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Thread: The think tank lies, that are said by Americas Republicans.

  1. #1 The think tank lies, that are said by Americas Republicans. 
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    EDITED, I had originally planned to post over 1,400 lies, said by US republicans in the last 15 years. But with the huge 1400+ numbers its hard to organize and edit them. I apologize for the poor organizing in this post, I should have listed the best/choice lies first.



    All of these lies were created by republican think tanks, they are designed to lower taxes on Americas rich and large corporations. They are also designed to make certain laws seem (bad or good) for America. And they also are designed to make democrats look bad (because democrats raise taxes on the rich/large corporations, the funders of the think tanks.)

    The following is a list of a few of the lies and un-true things US republicans say. The following list is poorly edited, but since US republicans say so many lies, it is very hard to put them in an edited order.



    1. tax cuts increase government revenues
    a lie b/c, all respected economist say this is not true. Even all of GW Bushs economists say its not true.


    2. Global warming is not happening. A lie because 97% of climate scientists say it is happening.


    3.) free trade creates better paying american jobs. A lie because the year before republicans started saying this, economists estimated that 3/4 of American workers lost about 12% of their current wages because of free trade deals.


    4.) the death tax effects everyone. A lie because it only effects the top 2% of income earners.


    5.) the flat/fair tax is a good idea for all americans. A lie because the flat/fair tax is actually a huge tax cut for the wealthy, and a huge tax increase for everyone else. (source: Citizens for tax justice.)



    6.) Most of Americas college professor's are involved in a liberal/communist conspiracy plot, to turn their students into liberals, and then communists.

    This is a lie because, how many of you had your college professors, try to turn you into a liberal or a communist?

    Perhaps most college professors are liberals, but perhaps most college professors are too smart to be republicans.





    7.) 97% of the worlds climate scientists, are involved in a liberal/communist conspiracy plot. They say these scientists are lying to the world and saying "global warming is happening." They say these scientists are lying about global warming, because they are part of the left and are corrupt.

    There is no proof that these 97% of climate scientists are lying, and saying global warming is happening, because they are part of a liberal conspiracy plot.

    (In reality certain republican paid scientists are lying about global warming.)



    The following R. Limbaugh quote, shows one of (many) ways republicans spread their (increase corporate profits) think tank lies.

    "We live in two universes. One universe is a lie. One universe is an entire lie. Everything run, dominated, and controlled by the left here and around the world is a lie. The other universe is where we are, and that’s where reality reigns supreme and we deal with it …Their are Four Corners of Deceit: Government, academia, science, and media. Those institutions are now corrupt and exist by virtue of deceit. That’s how they promulgate themselves; it is how they prosper."



    8.) Many republicans believe,

    "that science is now a lie, and scientists are lying for the left, and science can not be trusted."


    Even Bill Maher talks about how many republicans do not believe in science itself.

    There is no proof "science is lieng for the left, and science can not be trusted"

    (reality is republican paid scientists are the scientists who are lying.)



    There are 100's more (seperate) rep. think tank lies like 9-13 bellow.


    9.) raising the minimum wage kills jobs and hurts low-income workers. A lie because economists say there is no evidence of this, because states with high min. wages actually create more jobs.


    10.) low wages are offset by low prices. A lie because economists say this does not happen.

    11.) free markets -not regulation- will keep intrest rates low. A lie because economists say this is un-true.


    12.) we dont need policies that increase wages because wages are already growing. A lie because in the year before GW Bush and D. Cheny said this, American workers wages decreased by 0.6 %.

    13.) Al Gore owns a real big jet, so you cant trust his environmental laws.

    Republican think tank workers spread this lie to their followers, because Al Gore raises taxes on the rich.
    A lie b/c no one is perfect, I know people who preach buy American 24 hours a day, and they mean it, but they still drive Asian sports cars.


    14. tax cuts for large US corporations create jobs, and help America.

    14. a lie because, tax cuts do not create new jobs, (new customers and new markets create new jobs)

    And its a manipulation because small/family bussiness create most of the new jobs in america, not large corporations. Figures state aprox 65%-99% of new American jobs are created by small business. Also US corpoartions are moving (many, many) US jobs to China. THIS CREATES JOBS IN CHINA (not America.)

    Also tax cuts increase the corpoartions profits, this gives the corporations money to buy production increasing machines and robots. These corporate bought machines cause people to loose their jobs.


