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  1. #1 Science paper 
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    I think I have come across something that could be very important to science. When someone thinks of, observes, or creates an experiment and finds out a new property of nature, how would they officially submit the idea as there own?

    Such as the guy who discovered superconductivity; he was experimenting with mercury in some way and just happened to come across it, and I believe he won the noble prize for science. What did he do to declare the discovery as his own in order to take credit?

    I just do not want some SOB claiming that they thought of it instead of me.


    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

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  3. #2  
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    um, I am going to respond as if you were being serious. There are tons of scientific journals that which receive papers from scientists explaining their work. The first person who publishes a result is generally accepted as having been the first person to discover it.


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  4. #3  
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    Which journal do you suggest?

    And yes, I'm serious. I do not know anybody besides myself who is scientifically inclined at all, and school never taught me much. Really, I get most of my information from Wikipedia and the science channel, and now this forum.

    It really isn't that absurd of a question.
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  5. #4  
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    The problem with most journals is that they cost a lot of money to get access to so in turn only colleges and corporations tend to be able to afford access. However, www.interscience.wiley.com is a free resource which lets you search as well as google scholar although I think they search a very similar database. That being said the information your going to find will be very technical and unless you already know a lot about the subject at hand its not going to make much sense but these types of journal articles are where you will find the most recent research.

    Be very very careful about using wikipedia and this forum because anyone can post anything and can make it sound somewhat correct but be completely wrong. The science channel isn't too bad.

    About how old are you? If your in highschool and planning to go to college to major in science related you'll learn a lot more there and the college would likely have access to more journals.
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  6. #5  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cold Fusion
    Which journal do you suggest?
    It depends on what sort of discovery you made, of course. Most science journals are devoted to specific topics. Is your idea related to chemistry? Physics? Biology? Something else? Maybe if you tell us someone could suggest a specific journal.

    There are also two very prestigious journals that will publish articles on any scientific subject, which are called "Science" and "Nature". But they are very hard to get published in, because they are very selective and only publish particularly important/interesting results.

    Whatever journal you decide to publish in, be sure to read a few issues of that journal (you might have to go to a university library to get access) so that you understand how to write your article.

    Also, you want to spend some time checking to make sure that no one else has already reported your result before you spend many many hours trying to get something published. And not to be rude, but your chances of discovering someing very important without any formal training seem pretty slim...
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  7. #6  
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    I'm 17 going on 40 (My age holds no bar on my maturity or intelligence).

    I was considering going into a science related field, but the mathematics held me back; so I am currently attempting to go into business. I understand all of the concepts, and even can intelligently criticize advanced arguments made by scientists by using my innate logic. And I have on various topics, years later, found out that my criticism was correct. My physics abilities shows that I am incompetent at the math; I failed last years course, but at least during my senior year I am maintaining a 84% (Last year it was 14%, no kidding).

    My observation is related to physics.....and what appears to be quantum mechanics, since the observation (I think) deals with atoms sustainability and ability to emit fields of energy.

    I really just discovered it by mistake. What I saw really defies many laws of physics that we all know. Unfortunately I am not able to replicate it where I currently live (I was on vacation), but will be going back to the vacation spot this Winter; I am going to try to bring some measurement instruments with me to try to understand more of the phenomenon.

    Actually, I am so certain on the implications of it, that I based many calculations and self studies off of it which led me to some very interesting conclusions. And yeah, I know that there is a definite possibility the some PHD somewhere has already discovered it.....but if someone did discover it, why isn't it on the news? Why haven't I heard about it? I browse allot of science research forums and websites, and am generally up to date with all of the recent discoveries.

    Unless.....its such an amazing property of nature...that the government has censored all of the physicist from telling the public!
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  8. #7  
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    Cold Fusion, without wishing to pour cold water on your idea and your intent let me sound three words of caution: priority; pettiness; prejudice.

    Priority: if your observations and conclusions are valid it is, as you suggested, possible - indeed likely - that the phenomenon has been observed before and documented. I don't think you would need to invoke conspiracy theories of government censorship to explain lack of publicity. Frankly, unless the discovery had emerged from secret government sponsored and controlled research it would be very difficult to suppress it. The lack of awareness can be accounted for by my second word of warning.

    Pettiness: it may be that your discovery is genuine, but your interpretation of it is somewhat flawed. You may be observing something that is quite mundane and well understood by scientists in that particular field. Its very ordinariness is what has ensured it has a low profile.

    Prejudice: Pretty much all science journals expect to receive papers from established scientists working for appropriate universities, research institutes or commercial companies. Close to 100% of papers submitted from other sources are (rightly) dismissed as delusional junk. This attitude is enhanced when the author claims to have made a discovery that defies many laws of physics that we all know.

    Good luck.
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  9. #8  
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    Cold Fusion: you have to build it. Then you have to register a patent. Then demonstrate it to a journalist who will give you publicity. With this, people will find it difficult to lay claim to your ideas. Then you can approach a physicist who has established credentials, and allow him some of your credit in return for his sanction. But by then you won't need to.

    Note that there are many interesting ideas that you haven't heard of. The government doesn't "censor" these ideas. The sad truth is that the peer-review system associated with the physics profession and with journals effects a form of resistance that makes it difficult for new ideas to gain ground. Underlying this is what's called the "sociology" of science and scientists. Science has always been like this. It was thirteen years before Einstein's General Relativity was accepted as mainstream science. See page 6 of this paper http://www.arxiv.org/PS_cache/gr-qc/.../0510072v2.pdf. You don't know this because the resistance tends to be swept under the carpet and airbrushed out of history.

