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Thread: Islamic science (Claiming the qaran had all answers already)

  1. #1 Islamic science (Claiming the qaran had all answers already) 
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    Hi there,

    I quite often fall in a heavy discussion with a muslim at my school/gymnasium.

    As I ask for proof on the existance of Allah and of any god at all, he just tells me
    to read the Qaran as he claims it has the proof.

    But apart from that, he showed me a site:
    http://www.scienceislam.com/quran_miracles.php

    with so called "evidence" of the qaran writing about the creation of the universe and other so called "proof" of the religion. The site claims that the qaran contained alot of what scientists has first discovered today.

    regarding the link; was the universe created from smoke? And if so doesn't smoke only appear after something has been burned or heated? doesnt smoke always contain an organic substance? (considering that the universe was created from helium and hydrogen which are unorganic, since they don't contain carbon).

    Thanks in advance :wink:

    Please feel free to point out any errors you discover on the site


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  3. #2 Re: Islamic science (Claiming the qaran had all answers alre 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wattavault
    Hi there,

    I quite often fall in a heavy discussion with a muslim at my school/gymnasium.

    As I ask for proof on the existance of Allah and of any god at all, he just tells me
    to read the Qaran as he claims it has the proof.

    But apart from that, he showed me a site:
    http://www.scienceislam.com/quran_miracles.php

    with so called "evidence" of the qaran writing about the creation of the universe and other so called "proof" of the religion. The site claims that the qaran contained alot of what scientists has first discovered today.

    regarding the link; was the universe created from smoke? And if so doesn't smoke only appear after something has been burned or heated? doesnt smoke always contain an organic substance? (considering that the universe was created from helium and hydrogen which are unorganic, since they don't contain carbon).

    Thanks in advance :wink:

    Please feel free to point out any errors you discover on the site
    Yeah, i've heard many of these claims before. Islam has a more internally consistent theology than Christianity (no trinity paradox for instance), but it's still based on the premise that the Quran is god's word. I'll look at the cite, as i've not studied these particular claims, and comment later.

    For now i'm just making the link more accessible.


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  4. #3 Re: Islamic science (Claiming the qaran had all answers alre 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prometheus
    Quote Originally Posted by Wattavault
    Hi there,

    I quite often fall in a heavy discussion with a muslim at my school/gymnasium.

    As I ask for proof on the existance of Allah and of any god at all, he just tells me
    to read the Qaran as he claims it has the proof.

    But apart from that, he showed me a site:
    http://www.scienceislam.com/quran_miracles.php

    with so called "evidence" of the qaran writing about the creation of the universe and other so called "proof" of the religion. The site claims that the qaran contained alot of what scientists has first discovered today.

    regarding the link; was the universe created from smoke? And if so doesn't smoke only appear after something has been burned or heated? doesnt smoke always contain an organic substance? (considering that the universe was created from helium and hydrogen which are unorganic, since they don't contain carbon).

    Thanks in advance :wink:

    Please feel free to point out any errors you discover on the site
    Yeah, i've heard many of these claims before. Islam has a more internally consistent theology than Christianity (no trinity paradox for instance), but it's still based on the premise that the Quran is god's word. I'll look at the cite, as i've not studied these particular claims, and comment later.

    For now i'm just making the link more accessible.
    Thank you very much Prometheus, sorry about the link :wink:
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  5. #4  
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    It's nonsense, like the writings of Nostradamus. People are good at finding patterns, even if there aren't any. Does your Muslim friend think Nostradamus was a holy prophet?

    Let's take a look at the first claim, about the "smoke."

    The science of modern cosmology, observational and theoretical, clearly indicates that, at one point in time, the whole universe was nothing but a cloud of 'smoke' (i.e. an opaque highly dense and hot gaseous composition).
    God said in the Quran:
    Then He turned to the heavens when it was smoke...
    [Noble Quran 41:11]
    Smoke could mean anything. Perhaps the Milky Way. Here is the actual translation from the Quran.

    Then He turned to the heaven while it was something like smoke, and said to it and to the earth: ‘Come ye both of you, willingly or unwillingly.’ They said, ‘We come willingly.’
    What is the scientific meaning of the crap about coming willingly or unwillingly? Where did they come to? If the earth and the smoke were two separate things being addressed by Allah, then the Quran is not describing the universe that existed before the formation of the earth. So they have cherry-picked the parts that seem to fit their narrative.
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  6. #5  
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    The funny part is its the same myth as Christianity.
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  7. #6  
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    Thanks for the replies.

