Thread: Strange experiences.

Damn, I just had another one.

By 'strange', I mean inexplicable within the current scientific explanations of the workings of the universe. Don't even think co-incidence; that is not an option as an explanation here, and, quite possibly, I will hear you.

I've had several 'strange experiences'; they have all been very brief, used language, and were astonishingly banal. No final messages of love from a dieing parent for me, nope, I pick up that the person next to me would call that color 'coral', not 'pink'. [No, that's not what just happened, but it was about as significant.]

Scream of frustration; if I do have this weird non-verbal but language-based means of communication, why does it alway manifest itself in such trivial ways?

So, fellow scientists, do you have strange experiences? Are they language-based? Are they trivial?

nope never...i envy you and your strange experiences.

Well, I can understand that, although please believe me when I tell you they are, with one exception, stunningly trivial.

But are you so certain that you don't? I think that people often just don't perceive things that don't fit their world view; they skitter across the mind and fall off.

I am glad that I do have my strange experiences, because they prove to me that there are abilities beyond current scientific explanations, and so I am very open minded. Ghosts? Maybe. Telekinesis? Sure, why not. Telepathy? Probably. Clairaudience? Well, yeah.

But I find it so frustratingly pointless; I can not access the ability at will, and I never am gifted with significant information. Ah, well, knowledge is still knowledge even without a practical application.

I have seen ghosts on two occasions. And heard one, as part of a group, on four or five occasions.
In my teens, when I was fascinated by ESP and telekinesis, I tried to make a vase fall of a shelf by thinking at it. Two days later it fell off when nobody was in the room.
Last week, travelling home by train, I overheard another passenger explaining on his mobile that the Inverness train had been derailed by a tree. Twelve hours later the Inverness train was derailed by a landslide. I am presently trying to find out if there were in fact two disrailments within twelve hours of each other.

For the record, I don't believe in ghosts, extra-sensory perception, or clairvoyance.

Originally Posted by j

Well, I can understand that, although please believe me when I tell you they are, with one exception, stunningly trivial.

But are you so certain that you don't? I think that people often just don't perceive things that don't fit their world view; they skitter across the mind and fall off.

I am glad that I do have my strange experiences, because they prove to me that there are abilities beyond current scientific explanations, and so I am very open minded. Ghosts? Maybe. Telekinesis? Sure, why not. Telepathy? Probably. Clairaudience? Well, yeah.

But I find it so frustratingly pointless; I can not access the ability at will, and I never am gifted with significant information. Ah, well, knowledge is still knowledge even without a practical application.

trivial huh?
well i never heard anyone say they had to be specific.
perhaps if such an ability is written into your genes it would be future generations that experience them in non trivial ways.

Originally Posted by j

I pick up that the person next to me would call that color 'coral', not 'pink'.

This seems normal to me. I have played a game for several years when listening to or watching the news. When any number is about to be spoken as part of the broadcast (e.g. thirty seven dead, 250 million overrun, 400 new houses) I predict the number in advance. I get extremely close 95% of the time. Much closer than one could get through an intelligent guess based on general context. [I've tried it that way too.]
The technique is simple. I believe that the language used in the broadcast - the specific words used - tie in very closely with the number that will be spoken. Once one gets attuned to this it is quite simple to arrive at a near correct answer every time.
Might it be that you are doing a similar thing on a subconsious level?

Well, no. You know how your spouse will suddenly looked at you and answer the question you were about to ask, with no obvious external stimulus? That kind of thing happens to me with other people as well; strangers and friends.

I am willing to believe that my spouse and I might have the same thought in response to some completely un-noticed cue, because we have some many shared experiences, but I can not see how that would happen with others. People can come up with no end of 'natural' explanations; frankly, I find them a lot less probable and no more 'natural' than my explanation, which is that sometimes I pick up other people's thoughts, and sometimes people pick up mine.

Most people think this is just ... oh, damn, what is that phrase, when you only remember when you guess right, and ignore all the times you guess wrong? But that's not it; when this happens, I notice the difference ...

