Notices

View Poll Results: When antigravity device will be discovered

Voters
22. You may not vote on this poll
  • in 10 Years

    2 9.09%
  • in 100 Years

    7 31.82%
  • never

    13 59.09%
Results 1 to 24 of 24

Thread: Antigravity - science fiction or inevitable discovery?

  1. #1 Antigravity - science fiction or inevitable discovery? 
    Forum Freshman Ozolnyex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Latvia
    Posts
    84
    Some say history repeats, as it was with laser beam, submarine, science fiction, nobody believed that time it's gonna be real, the same is with antigravity, should be a great shock to the mankind.

    What phisical structure has an axis of rotating object, I suggest 0 structure, like spacetime also has 0 structure, so we get structure inside a matter similar to space structure, mayby we can manipulate it.

    When you push out from the point a working giroscope There is a violent reaction, I would ask why, Why could'nt we change direction of rotating giroscope's axis veri slowly, I appeal for common sense here, but answer is it's axis has the continuance in form of spatial dimension outside giroscopes matter, that's why it holds steady vectorial position, outer space dimension goes through rotating giroscope like a normal dimension, if You interrupt it, violent reaction ocurs.

    Antigravity discovery should be very close to this phenomenon.

    If we could interrupt a space constantly, it would prevent an object from falling because there will be no space for it to fall to.

    What You think?


    Ozolnyex
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Administrator KALSTER's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    8,231
    If a graviton particle is discovered, it would naturally have an antiparticle that possibly could have such an effect. I can't make heads or tails of any of the rest of your question, so let the actual scientists answer your question. Brace yourself.


    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

    "Gullibility kills" - Carl Sagan
    "All people know the same truth. Our lives consist of how we chose to distort it." - Harry Block
    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    927
    hmm, countering gravity with an antigravity field?
    wouldn't that field have to be powered, to make it refuse people to fall to the ground?
    we've already been able to "create" antigravity on earth.
    its done by making an airplane dive at the speed of gravity, thereby cancelling the effect of gravity.
    when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth
    A.C Doyle
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Ph.D. GhostofMaxwell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Thames estuary
    Posts
    851
    I think you will find that is zero gravity Dej.
    Es ist Zeit für sauberen



    You guys
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5 Re: Antigravity - science fiction or inevitable discovery? 
    Moderator Moderator Janus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    2,205
    Quote Originally Posted by Ozolnyex
    Some say history repeats, as it was with laser beam, submarine, science fiction, nobody believed that time it's gonna be real, the same is with antigravity, should be a great shock to the mankind.

    What phisical structure has an axis of rotating object, I suggest 0 structure, like spacetime also has 0 structure, so we get structure inside a matter similar to space structure, mayby we can manipulate it.

    When you push out from the point a working giroscope There is a violent reaction, I would ask why, Why could'nt we change direction of rotating giroscope's axis veri slowly, I appeal for common sense here, but answer is it's axis has the continuance in form of spatial dimension outside giroscopes matter, that's why it holds steady vectorial position, outer space dimension goes through rotating giroscope like a normal dimension, if You interrupt it, violent reaction ocurs.
    The reaction of the gyroscope is simply due to conservation of angular momentum. The indivdual parts of the gryoscope try to continue traveling in the same direction they were before you apllied the force. The gyroscope twists in response.


    Antigravity discovery should be very close to this phenomenon.

    If we could interrupt a space constantly, it would prevent an object from falling because there will be no space for it to fall to.

    What You think?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Moderator Moderator Janus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    2,205
    Quote Originally Posted by KALSTER
    If a graviton particle is discovered, it would naturally have an antiparticle that possibly could have such an effect.
    Sorry, but the graviton, like the photon, would be its own antiparticle. So there would not be any "repulsive" graviton.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Administrator KALSTER's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    South Africa
    Posts
    8,231
    OK my bad...
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

    "Gullibility kills" - Carl Sagan
    "All people know the same truth. Our lives consist of how we chose to distort it." - Harry Block
    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Avalon, England
    Posts
    18
    No not your bad, the photon has an anti-particle but its properties are almost interchangable-there is one theory why they are hard to detect and this is being investigated currently at CERN.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9 Antigravity device 
    Forum Freshman Ozolnyex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Latvia
    Posts
    84
    The spase has 3 axis, imagine You make a devise that can aniihilate one axis and Your space is flat, there will be no possible movements axcept flat, here is Your antigraviti, aniihilate downword dimension and object will hang on I can explain such a device if anybody want to listen, I wrote to NASA several times they just ignore me. I do not htink they have to ignore new ideas, anyway where do they take them, from treare own stuff? How to meke shuttles more safe?
    Ozolnyex
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Forum Professor
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the circuitous haze of my mind
    Posts
    1,028
    I think that it could also be a matter of allowing matter to ignore the gravitational field; you could also allow matter to ignore the higg's Boson-which would allow for some profound things.