    I completely agree with you Harold14370, it seems like they ignore everything else than just these words which accidentially match up with some of the scientific theories today.

    The funny thing is, that my gymnasium is technically oriented, meaning less humanistic subjects. Yet very many considerably religious muslims attend there. To me this makes no sense. Why would you attend a school if you will have to disapprove with many of the subjects presented?(considering they don't even approve darwins great discoveries)

    I also read on the site, of how they claim that the muslims contributed to science, and that they are the reason why western science made its great contributions, which of course have in some areas.(Maybe this is why they attend at my gymnasium)
    http://www.al-bab.com/arab/science.htm
    But which contributions has anything to do with Islam and muslims?


    What strikes me most is the fact that they compare new science with the qaran, and then claim that it was already in the qaran, but why haven't any science then been discovered the other way arround? why havent someone used the qaran to discover and create new science? (answer is almost rhetorical: they can't!)
    So why would you in the first place write all these "scientific miracles" in the qaran for the only purpose of being discovered 1400 years later with no influence from the qaran?

    IMO, they are desperately looking for evidence. The more religious you are, the more non religious people are going to ask questions about your religion. Another thing is that I think they look at the qaran very literally, instead of seeing it ambiguously.

    P.s. Just for fun i tried looking at the qaran to see how easy it was to spot an error. As I randomly looked at the index I thought the english "Thunder" looked exciting.
    http://quran.com/13
    Well, it basically starts out saying that the moon, AND the sun was set on a course! If they take their so called proof verses from the qaran so literally, why not take this verse literally?
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  8. #7  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wattavault
    The funny thing is, that my gymnasium is technically oriented, meaning less humanistic subjects. Yet very many considerably religious muslims attend there. To me this makes no sense. Why would you attend a school if you will have to disapprove with many of the subjects presented?(considering they don't even approve darwins great discoveries)
    There is no reason why religious people cannot do science, as long as they follow the scientific method. This does not include using religious texts to determine science facts.

    Many of our greatest scientists were religious people - Kepler, LeMaitre, Mendel, for a few examples. Even Darwin was quite devout at least early on, during the Beagle voyage. He seems to have become an agnostic later, but the point is, his beliefs did not keep him from doing good science.

    Well, it basically starts out saying that the moon, AND the sun was set on a course! If they take their so called proof verses from the qaran so literally, why not take this verse literally?
    Yes, good point. That verse could have been used to support a belief in the geocentric model, and probably was.
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  9. #8  
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    Thanks for the reply!

    There is no reason why religious people cannot do science, as long as they follow the scientific method. This does not include using religious texts to determine science facts.
    Very good point, I would say it's an arrogant approach, and kind of stupid of them to promote the qaran as scientific when there is so much in it that is definately no where near scientific.
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  10. #9  
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    The worst part is that these people claim their faith is sufficient for them to believe; that this is a test. But then they go looking for the evidence. Then they see faces in clouds.

    So which is Islam built on, faith of evidence?
    The mark of a moderate man is freedom from his own ideas - Tao Te Ching

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  11. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold14370
    There is no reason why religious people cannot do science, as long as they follow the scientific method.
    And for the 3 religions of the book, ignore virtually every empirical claim (global floods, man from clay, non-burning bush, men becoming a soul etc) made by their scriptures.

    Some people are rather amazing able to compartmentalize their belief in superstitions from what they reason based on evidence. But this is difficult, if not impossible, for many sciences which explains why some fields (e.g. biology) few scientist follow traditional faith-based religions.
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  12. #11  
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    Islam has an odd attitude towards science, often the approach taken is less resistant to science than Christian fundamentalism. Instead of claiming the science is false, they claim the Quran always said it was so but it was the readers of the text that failed to see the truth. Weird.

    Islamic countries have contributed to science though, in math and medicine particularly. And we owe them for preserving a lot of Greek philosophy and science during the Medieval period.
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  13. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_feel_tiredsleepy
    Islam has an odd attitude towards science, often the approach taken is less resistant to science than Christian fundamentalism. Instead of claiming the science is false, they claim the Quran always said it was so but it was the readers of the text that failed to see the truth. Weird.
    It's accommodating to science. *Ridiculously* accommodating.
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  14. #13  
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    It has also occurred to me that we owe the university system in Europe to the Muslims, who brought it from Africa to Spain.
    "I almost went to bed
    without remembering
    the four white violets
    I put in the button-hole
    of your green sweater

    and how i kissed you then
    and you kissed me
    shy as though I'd
    never been your lover "
    - Leonard Cohen
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