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Thread: How stupid can man get????

  1. #1 How stupid can man get???? 
    Forum Junior Zitterbewegung's Avatar
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    Yippppiiiiieeeeee motherfuckers!!! We finally made it!! TWo Hawaians filed a lawsuit with the US government trying to stop the LHC from firing up. Reason: the end of the world as we know it!! Uhooohhh, those two guys already stated the same "argument" in their lawsuit against the RHIC in Brookhaven in 1999 or so. Full story

    Hey cool, let's stop any reasearch until it is proven that noone can be harmed in the process or by the outcomes. Or let's sue Ford, GM and Chrysler for producing such dangerous goods like cars that kill tens of thousands of people each year. And let's sue the guy who invented fire, do you know how many people burn to death each year??? Must be hundreds of thousands!!! Starngely enough the people trying to stop the LHC willingly use the internet to spread their gobledygook and do not even think twice about this (anyone can spell Tim Berners Lee and knows where he earned his living, huh??) So this is a prime example for some people not knowing their asses from holes in the ground but screaming hell and bloody murder.


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    Its not even their country. The U.S. needs to start getting out of other countries business before they start WW3.


    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

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    Forum Cosmic Wizard i_feel_tiredsleepy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cold Fusion
    Its not even their country. The U.S. needs to start getting out of other countries business before they start WW3.
    One of the people filing the law suit is from Spain, and they are going up against American contributors to the project. There is no way in hell any sensible judge would give these people any money.
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    Its ridiculous.....that such morons could exist. Do we know whether or not these people are religious fanatics?
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

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    It's clear that they can't have any serious scientific basis for their concerns, so they probably are fanatics. Maybe they're scared LHC will find some major secrets of the world or something. Maybe they're even afraid LHC will disprove the existence of God
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    Thats part of the reason why religious scientists (The ones trying to progress our knowledge of everything) confuse me slightly. They are only eliminating their safety blankets. They are limiting the number of examples that they can use against atheists during arguments, and are unveiling the "mysteries" in life that they love so much. Theists love to use what science does not know against us; progresses in science like the LHC scares them, in that they will lose any final edge that they currently have. I can already destroy any theists argument....soon I will be able to annihilate them with my new found knowledge gained from the LHC.
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

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    What is LHC ?
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  9. #8  
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    The Large Hadron Collider near Geneva, Switzerland. It's scheduled to be fired up this year. Fully operational in 2009.

    One of the problem I see too here is that US courts do not have any say about a scientific project in a different continent. I do not give a mouldy old rat's ass what the judges do or do not allow in their courtrooms in the US (this is fucked up to begin with, I do not know how one can call the FUBAR over there "justice" ). But their decision is not legally binding for anyone in the EU and if I were the judge I would basicall sentence them to 6 months in a correctional facility to think about their own stupidity.

    And no, I do not think they are fanatics. They are just stupid Yanks trying to get money and publicity. Dickheads!!
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  10. #9  
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    There are genuine concerns related to the operation of the LHC that you do not need to be a 'fanatic', or 'stupid Yank', to share.

    CERN physicists acknowledge that the LHC may very well produce microscopic black holes. The consensus view is that these black holes will evaporate in a fraction of a second via Hawking radiation. The problem is that Hawking radiationhas never been validated as a real phenomenom by experiment or observation.

    If Hawking radiation is not a fact then the probability is that any black holes produced would grow at an exponential rate, absorbing the planet in fairly short order.

    Now the probability of this risk may be very low, but the consequences compared with those from minor issues such as global warming or thermonuclear war are dramatic. In such circumstances one might have wished for a somewhat more thorough consideration of the issues, benefits and risks than appears to have been applied.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    There are genuine concerns related to the operation of the LHC that you do not need to be a 'fanatic', or 'stupid Yank', to share.

    CERN physicists acknowledge that the LHC may very well produce microscopic black holes. The consensus view is that these black holes will evaporate in a fraction of a second via Hawking radiation. The problem is that Hawking radiationhas never been validated as a real phenomenom by experiment or observation.

    If Hawking radiation is not a fact then the probability is that any black holes produced would grow at an exponential rate, absorbing the planet in fairly short order.

