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Thread: drugs, should they be illegal?

  1. #1 drugs, should they be illegal? 
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    why are drugs illegal? i know they can be dangerous (probably not as much as their made out to be) but doesn't a person, in a free country, have the right to harm themselves any way they see fit? and if you're objective is preventing harm to a person, how are lengthy prison sentences for substance sale/abuse helping?

    don't you think their illegality leads to making drugs even more dangerous because they can be mixed and cut with whatever the person dealing them wants...

    studies show that most drug users are nonviolent http://www.jointogether.org/news/res...enders-in.html
    and if we trust people to control themselves with something like alcohol (most can and some can't) why not expect people to be grown up enough to handle themselves with other substances

    hell at least make pot legal, we're wasting time and money prosecuting it


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  3. #2  
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    Yea, if alcohol is legal weed should certainly be legal, much less dangerous and addictive.

    I'd draw the line at drugs that can make people violent or in other ways dangerous to other people. Perhaps drugs that are so addictive that a first-time user immediately gets hooked should also stay off the shelves. But weed probably reduces violence in society rather than increasing it..


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    Forum Masters Degree SuperNatendo's Avatar
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    Well, first of all, alot of drugs ARE legal, Caffeine, nicotine, alcohol, tobacco, guarana etc...

    Harming yourself is not the issue here, it is when people start harming others when linked to drugs.

    examples: Drunk driving, being hopped up on lsd, cocaine, these are bad.

    Laws are put in place to make a divide between what is considered by the majority to be safe, and what isn't.

    There are fine lines and some things that are illegal may not be as bad as society perceives them to be, but as long as the people using these drugs continue to break laws and be part of violent crimes it will be harder to legalize.

    Also, the government likes to be able to regulate drugs like tobacco and alcohol, some drugs that grow more easily cannot be as easily regulated so they are made illegal, even if those drugs cause less or equal damage to heavy drinking. As long as the majority of people find this regulation to be a good thing, this is how it will be. Some countries have less drug restriction, some have more. It depends on the majority opinion on how much better life is with or without something.

    Personally, I think life is much better without drugs, though I do consume alcohol on occasion, I Average about 6 drinks every month.
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    Legalization of drugs is much better than the current state of things. Right now drugs provide a large income base for organized crime and dictatorships like those in Columbia and previously the Taliban in Afghanistan.

    If you legalize the production of opiates, it would provide safer distribution.

    Marijuana is legal in Amsterdam, but levels of drug use in Amsterdam are on average about the same or lower than most countries where marijuana is legal. Moreover, drug addicts have higher life expectancies in Holland.

    Cocaine is not dangerous to other people, , it's a rich person's drug that people do at parties and clubs, it is dangerous to the user though, but that is the person's right.

    LSD can be potentially dangerous to others, but this has not been shown to readily happen, and it is certainly less dangerous than alcohol on a societal level.

    Crack is a very dangerous drug, it is highly addictive and very bad for a person's health, the reason why people do crack is it is dirt cheap and easy to get. If other safer drugs are legalized, I suspect usage of crack would decrease.

    Pharmaceuticals should remain available only by prescription, because people intending to use them for the proper purposes could misuse them if they didn't get them through a doctor's direction.

    Society can only benefit from taking money out of the hands of criminals as far as I see it. To use or not to use is a personal choice, I don't smoke marijuana/tobacco or drink alcohol. I don't think drug use would rise from legalization either.

    One thing for sure is that the 3 strikes law in the USA for drug posession is absurd, you can rape a woman and get 20 years, but if you're caught with marijuana 3 times you go to jail for life. This law is just complete nonsense.
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  6. #5  
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    One thing for sure is that the 3 strikes law in the USA for drug posession is absurd, you can rape a woman and get 20 years, but if you're caught with marijuana 3 times you go to jail for life. This law is just complete nonsense.
    i did not know that... for lack of a better word, that's fucked up

    There are fine lines and some things that are illegal may not be as bad as society perceives them to be, but as long as the people using these drugs continue to break laws and be part of violent crimes it will be harder to legalize.
    i think cause and effect are getting mixed up here. naturally bad people are more likely to commit crimes if their high on something, but they'd be doing that anyways.