And I have this new idea [I believe I have alluded to it in another thread] that things like this happen more often than anyone realizes, but people don't notice because the incidents are so trivial. You ask, 'Do you want peas or corn?', 'peas' pops into your head, and your spouse says, 'Peas'; no-one notices things like that. In fact, you are more likely to notice, and remember, if your spouse replies, 'Corn'.

As for ghosts, I don't know anyone who has seen one, but about half the people I know have heard one. Usually, however, after having done so, they believe in them.

Most of my birth family have/had little gifts, wallaby; lots of little incidences of knowing things they shouldn't have been able to know. I don't discuss it with the next generation, yet, but I think they have their little gifts, too.

I am willing to believe that my spouse and I might have the same thought in response to some completely un-noticed cue, because we have some many shared experiences, but I can not see how that would happen with others.

Nonetheless that is precisely what is happening. If it didn't work that way (cues subconsciously noted stimulating similar responses) Derren Brown wouldn't have a career. Your supposedly uniquely shared experieneces are actually surprisingly commonplace.

Your "pink/coral" thing (or whatever its equivalent would be) is again you picking up clues that are helping you make an accurate character assessment.

Originally Posted by j

Most people think this is just ... oh, damn, what is that phrase, when you only remember when you guess right, and ignore all the times you guess wrong? But that's not it; when this happens, I notice the difference ...

Confirmation bias. And you don't notice the misses, that's why it happens!

Originally Posted by j

'Do you want peas or corn?', 'peas' pops into your head, and your spouse says, 'Peas'; no-one notices things like that. In fact, you are more likely to notice, and remember, if your spouse replies, 'Corn'.

Not really. If your partner said "corn", most of the time your brain simply erases the triviality of "peas" having popped into your head, and you don't even register that you thought that. If you think "peas" and your partner says "peas", this reinforces it and your brain doesn't erase it. Of course, since our time perception is entirely brain-oriented, it's perfectly possible that your partner said "peas", your brain received it, then transmitted it to your consciousness in reverse order, so you only thought "peas" because your partner had alread said it, but your brain fooled you into thinking it was the other way around.

Originally Posted by j

But I find it so frustratingly pointless; I can not access the ability at will, and I never am gifted with significant information. Ah, well, knowledge is still knowledge even without a practical application.

Of course it has a practical application: become a professional Psychic. Your abilities are no better or worse than any other Psychic's, in that they are non-existent as far as mystical non-existent "powers", and very high quality in terms of judgement, observation and induction.

It amounts to, you're a very good judge of character, so go make use of your talent!

Confirmation bias, thank you. It’s kind of like bad breath, isn’t it? We always notice it in other people, but seldom in ourselves.

From the tone of your post, Silas, I get the impression that you are not really interested in this phenomenon. I never indicated that it is ‘mystical’, just beyond current measurement techniques. However, I may misunderstand you, so I will explain in greater detail.

This little gift is not a vague sense, open to interpretation. Phrases that another person physically close to me and usually in conversation with me think, pop into my head. Theses are not full thoughts or vague ideas, but simple concrete phrases like ‘corn’ or ‘green shoes’ [i.e. either very common or rather unusual].

The first time I noticed it, I was fifteen; a person to whom I was just introduced expressed a personal preference that was quite unexpected. I don’t want to get side-tracked by details; let’s say it was like Elizabeth II announcing that her favorite singer was Jim Nabors; not impossible, but definitely unexpected.

So I started paying attention; phrases did not pop into my head very often, but when they did subsequent conversation strongly indicated that another person in conversation with me had just thought that exact phrase. Usually, this would occur during animated conversations. Often, the ‘sender’ would be rather excited and eager to share some information; for example, the name of a book they really enjoyed.

For a while, I tested this; whenever a phrase popped in, I would say it out loud. Another person present would always indicate they had just thought the phrase, usually using words like ‘exactly’ or ‘that very thought’; occasionally, I would question, 'Those exact words?', and received confirmation. I never got a blank look or a response like ‘not quite’. This would happen with both close friends and near strangers. Furthermore, this did not excite any particular interest; people would just go on with the conversation, or, at most, make a comment about great minds or fools’ minds. This went on for a couple of years; eventually, I had to stop because some-one did take notice, and I realized that any additional data would be tainted.

