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Thread: Religion - The End Times

  1. #1 Religion - The End Times 
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    What is it about religions and the end times? There is a new show, a miniseries, I think, called Revelations. After each commercial clip we're treated to a bible quote. An interesting bible quote, not the kind that you come across in church.

    When I say interesting, I mean that the bible quote has something to do with the end of the world (Which people are always interested in). Which is a continuing fad among church goers. The rapture is going to suck some of us up to heaven while the rest of us suffer, correct?

    Or maybe the whole idea behind the revelation, or the end of the world (With God, and not scientifically proven zombie apocalypses) is to push more people into religion?

    Is the idea of the end of the world (AKA your life) so frightening that religion will sooth your mind? What if I told a Christian that he were going to die tomarrow? Would he accept death, or would he say "No. But during the rapture...."

    It's a thought that I've been going over in my head for some time now (The past hour, basically). Discuss.


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    Life to me is just a book to read, religion just happens to be part of that book. The book is written in ink, it will not be changed. Some people have been given the gift to look a few pages ahead. The question of course remains, are we all reading the same book?

    The book of course is just pre-determined destiny. The Bible and such having nothing to do with it.

    The the movie starts, the ending is known. The people watching the movie have no clue how it ends, unless they have asked a friend who has already seen it.

    Fear not, the last chapter.


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    Coffee,


    What is it about religions and the end times? There is a new show, a miniseries, I think, called Revelations. After each commercial clip we're treated to a bible quote. An interesting bible quote, not the kind that you come across in church.

    When I say interesting, I mean that the bible quote has something to do with the end of the world (Which people are always interested in). Which is a continuing fad among church goers. The rapture is going to suck some of us up to heaven while the rest of us suffer, correct?
    Yes, but this is how those people think who also think that religion and magic are quite the same thing.


    Or maybe the whole idea behind the revelation, or the end of the world (With God, and not scientifically proven zombie apocalypses) is to push more people into religion?
    I don't think so. The Biblical text was written long before Christianity became a tool in the hands of worldly rulers, who used it to pursue their worldly interests, but under the guise of "doing God's work". Those worldly rulers have then pushed people into their worldly interest schemes, which, on the outside, were called "religion".


    Is the idea of the end of the world (AKA your life) so frightening that religion will sooth your mind?
    We must delve into what the fear of death, the fear of the end of one's life and also the fear of the end of the world actually stand for.
    Noone has experienced their own death and survived to tell; we experience death by proxy, seeing other beings die, things end.

    Speaking strictly logically, noone knows *for sure* that he will die. It is not imposible that one might not die. Usually, people don't think so consequently -- but empirically speaking, you don't know that you will die until it happens (and then we can wonder if you will actually know that then).

    Noone knows death, noone knows the end (but let's leave the possibility open that there is a Creator who does, and who can choose some people to tell them so); it is irrational to fear them.

    It makes far more sense to say that what we fear is that our lives are meaningless. And seeing that lives do end, and that we don't have infinite time, we are aware that we cannot walk all paths, try out everything ourselves. Death/the end is then just the visual reminder of this meaninglessness.

    People who know why they live, who have clearly set goals and beliefs, don't fear death.


    What if I told a Christian that he were going to die tomarrow? Would he accept death, or would he say "No. But during the rapture...."
    Ask them.


    * * *

    (In)Sanity,

    Life to me is just a book to read
    To you, life is just a book to read.

    Are you happy in your life?
    (I'm just curious.)
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    Water:

    Quote Originally Posted by water
    Yes, but this is how those people think who also think that religion and magic are quite the same thing.
    Indeed. I know these types of people. God is full of love, blah blah. God will forgive you, blah blah. God is pissed and he will smite the holy hell out of you if he feels like it.

    I don't think so. The Biblical text was written long before Christianity became a tool in the hands of worldly rulers, who used it to pursue their worldly interests, but under the guise of "doing God's work". Those worldly rulers have then pushed people into their worldly interest schemes, which, on the outside, were called "religion".
    Which, we really have to ask (And already know), if the Bible is still being used in that form today. George Bush's favorite guy in the world is his friend Jesus, which is great! I have no problem with someone getting along with Jesus. What I do have a problem with is using his friend Jesus to get a couple of votes. Even if he didn't do it on purpose.

    People who know why they live, who have clearly set goals and beliefs, don't fear death.
    I think, and maybe it's just me, that people who set goals do not fear death because they're to busy to think about it.

    Insanity:
    Life to me is just a book to read, religion just happens to be part of that book. The book is written in ink, it will not be changed. Some people have been given the gift to look a few pages ahead. The question of course remains, are we all reading the same book?
    But for some it's not just a book. For some it's "On page 313 it says that we should beat a goat to death with a shoe every Friday... Well, let's go get a goat!" But at the same time "Hey, man... It says on page 866 that killing goats with shoes is against God's word."
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    But for some it's not just a book. For some it's "On page 313 it says that we should beat a goat to death with a shoe every Friday... Well, let's go get a goat!" But at the same time "Hey, man... It says on page 866 that killing goats with shoes is against God's word."
    No No, The book of life is your destiny. Don't confuse "The Book" with anything to do with religion. All I'm saying is your destiny is pre-determined. The "Book" aka the story of your life.