    Now the probability of this risk may be very low, but the consequences compared with those from minor issues such as global warming or thermonuclear war are dramatic. In such circumstances one might have wished for a somewhat more thorough consideration of the issues, benefits and risks than appears to have been applied.
    But neither have microscopic black holes been produced or observed. I'm pretty certain that the theoretic basis for Hawking radiation (supported by what we already know about vacuum pressure, which leads to it) is on firmer ground than the possibility of micro black hole production.

    And how could a microscopic black hole, with nigh on zero mass, consume the earth? Surely it will eat it's way (in small bites) to the centre of the earth and then, once gravitationally stable, remain their, not affecting our gravity, with a sub-atomic sized event horizon. No?
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    I have absolutely no idea. I have enough trouble handling Newton's equations of motions without delving into particle physics.

    I am simply noting that that some persons more knowledgeable than myself in these matters have expressed concern that the potential hazards have not been properly addressed. And further, that you do not have to be a fanatic, a dunderhead, or a publicity seeker to have these concerns. I thought Zitterbewegung's opening attack was rather too emotional. I wanted to introduce some balance to the discussion.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    CERN physicists acknowledge that the LHC may very well produce microscopic black holes. The consensus view is that these black holes will evaporate in a fraction of a second via Hawking radiation. The problem is that Hawking radiationhas never been validated as a real phenomenom by experiment or observation.

    If Hawking radiation is not a fact then the probability is that any black holes produced would grow at an exponential rate, absorbing the planet in fairly short order.

    Now the probability of this risk may be very low, but the consequences compared with those from minor issues such as global warming or thermonuclear war are dramatic. In such circumstances one might have wished for a somewhat more thorough consideration of the issues, benefits and risks than appears to have been applied.
    The problem is, I can't think of any way to TEST that other than firing it up and finding out. Up until that point, it's theory and math. Which is great, except when not everyone can come to consensus on it.

    Catch-22, isn't it? Either we're peachy, or we're sucked into a singularity...and we can't really find out until it's too late to do anything about it.

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  14. #13  
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    I read that the blackholes would be so small it would take them several hundred years to consume a single proton...
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_feel_tiredsleepy
    I read that the blackholes would be so small it would take them several hundred years to consume a single proton...
    My understanding was along those lines too. And whilst I suspect, like Ophi, that the OP was a bit OTT (gotta love these abbreviations) I'm still of the opinion that the reports of the earth's death have been greatly exaggerated (at least the risks to it from this experiement).

    I suspect that some of the scientists working on publicity (and hence funding) for this project have tried to make it sound cool by making it sound dangerous, and some chappies have taken them seriously.

    I haven't heard any scientist, in context, discussing this in any way as to suggest there is a genuine, feared danger in this project - but we know how easy it is to quote scientists out of context. And I haven't heard all the scientists who may have something to say on this matter...
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    [quote="sunshinewarrio"]
    I haven't heard any scientist, in context, discussing this in any way as to suggest there is a genuine, feared danger in this project - but we know how easy it is to quote scientists out of context. /quote]

    Honestly, I'm thinking the only REAL danger is lots of bad "Hadron" puns and silly cartoons.
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    Hawking radiation has been observed according to this other NS article. I don’t have a subscription so haven’t read the whole thing.

    http://www.newscientist.com/channel/...radiation.html

    I agree with Ophiolite’s rather understated complaint that Zitterbewegung's opening attack was rather too emotional. It was in fact totally out of place on a so-called science board.

    They are just stupid Yanks trying to get money and publicity. Dickheads!!
    One of them is Spanish, but I realize that’s a pretty difficult detail to assimilate.

    The CERN team is supposed to have another safety conference April 6. Let’s hope it will be less speculative than the last one.
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  18. #17 Re: How stupid can man get???? 
    Forum Ph.D. Wolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    ...filed a lawsuit with the US government trying to stop the LHC from firing up. Reason: the end of the world as we know it!!
    This is typical of society at large. With lack of education comes stupidity. One of those "duh" things, I know, but still.

    This is the same reason why nuclear technology has been so grossly stunted.

    The world is not going to end when the LHC gets finished. People think that "rapid nuclear explosions" and "mini black-holes" means we're gonna suddenly blow up, when in fact it's amazingly benign.

    I feel sorry for anyone working on the LHC who might be harmed by crazies who attempt to attack them to stop LHC from coming online.