    15. "Bill Clinton wants to punish the rich" -- a lie b/c B. Clinton is rich, does he want to punish himself ??

    16. minimum wage laws hurt the poor-- a lie b/c economists say this is not true

    17. barack obama is not a us citezen -- a lie b/c he is.

    18. Barack Obama is a secret muslim. A lie b/c the man goes to a church of Jesus more than most of you.

    19. Barrack Obama is against prayer. A lie b/c he goes to a Christian church.

    20. Barack Obama hates white people. A lie b/c his mother is white and he worships her.

    21. Al Gore said he invented the internet-- a lie b/c the actual inventer of the internet said "there would be no internet without al gore, Gore in some way made the law that created it" the man who invented the internet said al gore said nothing untrue

    22. Sadam Husane had something to do with sept 11 - its a LIE b/c no government agency on all of earth ever said this.

    23. The US media has a liberal bias

    The US media protects the republicans, during GW Bush, liberals had to promise the TV stations manager's, that they would not say anything bad about GW Bush on the air, if they did not make the promise to the manager, they could not be on TV, the media never did this with a democrat.

    The media protects the Republicans, because the republicans give the tv station owners billions of dollars in tax cuts, its only natural. When some one gives you billions of dollars you protect them.


    24. socialism always leads to comunism - a lie b/c sweeden, iceland, and norway are socialist minded countrys, do (you) think they are heading to communism?

    25. the democrats are the big spenders-- a lie b/c CBO records show that Ronald Reagan and GW Bush spent more money than anyone. The republicans spend at least 2x more than the democrats. (check out CBO records)

    The following link is one example,

    Debt: Unlike Republicans, the Numbers Don’t Lie Politics Plus



    26. Ronald Reagan had high deficits b/c he had a democrat congress. A lie b/c public pressure caused the democrat congress to give Reagan every thing he wanted.

    26b. GW Bush had high deficits b/c of a democrat congress. This is a lie too, no democrat congress would pass tax cuts for the rich, because they know this creates huge deficits.

    27. Large US corporations are forced to pay too much money in taxes-- a lie b/c GE and many other large US corporations pay 0% in federal taxes and get billions in refunds.

    28. GOP candidate Rick Santorum said that 10 per cent of the (European country) Netherlands' deaths were from euthanasia, 5 percent forced, and that "elderly people in the Netherlands don't go to the hospital" or, if they do, wear bracelets saying "do not euthanize me," (every thing he said above is a lie.)

    29. socialism never works -- a lie b/c sweeden, norway, Iceland, and finland are socialist minded countrys. They have a higher standard of living than america, scientists say they are happyer than americans , and they have lower national debts and deficits. Socilists countrys in europe out perform and beat america in (every) way.

    30. the rep. phrase "the liberals are lying." This is a lie because the list of republican lies is many, many, many,many, many, many times larger that the lies said by democrats. Its actually the republicans that are lying.


    Last edited by chad; September 5th, 2012 at 11:22 PM.
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    31.) Social Security is in crisis and going bankrupt

    (This is a lie, for example) When GW Bush said this, at the same time social securitys own actuaries were saying the system will provide full benifits untill 2041. Congessional researchers said the system is 100% sound untill 2052.

    GW Bush and the republicans have been pushing this lie, because they want to privatize Social Security.

    (And if Social security (payments) are in crisis, this is because of deficits and debt created by republicans.)




    32.) privatizing social security will "fix" the social security system. A lie because Wall street will charge $750 billion dollars in transition costs, so every one would get $750 billion dollars less in Social Security money. And if (and when) the stock market crashes that part of every ones social security will just vanish.

    33.) real world examples prove that social security pritatization works.A lie because other countrys and states that have done this, have had their retirees social security checks get much smaller after privatization)

    34.) GW Bush said "America should take lessons from Chile on how to run our social security system" A insane lie because Chile privatized their social security system, and then (according to the World Bank) many of the countrys retirees got around 1/2 less money in their monthly payments.)


    35. the republican phrase "only the rich pay taxes". A lie because Warren Buffits tax rate is 17%, and americans who make $60,000 a year have a 30% tax rate.

    The rich pay less of their money in taxes, than regular Americans do.


    36-40 Mitt Romney said the following lies


    36. Income is not all that unequal.

    But today 300,000 very rich Americans enjoy almost as much income as 150 million. (these may even be be republican figures)

    the reality is: Income is very, very unequal


    37.