    I'm pretty happy with the story so far. It does have a bit of drama in a few chapters, but overall it's a good book.
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    Coffee,



    Which, we really have to ask (And already know), if the Bible is still being used in that form today. George Bush's favorite guy in the world is his friend Jesus, which is great! I have no problem with someone getting along with Jesus. What I do have a problem with is using his friend Jesus to get a couple of votes. Even if he didn't do it on purpose.
    Do you really believe GW Bush is "getting along" with Jesus?
    What do you think Jesus would say of GW Bush?

    'M 'fraid you are most negligently letting the object of your investigation letting it define itself.

    As if a lab mouse said "I am white", and then you'd put it with the white mice -- refusing to see for yourself that the mouse was grey.


    I think, and maybe it's just me, that people who set goals do not fear death because they're to busy to think about it.
    Some, maybe. But I also think that those people have a very different outlook on life and death anyway, fear not being part of that outlook. If they were afraid, they couldn't be busy. It doesn't follow that because they are too busy, they don't think about it. (Given we assume that values and preferences are there before actions.)
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    I find all this talk of beating goats disturbing, what did they ever do to us? Many are the tragic victims of goat-trauma.

    http://www.goat-trauma.org/
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    Well personally I consider the bible to be the most depressingly perverse and sadistic garbage I have ever had the displeasure to read. While it was completely understandable an image for people of those times, it makes me cringe with pain when realising there are people in the year 2005 that still hang onto such barbaric caveman tripe.

    Stars poking out of the ground.. no seriously, that's ridiculous.
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    Coffee,

    What is it about religions and the end times?
    Let's be specific - we mean Christianity here since that religion has the concept of final judgment and where the meek shall inherit the earth etc. So it is part of their mythology that one day everything will end and everyone will be judged and all the goodies will go to heaven and live happilly ever after, just like any quality fairy story.

    So speculation about when this will happen and how it will happen is inevitable. It makes for good TV and movies - the filmmakers must be very excited about all the money they are going to make during this recent fashion of religious frenzy. Mel Gibson is now of course very rich.
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    I think the emphasis on the end times reflects modern reality. Regardless of the specifics of the bible, can you imagine what another 1000 years of human culture will be like, or even the next 100, or 10? Things are changing so rapidly that it is entirely reasonable to propose some kind of major revolution in the basic assumptions of humanity. A technological singularity has been proposed when computers become so advanced that they outpace the ability of people to predict their behavior. Combine that idea with environmental changes, increasing populations and their industrialization, peak oil, nuclear proliferation, the internet and emerging diseases, and the only question is how on earth will humanity survive? I'm optimistic, I think we will prevail due to enlightened self-interest, but some amazing and novel things are in store for us. Terence McKenna thinks that 2012 is the date to watch out for, and other sources agree, such as the Mayan calender.
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    Cris<

    Let's be specific - we mean Christianity here since that religion has the concept of final judgment
    Indeed, I was speaking of Christianity. But why is the Christian end times so popular? Why not the Ragnarok? Aren't the Gods and Giants ready to battle?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee
    Cris<

    Let's be specific - we mean Christianity here since that religion has the concept of final judgment
    Indeed, I was speaking of Christianity. But why is the Christian end times so popular? Why not the Ragnarok? Aren't the Gods and Giants ready to battle?
    Sounds more fun to me!
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    2 Billion Christians, 1/3rd of the planet tend not to be interested in other mythologies so much.
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    Well, and that's not counting the muslims world, good for another billion, and who have, generally speaking, contempt for all religions, as they do not follow the truth prophet, Mohammed.

    Mr U
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee
    Cris<

    Let's be specific - we mean Christianity here since that religion has the concept of final judgment
    Indeed, I was speaking of Christianity. But why is the Christian end times so popular? Why not the Ragnarok? Aren't the Gods and Giants ready to battle?
    The Christian end times is so popular only in certain parts of the world -- those Christian or Christian-influenced ones.
    The Aborigins really don't care about it.
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    Belief in the end times allows you to be greedy. I don't know how many humungous trucks i've seen with a jesus fish on there. It must mean- "I'm getting raptured, so fuck the Earth, it's just a temporary stopover.".
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    Our bodies get old, wear out and we die. What is so hard about that concept.

    What comes after that? Nobody knows for sure. Worm food? Maybe. Heaven? Maybe. Reincarnation? Maybe. Cosmic Consciousness? Maybe. Nobody has died and came back and told me personally what is next. They (Christians) say Jesus did but they have also written and re-written their Holy Book so much that it is full of inaccuracies and contradictions. Who really knows......my opinion, we should each be allowed to speculate and keep our opinions until we decide to change them.
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    What was it like before you were born? Nothingness, the same as what you will experience with death. The ego is an illusion generated by thought. Nothing happens to you after death, because there is no you in the first place apart from your body.

    Another reason end times belief is attractive is that it separates you into an "in" group, so you can look down upon those who aren't a part of it.
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    Maybe your right. Conciousness can be taken away with a blow to the head. I guess part of the question is, "what makes a person a person?"