    Some countries have less drug restriction, some have more. It depends on the majority opinion on how much better life is with or without something.
    it shouldn't be about the majority opinion, it should be up to the individual what makes their life better or worse.

    you cross a dangerous line when you start letting the government decide for people whats good for them
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  7. #6 Re: drugs, should they be illegal? 
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    Does legalization of all drugs make our life more dangerous? Yes, in some circumstances, such as what SuperNatendo said.

    Does legalization of all drugs harm our freedom? Maybe not.

    Does legalization of all drugs violent our pursuit of happiness? Yes, the people who don't use drugs maybe don't feel safe whereever they are surrounded by drug addicts.

    So, it shouldn't be legal.
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    The government only has as much power as the people give it. No matter how oppressive a government becomes, it CAN be overthrown.

    We mustn't give up our freedoms lightly, and I believe a small amount of these drug restrictions are causing worse things than they are preventing just as prohibition did. But I cannot think of a logical reason for a person using cocaine, lsd, heroine, etc... Maybe it is because I have never tried anything beyond alcohol, nor do I have a desire to, but If you "NEED" this stuff or even want to try it maybe you have a few things you need to work out with yourself?
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  9. #8  
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    Does legalization of all drugs make our life more dangerous? Yes, in some circumstances, such as what SuperNatendo said.
    i think Benjamin Franklin said it best
    "those who would sacrifice liberty for a little security deserve neither"

    By the way, crime would most likely decrease if drugs were legal. seeing as how they'd be legal, people could use mildly and still get a job. they'd be cheaper and more available, people wouldn't need to steal to support their habit anymore.

    cops wouldn't be wasting their time on petty drug use so they could devote more of their resources to real crime. come to think of it legalization would make our lives much, much safer.
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    Why are some drugs illegal? Well it can't be to protect the mental or physical health of those that use them otherwise fatty foods, tv, tobacco, alcohol, video games and a host of other things would be illegal. Is it because drugs can lead to violence? Well, if you ask any police officer or security person what they would rather deal with , a pub full of people drinking alcohol or a pub full of people on ecstacy or pot and the answer will always be the latter. Is it because they can be addictive? once again tv, chocolate, ciggerettes, alcohol and so on are addictive so that cant be it.
    Who are the only people that can make drugs legal or illegal? Lawyers. Now, if you go to any court in this country at least, (Australia) you will see that roughly half the cases before the courts are for the possession or sale of illegal drugs. That means half the income for lawyers in the country are from people defending themselves against drug charges, from the poor small time user, to the rich big time drug baron's. Now why would any lawyer fight to legalize anything that could take away half his income?
    Add to this politicians (a lot of ex-lawyers) that must convey themselves as clean cut and never breaking the law and a news media that loves to report anything negative regarding illegal drugs (even though some consume illegal drugs them selves).
    So, we have a non-drug using part of society that is so paranoid and mis-informed about the real deal with drugs and then you have another group that might use drugs regularly or just occasionally but too afraid to admit it to the paranoid public for fear of what that paranoid, mis-informed group of people might try to have done to them.
    If you were an alien race watching how we decide what is illegal and what isn't, surely you would be confused how we make millionaires out of those that sell one thing that is just as addictive and just as bad or worse for your mental and physical health as those things that we imprison others for selling.
    Have i used illegal drugs? Yes but i am 38 now and my lifestyle is different from what it was 10 years ago. If the time and the surroundings were right, "i" would have no problem using them again, it doesn't mean i have a drug "problem" though.
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  11. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_feel_tiredsleepy
    Cocaine is not dangerous to other people, , it's a rich person's drug

    Crack is a very dangerous drug, it is highly addictive and very bad for a person's health, the reason why people do crack is it is dirt cheap and easy to get.
    Do know that crack & cocaine - "freebase" & "base" - are essentially the same thing, just cooked differently. Dealers and users can convert one to the other in any kitchen.