    I will add that you say "noble" instead of "Nobel" and talk of "energy fields", so people are going to be sceptical of your claim.
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  10. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cold Fusion
    I'm 17 going on 40 (My age holds no bar on my maturity or intelligence).
    My question about your age was merely meant to see the opportunities available to you; no reflection on your intelligence was intended. If you were 40 and well set in a non-science oriented career it would be much harder to gain access to the journals most of which are quite expensive. However, since your about to college it will be much easier. Even if you go into business you should still be able to access the same resources as physics majors through the library on campus.

    Ophiolite made some very good points that you should consider. That being said you've got me interested in what you saw and how your planning to test it. If you care to share for a second opinion send me a pm, I promise I'm not out to steal anyone's idea.
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  11. #10  
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    GR took so long to be accepted because it took so long for experimental physics to reach the point that it could be tested. Special relativity was picked up quite quickly.

    On another note, you don't need a huge budget to access most journals. First try here : http://www.doaj.org/ which is the site for the directory of open access journals which is a treasure trove for anyone interested in more serious matters. Secondly, try contacting your closest library and see what their library access costs are - most tertiary institutions sell access to their libraries and the associated journals.
    As is often the case with technical subjects we are presented with an unfortunate choice: an explanation that is accurate but incomprehensible, or comprehensible but wrong.
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  12. #11  
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    Thanks for all the information.

    I am a person who isn't worried by the odds of anything to be frank.
    Whether I can get it ever officially published or not, I will at least try to (that is, if it is in fact true) make as many people as possible believe that I am the one who discovered it. This could be done by simultaneously posting videos on every internet video website, posting on every forum I know of, sending the video and explanation to every news network, etc...

    I will be able to test it again this winter by using some equipment. If there is a particular tolerance that it adheres to, then I will see what I can do. But If I cannot do it again, I might just PM one of you, or just post it on the forum.

    Really though, what I observed was on the level of observing superconductivity levitating a magnet for the first time-or more.

    Also, I did try to replicate the natural apparatus and modified it many times, yet could not get the same result. What happened is that the substance behaved just like it is meant to, it didn't do anything odd.

    Oh yeah, farsight, your link didn't work.

    Another thing, what is the point of these overly scientific papers if the main point of science is for people to appreciate these discoveries? Allot of the things discovered cannot really do much for us besides give us an answer; I think it is important for there to be a T.V. channel or something that is dedicate to science, and talks in a technical but not impossible to understand language. The Science channel is good, but they do not go over enough, nor is it technical enough for me.

    You shouldn't have to be a PHD physicist to be able to know these things!
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  13. #12  
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    Sorry, ColdFusion. Try this: http://arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0510072

    Click on it, then click on PDF at the top right of the window.
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  14. #13  
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    Is it discussing the possibility that different elements are effected by gravity in varying ways?
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

    -Einstein

    http://boinc.berkeley.edu/download.php

    Use your computing strength for science!
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  15. #14  
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    The journals are heavily peer reviewed to make sure an article is scientifically valid. It's not that anyone is trying to hold you back, it's just that graduate students and PhDs are usually the people that make great discoveries in the physical sciences. They're the people with the most knowledge and best equipment. (The guy that discovered supercoductivity had a PhD)

    Are you absolutely positive what you witnessed has not been observed before? It is VERY hard to believe that the physics behind something visible to the naked eye in a natural setting has not been explained. I'm not trying to call you a liar or anything, just saying.

    If you would like to PM me about it, I would be glad to discuss it. I could check through some journals at the uni library to see if this phenomenon has ever been mentioned. I'm not out to take credit for your work.
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  16. #15  
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    I searched the internet for an hour or two using every possible keyword I could imagine, and went to many reputable websites. Everything that I read was still under the assumption that my observation does not exist.

    I still can't imagine though, that scientists could figure this out, yet it would not be on any website I've seen, nor have been mentioned at any point in my life.
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

    -Einstein

    http://boinc.berkeley.edu/download.php

    Use your computing strength for science!
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  17. #16  
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    Why don't you just tell us exactly what you observed? If its something really wild, most people here won't believe you anyway, so you don't really need to worry about someone taking credit for your work.
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  18. #17  
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    Rotfl, actually I am kind of paranoid about these things due to other things that have happened. Really, my ideal "job" is to be an inventor. But what has prevented me from patenting any of the great things that I have thought of, is the money involved, which I just don't have. So, it turned out that almost every one of my inventions have been taken over the years, that I could have made good money off of; in fact, what these companies produced seemed way to similar to what my plans were.

    Back then, I did occasionally tell friends and family about what I invented, and it has grown on me that I shouldn't tell anyone anything, as to avoid it being taken.

    So, my paranoia reaches to this topic, that I really shouldn't tell anyone from fear of them stealing the idea, claiming to be the creator of it, and becoming scientifically famous. But, If I cannot re-create it, I will consider PM'ing somebody about it....or maybe even trying to see if I can talk to a local college physics instructor about it....but I guess that might be worse, since he would have allot of access to these journals.
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

    -Einstein

    http://boinc.berkeley.edu/download.php

    Use your computing strength for science!
    Reply With Quote  
     

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