Keep in mind what I am tallking about; I am not talking about guessing what someone is going to say next, or even having a general sense of what someone will say, but specific words just popping into my head.

This still happens to me; with some people it is common, and with others it has never happened. Occasionally, I believe some one has picked up one of my thoughts; I tend to be a bit reserved and to monitor my own mental language with that person. Oh, and I don't recall it ever happening with a family member or when I have had alcohol; I wonder if I don't just filter out such incidences as unreliable data.

I have absolutely no control over this; I can not read someone by concentrating hard, nor send to someone [actually, I don't know about the latter; I've never tried it. Hmmm.] This does not correlate to how well I know someone; it might correlate to how much I like someone, but I suspect that my sense that it does is a matter of confirmation bias. I don't believe that I can do anything to develop the ability; I remember more incidences during my testing phase, but I attribute that to just paying more attention. It is not an unpleasant or startling experience, although I might be startled by the content of the thought.

I have had other types of 'strange experiences', but they are less concrete; so, I just accept them. Maybe I just find the proportions of the rooms unpleasant in the house that feels 'haunted'; maybe there is something wrong with the road on which all those car accidents occured; maybe my hand-eye co-ordination has improved or my spouse has learned to make subtle adjustments when throwing me something. Eh, who cares.

As for those little mind reading moments in marriage, consider the ‘peas or corn?’ scenario [note: in this case, peas and corn really are perfectly equally likely to be chosen]:
I asked, ‘peas’ pops into my head, and my spouse says ‘corn’. Naturally, I am startled, so I mention that I expected to hear ‘peas’; my spouse replies, ‘Actually, I did thinks peas, but then I remembered I wanted the peas tomorrow night with the shrimp.’ This is completely different from both of us thinking of Christmas shopping when we hear a particular Jimmy Buffet song; it is as if you were suddenly to think 'Christmas shopping' if you heard the song in my company.

Originally Posted by Ophiolite

I have seen ghosts on two occasions. And heard one, as part of a group, on four or five occasions.
In my teens, when I was fascinated by ESP and telekinesis, I tried to make a vase fall of a shelf by thinking at it. Two days later it fell off when nobody was in the room.
Last week, travelling home by train, I overheard another passenger explaining on his mobile that the Inverness train had been derailed by a tree. Twelve hours later the Inverness train was derailed by a landslide. I am presently trying to find out if there were in fact two disrailments within twelve hours of each other.

For the record, I don't believe in ghosts, extra-sensory perception, or clairvoyance.

Watch this video:

http://www.scifi.com/ghosthunters/vi...lip/index.html

Not working.

Doh!

It requires quicktime and this is the full URL: http://www.scifi.com/ghosthunters/

At the top right theres an "exclusive case video file" - click that.

It features a thermal image of a ghost. Quite impressive!

I have quicktime. The page loaded the QT symbol came up. I waited ten minutes. I clicked every vacant and non-vacant spot on the page. I'll try again.

Originally Posted by Ophiolite

I have quicktime. The page loaded the QT symbol came up. I waited ten minutes. I clicked every vacant and non-vacant spot on the page. I'll try again.

:x Frustrating isnt it.. Maybe your browser doesnt like the way their doing it. Or even a download manager can interfere.

Finally worked. Not at all impressive. Having been conditioned by multiple factors (your comments, the title of the extract, the comments from the 'researchers') to expect to see a figure it is not too surprising that I interpreted the image as a figure.
Also, are all materials of all walls impervious to all inra-red all the time? If not what is to say we are not dealing with a figure on the other side of the wall?
Anyway, interesting, but not mind numbing.