    This wouldn't be the first time the uneducated of society have destroyed or stunted advancement of technology that will benefit humanity. MRI machines used to be called NMRI's (N for Nuclear) but people were afraid of it because it said "nuclear" in the name. In order to save the technology, the name had to be changed. Even now, people who don't know that it used to be called an NMRI, start to make objections when they find out.

    Accidents lik Chernobyl and Long Island effectively ended the nuclear power industry, even though with today's technology and understandings we are able to have nuclear power far more safely and easily than then.

    The accidents (and poor methods) of airship travel, killed the airship industry. Think of how great such an industry would be today? Lighter-than-air cargo ships? Luxury cloud-liners? Just to name a couple of the ways we could have gone. It probably won't ever come back to life. People get bent out of shape about the Goodyear Blimp, let alone someone building another trans-atlantic airship fleet.
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  19. #18  
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    Can black holes take in gravity/be effected by it? I still believe that gravity is made of particles, rather than a space time curvture.
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

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  20. #19 Re: How stupid can man get???? 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf
    Accidents lik Chernobyl and Long Island (sic) effectively ended the nuclear power industry, even though with today's technology and understandings we are able to have nuclear power far more safely and easily than then.
    While the design of the Chernobyl reactor was suspect, the principle reason the 'accident' occured is that all the safety constraints were removed during an experimental procedure. Human error remains the primary (one might say, ultimately, the only) source of 'accidents'. I am pro-nuclear, but I am not foolish enough to believe that a future Three Mile Island, or Chernobyl may not occur to even the best designed, regulated and operated reactor it is within our power to create. Only by recognising this risk can we minimise the chance of it occuring.

    Back on topic, when a senior CERN physicist instructs personnel to say the risk is zero then alarm bells ring in my head. Such absolute statements are the stuff of politics, not science.
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    Let's not forget that the energies unleashed in the LHC pale in comparison with the cosmic radiation upper atmosphere sees every friggin second every day of the week. Allthough the number of particles colliding up there is small compared to what the LHC cranks out, the lab in the stratosphere is up and running for 4.5 billion years. Or to put it this way: for more than 1^17 seconds, no days off due to Holyday or somesuch. Ample time in my oppinion to produce micro-Black Holes. Given the size of the "lab" and the timeframe I think there is only a miniscule chance that the LHC actually cranks out BHs to begin with or those BHs really were created and decayed pretty fast. So if someone want's to get worked up about a physical experiment, O.K. go ahead. Sounds like those Doomsday Prophets (ARMAGEDDON IS NEAR!!!) that always have to postpone the date for the final day as it just won't come, dammit Hey, the RIC was also supposed to turn the world into a flaming chaos. When I visited the facility in 2000, it was humming along happily and I did not see the Godbewithus crawling out of a crack in space-time fabric.
    So I'm not gonna lose sleep over this and look forward to the results CERN has to show for a couple of billion Euros. And they better be good, I payed for it too with my taxes!
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  22. #21  
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunshinewarrio
    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    There are genuine concerns related to the operation of the LHC that you do not need to be a 'fanatic', or 'stupid Yank', to share.

    CERN physicists acknowledge that the LHC may very well produce microscopic black holes. The consensus view is that these black holes will evaporate in a fraction of a second via Hawking radiation. The problem is that Hawking radiationhas never been validated as a real phenomenom by experiment or observation.

    If Hawking radiation is not a fact then the probability is that any black holes produced would grow at an exponential rate, absorbing the planet in fairly short order.

    Now the probability of this risk may be very low, but the consequences compared with those from minor issues such as global warming or thermonuclear war are dramatic. In such circumstances one might have wished for a somewhat more thorough consideration of the issues, benefits and risks than appears to have been applied.
    But neither have microscopic black holes been produced or observed. I'm pretty certain that the theoretic basis for Hawking radiation (supported by what we already know about vacuum pressure, which leads to it) is on firmer ground than the possibility of micro black hole production.

    And how could a microscopic black hole, with nigh on zero mass, consume the earth? Surely it will eat it's way (in small bites) to the centre of the earth and then, once gravitationally stable, remain their, not affecting our gravity, with a sub-atomic sized event horizon. No?
    The trick is that every particle of matter that gets close enough to it gets sucked in, one particle at a time. So, it starts as a speck, and then gets bigger and bigger.