    38. Income inequality is not a result of tax policy.


    A lie because the lower your tax rate, the more money you keep. Republicans like Reagan have increased the wealth of americas rich in mind blowing ways.





    39. Taxing the rich will slow economic growth.


    AMERICAS rich are currently moving jobs, in their large US corporations to China for cheaper labor. Taxing Americas rich may slow economic growth in China, (but not in America.)


    40. Taxing the rich would not raise much money.

    these may be republican figures.
    If only the richest 400 families, whose average income in 2008 was an astounding $270 million actually paid the statutory rate of 39 percent (revived as of next January 1st) an additional $500 billion would be raised over 10 years, putting a substantial dent in the projected deficit






    Health Care Reform Lies.

    41. President Obama wants to euthanize your grandmother.

    A lie because these accusations—of "death panels" and forced euthanasia—are, of course, flatly untrue. As an article from the Associated Press puts it: "No 'death panel' in health care bill."

    42: Democrats are going to outlaw private insurance and force you into a government plan.

    A lie because withreform, choices will increase, not decrease. Obama's reform plans will create a health insurance exchange, a one-stop shopping marketplace for affordable, high-quality insurance options. Included in the exchange is the public health insurance option—a nationwide plan with a broad network of providers—that will operate alongside private insurance
    companies, injecting competition into the market to drive quality up and costs down.

    If you're happy with your coverage and doctors, you can keep them.




    43. Obama has passed more regulations than any other president in history.

    A lie because, President Barack Obama has signed fewer regulations than President George W. Bush had at this point in his presidency.


    44. Obama has grown the government more than any president in history.

    An insane lie because, government did grow (more) than at any time since World War II under their Republican president, under George W. Bush and a Republican congress, and this Democratic president is proposing shrinking government, but that will not interrupt the talking point, which alleges exactly the opposite of what’s really happening.


    45. The economy was fine until Democrats got into office.

    A lie, just look at what GW Bush did to Clintons surpluses, Obama is living in deficits created by GW Bush. And also the economy has improved because of some of Obama laws. Goto CBO figures they show that when ever republicans get control of Americas government they cut taxes on the rich, and then Americas deficits and debt start to jump up fast.

    Also, the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office found that the economic stimulus Obama signed into law added -- in the 4th quarter of 2009 -- between 1 million and 2 million employed workers and boosted the GDP between 1.5% to 3.5% higher than it would have been without the stimulus.

    In addition, a more recent CBO study -- for the second quarter of 2011 -- found that the stimulus raised real GDP between 0.8% and 2.5% and lowered the unemployment rate between 0.5 and 1.6 percentage points, compared with what would have occurred without it.

    And another analysis, by economists Alan Blinder and Mark Zandi, estimated that the stimulus raised 2010 real GDP by 3.4%, held the unemployment rate about 1.5 percentage points lower, and added nearly 2.7 jobs to U.S. payrolls.


    (not listed) Freddie/Fannie and Barney Frank caused the economic meltdown.
    I forgot to add the proof for this one,


    46. "People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn't have a chance in the U.K., where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, (because of his physical handicaps), is essentially worthless."

    But Stephen Hawking is himself British, and responded by telling The Guardian that he "wouldn't be here today if it were not for the NHS."

    (Steven Hawking said this was a lie.)



    47. Extending the Bush Tax Cuts for the Wealthy Will Reduce the Deficit.
    A lie because tax cuts do not increase government revenues.



    48. President Obama wants to implement Soviet-style rationing.
    The truth: Health care reform will expand access to high-quality health insurance, and give individuals, families, and businesses more choices for coverage. Right now, big corporations decide whether to give you coverage, what doctors you get to see, and whether a particular procedure or medicine
    is covered—that is rationed care. And a big part of reform is to stop that.




    49. Obama is secretly plotting to cut senior citizens' Medicare benefits.

    (A lie because the libertarian/republicans want to abolish Medicare itself, and replace it with a private non-government system.)

    The truth: Health care reform plans will not reduce Medicare benefits. Reform includes savings from Medicare that are unrelated to patient care—in fact, the savings comes from cutting billions of dollars in overpayments to insurance companies and eliminating waste, fraud, and abuse.


    50. Obama's health care plan will bankrupt America.

    The truth: We need health care reform now in order to prevent bankruptcy—to control spiraling costs that affect individuals, families, small businesses, and the American economy.
    Right now, we spend more than $2 trillion dollars a year on health care. The average family premium is projected to rise to over $22,000 in the next decade—and each year, nearly a million people face bankruptcy because of medical expenses.

    51. Republican Rush Limbaugh, and other republicans say "man made global warming is the greatest hoax of all time"

    But 97% of climate scientists state "man made global warming is happening"



    52. Senator James Inhofe (R-OK) states,

    The Christian Bible verse Genesis 8:22 proves that global warming is a hoax,

    How does Genesis 8:22 proves that global warming is a hoax, and all the climate scientists are wrong?


    Last edited by chad; May 20th, 2012 at 12:02 AM.
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    (THESE ARE LIES 53-63 ) I was un-able to delete the following 1-10 numbers.

    The proof that the following are lies is listed at the following website

    10 Republican Lies About the Bush Tax Cuts | Americans for Responsible Taxes

    Lie #1: Democrats Plan Across the Board Tax Hikes on January 1st
    Lie #2: Democrats Want a $3.8 Trillion Tax Increase
    Lie #3: Tax Cuts Pay for Themselves
    Lie #4: The Bush Tax Cuts Didn’t Add to the Deficit
    Lie #5: Expiring High Income Tax Cuts Will Hurt Small Business
    Lie #6: The Estate Tax Devastates Small Businesses and Family Farms
    Lie #7: The Bush Tax Cuts Helped All Americans
    Lie #8. Extending Bush Tax Cuts for the Wealthy is the Best Way to Stimulate the Economy
    Lie #9. Bush Tax Cuts Produced 52 Straight Months of Job Growth
    Lie #10: The Rich Pay Too Much in Taxes Already

    (note: lie #10 above, and maybe others, were already listed above, I will adjust the numbers later on.)



    63. President Obama is soft on terrorism/won't protect the country/is a Muslim sympathizer.

    A lie because from the time Obama took office the record shows that Obama has been more aggressive than his predecessor was in targeting and killing terrorist group leaders, including authorizing more drone attacks.


    64. President Obama wants to raise your taxes.

    A lie given that Obama campaigned that he wouldn't raise taxes on anyone making more than $250,000 per year, and would cut taxes on most families below that range. And what did he do? Exactly what he promised. In fact, he went beyond his campaign promise,




    (I the following lie was also already listed, so I took its number out, but I left it up, because of new republican email attacks saying, Obamas birth certificate is fake.)

    President Obama wasn't born in the United States.

    A lie because after all, he released a scan of his birth certificate in 2008, and Honolulu newspapers reported his birth at the time. But on April 27, as unnecessary as it was, Obama released his long-form birth certificate, putting the issue to rest once and for all.



    (( The following 20 republican lies about Iraq, are from a international socialist organization, these people may see things, in a different way than us americans.))


    (((((Proof they are lies as seen by (international) non-americans, is at this address!!!!!!!!!!

    The twenty lies of George W. Bush

    The following are not interesting, but they are considered to be lies.


    66.“My fellow citizens, events in Iraq have now reached the final days of decision.”
    Proof these are lies is at the above link.


    67. “For more than a decade, the United States and other nations have pursued patient and honorable efforts to disarm the Iraqi regime without war.”


    68. “The Iraqi regime has used diplomacy as a ploy to gain time and advantage. It has uniformly defied Security Council resolutions demanding full disarmament...”

    69.“Peaceful efforts to disarm the Iraqi regime have failed again and again because we are not dealing with peaceful men.”


    70.“The Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised.”


    71.“[Iraq] has aided, trained and harbored terrorists, including operatives of Al Qaeda.”


    72. “America tried to work with the United Nations to address this threat because we wanted to resolve the issue peacefully.”


    73. “These governments [the Security Council majority] share our assessment of the danger, but not our resolve to meet it.”


    74. “Many nations, however, do have the resolve and fortitude to act against this threat to peace, and a broad coalition is now gathering to enforce the just demands of the world.”


    75. “The United Nations Security Council has not lived up to its responsibilities, so we will rise to ours.”


    76. “If we must begin a military campaign, it will be directed against the lawless men who rule your country and not against you.”


    77. “As our coalition takes their power, we will deliver the food and medicine you need.”


    78. “We will tear down the apparatus of terror and we will help you to build a new Iraq that is prosperous and free.”


    79. “Should Saddam Hussein choose confrontation, the American people can know that every measure has been taken to avoid war and every measure will be taken to win it.”