    How to do this? Through the LHC, we might be able to find the part of all known matter that reacts to the field, and could then try to eliminate it from the element, or make it inactive. If NASA starts exploring distant solar systems, we might even be able to find new elements that do not react to gravity or the Higgs Boson.
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

    -Einstein

    http://boinc.berkeley.edu/download.php

    Use your computing strength for science!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Forum Professor
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    In the circuitous haze of my mind
    Posts
    1,028
    I don't think that we'll be able eliminate a dimension any time soon though. It would require knowledge that is currently beyond our mental capacitance.
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

    -Einstein

    http://boinc.berkeley.edu/download.php

    Use your computing strength for science!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12 steel sphere 
    Forum Freshman Ozolnyex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Latvia
    Posts
    84
    Make one stable axis by rotation, then rotate perpendiculary. Axis itself like dimension is zero structure, if You push it inside the matter it will move
    Ozolnyex
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #13  
    Guest
    Let's clear something up here so we are all reading the same page.

    "Apparent gravity cancellation" That is what you get with the diving aircraft it is not 'anti-gravity' it is merely a vector sum of forces where gravity is apparently cancelled/nuetralised or destroyed

    Another example might be two large identical globes (don't go there please.. ) in space (lets assume jupiter size. they are close together and you are equidistant between them, you appear to either to be hovering above the surface, you appear to be defying gravity this is not the same as the first example.
    THis is "centre of gravity" where you are very much subject to gravity in all directions.

    Antigravity to me suggests that you switch on this machine and it projects a cone or cylinder of space vertically upwards in which no trace of gravity can be found.

    But looking at the word I see it means to 'defy gavity' in the same way defying society can be considered ant-social. I defy gravity everytime I swim, or jump or cycle up hill...

    Of the magic machine above, (that projects a cone or cylinder of space)
    IN order to produce a machine like this we must first understand the source of gravity, long projected is the graviton but alas it has not been found. Anyway if it were found this would actually mean an anti-gravity machine as considered above would be impossible! You would need as many anti-gravs as you have gravs, they would need to occupy the same space (so as to cancel each 'gravs' influence.

    Secondly this 'antigrav' particle if ammassed would do what with passing matter? would it repel it? would it attract it?

    There is another way and that is to annihilate or temporarily move the matter who's gravity you are influenced by, from the universe! so matter has gravity, anti-matter annihilates matter and therefore annhilates gravity.

    So in the long term a gun that you can point at someone press the trigger and watch them float up is a great hollywood subject but for me, I'll file it along side..

    Hawking Radiation, or 'How I fudged the maths'
    Telekinesis, not with the rules of our universe!
    Time travel not survivable to anything larger than a photon.
    Teleportation (of live tissue), as for time travel.
    And of course the actual building of an efficient space elevator!

    I am open to persuasion on any and all of these but not from the usual "Just because it isn't possible now, doesn't mean it will always be that way" because that's the very argument we despise of theists for the existence of gods.

    NOw I'm gonna duck....
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #14  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    927
    how about the biefield brown effect?
    when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth
    A.C Doyle
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #15  
    The Doctor Quantime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    4,546
    Interesting dejawolf.

    On an SVW note, gravity and electromagnetism are somehow connected so there must be a way to allow for graviational repulsion if they are the same 'force'. The only trick now is to put gravity under circumstances similar to that of electromagnetism and at the same time vice versa.
    "If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe". - Carl Sagan
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #16  
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by dejawolf
    how about the biefield brown effect?
    It's really hard to ionise air particles in a vacuum, electrostatically propelled flying machines never really took off.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  18. #17  
    The Doctor Quantime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    4,546
    umhum, if only the people had put more thought and effort into it, BTTF.
    "If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe". - Carl Sagan
    Reply With Quote  
     

  19. #18 Antigravity 
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    126
    I discovered casually this about 6 months ago searching for free energy...

    In theory in a closed container,there can be a sum of forces disequal from 0. So you can mount it in an object to take it in air deleting the force of the planet gravity. Or magnetics fields. I have to specify that my engine don't erase the gravity but let an object to be put on this in middle air.
    If you are interested tomorrow i will post diagrams of this fuell-less propeller.

