Notices
Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Is this proof that the first God was a man?

  1. #1 Is this proof that the first God was a man? 
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    675
    During my travels I came across this.


    The Vatican wrote:
    The Holy Spirit Proceeds from the Father and the Son

    Only the Word, the Son, "proceeds" from the Father by eternal generation. God, who eternally knows himself and everything in himself, begets the Word. In this eternal begetting, which takes place by way of intellect (per modum intelligibilis actionis), God, in the absolute unity of his nature, that is, of his divinity, is Father and Son. "He is," and not "he becomes," "he is" so eternally. "He is" from the beginning and without beginning. Under this aspect the word "procession" must be understood correctly. There is no connotation proper to a temporal "becoming." The same is true of the "procession" of the Holy Spirit.



    I don't quite know what this means either. But it is clear that asking the question which of the Trinity came first displays a serious ignorance of the doctrine of Trinity.

    Is this proof that the first God was a man?

    Regards
    DL


    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Forum Ph.D. Hanuka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    The 10th Kingdom xD
    Posts
    750
    I dunno if it relates to yar post or not(as I didn't quite understand what's yar point),
    but I think it's safe to assume that the 1st "God" was eather the Sun or the Moon.
    Probably the Sun..

    Although.. Early man was pretty stupid, so it is possible that the 1st "God-title"
    was given to some powerful tribe leader at the time.


    Good Brother
    ~~~~~~~~~~
    The truths that matter to us the most are often left half-spoken..
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    675
    Quote Originally Posted by Hanuka
    I dunno if it relates to yar post or not(as I didn't quite understand what's yar point),
    but I think it's safe to assume that the 1st "God" was eather the Sun or the Moon.
    Probably the Sun..

    Although.. Early man was pretty stupid, so it is possible that the 1st "God-title"
    was given to some powerful tribe leader at the time.
    The shaman of the day knew that there was something there. They just did not know how to convey it. They found a cosmic consciousness. That was a man yet non corporeal. Our next evollution at death. We all get there.
    God was born at that time.

    Suns and moons do not produce words or philosophies to follow.

    Regards
    DL
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    The Doctor Quantime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    4,546
    If God was, is and for ever shall be, then He was only ever one. But Jesus says that no-one can see The Father without making the male the female and vice versa. Same with merging other things.

    And although The Father isn't God, Jesus isn't either. Only both with the Holy Spirit are.

    For instance Jesus says He is the Son of God. The Father could say: "I am the Father of God, no-one see the Son but through me. So Jesus is not saying He is God's son because that doesn't make sense with the Trinity, what He meant was 'I am the Son part that makes God, therefore I am only a third of all that makes God.

    So to answer your question, if Jesus talks in riddles, then the Vatican is talking complete bollocks.
    "If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe". - Carl Sagan
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    927
    could be that god is just a metaphor for whoever fathered a civilization.
    sorta like "my daddy is the strongest and best..." and taken that and gone way overboard. "my great great grand daddy was so awesome, he's never going to die, and he'll help me in every regard"
    the sort of ancestor worship taken to a whole new level.
    you know, like the indians, and some tribes did.
    when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth
    A.C Doyle
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    675
    Quote Originally Posted by 425 Chaotic Requisition
    If God was, is and for ever shall be, then He was only ever one. But Jesus says that no-one can see The Father without making the male the female and vice versa. Same with merging other things.

    And although The Father isn't God, Jesus isn't either. Only both with the Holy Spirit are.

    For instance Jesus says He is the Son of God. The Father could say: "I am the Father of God, no-one see the Son but through me. So Jesus is not saying He is God's son because that doesn't make sense with the Trinity, what He meant was 'I am the Son part that makes God, therefore I am only a third of all that makes God.

    So to answer your question, if Jesus talks in riddles, then the Vatican is talking complete bollocks.
    Perhaps.

    Regards
    DL
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    675
    Quote Originally Posted by dejawolf
    could be that god is just a metaphor for whoever fathered a civilization.
    sorta like "my daddy is the strongest and best..." and taken that and gone way overboard. "my great great grand daddy was so awesome, he's never going to die, and he'll help me in every regard"
    the sort of ancestor worship taken to a whole new level.
    you know, like the indians, and some tribes did.
    All of the above if you have just a bit of power or familly- in those days-.