Originally Posted by Ophiolite

Finally worked. Not at all impressive. Having been conditioned by multiple factors (your comments, the title of the extract, the comments from the 'researchers') to expect to see a figure it is not too surprising that I interpreted the image as a figure.
Also, are all materials of all walls impervious to all inra-red all the time? If not what is to say we are not dealing with a figure on the other side of the wall?
Anyway, interesting, but not mind numbing.

They were investigating a place said to be haunted, and they caught an image of a man (ghost) on the thermal imaging camera. Furthermore, during the program they tried to reproduce the same image with the camera and never could. Also, coal miners were said to have worked down in that area as well. It fits with the reported disturbances and provides us with some proof.

It's very impressive and does not matter if you are too skeptical to accept it.

You can never be too skeptical. :wink:

Aaah, I think one can be too skeptical. I think it better to be able rather than determined to doubt. There are those whose minds shut with a nearly audible click ...

However, skepticism is preferable to automatic acceptance.

When walking my girlfriend home one time we had just finished crossing the nature strip and started crossing the road when for some unknown reason I felt an almost uncontrollable urge to go back on to the nature strip and start digging in the dirt. I told my girlfriend there was something there as I proceeded to dig up the dirt I found a cross. It was one of those crosses that goes on a necklace with some microscopic prayer that you could read through a pinhole. That's probably the strangest thing I've ever experienced. :?

Originally Posted by j

Aaah, I think one can be too skeptical. .

Not if one is also sceptical of one's scepticism. :wink:

That's not just clever, it's true.

I am skeptical, that's why I find the thermal image of a male spirit solid evidence of spiritual activity.

I think it helps that I watch that show (TAPS) rather often and they are tireless in their pursuit to debunk EVERYTHING they uncover that could be paranormal.

A true, fair minded skeptic should be able to watch their show and enjoy it because they often solve cases, NOT by saying the problem is paranormal. For instance, once case they had a door that closed hard by itself. Well, of course they did some tests and found out that it was the other door, causing a suction effect and making the other door close. They were able to repeatedly illustrate how this was not paranormal. They also uncovered NO paranormal evidence at all.

It's also interesting to note this;

Jason (Leader of the TAPS group) was given a psychic reading from a medium. Grant (also with TAPS) was using the thermal camera during the reading. When the medium was trying to read Jason the thermal camera went crazy and strange heat signatures went from Jason to the medium.

I found that rather amazing, because he was getting correct information and the Thermal camera seemed to be picking up this exchange. I'd love for them to do more work on that. 8)

Originally Posted by j

Aaah, I think one can be too skeptical.

I doubt that.

Actually, you only doubt because you only remember the times you were right to doubt ...

Do you really think that is true? :wink:

Originally Posted by btimsah

I found that rather amazing, because he was getting correct information and the Thermal camera seemed to be picking up this exchange. I'd love for them to do more work on that. 8)

I simply don't believe anecdotal accounts like this. If this were true, they could set up experiments to actually documents it a few times, under conditions where you can rule out ordinary explanations. It's never been done, and when the conditions are properly set up, mystical hogwash like this never works. Or, go take a look at the JREF challenge. If this psychic is for real, he/she has a $1,000,000 prize waiting for them. But of course, no one has ever even passed the preliminary screening let alone the final.
None of that crap is real. I'd say I have a pretty strong belief about that. But of course, the proper evidence would change my mind.

Originally Posted by KazaKhan™®©

When walking my girlfriend home one time we had just finished crossing the nature strip and started crossing the road when for some unknown reason I felt an almost uncontrollable urge to go back on to the nature strip and start digging in the dirt. I told my girlfriend there was something there as I proceeded to dig up the dirt I found a cross. It was one of those crosses that goes on a necklace with some microscopic prayer that you could read through a pinhole. That's probably the strangest thing I've ever experienced. :?

I'm sorry, I missed this before. So, you've have one, and it did NOT involve language. [Unless you are just not reporting all the other times you had a strong urge to dig in a nature strip ...].

The skeptic would reply that in a highly travelled spot you would be bound to find something if you dugged around a lot, and call it co-incidence, but I'll accept that as a bone-fide strange experience.

So, what did you do with the cross?

And what's a nature strip?