    80. “War has no certainty except the certainty of sacrifice.”



    81. “[T]he only way to reduce the harm and duration of war is to apply the full force and might of our military, and we are prepared to do so.”



    82. “The terrorist threat to America and the world will be diminished the moment that Saddam Hussein is disarmed.”



    83. “We are now acting because the risks of inaction would be far greater. In one year, or five years, the power of Iraq to inflict harm on all free nations would be multiplied many times over.”



    84. “As we enforce the just demands of the world, we will also honor the deepest commitments of our country.”


    85. “Unlike Saddam Hussein, we believe the Iraqi people are deserving and capable of human liberty... The United States with other countries will work to advance liberty and peace in that region.”






    The following is a new set of republican lies.


    86. Birth control is easily accessible for all women.

    A lie because,
    While organizations like Planned Parenthood and state funded health departments are able to defray the costs of birth control for some low-income women, these options are limited. These organizations are facing massive cutbacks as a result of Republican starve-the-beast legislation tactics. They also cannot offer the same kind of sliding scale pricing to women who have health insurance, even if that insurance doesn’t cover contraception.
    When contraception is covered by a private health insurance plan, the percentage of women at risk for unplanned pregnancy who do not use contraception goes down to 7%. 75% of women cite cost and insurance coverage as major deciding factors for choosing a method of contraception.




    87. The GOP lie "Obama is a job killer” the following address shows this is a lie

    The Republican Lie That 'Obama Is A Job Killer' In One Chart



    88. Obama apologized for America.

    Romney: President Obama “went around the world and apologized for America.” a lie because



    “The president has never used the word ‘apologize’ in a speech about U.S. policy or history. Any assertion that he has apologized for U.S. actions rests on a misleading interpretation of the president’s words.”



    89. ObamaCare is a government takeover of health care.

    Romney: President Obama’s health care law “represents a government takeover of health care.”



    A lie because, experts say the government’s expanded role in health falls far short of being a government takeover.







    90. Taxes are skyrocketing under Obama.

    A lie because “According to the Tax Foundation, a business-backed group that studies tax policy, the total federal, state and local tax burden has been falling — not rising — in recent years.



    91.


    92. Obama is putting “free markets on trial.”

    A lie because First, Obama continued the Bush crisis-fighting policy of bailing out and stabilizing the banking sector On taxes? He continued the Bush-era tax cuts on the wealthiest Americans over fierce opposition from his own party. Now he’s offering even more tax cuts. In his $447 billion jobs plan, Obama has recommended slicing the payroll tax paid by businesses. And on trade? Obama this week sent free-trade agreements with South Korea, Colombia and Panama to Congress for final approval, again over some opposition from his party


    93. Romney: With our current trendline of government intervention in the economy, “we cease at some point to be a free economy.”



    A lie because And international comparisons show that the U.S. ranks low in both total tax burden and high in economic freedom — at least as measured by a prominent conservative think tank





    94. Romney: “We’re only inches away from no longer being a free economy.”



    A lie because the web site I got this from said "this is a pants on fire lie." sorry for the very poor info. on this one.





    95. Obama models policy after Europe

    Romney: “This president takes his inspiration from the capitals of Europe…”



    A lie because Obamas fiscal approach of continued stimulus is actually the opposite of Europe’s prevailing austerity policy. On Obama’s central domestic policy effort, universal healthcare, he looked not toward Europe but to Romney’s own state of Massachusetts.”
    Last edited by chad; May 19th, 2012 at 06:53 AM.
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    Chad, I am no fan of the Republican world view, but your list is juvenile and ill considered.

    You have failed, from the outset, to define what you mean by a Republican. Just because one person, who is a registered and recognised Republican, espouses a view does not make that a Republican view.

    Repeatedly you use narrow definitions of terms within your examples that make your conclusions ridiculous. I'll give one example: you deny Obama's socialism on the basis of a single, arguably seriously wrong, definition of socialism.

    Rather that titling your thread "The lies and un-true things, that are said by Americas Republicans. ( PART 1 ) " a more accurate title would be "How to make a silly list of illogical, distorted, simplistic statements, pulled out of context to make an impossibly weak argument."
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    That socialism lie was taken from some one elses republican lies list. I did not write that, most of the lies I listed were copy/pasted from online websites.

    Thank you for your comments in your post. I would have to make about 5 or more threads like the one above, to list all of the lies, that I copy/pasted into my email .