    Quote Originally Posted by i_feel_tiredsleepy
    I read that the blackholes would be so small it would take them several hundred years to consume a single proton...
    That's an interesting point, and may prove our salvation if current black hole theories hold, and they create one.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    The Large Hadron Collider near Geneva, Switzerland. It's scheduled to be fired up this year. Fully operational in 2009.

    One of the problem I see too here is that US courts do not have any say about a scientific project in a different continent. I do not give a mouldy old rat's ass what the judges do or do not allow in their courtrooms in the US (this is fucked up to begin with, I do not know how one can call the FUBAR over there "justice" ). But their decision is not legally binding for anyone in the EU and if I were the judge I would basicall sentence them to 6 months in a correctional facility to think about their own stupidity.

    And no, I do not think they are fanatics. They are just stupid Yanks trying to get money and publicity. Dickheads!!
    If it did destroy the Earth, it would be killing American citizens. I'm not sure how murder is interpreted internationally, but I'm pretty sure you can be tried in an American court for actions you committed while in another country, if those actions resulted in a death here in the USA.
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  23. #22  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    If Hawking radiation is not a fact then the probability is that any black holes produced would grow at an exponential rate, absorbing the planet in fairly short order.
    Not from what I've seen. If Hawking Radiation proves true, the micro black holes will simply evaporate. If it proves false, there's still the rest of quantum physics which may prevent the black hole(s) from doing anything. Also, according to what's happening inside the LHC, such events happen elsewhere, too, such as from cosmic rays. If micro black holes can be formed in such ways, and they did balloon like in badly-written TV sci-fi dramas ( :P ) then we would probably be experiencing some black holes all over the place.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Now the probability of this risk may be very low, but the consequences compared with those from minor issues such as global warming or thermonuclear war are dramatic. In such circumstances one might have wished for a somewhat more thorough consideration of the issues, benefits and risks than appears to have been applied.
    Are you saying that the activation of the LHC is a larger issue than all that other stuff, because it could...well, I'll say "potentially" destroy the planet?

    I'm not so sure there's much risk here. Well, in-so-far as we can tell without trying. I doubt the cheif scientists are going to attempt something that could wipe out the whole planet, if they knew that was a possibility. It's not like making a mistake with a weapon, where you might blow up the lab. "Possible destruction of planet" is kinda a big chance side-effect.

    On the other hand, all the work shows that things will be fine. We won't be absolutely certain until we throw the switch, but if all you can be is sure of what you've got, then that's the best you can do. Has anyone proposed a better solution for studying the things the LHC will attempt to make possible to study?


    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    The trick is that every particle of matter that gets close enough to it gets sucked in, one particle at a time. So, it starts as a speck, and then gets bigger and bigger.
    That's not really an accurate model of a black-hole. In simplistic terms black-holes "suck" stuff in continually, getting bigger and bigger like a vacuum cleaner bag...but it's a bit more dynamic than that. Depending on the size of the black hole, and it's gravitational potential, the black hole could either evaporate, or even become similar to an electron, failing to dissipate or grow.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    One of the problem I see too here is that US courts do not have any say about a scientific project in a different continent. I do not give a mouldy old rat's ass what the judges do or do not allow in their courtrooms in the US (this is fucked up to begin with, I do not know how one can call the FUBAR over there "justice" ). But their decision is not legally binding for anyone in the EU and if I were the judge I would basicall sentence them to 6 months in a correctional facility to think about their own stupidity.
    Perhaps not, but wars have been started in similar fashion. Fortunately these protesters are a small minority.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    They are just stupid Yanks trying to get money and publicity. Dickheads!!
    As much as I enjoy being painted with the same brush as these protesters simply because of the country I live in, by someone who can't even conduct themselves in a civil manner, the actions by these few individuals is hardly anything to get overly worked up about.