    What you're seeing is the difference between pipe tobacco and cartons of cigarettes. A true addict will not kid around with tobacco pipes or snorted coke.



    The key challenge of highly addictive drugs, in my opinion, is that people of any intellectual sophistication and supposed rationality can become addicted. If your aim in life boils down to personal happiness, then one try and you're screwed. Because crack and smack do answer better than one can possibly imagine. It is rational to cast all else aside for the high. Given mainstream values, it's the right thing to do. The addicted can be perfectly lucid about this, and I'd be convinced they're right, except I don't believe happiness a desirable goal in life.

    We have to push a stigma around these drugs, or a lot of nice people will get lost to them. By pushing I mean the little lie "drugs are bad" when in fact many drugs are too good. Until we change our values.
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    Quote Originally Posted by medlakeguy
    Does legalization of all drugs make our life more dangerous? Yes, in some circumstances, such as what SuperNatendo said.
    i think Benjamin Franklin said it best
    "those who would sacrifice liberty for a little security deserve neither"

    By the way, crime would most likely decrease if drugs were legal. seeing as how they'd be legal, people could use mildly and still get a job. they'd be cheaper and more available, people wouldn't need to steal to support their habit anymore.

    cops wouldn't be wasting their time on petty drug use so they could devote more of their resources to real crime. come to think of it legalization would make our lives much, much safer.
    I think it's not "a little security". Many, many people have been addicted to drugs. And the effects? The fact says that they aren't good. People usually begin to try drugs in their teen age because it's the age when people always want to try every new thing. And when someone becomes addicted, he/she begins to ruin his/her life. Is this what we want? No, that's why drugs aren't legal.
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  13. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by georginho_juventusygr

    I think it's not "a little security". Many, many people have been addicted to drugs. And the effects? The fact says that they aren't good. People usually begin to try drugs in their teen age because it's the age when people always want to try every new thing. And when someone becomes addicted, he/she begins to ruin his/her life. Is this what we want? No, that's why drugs aren't legal.
    You could say the same for alcohol or gambling, and countries where certain drugs have been legalized have shown that the amount of drug users doesn't rise.
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  14. #13  
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    Quote Originally Posted by georginho_juventusygr

    I think it's not "a little security". Many, many people have been addicted to drugs. And the effects? The fact says that they aren't good. People usually begin to try drugs in their teen age because it's the age when people always want to try every new thing. And when someone becomes addicted, he/she begins to ruin his/her life. Is this what we want? No, that's why drugs aren't legal.
    you can become addicted to anything, many people just do drugs on occasion and are fine. but if you do get yourself addicted, its your right to ruin your life. would you imprison people for dropping out of school? that can very well ruin your life. would you imprison people for eating to much? that can ruin your life too. what about skydiving? your parachute just has to fail once.

    it should never be up to the government to decide what's good/bad for you or whats morally wrong. that should always be up to the individual.
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  15. #14  
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    Quote Originally Posted by medlakeguy
    it should never be up to the government to decide what's good/bad for you or whats morally wrong. that should always be up to the individual.
    I agree. But we wish our children may play in the park without encountering some creepy junkies huddled under the jungle gym.

    In fact the neighbourhood park my son most plays at, happens to be something of a hippy scene. There's an everpresent mill of shaggy loafers, sometimes laughing and hooting, sometimes swaggering and fighting, mostly just sprawled around in clusters... for pot is legal in my city and the police don't bother them. Well, these rascals do bother me. A lot of these characters are unstable addicts, growing crazy, desperate, psychopathic, before our eyes.

    Quote Originally Posted by medlakeguy
    its your right to ruin your life
    It's not only their lives, it is other people's lives too. This is where government and even police come in.
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  16. #15  
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    But we wish our children may play in the park without encountering some creepy junkies huddled under the jungle gym.
    i agree, but maybe if our cities built more shelters for the homeless and gave people good places to shoot up with clean needles and the like we wouldn't have that problem

    but you make the mistake of thinking all drug users are complete junkies. i know a woman who does heroin and while shes not exactly successful, she certainly doesn't live under a jungle gym.

    A lot of these characters are unstable addicts, growing crazy, desperate, psychopathic, before our eyes.
    we as a society often forget drug use is more often a symptom of a problem and not the problem itself. unstable people may gravitate to using drugs unwisely, and naturally being unstable, they act unstable. so why not fix their problems instead of throwing them away for years at a time? we cant keep scapegoating drug use for all of societies problems.
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  17. #16  
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    Quote Originally Posted by medlakeguy
    maybe if our cities built more shelters for the homeless and gave people good places to shoot up with clean needles and the like we wouldn't have that problem
    Vancouver does have a safe injection site with health care staff, it helps with a certain segment. Besides that, is the dozen or so blocks of "open shooting gallery" off downtown, where innocents just don't go. I'd bet that most of the city's hard drugs are bought and used (immediately) right there on that stretch. In fact there are usually a few ambulances and police cars parked on the sidewalk.

    As for my friendly neighbourhood bohemians, we did have a marijuana cafe to consolidate them but unfortunately that is technically illegal so now they're hanging around the park again.

    Gripe. Moan. Whine. Kids these days, etc.

    My immediate problem is basically with public intoxication. Disturbing the peace. Including what happens when a bar empties. Mostly it's the fights and people screaming bloody murder, cursing to the heavens and otherwise freaking out. When I was a single guy, it didn't phase me. But try taking a toddler through that.
    Quote Originally Posted by medlakeguy
    but you make the mistake of thinking all drug users are complete junkies. i know a woman who does heroin and while shes not exactly successful, she certainly doesn't live under a jungle gym.
    If people can control themselves, I don't care what they put in their bodies. But getting stoned/drunk, or being hard core addicts, people lose control. Values change and mostly it's our most vulnerable who get the short end. Women, the elderly, children. Of course drugs alter values and inhibitions. This is not necessarily good, just because it's different! In most cases, society loses.

    And I'm not opposed to social engineering.

    I would stigmatize recreational drug use. And maintain a ban on hard drugs for the same reasons we (Canadians) ban handguns. I understand people purchase drugs for different reasons than they purchase guns, so the cure must be different. Both threaten society though.

    Quote Originally Posted by medlakeguy
    we as a society often forget drug use is more often a symptom of a problem and not the problem itself. unstable people may gravitate to using drugs unwisely, and naturally being unstable, they act unstable. so why not fix their problems instead of throwing them away for years at a time? we cant keep scapegoating drug use for all of societies problems.
    The gun advocates use the same argument.

    The root cause of drug use, in my opinion, is "the pursuit of happiness". Society is extremely muddled about personal happiness. Generally, the message is to do whatever makes one happy. Oh, but drugs are bad. Huh?

    The root cause of (USA) handgun ownership, in my opinion, is "the world is dangerous". The anti-gun people really screw their argument, saying the world is dangerously saturated with handguns, therefore one should not own a handgun. Huh?

    To cure either, some sacrifice must be made. Society has to be a little more demanding. Guns: "Better be defenseless." Drugs: "Better tough it out."

    I see some amazing homeless martyrs pushing shopping carts of pop bottles at 4am, down the alleys in the rain, even through snow. I have never witnessed a greater drudgery. They would rather do this than survive off petty crime. They would rather die (and they do) than betray their morals. I don't believe they earn enough to buy drugs. As a society, we could honour these noble characters. It would send a message.