    I will strongly consider what you said above, before I post any more republican lies threads.


    Perhaps I will edit all my republican lies lists I did not post, and just leave the lies that are backed by good proof.


    And I also believe I may not have read the things I copy/pasted good enough before posting.


    Thank you for your opinion, I will think about what you said, before further posting on this subject.

    Chad.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chad View Post
    And I also believe I may not have read the things I copy/pasted good enough before posting.
    Thank you for your honesty. I hope you will be more discerning in future.
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    chad, if you want to criticise any politician or political party for the way they state things you need to get a bit of perspective.

    I'd agree that the current state of the Republicans in the US is deplorable, but you can only make judgements of this or any other kind if you look at several things. For this particular party at this particular time, you need to look at how they differ from Republicans of the past. Are they continuing along much the same lines as their predecessors or are they different in some identifiable way?

    You also need to look at political practice and theory generally. As a non-American, I've always found US statements about what and who counts as 'socialist' to be laughable. The important issue you should look at is how these recent reports differ in style, substance or apparent intent from similar accusations in the past. Are they now nicer, nastier, more or less accurate - by your own society's rather odd standards - they could be more or less important or relevant than previously. Are the kinds of people making these statements the leaders or pace makers of the party in question or are they the lunatic fringe? This of course gets back to the question of relevance and importance - if it's only mad old Senator Stupid raving on again - who cares?

    It's not enough to just list all the things you don't like about one or the other side of politics. You need to think about what's important for you, your region, your country. You can't dismiss the whole lot of them. For my part, I actually feel a bit sorry for some of the Republicans and especially some supporters that I know - they feel betrayed by people they voted for, even worked to get elected, and then find they've gone and signed an undertaking with someone they never heard of who's not from their state, let alone their congressional district - to behave in the legislature according to some rules they never considered. (Ye olde never-raise-taxes-even-to-pay-for-a-war Grover Norquist.)

    That's just one example of things that are more important and to the point than just listing various talking points which you've not sorted or examined in any coherent way. If you're really concerned about the behaviour of some politicians, or of some group of politicians, you need to look more carefully at the information you've gathered and follow through. I bet you'll find that some of them are just thoughtlessly repeating rubbish they've heard elsewhere. The important political question is - who's getting the ball rolling and who's letting themselves get sucked in. Who's serious about making certain points and who's just singing along in the chorus.

    If you're interested in politics, take a real interest. Don't just repeat what you've heard elsewhere or you'll be making the same kinds of mistakes as the people you criticise.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
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    Repeatedly you use narrow definitions of terms within your examples that make your conclusions ridiculous. I'll give one example: you deny Obama's socialism on the basis of a single, arguably seriously wrong, definition of socialism.
    Chad's list may be a bit scattered, but there is no definition of socialism that labels Obama's policies socialist. That is a Republican lie, just as described.

    Quote Originally Posted by adelady
    The important issue you should look at is how these recent reports differ in style, substance or apparent intent from similar accusations in the past. Are they now nicer, nastier, more or less accurate - by your own society's rather odd standards - they could be more or less important or relevant than previously. Are the kinds of people making these statements the leaders or pace makers of the party in question or are they the lunatic fringe? This of course gets back to the question of relevance and importance - if it's only mad old Senator Stupid raving on again - who cares?
    Although your advice is well considered, and the OP naive and immature, there is the issue of its accuracy still on the table.

    US Republicans have been consistent since the Reagan takeover of their Party - when Nixon's open invitation to the heirs of the Confederacy to join hands with the corporate elite recovered from Nixon. Yes, it is the leaders and powers of the Republican Party, their elected upper echelon and their intellectual heavyweights and their lavishly supported media arm, that tell these lies and have for many years now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by iceaura View Post
    Repeatedly you use narrow definitions of terms within your examples that make your conclusions ridiculous. I'll give one example: you deny Obama's socialism on the basis of a single, arguably seriously wrong, definition of socialism.
    Chad's list may be a bit scattered, but there is no definition of socialism that labels Obama's policies socialist. That is a Republican lie, just as described.
    I was not discussing the reality or falsehood of Obama's socialism. I was asserting that basing such a claim upon a single, poor definition of socialism undermined any argument he may have about lies.