    It's not surprising that such views arise when there is such a lack of education on these subjects (not just the LHC, but other advanced technologies and studies as well). Even if the protest-originators themselves are equals of the scientists working at CERN and their conclusion is of looming disaster, what're they gonna do? Through the justice system they can attempt to file an international lawsuit against CERN. To what end? People have sued for stranger things. I'm not about to lose sleep over this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    If it did destroy the Earth, it would be killing American citizens.
    If it did destroy the Earth...moot point, no one will be around to care.
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  24. #23  
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    The other point I see is the problem with risk-asessment. I mean the honest-to-goodnes estimate that BHs are REALLY created in the LHC is somewhat like 1 to 10^100. The chance to hit the jackpot of a 7 out of 49 lottery is 1 to 1,4*10^8. If you run an experiment at the LHC every 1/10,000 seconds (one orbit around the LHC when the particles are approaching c) and furthermore assume that in every collision there are 1^20 particles involved and assign the same probability (1^-100) of a BH beeing created for each event then one could run the LHC for 10^56 seconds i.e. 2.5*10^38 times the age of the friggin' universe to certainly create a BH and according to theories this will evaporate within a fraction of a microsecond. Would you bet the the farm on a chance like THAT??? And let's not forget that in the atmosphere of the gas giants the same process is also going on since 4.5 billion years. I mean the particles with an energy of one order of magnitude higher than the LHC can crank out under optimum circumstances zipping around in a gas/plasma/metallic hydrogen creating millions of such collisions each second in a much larger volume. Last time I checked neither Jupiter nor Saturn nor Neptune were devoured by a BH, nay?
    What also really gets on my nerve is the whole BooooYaaaaaa about the BHs to beginn with. In my oppinion this would be some amusing side effect if it could be seen at all. I rather expect clarification about real issues like proving/disproving SuSy or detecting the Higgs or getting more data on the possible existence of dark matter.

    Same thing with the RIC in Brookhaven. The reason why this machine was designed was simply to reach the high energies necessary to run the experiments that unify certain fundamental forces. And some scientist dropped the remark that the Quark-Gluon-Plasma produced during the experiment resembles the state of the universe a few microseconds after the BB. This was turned into: "Scientists want to re-create the BB!!!!!!! Is this the end of the world as we know it?????"

    I'm just waiting for the "Sun" or other asswipe tabloid to get wind of the experiment when a couple of scientists created a virtual event horizon in a optical fiber using simple laser beams. This is gonna read soething like this: "HORROR!!!!
    Scientist use deadly laser beams to create Doomsday on Earth!!
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  25. #24  
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    This reminds me of NASA nuking Jupiter.
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  26. #25  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pong
    This reminds me of NASA nuking Jupiter.
    I wonder how many people think that image is of a nuclear explosion on Jupiter? lol
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  27. #26  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Now the probability of this risk may be very low, but the consequences compared with those from minor issues such as global warming or thermonuclear war are dramatic. In such circumstances one might have wished for a somewhat more thorough consideration of the issues, benefits and risks than appears to have been applied.
    Are you saying that the activation of the LHC is a larger issue than all that other stuff, because it could...well, I'll say "potentially" destroy the planet?

    I'm not so sure there's much risk here. Well, in-so-far as we can tell without trying. I doubt the cheif scientists are going to attempt something that could wipe out the whole planet, if they knew that was a possibility. It's not like making a mistake with a weapon, where you might blow up the lab. "Possible destruction of planet" is kinda a big chance side-effect.

    On the other hand, all the work shows that things will be fine. We won't be absolutely certain until we throw the switch, but if all you can be is sure of what you've got, then that's the best you can do. Has anyone proposed a better solution for studying the things the LHC will attempt to make possible to study?

    [/quote]

    Maybe the public just requires patience. They're naturally jittery, since the physics community has been known to change the way life on Earth works in some scary ways.

    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    The trick is that every particle of matter that gets close enough to it gets sucked in, one particle at a time. So, it starts as a speck, and then gets bigger and bigger.
    That's not really an accurate model of a black-hole. In simplistic terms black-holes "suck" stuff in continually, getting bigger and bigger like a vacuum cleaner bag...but it's a bit more dynamic than that. Depending on the size of the black hole, and it's gravitational potential, the black hole could either evaporate, or even become similar to an electron, failing to dissipate or grow.
    True. I wasn't taking into account the possibility that the black hole might just draw the nearest materials into a sort of orbiting pattern around it, and so most objects would be repelled or deflected by the debris that was orbiting it, and only the occasional object getting close to the core gets sucked in.