    But perhaps society does not really value what it pretends to. So the contradictions must remain.
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  18. #17 Re: drugs, should they be illegal? 
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    Quote Originally Posted by medlakeguy
    why are drugs illegal? i know they can be dangerous (probably not as much as their made out to be) but doesn't a person, in a free country, have the right to harm themselves any way they see fit? and if you're objective is preventing harm to a person, how are lengthy prison sentences for substance sale/abuse helping?

    don't you think their illegality leads to making drugs even more dangerous because they can be mixed and cut with whatever the person dealing them wants...

    studies show that most drug users are nonviolent http://www.jointogether.org/news/res...enders-in.html
    and if we trust people to control themselves with something like alcohol (most can and some can't) why not expect people to be grown up enough to handle themselves with other substances

    hell at least make pot legal, we're wasting time and money prosecuting it
    NO to the question and yes to the enforcement that is a waste of time and money.
    Drugs should be legalized because that is the only way to put those drug lords in Columbia and elsehere out of business.
    This would then put all the street peddlers out of business in the US .

    That way, the problem would NOT be spredding as it is now.

    Also, the costs of inforcing this problem would be eliminated and this could be TAXED to benefit the budget balance.

    Personally, I think it is illegal because it would compete with the prescriptgion cartel the government has created.
    Prescription drugs are INFERIOR to the natural treatment by GOD's medicines like vitamins, minerals, herbs and etc.

    Our current healthcare system is nothing but a business.

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    this is a realy long post so i just read the first three post's srry all u talented and opinionated writers.

    but how can drugs not be illigal they create danger towards there users,they are dangerous to those surrounding u,and they can be hazzardous,one poster said if we are in a free country then we should be able to choose what happens to us and how we do it or something,
    well it is kindsa like saying to a baby who doesnt know what he is doing that he can do what ever he wants and just leaving him at home for a year or two and not even wondering if he will be allright wich the people who make these laws the parent and u the baby

    they can not do that to u so they make laws to stop them and if u think u are in a free country with rights,were have u been for the last i dont know 5 thousand years i cant think of a single coulture that has had rights that havnt been temporarily taken away or ammended or apposed and have had there rights fall,if a right can be taken away or compromised it isnt a right it is just a temporary privaledge so is your right to live and if drugs should be legalized because u like to do them then what if i liked to kill people at random in large numbers than shouldn't that be legalized?

    this is where opinion and greed and pleasure come in .
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  20. #19  
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    They are illegal because people cannot control how much they have. Thats why public smoking ban is in effect in many places worldwide. People have no self control, so to preserve society governments have to take extreme measures, that can be percieved to be dictatorial. I can't blame them really though, if people can't look after themselves, they shouldn't be. Hence bans.
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  21. #20  
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddog67
    this is a realy long post so i just read the first three post's srry all u talented and opinionated writers.

    but how can drugs not be illigal they create danger towards there users,they are dangerous to those surrounding u,and they can be hazzardous,one poster said if we are in a free country then we should be able to choose what happens to us and how we do it or something,
    well it is kindsa like saying to a baby who doesnt know what he is doing that he can do what ever he wants and just leaving him at home for a year or two and not even wondering if he will be allright wich the people who make these laws the parent and u the baby

    they can not do that to u so they make laws to stop them and if u think u are in a free country with rights,were have u been for the last i dont know 5 thousand years i cant think of a single coulture that has had rights that havnt been temporarily taken away or ammended or apposed and have had there rights fall,if a right can be taken away or compromised it isnt a right it is just a temporary privaledge so is your right to live and if drugs should be legalized because u like to do them then what if i liked to kill people at random in large numbers than shouldn't that be legalized?

    this is where opinion and greed and pleasure come in .
    The hazardous use of these drugs ia a lame excuse for banning them.
    Prescription drugs are more dangerous than these 'happy pills'.
    The JAMA journal said these PD's kill about 100,000 people a year.
    I read a news item on the internet that these HP's kill about 50 thousand a year and I am sure that those killings involve adulterated pills with toxic substances.
    There was a recent news item in Detroit of a drug pusher that adulterated his drugs that killed abour 9 users.. He was caught.

    If these HP's were controlled by the government, they would control the dispensation of them to eliminate those overdoses (OD'S).

    Incidentally, I myself, do not use any drugs and that includes the medicinal ones as well.

    Cosmo
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    many complain but few run for office congress etc except if theyre boring libertarians or commies
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