    Since I am European I do not consider socialism to be an undesirable concept. I see aspects of socialism in Obama's approach and I welcome these. Consequently it could be valid to identify Obama as having socialist leanings. However, Chad's example failed for the reasons noted above.
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    I want to apologize to all forum members, for posting my original unedited thread(s) here. I have not been feeling well recently, and I have been away from this forum for a while now. My original thread here was actually months old, it was a draft in my email account, and I posted it without proper editing. I also posted it without thinking or investigating things, I have already posted in this forum section.

    My original thread'(s) here were also a childish attack, that I wrote months ago. But I did not fully realize this until after I posted it. This has been my 2nd major mistake in this forum, were I have posted threads, that were not properly researched or edited.

    The thing that bothers me most is, these 2 poorly researched threads have caused many forum members, to waste their time, and flip their brains reading rushed posts, that should have been much better edited and researched. I am very sorry.

    The next time I start a thread in this forum, I will edit it more, and I will research it more. I will also research the things I have already posted, so I do not repeat myself.


    I would also like to thank John Galt, and other forum members like him, who have brought these things to my attention. Once more I apologize to all forum members who read my original thread(s) here.

    I am sorry, and I will try much harder, to research and edit threads before I post them.

    I have not fully realized, my selfish and disrespectful behavior until now.

    Chad.
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  12. #11  
    Forum Ph.D.
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    I forgot to thank MeteorWayne above.

    Chad.
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  13. #12  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chad View Post
    I am sorry, and I will try much harder, to research and edit threads before I post them.

    I have not fully realized, my selfish and disrespectful behavior until now.

    Chad.
    Chad, as we say in the UK, don't get your knickers in a twist. It is no big deal. Thank you for the apology. Please keep actively posting, just double check before you hit the Post button.
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    I don't have a comment on the thread but have an oblique point on Rush Limbaugh and his self-styled scientific expertise. I'm in no way a scientist but have always been intensely interested. Before I retired I listened to Limbaugh every day and was often amused by his science points. I think my favorite was when he asked somebody if the earth was "4 million or 4 billion years old".
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  15. #14  
    Ascended Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Much respect has be earned by the way this was handled.
    Everything has its beauty, but not everyone sees it. - confucius
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    Quote Originally Posted by slush33 View Post
    I don't have a comment on the thread but have an oblique point on Rush Limbaugh and his self-styled scientific expertise. I'm in no way a scientist but have always been intensely interested. Before I retired I listened to Limbaugh every day and was often amused by his science points. I think my favorite was when he asked somebody if the earth was "4 million or 4 billion years old".
    I don't get that one though. Christians believe it to be 8000. Will be a nice round anime number in 1000 years . But what was the point of asking someone if the earth was 4million or billion years old. It is both to long to comprehend, and without carbon dating, knowing evolution speed, erosion, etc, we would not know if it was 4 million or billion year old.

    My biggest downer on the look on history, is that some people think it were aliens that helped build the pyramids (maya, egyptian, tibetan). That they could not make a masterpiece like that. I felt like they were discrediting their work. Hmm..
    Growing up, i marveled at star-trek's science, and ignored the perfect society. Now, i try to ignore their science, and marvel at the society.

    Imagine, being able to create matter out of thin air, and not coming up with using drones for boarding hostile ships. Or using drones to defend your own ship. Heck, using drones to block energy attacks, counterattack or for surveillance. Unless, of course, they are nano-machines in your blood, which is a billion times more complex..
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  17. #16  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Zwolver and slush, please stay on topic. If you want to discuss Rush Limbaugh's interviewing style with each other start a new thread. (And Zwolver, carbon dating is useless for anything past about 50,000 years and so wouldn't distinguish between 4 billion or 4 million.)
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  18. #17  
    Forum Professor Zwolver's Avatar
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    @John Galt

    It's hard to stay on topic in politics, you know that. As every politician will, whenever they can not answer (or don't want to answer) a question, find another topic to talk about within the conversation. Isn't that politics. Using other interests of people to lure them away from the points YOU represent? The same thing with all the "lies". Can't it be possible they have been said merely to cover up people from finding out the truth. Rather you give them something completely different to chew on. As of my dog, without anything to chew on, he'll start on my couch.
    Growing up, i marveled at star-trek's science, and ignored the perfect society. Now, i try to ignore their science, and marvel at the society.

    Imagine, being able to create matter out of thin air, and not coming up with using drones for boarding hostile ships. Or using drones to defend your own ship. Heck, using drones to block energy attacks, counterattack or for surveillance. Unless, of course, they are nano-machines in your blood, which is a billion times more complex..
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