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Thread: A hypothesis regarding time & space: as it is, and as we experience it

  1. #101  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagiMaster View Post
    Any scientist would readily admit that neither GR nor QED (our two best models of reality) are complete as each are incredibly accurate within their domains, but their domains don't overlap.
    Not familiar with the abbreviations GR and QED. What models do they represent?
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  2. #102  
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    Quote Originally Posted by imetheman View Post
    Not familiar with the abbreviations GR and QED. What models do they represent?
    General Relativity and Quantum Electrodynamics.
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  3. #103  
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by imetheman View Post
    Not familiar with the abbreviations GR and QED. What models do they represent?
    General Relativity and Quantum Electrodynamics.
    Yes of course it is. Just had to clarify the abbreviations, though now I feel a bit of a dummy!!
    Any model which encompasses both GR and QED, (getting the hang of it now!), would naturally accommodate both, without prejudicing the validity of either. I think it would be fair to assume that an encompassing model is required to be the blueprint for the evolution of the universe throughout the whole of it's existence from the Big Bang to the present time. The laws of all that we know regarding time and space no longer apply at the embryonic stages of the early universe. That notwithstanding, the universe evolved at this time nonetheless.

    In order that the changes which were required in order to ensure that the universe continued to grow and evolve, implies the existence of some bedrock overriding and guiding principle. Each subsequent change to the state of the universe had to lead to the next 'improved' state of the whole, in order to facilitate the eventual appearance of hydrogen, helium and lithium. Every change represents the evolution of the universe. The changes which occurred during the early stages of the universe were certainly not restricted by the laws of GR. Changes would have been instantaneous. The speed of light would not have been the ceiling at which information can be transferred as light did not exist. Non-locality therefore appears to exist in a dimension/domain which is essentially timeless. If so, this is the dimension in which the early universe evolved. Moreover, it is therefore also the dimension in which it continues to evolve. The non-locality interaction and the appearance of virtual particles which is observed in experiments, is a glimpse of the dimension of timelessness.

    In order for subsequent changes in the early universe to consistently be an improvement on the state which existed before, there firstly requires that some form of memory should be inherent in the model. It would be fair to assume that cause always precedes effect everywhere in the universe - even when it occurs in a dimension of timelessness.
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  4. #104  
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    Quote Originally Posted by imetheman View Post
    In order for subsequent changes in the early universe to consistently be an improvement on the state which existed before, there firstly requires that some form of memory should be inherent in the model. It would be fair to assume that cause always precedes effect everywhere in the universe - even when it occurs in a dimension of timelessness.
    Very nice statement above, but some of my recent readings regarding geometrogenesis, whether time is timeless of truly fundamental, whether time reversible equations faithfully describe nature, if there is a fundamental universal asymmetry to allow for 'cause and effect' etc. all put forward powerful arguments, but without a detailed knowledge (which is often predicated on years of learning a particular model) makes it very hard to support or refute these notions in the absence of observational proof.

    ....anyway it shouldn't stop us discussing and philosophising on these notions. The biggest mystery I have however is in understanding why my wife thinks I spend too much time on this forum. Now that is a mystery to me indeed if we accept that the universe is timeless :-))
    Last edited by Implicate Order; December 3rd, 2013 at 11:19 PM.
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  5. #105  
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    Quote Originally Posted by imetheman View Post
    The speed of light would not have been the ceiling at which information can be transferred as light did not exist.
    Just a little comment: I don't think the speed of light is dependent on light existing.

    This probably undermines the following claims:
    Non-locality therefore appears to exist in a dimension/domain which is essentially timeless. If so, this is the dimension in which the early universe evolved. Moreover, it is therefore also the dimension in which it continues to evolve. The non-locality interaction and the appearance of virtual particles which is observed in experiments, is a glimpse of the dimension of timelessness.
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    Once we throw dark energy and matter into the mix we have come to the conclusion our observation of reality is limited. This is why I prefer to use an empirical truth as a foundation which is thermal dynamics. If one third of our time and energy were spent trying to prove our universe is an open system instead of a closed system I believe many problems in physics can be solved.
    In an open system dark energy would be an infinite reservoir our universe draws energy from. Dark energy would filter through matter as it is pulled into black holes then returns back into an infinite realm as quantum macro foam. The time and space we experience is after the fact. Space is the difference between positive expanding energy and negative collapsing energy. Matter acts like a three dimensional drain we can only observe the effect as GR. Space is actually a dimensionless void with semi-infinite qualities where different quantum states can exist on the same plane.
    This makes dark energy a collapsing force. New black holes and new matter continually need to be introduced for the universe to continue to expand. This is the opposite of a closed system.
    For our concept of time and space to evolve our concept of special relativity needs to evolve. Once an open system is accepted and dark energy is a collapsing force the next step is to realize the collapsing force is a three dimensional rotating collapsing sphere one after another. Positive energy moving against a collapsing sphere starts at the equator and moves up the latitude on the inside of the sphere according to its velocity. Positive energy quantifies at the latitude it is in during the completion of the collapse its momentum thereafter is dictated by the expansion of space as all the dark energy in that moment is absorbed by all the matter in the universe.
    A Galaxy goes through the same process and quantifies at certain latitudes according to its total combined mass and positive energy creating its own special relativity and observation point on how the rest of the universe will be observed. This is why there is dark matter.
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    Quote Originally Posted by YangYin View Post
    Once we throw dark energy and matter into the mix we have come to the conclusion our observation of reality is limited.

    I'm not sure why dark matter and dark energy are relevant, but obviously our observation of reality is limited.

    This is why I prefer to use an empirical truth as a foundation which is thermal dynamics.
    How can there be empirical "truth" if our observations are limited.

    Science is based on the fact that our observations and theories are limited. That is why science has nothing to do with "truth".

    You then go into a load of wild speculation for which you provide no empirical evidence. Sigh.
    ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat
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    Thermal dynamics is an empirical truth. An open system answers more questions than a closed system. Dark energy and dark matter is unobservable. Special relativity opens the door to an infinite prospective point. The speed of light is not an infinite prospective point. It may or may not be a universal frame of reference. The speed of light may be our galaxy’s prospective point. The speed of light may be the frame rate our galaxy quantified in. Each galaxy may have a different prospective point dictated by its total mass. A clue to this being a probability would be observing other galaxies rotating faster than their mass would allow. When and if a galaxy is able to quantify and create its own frame rate, say the speed of light, it would do so at a specific latitude. This would make space appear to be flat and create a narrow bandwidth which to view the rest of the universe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by YangYin View Post
    Thermal dynamics is an empirical truth.
    I'm not sure what "Thermal dynamics" is. Thermodynamics, perhaps?

    Is it "truth"? Or is it just a good approximation based on our limited observations?

    An open system answers more questions than a closed system.
    Why?

    Dark energy and dark matter is unobservable.
    Obviously not. Otherwise they wouldn't be hypothesized.

    Special relativity opens the door to an infinite prospective point.

    The speed of light is not an infinite prospective point. It may or may not be a universal frame of reference.
    It cannot be a frame of reference. The rest of your post makes no sense at all.
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    When all the mathematical equations are calculated at some point the way everything is connected has to be put together physically. I am not surprised what I’m trying to explain seems wild and strange I have broadened my prospective and I am not limited to a closed system. When combined quantum mechanics and general relativity produces infinite loops. This is the correct answer. It seems finite creatures are very reluctant when dealing with infinity. String Theory was an attempt to reduce the infinite loops to 25 or less dimensions but still failed at connecting everything.
    I don’t know how many times in the physical world you and others need to see loops and make the connections, magnetic fields, looped magnetic fields, faraday’s law, electric transformers, electric motors, electromagnetic wave, wavelengths, all orbits, rotations, and spins in the arrow of time. These are all related to each other and to time and special relativity. Depending on the speed of the observer and what is being observed all fields are looped, at the right speeds the fields making the loops are also looped and so on infinitely space allowing.
    This is only applicable in an open system where a collapsing dimension and an expanding dimension create a balancing act bypassing each other in a corkscrew looped event. This galaxy is in a loop. All the matter in the galaxy is in the galaxy’s loops and is why it moves like a wagon wheel. Electrons and protons want to bypass each other in a looped corkscrew event. Up and down quarks connected in a stable environment are in a W boson loop. At the right speed the observer can observe loops in the field of the W boson. There are different generations of quarks because there are different generations of the W boson its sign is relative to direction within the loop. There is not a sufficient amount of space or velocity to keep more than the first generation of the W boson loop open. W bosons are like loops in a transformer only as energy is increased more loops are created, a decrease in energy and loops can unravel creating weak nuclear decay. The space between the W boson loops are the Z boson. There are also different generations of space, we are only able to observe a few. As the Z boson generation of space decays it produces different generations of leptons.
    This is actually a very simple way in which everything may be connected. I have found geniuses seem to over complicate things. A mathematical genius could over complicate a bowl of soup. Make it an alphabet soup and a Mathematician might wonder how many times could each can of soup spell quantum physics?

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    Quote Originally Posted by YangYin View Post
    A mathematical genius could over complicate a bowl of soup. Make it an alphabet soup and a Mathematician might wonder how many times could each can of soup spell quantum physics?
    Actually, I would just eat it.
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    Me, too, but not the "P"s, I don't like vegetables in soup...
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    Me, too, but not the "P"s, I don't like vegetables in soup...
    I only have carrots I mine and I make my own noodles and stock .........tonight....I made a pot of clam chowder for my band after we do our show.....want me to ship you some?
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    This is more like philosophy - I agree, our five senses and how they interact with the surrounding, our perceptual understanding of time and space are where we are eventually headed. All our understanding and thinkgs we see are so real that we have little doubt about, .... but we all get to the point where we realize that nothing is truly real. Is self real or is self-consciousness real? Ultimately, the Universe is what we say it is, but we have to say it logically. ... Once our blood stops circulating throuhg our veins, our understanding will simply be no more. ... Until then, keep thinking and keep thinking you are real.

    If time goes backward, do we remember future, or past?
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    Quote Originally Posted by tachyon1 View Post
    If time goes backward, do we remember future, or past?
    Dan Simmons has woven an entire storyline around precisely this question in his novel "Hyperion" ( an excellent and worthwhile read, btw ). Basically, even if you age backwards, your past is still your past, and your future is still your future - hence, you will still remember the past, but you will remember less of it every day, since your past gradually disappears as you grow back into a teenager, then a child, then an infant. Eventually there is nothing left to remember.

    Read the book, it's worth it
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markus Hanke View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by tachyon1 View Post
    If time goes backward, do we remember future, or past?
    Dan Simmons has woven an entire storyline around precisely this question in his novel "Hyperion" ( an excellent and worthwhile read, btw ). Basically, even if you age backwards, your past is still your past, and your future is still your future - hence, you will still remember the past, but you will remember less of it every day, since your past gradually disappears as you grow back into a teenager, then a child, then an infant. Eventually there is nothing left to remember.

    Read the book, it's worth it
    A number of forums have a good book thread.

    Is there one here?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beer w/Straw View Post
    A number of forums have a good book thread.

    Is there one here?
    Not sure, but you can always start one...I suggest the "Arts and Culture" Section. The "Hyperion" books by Dan Simmons should definitely be on that list
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    Quote Originally Posted by tachyon1 View Post
    This is more like philosophy - I agree, our five senses and how they interact with the surrounding, our perceptual understanding of time and space are where we are eventually headed. All our understanding and thinkgs we see are so real that we have little doubt about, .... but we all get to the point where we realize that nothing is truly real. Is self real or is self-consciousness real? Ultimately, the Universe is what we say it is, but we have to say it logically. ... Once our blood stops circulating throuhg our veins, our understanding will simply be no more. ... Until then, keep thinking and keep thinking you are real.

    If time goes backward, do we remember future, or past?
    In order to have philosophy you need biology to have the means to think. Chemical and electrical reactions are needed to create consciousness. This all makes it real enough and are clues to understanding our surroundings. Our surroundings on all levels are acting like a chemical reaction in an open system. The disconnection has been created by the path our combined thoughts have taken us and the inability to observe everything in its entirety. The missing link is the electron and our inability thus far to fully understand time,space, and dimensions. In the beginning the electron is the path to the evolution of heavier matter. The electron has the ability to build upon itself from a system able to build upon itself over a period of time, space, and dimensions. Our consciousness is created from the same system.
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    If time reversed would we observe the future or the past? To the observer in the event the next moment or position would appear to be the future. If the universe collapsed time has just looped and each moment in the collapse would appear to the observer to be the future just as each moment in the expansion of the universe appears to be the future. If the universe collapsed it depends on how much space was created in the expansion and the velocity of the collapse if all the matter in the universe will eventually smash into each other. Too much space and high enough velocities, and matter and packets of energy will react differently in the collapse by expanding. This would happen as velocities exceed the next collapsing moment of negative collapsing time and dimensions. As it is now, time slows down as you physically approach the event horizon of the black hole in the middle of our galaxy. On the event horizon of a black hole time stops, making this another big clue. In an open system black holes are the erasers of this event pulling each moment left behind in and expelling it out in an infinite state as expanded quantum macro foam, from which this system came. Being on the event horizon of a black hole physically is different from being on the event horizon of a black hole time wise. In an open system, each galactic moment of time left in the past eventually spirals into the black hole. This is not observable to observers heading with the expansion of the universe because black holes are able to pull time in faster than the speed of light. An observer on the Earth left to spiral into the black hole with the past would observe a worm hole opening up forming a tunnel with a light appearing to be at the end of it. The light is the core of this planet, the worm hole would continue on with another light appearing to be at the end of it which would be our sun. The tunnel way would continue as it entered the black hole. This would mean for every moment you are conscious and heading into the expanding future, you may be conscious as the present parts ways with the future and falls into the past. For every moment you are alive in each new moment you perish in each moment left behind with everyone around you at that moment. If this is the case I would suggest you live each moment the best you can for this is a high price to pay in a universe where every action has an opposite and equal reaction.
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