    Clearwar
    Reply With Quote  
     

  20. #19  
    Guest
    You might want to ask SVWILLMER he is way ahead of us in understanding your sort of science.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  21. #20  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    14,168
    Through the eighties and nineties there was an amateur researcher in Scoltand (Fife, I think) who believed he had found a gravity reducing effect, i.e. anti-gravity, with gyroscopes. (I am not sure if the details his hypothesis were the same or similar to Ozolnyex's.)
    I believe I read recently that the effect had finally been identified as an artifact of his apparatus.

    I suspect what we need is not an anti-gravity device, but a device to suppress or eliminate inertia.

    Edited to correct abominable typographical errors.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  22. #21  
    Forum Freshman Ozolnyex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Latvia
    Posts
    84
    If we could manipulate the axis of space we could do much interesting things. The proof that the axis is real is an axis of rotating object, it's diam. is 0. The same is space - consists of phisical zeroe's.
    Ozolnyex
    Reply With Quote  
     

  23. #22  
    Forum Freshman Ozolnyex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Latvia
    Posts
    84
    I see someone's interest here :wink: I'm not native english speaker, so maybe sometimes I choose not appropriate words. "Antigravity", I just call this idea because there is no more popular word for the device being able to overcome gravity. I personally belong to those considering gravity as an effect of curvation of space, not flow of gravitons. Space has 3 dimensions, eliminate one and You have 2 dim space, the object will be excluded from gravitational attraction if it's in the field with just 2 dimensions. The Idea is simple but takes an effort to understand. The device would be more complicated, high precision rotation speeds necesary. Main thing to undestand is that in a rotating object, let's take a cylinder for example, there is an axis going through an object and the diameter of the axis is 0. Is it correct? So it has the same structure as space "0 structure". Next is my hipothesis: the axis in object has a dimensional continuance outside it, because of the same structure. Like a long string. And because it goes through a phisical object we can interrupt "a dimension" by moveing the object. I have an idea how to interrupt dimension of space continiously, the moment and point of interruption is the point where phisical object cuts of one space dimension, the result we can imagine.
    Ozolnyex
    Reply With Quote  
     

  24. #23  
    Time Lord
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5,328
    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    I suspect what we need is not an anti-gravity device, but a device to suppress or eliminate inertia.
    Yeah, that has practical application. And intuitively seems less trouble than opposing gravity of, say, the Earth.

    Gravity, we can and do overcome. No biggy.

    The real wall we're up against is inertia of squishy compressables like human bodies. You want to go to another star? Fastest trip is limited to 1g acceleration all the way (or you pancake) - or worse yet turn around half way and accelerate towards Earth so you stop at the destination. That is so lame.

    We need a force that accelerates us with brutal explosive force yet gently (consistently all through) "like gravity". I guess it'll be a new kind of bomb, that puts out "infinitely" small shrapnel.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  25. #24  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    2,176
    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Through the eighties and nineties there was an amateur researcher in Scoltand (Fife, I think) who believed he had found a gravity reducing effect, i.e. anti-gravity, with gyroscopes. (I am not sure if the details his hypothesis were the same or similar to Ozolnyex's.)
    I believe I read recently that the effect had finally been identified as an artifact of his apparatus.

    I suspect what we need is not an anti-gravity device, but a device to suppress or eliminate inertia.

    Edited to correct abominable typographical errors.
    I am not sure exactly what you mean by anti-gravity. However gyros, multiple gyros can be opposed to one another and lift or move things. It was already looked into. The problem is the incredible wear on the bearings.

    You would need magnetic bearings or liquid bearings. Either way it is pretty complicated and prone to stress failure. That is why it did not take off real big or fast.

    We can hurl things by charging a face of the object, like an explosion but controlled, and calm, however, the dangers are what they are obviously. Also below such a vessel, were reported strange magnetic/gravitational effects.

    Old Roy Grummans Lunar Rock collector of the fifties, used a laser beam to super heat, liquefied gases, to extreme temperatures. And use the ejection to propel his vessel. This used to allow the craft to streak to the moon in four hours. Straight up. No volute orbital patterns.

    The trainer for the lunar module in Florida had to be chained down, because the astronauts were flying it all over Florida. At a time when desperate oil prices and shortages were about to force war upon us again, this seemed like a slap in the face.

    Where is Professor Joad when you need him?

    Sincerely,


    William McCormick
    Reply With Quote  
     

Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •