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Thread: The Ambiguity of Race

  1. #1 The Ambiguity of Race 
    Forum Junior ArezList's Avatar
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    Come up with this question because of the recent case

    of an Arab men is accused for rape after having consensual sex with an Israeli woman who take me as a Jewish from his nickname.

    Link: http://thestir.cafemom.com/love_sex/...rape_isnt_rape

    Irrespective of the ridicule of the above case.

    I don't think we could call someone a caucasian or asian according to their looking..

    Plus, is Jew a race do you think?

    How do you define race?


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  3. #2 Re: The Ambiguity of Race 
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArezList
    How do you define race?
    I define race as a competition to see which individual can cover a specified distance in the shortest time, according to a set of rules.

    Any other definition of race is pointless, misguided, antiquated and rissible.


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  4. #3  
    Forum Junior ArezList's Avatar
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  5. #4  
    Forum Ph.D. Leszek Luchowski's Avatar
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    If they had laws against "interracial" sex, that would be preposterous.

    However, if the man told the woman, or made her believe, that he is a Jew (in whatever sense they both understood this word) while in reality he was not, and in that way cheated her into having sex with him - which she would not consent to if she knew the truth - then I would call it rape by deceit. Same as if he got her into bed by telling her he was Elvis Presley.

    A person, male or female, has the right to reject prospective sexual partners on any grounds (s)he likes, including racial, cultural/ethnic, or religious. It's a personal choice and nobody can require her to be an "equal opportunity dater".
    Leszek. Pronounced [LEH-sheck]. The wondering Slav.
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  6. #5  
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    Cherokees had law up till about 1809 if a Cherokee married a black you would get death penalty -

    they abolished it on their own though
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  7. #6  
    Time Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Quote Originally Posted by ArezList
    How do you define race?
    I define race as a competition to see which individual can cover a specified distance in the shortest time, according to a set of rules.

    Any other definition of race is pointless, misguided, antiquated and rissible.
    I wish everyone agreed with you.

    Of course, you can't pass laws against racism without some idea of what behaviors can be considered "racist", and people can't protect themselves from being victims of it without gathering into groups that all share a common targeting criteria. (Which would seem to put other discriminated groups, like homosexuals, in an awkward position.)



    Quote Originally Posted by Leszek Luchowski
    If they had laws against "interracial" sex, that would be preposterous.

    However, if the man told the woman, or made her believe, that he is a Jew (in whatever sense they both understood this word) while in reality he was not, and in that way cheated her into having sex with him - which she would not consent to if she knew the truth - then I would call it rape by deceit. Same as if he got her into bed by telling her he was Elvis Presley.

    A person, male or female, has the right to reject prospective sexual partners on any grounds (s)he likes, including racial, cultural/ethnic, or religious. It's a personal choice and nobody can require her to be an "equal opportunity dater".
    If every man who ever lied to a woman to get in bed with her were charged.....oh dear....
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  8. #7  
    Forum Masters Degree Twit of wit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    Of course, you can't pass laws against racism without some idea of what behaviors can be considered "racist", and people can't protect themselves from being victims of it without gathering into groups that all share a common targeting criteria. (Which would seem to put other discriminated groups, like homosexuals, in an awkward position.)
    Do we need such laws? Racist violence? We already have laws against violence. Discrimination? All we need are laws agains discrimination "for irrelevant reasons".




    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    If every man who ever lied to a woman to get in bed with her were charged.....oh dear....
    Actually, why not?
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  9. #8  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope skeptic's Avatar
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    The article does not even say he lied. He just introduced himself as 'Dudu', which is apparently a common Jewish nickname, and she assumed the rest.

    Assuming that is true, the whole thing is a case of utterly unbelievable prejudice, and injustice.

    It is not even based on racism. The difference between Arabic and Jewish is religious and cultural, not racial.

    My only caution here is that this is all based on a particular article, which may not have been complete, or even completely truthful. It would not be the first time a journalist plays fast and loose with the truth to get a better story.
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  10. #9  
    JX
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic
    Assuming that is true, the whole thing is a case of utterly unbelievable prejudice, and injustice.

    It is not even based on racism. The difference between Arabic and Jewish is religious and cultural, not racial.
    Putting aside the chance this a reporter playing 'fast and loose,' surely everyone has the right to decide who they sleep with - even if this decision is based on morally unjustified reasons such as racism or similar criteria?
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  11. #10  
    Time Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twit of wit
    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    Of course, you can't pass laws against racism without some idea of what behaviors can be considered "racist", and people can't protect themselves from being victims of it without gathering into groups that all share a common targeting criteria. (Which would seem to put other discriminated groups, like homosexuals, in an awkward position.)
    Do we need such laws? Racist violence? We already have laws against violence. Discrimination? All we need are laws agains discrimination "for irrelevant reasons".
    That last part is an interesting question. Really all racism amounts to is discrimination "for irrelevant reasons", even when it takes the form of hatred or violence. But, how do you eliminate all the "irrelevant reasons" out there without taking individual judgment out of our daily life?

    My father, right now, is having a hell of a time hiring a new secretary. He gets around 400 applicants, but then the HR department filters it down to 6. (He's not even allowed to see anyone else's resume.) Even among those 6, he still can't see their full application, only selected parts. So, he's gone through 2 or 3 secretaries over the last 2 years. Every time he hires one, it's this massive bureaucratic battle just to get them fired when they don't do the work. He had this really great secretary about 3 years ago, but she moved up the chain. I think he'd just like to find someone with a similar personality, but there's no way to quantify that, and therefore no way to prove that the decision is being made "objectively" instead of "prejudicially".
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  12. #11  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    HR departments are the curse of modern business. They are often staffed by people who were unable to make it in media studies.
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  13. #12  
    Forum Junior ArezList's Avatar
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    HR departments are the curse of modern business.
    Touche!!!

    They are more often than not, a bunch of dipshit....
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