    Just like how black holes work in the known universe..... kind of.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    One of the problem I see too here is that US courts do not have any say about a scientific project in a different continent. I do not give a mouldy old rat's ass what the judges do or do not allow in their courtrooms in the US (this is fucked up to begin with, I do not know how one can call the FUBAR over there "justice" ). But their decision is not legally binding for anyone in the EU and if I were the judge I would basicall sentence them to 6 months in a correctional facility to think about their own stupidity.
    Perhaps not, but wars have been started in similar fashion. Fortunately these protesters are a small minority.
    Here I'm pretty sure laws have been set up that might allow it. If some mafia tsar in Russia orders a hit on somebody in the USA, I'm pretty sure there is some legal mechanism that would allow us to try him in a US court.

    Not absolutely sure...... but it just kind of seems like it would.

    Similarly here, we're talking about what some may perceive as the endangerment of their life, so jurisdiction might be less of an issue.




    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    They are just stupid Yanks trying to get money and publicity. Dickheads!!
    As much as I enjoy being painted with the same brush as these protesters simply because of the country I live in, by someone who can't even conduct themselves in a civil manner, the actions by these few individuals is hardly anything to get overly worked up about.

    It's not surprising that such views arise when there is such a lack of education on these subjects (not just the LHC, but other advanced technologies and studies as well). Even if the protest-originators themselves are equals of the scientists working at CERN and their conclusion is of looming disaster, what're they gonna do? Through the justice system they can attempt to file an international lawsuit against CERN. To what end? People have sued for stranger things. I'm not about to lose sleep over this.
    I'm not too worried either. They probably are actually just trying to get money, as the nation is a little bit sue happy, what with all these unemployed lawyers running around with nothing better to do. But, they're voicing a concern I'm sure some others share.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    If it did destroy the Earth, it would be killing American citizens.
    If it did destroy the Earth...moot point, no one will be around to care.
    [/quote]

    Actually I think that was my quote. And, I'm pretty sure "reckless endangerment" can be applied as a legal concern prior to it actually resulting in a death.

    If it destroys the Earth, nobody will be there to sue them but.... that's....why.... the suit focuses on shutting it down before instead of after.
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  28. #27  
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    How could a microscopic blackhole exist? Isn't there a point at which the density causes the matter to expand? And woulden't the gravity of the earth easily overcome the microscopic black hole's gravity?
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  29. #28  
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    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    Are you saying that the activation of the LHC is a larger issue than all that other stuff, because it could...well, I'll say "potentially" destroy the planet?
    I am saying the maximum consequences are worse - the worst case scenario is worse with the LHC than global warming or thermonuclear war.
    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    I doubt the cheif scientists are going to attempt something that could wipe out the whole planet, if they knew that was a possibility
    Nevertheless the Los Alomos scientists went ahead with the explosion of the first atomic bomb even though some of them believed it might 'ignite' the atmosphere in a run away chain reaction.
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  30. #29  
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    We have to try it someday. So what are we waiting for? Oh yeah, just one more WoW gold, one more...
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  31. #30  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond K
    How could a microscopic blackhole exist? Isn't there a point at which the density causes the matter to expand? And woulden't the gravity of the earth easily overcome the microscopic black hole's gravity?
    Well, very near the singularity, the force of the singularity's gravity is, like, thousands of times greater than that of the earth. Move something like a nano-meter away, and the earth's gravity will be felt stronger.

    Gravity is G (the number used to adjust the units of measure to metric units) times mass of both objects ("Mm")divided by distance (or radius "R")squared

    GMm/(R^2) If you're withing like, a nanometer of it, then R squared can be a number much less than zero, and dividing by a very small decimal number is the same as multiplying by a very large ordinary number.

    So, it's dangerous to objects very near it, but entirely harmless to objects that are a few feet or inches away.
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  32. #31  
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    Quote Originally Posted by kojax
    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond K
    How could a microscopic blackhole exist? Isn't there a point at which the density causes the matter to expand? And woulden't the gravity of the earth easily overcome the microscopic black hole's gravity?
    Well, very near the singularity, the force of the singularity's gravity is, like, thousands of times greater than that of the earth. Move something like a nano-meter away, and the earth's gravity will be felt stronger.

    Gravity is G (the number used to adjust the units of measure to metric units) times mass of both objects ("Mm")divided by distance (or radius "R")squared

    GMm/(R^2) If you're withing like, a nanometer of it, then R squared can be a number much less than zero, and dividing by a very small decimal number is the same as multiplying by a very large ordinary number.

    So, it's dangerous to objects very near it, but entirely harmless to objects that are a few feet or inches away.
    Thank you
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