!
    and you are still thinking im a pervert.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  30. #29  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    409
    you forgot this spam/porn link deleted by moderator
    Last edited by Harold14370; June 19th, 2012 at 09:00 PM. Reason: Try to use a little common sense, Bezoar
    Reply With Quote  
     

  31. #30  
    Forum Bachelors Degree dmwyant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    456
    To answer the actuall QUESTION that was posed for this thread... PaulMichael, You will be hard pressed to find any single text or body of works that lays out a moral path like the one you seek. In todays society things that were common place even just a hundred years ago are considered immoral. The bible has numerous passages okaying things like rape, incest, slavery and more. The moral path will depend on the society. Things that I may find abhorent and evil another society may consider commonplace.
    Not all who wander are lost... Some of us just misplaced our destination.

    I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet. The proper function of a man is to live, not to exist.
    -Jack London
    Reply With Quote  
     

  32. #31  
    Forum Masters Degree
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    597
    I don't know of a single concise moral text that is considered authoritative by all people.

    Christians consider their Bible to be the authoritative text.

    There seems to be core moral beliefs like the 10 Commandments and "Love God and neighbor" in the Christian Bible as well as layers of moral beliefs that deal with more specific situations such as the Book of Proverbs, Psalms, etc.

    Also, the conscience seems to be a key component of moral belief. However, the conscience seems to be something that can be developed and strengthened. Or the conscience can be weakened and numbed.

    For example, when some serial killers have been imprisoned and interviewed such as Bundy or Dahmer, they try to describe behaviors that the killer thinks contributed to the final murderous state they ended up in. At least in these two cases, sexual deviant practices figured prominently in what the killer felt contributed to his malevolance. I believe Bundy felt pornography got him started, and Dahmer said his primary motivation was lust + control. Thus, it is reasonable to think that this combination of lust + control can be harmful. Animal cruelty is another behavior that numbs the conscience and contributes to the development of a serial killer. Violence itself is a known contributor to the development of violent criminals.

    From a religious perspective, some religous teachings suggest that sexual deviant practices are the number one cause for souls to be sent to hell.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  33. #32  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Fort Lee, NJ, USA
    Posts
    153
    Quote Originally Posted by PaulMichael View Post
    Are their any sacred texts or what are the first texts that we can read this day that tell you about what is right and wrong that everyone would agree on?
    Before asking people to either agree or disagree, you must define terms. What do you mean by "right" and do you mean by "wrong"?
    .
    Reply With Quote  
     

Similar Threads

  1. Where did I go wrong?
    By j.r in forum Biology
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: March 9th, 2011, 06:31 PM
  2. Replies: 14
    Last Post: October 15th, 2009, 07:23 PM
  3. What is right and wrong?
    By Quantime in forum Philosophy
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: May 27th, 2008, 03:40 PM
  4. right or wrong?
    By Darthskywalker699 in forum Behavior and Psychology
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: December 30th, 2006, 04:48 PM
  5. 1$ = 1c... what's wrong?
    By william in forum Mathematics
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: September 20th, 2006, 10:20 PM
Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •