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Thread: Is there spirit?

  1. #1 Is there spirit? 
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    Is there spirit?


    Matter is just matter. But what shapes us exactly as human beings, with eyes, nose, ears, etc, no matter what, we are shaped exactly as human beings, as if there is a principle that is being followed, rather, that is obeyed. Is this just the making of matter, are we just chemical reactions? Or, is there injected another ingredient in matter that causes chemical reactions, that shapes us all exactly as human beings, is this ingredient, the Spirit that gives life?

    Jsaldea12


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    There is no good reason to think that such a thing as a "spirit" exists. Nor is there any reason to consider such a proposition scientifically.


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    Quoted: "There is no good reason to think that such a thing as a "spirit" exists. Nor is there any reason to consider such a proposition scientifically."


    There is all reasons to consider such proposition scientifically.
    Because science cannot detect it does no mean it does not exist. The principle is very undeniable: no matter what, we are born human beings, and not other forms, who made this possible, definitely not matter to matter, neither is it the result of chemical interaction of matter, if it is such chemical interaction, we would have different shapes, ...but no matter what, we are born human beings, universally. There is principle behind that guides, that governs that make us as is human being. Is that not what all religions call spirit?

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    It's called genes and DNA. There is no reason to suspect a spirit exists.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you" - Friedrich Nietzsche

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  6. #5  
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    Zero credible evidence that spirits exist, are part of humans in this life or the next or any other animals.
    Meteorologist/Naturalist & Retired Soldier
    “The Holy Land is everywhere” Black Elk
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsaldea12
    Quoted: "There is no good reason to think that such a thing as a "spirit" exists. Nor is there any reason to consider such a proposition scientifically."


    There is all reasons to consider such proposition scientifically.
    Because science cannot detect it does no mean it does not exist.
    That's not exactly what I meant. What I meant was there are no unknown phenomena about the human body in which a "spirit" need be invoked to explain. Thus far, more prosaic and parsimonious explanations exist, and no hypothesis of a "spirit" has had any explanatory power or rational description of a "spirit" mechanism.
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    The body has been dissected completely, yes, physically. But what is that that gives it life? We know what happen when life leaves the body….from dust to dust returneth, the saying goes. Something not just matter gives it life, it is not matter which scientifically has been dissected, not just chemical reaction, something too perfect is infused that gives it life,…because we cannot dissect it, it is not real? It is that gives reality…call it unknown phenomena, call it spirit. Scientifically, by total inference, we are evidence that it exists, this that write is the making of spirit, itself..

    Jsaldea12
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    It's all biology. ATP.

    This is moved to pseudoscience.
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  10. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkinWalker
    There is no good reason to think that such a thing as a "spirit" exists. Nor is there any reason to consider such a proposition scientifically.
    On the contrary, there are some very fine spirits.

    http://www.jackdaniels.com/age.aspx?...2fDefault.aspx

    http://www.chivas.com/Default.aspx

    http://www.highwest.com/

    They make pseudoscience more palatable.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsaldea12
    The body has been dissected completely, yes, physically. But what is that that gives it life? We know what happen when life leaves the body….from dust to dust returneth, the saying goes. Something not just matter gives it life, it is not matter which scientifically has been dissected, not just chemical reaction, something too perfect is infused that gives it life,…because we cannot dissect it, it is not real? It is that gives reality…call it unknown phenomena, call it spirit. Scientifically, by total inference, we are evidence that it exists, this that write is the making of spirit, itself..

    Jsaldea12
    Does the "spirit" age and die? If not, why then does the body? It appears that when the body can no longer support itself and fails, the "spirit" leaves. Clearly the more powerful force in this instance would be the body. As such there is no need for a spirit. It serves no purpose.

    You are making wild irrational claims that have no bases in reality or evidence.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you" - Friedrich Nietzsche

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    What gives mass to a person? LHC is searching for ir. They call it higgs boson.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jsaldea12
    What gives mass to a person? LHC is searching for ir. They call it higgs boson
    The molecules of their physical body. Making shit up doesn't define "spirit."

    And wishful thinking or an adherence to superstition doesn't mean "spirit" exists. There is simply no need to insert "spirit" as a part of reality to explain human existence.
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    Even if we didn't know what gave us mass, that doesn't give you the right to make up an answer.

    If you don't know something, the right thing to do is (assuming there is liturature on it) try to read about it and learn that which you don't know. If no literature exists for it, and you don't want to do anything to try to prove something exists, the only honest answer you're left with is "I don't know." You don't get to make up something to attempt to fill the gap in your head.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you" - Friedrich Nietzsche

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    Scientists call that higgs particle |”God particles”. Hope, we are coming close to it. This is one of the objectives of Large Hadron Collider. LHC claims to detect it very, very slightly. We are looking for source of mass of particles, molecules, etc. In the deepest analysis, the law of conservation is not just matter to energy, and energy to matter. In an atomic explosion, a small portion of conversion from matter to energy, never return to matter. Where did it go? Thus, the law of conservation which states: matter to energy to matter is not complete: It should be matter to energy to unknown phenomenon, and back, that is forever vibrating, even spacetime, itself, is vibrating. Gravity vibration of earth is different,it is life-giving vibration.

    Close your eyes, and open inside, see, there are movement, vibration, that is the vibration of life, that unknown phenomenon, that gives life, that exposes itself, call that phenomenon, spirit, or any other name, it is one and same.

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    Scientists call that higgs particle |”God particles”.
    That doesn't mean anything. That is just a name, and I remember reading somewhere that they regret using that term.

    From Wiki
    The Higgs boson is a hypothetical massive scalar elementary particle predicted to exist by the Standard Model of particle physics.
    It has nothing to do with religion.

    LHC claims to detect it very, very slightly.
    Where did you hear that? I have heard nothing about them detecting the higgs boson at all. They claim to have detected particles that carry some of the weak force, but that is not what they were after. Please provide a reference for this claim.
    In the deepest analysis, the law of conservation is not just matter to energy, and energy to matter. In an atomic explosion, a small portion of conversion from matter to energy, never return to matter.
    The law of conservation states that matter can change into energy and energy can be changed into matter. It doesn't HAVE to change back into matter once becoming energy. All the law of conservation says is that it CAN. Once again you make a positive claim, "...a small portion of conversion from matter to energy, never return to matter." I would like to see some evidence provided to back up this claim.
    Thus, the law of conservation which states: matter to energy to matter is not complete: It should be matter to energy to unknown phenomenon, and back, that is forever vibrating, even spacetime, itself, is vibrating. Gravity vibration of earth is different,it is life-giving vibration.
    This is just utter non-sense filled with positive claims that you have no evidence supporting. Show me the evidence.

    Close your eyes, and open inside, see, there are movement, vibration, that is the vibration of life, that unknown phenomenon, that gives life, that exposes itself, call that phenomenon, spirit, or any other name, it is one and same.
    Here you flat out contradict yourself. You say the unknown phenomenon, is the vibrations of life. If it is the vibrations of life, whatever that means, then clearly it is not an unknown phenomenon.

    You also admit that your attempt to name it, is completely pointless. "...call that phenomenon, spirit, or any other name, it is one and same." If you can name it anything you want and it doesn't help in any way, you have no point in positing it as an explanation for an unknown. The only proper thing to do, is to say "I don't know."

    Get down to the fundamental question of what gives the atoms their mass, we simply don't know yet. We have hypothesis, but they have not been tested and proven true or false yet. As such we have to answer "I don't know" to that question. But just because we don't know YET, doesn't mean we CAN'T know, it also doesn't mean you get to posit something as the cause that has no usefulness in the real world.

    Honestly your post hurt my brain trying to read it and figure out what you were saying.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you" - Friedrich Nietzsche

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  17. #16  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haasum
    Scientists call that higgs particle |”God particles”.
    That doesn't mean anything. That is just a name, and I remember reading somewhere that they regret using that term.
    You are right, iit is just a name.

    There is no "they". Leon Lederman used the term in the title of a (rather good) book. It sold a lot of books. The term is not used in scientific circles.
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    Close your eyes, and open inside, see, there are movement, vibration, that is the vibration of life, that unknown phenomenon, that gives life, that exposes itself, call that phenomenon, spirit, or any other name, it is one and same.


    Consider the complex creation of every human being: the billions of brain cells, the more billions of cells in human being, Chemical reaction? There is cause to the amazing creation beyond calculation how to the making and arrangement of a baby, itself. It is just chemical reaction?. Besides , chemical reactions has a cause itself. There is too much perfections, and some imperfection in this world, there is a cause that is operating in the making a baby. If your mind can comprehend the making of baby, just those billions of cells, accidental, just chemical reactions? Think again? By the way, what causes such thinking.

    Jsaldea12
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    I'm done with this. You clearly have not taken biology at college. Go read a book, take a class on the subject. Educate yourself about the subject before injecting your claims about spirits and vibrations.

    Yes, chemical and biological reactions are making the baby. It is a very well understood process. The cause of the baby being made, is that two adults got together, had unprotected sex and impregnated an egg cell with a sperm. After that, millions of years of evolution take over and run the right programs in the right orders to make a baby.

    When these programs go awry as they sometimes do, you get deformities. Clearly if this "spirit" you're claiming exists, is responsible for the building a baby it can fail and is thus not perfect as you claim.

    This is going no where since you wont acknowledge any point I or anyone else makes. So as I said at the begging, I'm done. Have a nice night.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you" - Friedrich Nietzsche

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    Quoted, "Yes, chemical and biological reactions are making the baby. It is a very well understood process. The cause of the baby being made, is that two adults got together, had unprotected sex and impregnated an egg cell with a sperm. After that, millions of years of evolution take over and run the right programs in the right orders to make a baby".

    Who or what causes that chemical reaction and biological reactions?

    jsaldea12
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    The magical invisible pink unicorn that lives in my shower drain.

    You are asking the wrong question. It is not a who or what, but a why. The answer to that question is physics and chemical attractions. Take a chemistry class, and a biology class, and that will get you on your way.

    However you seem to want to just ask "and then what" questions, which i'll admit right now will eventually lead us to "I don't know." But as said before that doesn't give you the right to posit a claim to fill that void with another void.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you" - Friedrich Nietzsche

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    Quoted "However you seem to want to just ask "and then what" questions, which i'll admit right now will eventually lead us to "I don't know." But as said before that doesn't give you the right to posit a claim to fill that void with another void".
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    No comment because we do not know, we cannot know but it does not mean that because we do not know, we cannot know, it does not exists, the evidence by inference that it exists is us. We are not just biological/chemical reaction…we have intelligence that knows that is not due to biology and chemistry. Something far behind is there, inscrutable, beyond, that moves , that gives us this intelligence, this life..

    Jsaldea12
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    So you believe that I have an invisible pink unicorn that lives in my shower drain and that it is the reason we exist, there is gravity, and that it makes all the reactions occur?
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you" - Friedrich Nietzsche

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  25. #24  
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    In my shower drain there resides an invisible, non-corporeal dragon that breaths fire and eats unicorns. May our pipes never cross; our plumbing never connect.
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    lmao
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