    We, people, are made up of the same elements found on Earth. Is reincarnation really just the gathering of those elements to make another person. Is there any other part of a person that lives beyond death?
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    When are the meek going to inherit the Earth? I've never inherited anything let alone the Earth.. Where's the justice?
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    Quote Originally Posted by kestasjk
    When are the meek going to inherit the Earth? I've never inherited anything let alone the Earth.. Where's the justice?
    I think they actually meant to write "Mink" when they wrote the good book, somehow it came our "Meek". Perhaps it was suppose to be "Roach".
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    The end times have been on my mind for over thirty five years since I first read the bible that those words come from. Today it has a whole new meaning to me because on my comprehension of the world and universe around me. Leaving religion completely out of it and just reading it for what it says about mankind, who we are, how we came to be, and as many have mentioned our destiny, it says a whole lot more than any religion has ever taught from a pulpit.

    Check out this;
    Humans because of our present level of technology can answer questions that have plagued
    scholars for millennium. Questions asked of Ezra about three millennium ago can now be
    answered. Questions asked of him such as, "Go, weigh for me the weight of fire, or measure
    for me a blast of wind, or call back for me the day that is past … or show me the picture of a
    voice … if you solve one of them for me, then I will show you the way you desire to see …
    You cannot understand the things with which you have grown up; how then can your mind
    comprehend the way of the Most High?" Since we can now answer these questions and we
    can now comprehend, there is a responsibility that accompanies this comprehension. That
    also makes us responsible for being able to understand the message.

    It would stand to reason that since these are technological questions to which we now have answers the entire bible was meant to be understood when we "grew up". Yes, gods to us as simple uneducated folks, ghosts, demons, and all that woo doo BS were really far technologically advanced beings. And just like us, some are bad ones. But now with our advanced knowledge of the universe and physics we should be able to comprehend that book about the Kingdom as an intergalactic government and these so called "end times" which I call mankind's greatest threshold next to cross. The kingdom of the heavens is a mighty big place.

    It's not about religion, it's about a message that we can now understand. What, you expected Jesus to ride in on a donkey? Try the heavenly New Jerusalem which is 1,500 miles square in size. Now that is one hell of a big, what, uh huh, ship. Some donkey I would have to say. But it gets even better. Since this King of the Universe is coming to earth try to imagine the entourage that will accompany such a personage. 400 billion galaxies of over 400 billion star systems in them, and that sovereign is coming to earth. If you believe it, now is a good time to say "oh shit".

    These "end times" are going to be the most exciting and memorable events for mankind, we will either accept this coming ruler ship gladly over democracy, or,,,.

    Yes, the mink will inherit the earth, those too timid to "go where mankind has never gone before".

    Yah just had to ask, didn't yah C-Coffee, :wink:
    It's not what you know or don't know, but what you know that isn't so that will hurt you. Will Rodgers 1938
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    The meek shall inherit shit. - David Lee Roth
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    For more information on the end times, read Mathew 24th chapter as it contains
    about 27 pieces of the end times prophesies. Luke 21, and Mark 13 also. With the
    rest of the bible taken into concideration there are well over 200 statements that
    deal primarily with the end times, the last days, and what to expect. It is stated that
    those that are trying to destroy the earth will themselves be destroyed. So don't
    worry, the earth as we know it in all it's wonders is here to stay for a very long
    time. But society will change, as will government and education. Unfortunatly many
    will not be able to handle a society where ones personal pride is in their integrity,
    honor, and justness. All in all it made for some very interesting research and reading
    for some 35 years.
    It's not what you know or don't know, but what you know that isn't so that will hurt you. Will Rodgers 1938
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    Our own planet, in which philosophers are apt to take a parochial and excessive interest, was once too hot to support life, and will in time become too cold. After ages during which the earth produced harmless trilobites and butterflies, evolution progressed to the point at which it has generated Neros, Genghis Khans, and Hitlers. This, however, I believe is a passing nightmare; in time the earth will become again incapable of supporting life, and peace will return.- Bertrand Russell

    Homo Sapiens will go extinct at some point; all life forms do. There is no good reason to think that Christianity will be involved in any way.
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  27. #26 Homo sapiens to go extinct? 
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    "Homo Sapiens will go extinct at some point; all life forms do. There is no good reason to think that Christianity will be involved in any way."
    *************
    M*W: I tend to think that Homo sapiens won't "go extinct" in the literal sense of the word but will evolve toward a higher life form which I call "Homo spiritus." But, true, at some point in time, there may be no more Homo sapiens around, and if there were, they would be inferior to the Homo spiritus. Now, just what Homo spiritus will be, I don't know, but I think we/they will vibrate at a much higher resonance than we do. They will have an infinitely greater capacity for technology and may even be able to find a way to conquer death. Also, Homo spiritus will be a more "generic" or "evolved" breed in race, gender, color, etc.

    For the sake of argument, this is just my theory, but thanks for bringing it up.
    "Baby, you don't have to live like a refugee."

    ~ Tom Petty
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