    Regards
    DL
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Junior kkawohl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    226
    The Intelligent Designer proclaims

    I am the Intelligent Designer;
    I am what mankind has decided to call God.
    I did not come from nowhere.
    I play no magic tricks on man.
    I did not create the earth by casting spells.
    I had a humble beginning the same as man;
    My beginning was at the dawn of spirituality.
    My wisdom grows as more spirits unite
    After the cessation of life after much physical strife.
    Throughout time I have been named God,
    Allah, Jehovah, The Great Spirit, and many more.
    I do not judge man for his vanity or naivety
    To be the one who claims to please me the most.
    I am easy to please. I require very little.
    I only want you to do what is best for mankind.
    I will bless you and wish you well.
    I will inspire your mind and you will
    Accomplish the unfathomable.
    I require no worship. I need nothing from man.
    I am self-sufficient. I am spirit.

    Develop your spirit wisely, the best that you can.
    Live your life for the betterment of man.
    Your spirit will soon be with me and then
    Together we will see and traverse the universe.
    There are many wonders to behold,
    Your spirit will soar.
    You will partake in all the wisdom
    That has been gathered from the beginning of time.
    The stars will be your playgrounds.
    You can play with the animals,
    Be with your loved ones,
    Listen to the greatest opera,
    Stage or musical performances,
    Or you can just relax next to a bubbling brook
    And enjoy the scenery.
    You feel no pain, despair,
    Heartache, or negative emotions.
    You are now One with me.
    You are with the Intelligent Designer
    You are with God my child.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9  
    Time Lord
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5,328
    No, kkawohl, we don't fall for that old channeling God voice. It doesn't echo in our modern brains. And you don't get to be shaman for invoking it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dejawolf
    could be that god is just a metaphor for whoever fathered a civilization.
    sorta like "my daddy is the strongest and best..." and taken that and gone way overboard. "my great great grand daddy was so awesome, he's never going to die, and he'll help me in every regard"
    the sort of ancestor worship taken to a whole new level.
    you know, like the indians, and some tribes did.
    Well, the concept of God probably did evolve. Meanwhile, language and consciousness itself were evolving, surely. I guess they went through some breaking-in period and maybe convolutions with other aspects of human psychology, society, etc. So God confounded with ancestors is an easy one, I agree, but misses religion.

    I suspect that God relates to our parallel evolution of ego/super-ego, and the whole human hierarchy business. I guess that if you traveled back to paleolithic times you'd meet nagging shamans "gifted" with a conscience normal folk could not conceive but could hear and with childlike selflessness obey. But now anybody can think for themselves, talk like God, impersonate Jesus and collectively go further, e.g. the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Our minds have surpassed the phase that spawned God. If some of our brains have begun to, it's a touchy issue.

    But there is something fishy about the Genesis God moving across the water, or, in Koran, having his throne where the water is now. I have a feeling Noah the father may have been God at one point.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Forum Junior kkawohl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    226
    Quote Originally Posted by Pong
    No, kkawohl, we don't fall for that old channeling God voice. It doesn't echo in our modern brains. And you don't get to be shaman for invoking it.

    Our minds have surpassed the phase that spawned God.
    (concept formation) I, god, had a humble beginning the same as man;
    My beginning was at the dawn of spirituality.

    I agree, man no longer needs to be submissive...but spirituality is a trait in our DNA.

    Concept formation is the process of developing abstract rules or mental constructs based on sensory experience.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Administrator KALSTER's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    8,245
    kkawohl, I am getting the distinct impression that you are mostly responding to threads by copy and pasting passages from your book.
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

    "Gullibility kills" - Carl Sagan
    "All people know the same truth. Our lives consist of how we chose to distort it." - Harry Block
    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12  
    The Doctor Quantime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    4,546
    I do that with The Bible. Sometimes. Hehe.
    "If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe". - Carl Sagan
    Reply With Quote  
     

Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •