Notices
Results 1 to 35 of 35
Like Tree8Likes
  • 1 Post By Dywyddyr
  • 1 Post By Neverfly
  • 1 Post By stander-j
  • 1 Post By Steel Neuron
  • 1 Post By Dywyddyr

Thread: Friction of arrows- spark a fire?

  1. #1 Friction of arrows- spark a fire? 
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    36
    Hey! I was just wondering if any type of projectile [arrow?] can be shot from a weapon and catch fire in mid-air, by friction to itself [and while coated in some type of highly flammable/reactive substance?]: basically, is there any chemical that can catch fire by the friction of air by either being highly reactive to the molecules in air, etc.?


    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Forum Masters Degree
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    739
    I'm sure there are many chmicals that will ignite/react/combust when exposed to air. I doubt if there are any that will ignite due to the friction between the arrow and the surrounding air. Let's face it, an arrow doesn't travel that fast compared to the speeds of jets and rocket planes.


    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Apocalyptic Paradise
    Posts
    6,613
    Quote Originally Posted by PumaMan View Post
    I'm sure there are many chmicals that will ignite/react/combust when exposed to air. I doubt if there are any that will ignite due to the friction between the arrow and the surrounding air. Let's face it, an arrow doesn't travel that fast compared to the speeds of jets and rocket planes.
    And if it was that reactive, you'd have a hard time preventing them from bursting into flame in your quiver.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Malignant Pimple shlunka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Dogbox in front of Dywyddyr's house.
    Posts
    1,785
    I don't think any substance would allow for that. However, an alternative... You could coat the arrow in some flammable material, anything that would dry. And then put some flint on the side of the bow where the arrow slides along before leaving the bow. The sparks from the flint could possibly cause the coating on the arrow to catch fire.
    "MODERATOR NOTE : We don't entertain trolls here, not even in the trash can. Banned." -Markus Hanke
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    36
    Does anyone know of a substance that bursts into flames upon impact, then?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Genius Duck Moderator Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    11,707
    Match heads.
    curious mind likes this.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    喫茶店
    Posts
    16,844
    Quote Originally Posted by MrPiano View Post
    Does anyone know of a substance that bursts into flames upon impact, then?
    Primary explosives such as the fulminates.
    ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Masters Degree
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    739
    Quote Originally Posted by MrPiano View Post
    Does anyone know of a substance that bursts into flames upon impact, then?
    First off, what are you trying to do? You're not related to the Tsarnaev brothers are ya?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    36
    haha no-- I'm writing a novel! Not for actual use :P
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    喫茶店
    Posts
    16,844
    Quote Originally Posted by MrPiano View Post
    Does anyone know of a substance that bursts into flames upon impact, then?
    Or a glass container containing phosphorous.

    Or two containers with, say, water and potassium or two similar highly reactive compounds.
    ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Forum Bachelors Degree
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    480
    Or a green dragon laser, it wont catch fire passing through the air I think, but it will set fire to what ever it lands on within reason. Fiction novel is it..?
    Depression is the uncertainty of the unknown, I know one day I'll die so I'm happy.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12  
    Forum Masters Degree
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    739
    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    I work with green lasers (532 nm) on a daily basis. They will not catch fire passing through air, they pose a minimal fire hazard at best (unless you deliberately jack up the power and focus the beam with the intent of trying to burn something).
    It's just another one of Andy's nonsense posts. I'm starting to think that he's a troll.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #13  
    Forum Bachelors Degree
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    480
    Your are amusing Pumaman.

    Depression is the uncertainty of the unknown, I know one day I'll die so I'm happy.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #14  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Apocalyptic Paradise
    Posts
    6,613
    Whoa! That man used a match to light that laser beam on fire!
    Flick Montana likes this.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #15  
    Forum Bachelors Degree
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    480
    Well the op hasn't stated much about the novel so anything is up for grabs atm, like I asked..

    Fiction novel is it..?
    The op could well be writing a science fiction novel and this may of been some use.
    Depression is the uncertainty of the unknown, I know one day I'll die so I'm happy.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #16  
    Forum Masters Degree
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    739
    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    Trying to claim you were answering the OP with this nonsense is a non-starter. Why do you try thinking before you spew crap in future.
    That is andy's MO. If you take a look back thru his posts (admittedly a horrible chore) he loves to post one-liners that are never helpful to the OP and usually they are way off subject, that is, if they make any sense at all. He takes threads off-topic (like he did in this one) by posting some nonsense which then several posters spend time trying to show him that his post is nothing but BS. By then the thread is way off topic. It's troll-like behavior because he probably enjoys the attention he's getting.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  18. #17  
    Forum Masters Degree
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    739
    Getting back to the OP . . .

    It's a horrible movie but Sylvester Stallone in Rambo III used arrows with explosive heads to bring down a helicopter, if I remember correctly.

    Also, Arnold Schwartzenegger in the movie Predator devised some explosive arrows using the explosive powder from some munitions.

    ==> I'm sure there have been many movies where explosive-tipped arrows have been used in the plots. Maybe some expert out there can tell us if these are even practical???
    Reply With Quote  
     

  19. #18  
    Forum Bachelors Degree
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    480
    Well its not really back on track now is it...


    Quote Originally Posted by MrPiano View Post
    Hey! I was just wondering if any type of projectile [arrow?] can be shot from a weapon and catch fire in mid-air, by friction to itself [and while coated in some type of highly flammable/reactive substance?]: basically, is there any chemical that can catch fire by the friction of air by either being highly reactive to the molecules in air, etc.?
    It's a horrible movie but Sylvester Stallone in Rambo III used arrows with explosive heads to bring down a helicopter
    Were in any point of the film Rambo 3 did his arrow catch fire in mid air? Are you spamming now?
    Depression is the uncertainty of the unknown, I know one day I'll die so I'm happy.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  20. #19  
    Forum Masters Degree
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    739
    Quote Originally Posted by andythomasthekey View Post
    Well its not really back on track now is it...
    Well, yes it is. I'm answering a question posed by the thread starter. You have a reading disorder to go along with your other disorders so I'll do the work for you:

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPiano View Post
    Does anyone know of a substance that bursts into flames upon impact, then?
    And, if you take a look back thru this thread, your post was the one that deviated from the thread topic. Remember? Your stupid green laser post.
    Last edited by PumaMan; May 4th, 2013 at 11:07 AM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  21. #20  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    7
    Sodium metal catches fire as soon as it is exposed to air within a very small time lag and the greater the quantity the more lethal it can be it can even blast in mid-air......
    Reply With Quote  
     

  22. #21  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    7
    It has to be stored in kerosene so that it doesnt catch fire..
    I guess it will be great if u could make a thin polythene film cover filled with kerosene and containing sodium metal and then as soon as it is released the film will break causing the arrow coated with the sodium metal to get exposed to the air and hence give the burning effect..nice thought by Mrpiano...
    Reply With Quote  
     

  23. #22  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    4,211
    piano
    look into pyrophoric materials that react in air

    eg:
    alkali metals (potassium, cesium)
    finely divided metal dusts (nickel, zinc, titanium)
    hydrides (barium hydrides, diborane, diisobutyl aluminum hydride).


    then keep your arrows wet or in a sealed container until use
    Last edited by sculptor; May 4th, 2013 at 11:44 AM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  24. #23  
    Forum Bachelors Degree
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    480
    Quote Originally Posted by PumaMan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by andythomasthekey View Post
    Well its not really back on track now is it...
    Well, yes it is. I'm answering a question posed by the thread starter. You have a reading disorder to go along with your other disorders so I'll do the work for you:

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPiano View Post
    Does anyone know of a substance that bursts into flames upon impact, then?
    And, if you take a look back thru this thread, your post was the one that deviated from the thread topic. Remember? Your stupid green laser post.
    Still the OP has not yet stated the nature of the novel. Again if it were science fiction, then my helpful answer would have been a cool idea. Not one that has been copied many times over, Rambo was 1980 maybe...and no longer original.
    Depression is the uncertainty of the unknown, I know one day I'll die so I'm happy.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  25. #24  
    Life-Size Nanoputian Flick Montana's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Flatland
    Posts
    5,437
    Quote Originally Posted by AV123 View Post
    It has to be stored in kerosene so that it doesnt catch fire...
    I want to see an archer with a kerosene-filled quiver of sodium metal arrows. Sounds like an under-utilized tactic.
    "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." -Calvin
    Reply With Quote  
     

  26. #25  
    Universalis Infinitis Devon Keogh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Dublin, Republic of Ireland
    Posts
    145
    That is an easy one, Silver fulminate would do the job. As soon as it encounters even the slightest force it explodes. So the force of the air hitting the arrow would do the job of exploding it.

    Small print:

    Use of this method may result in you exploding and ruining your bow.


    P.S. It even sets fire from the force of a single drop of water hitting it.
    Last edited by Devon Keogh; May 9th, 2013 at 02:47 PM.

    "If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."
    Sir Isaac Newton

    In my own opinion there is no greater mathematical Principle than that which is x - x = 0. This shows that matter can be created from nothing as long as the total product of the matter's mass & energy equal exactly zero.
    The only question is, "Where did all that antimatter go?"

    Favourite Elements: Sodium, Neodymium, Xenon
    Reply With Quote  
     

  27. #26  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    36
    If you put [carefully] some silver fulminate in a little capsule/shell and put it on the front of an arrow, would it explode it airflight or only when the capsule itself hit the target?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  28. #27  
    Forum Bachelors Degree
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    480
    From the way you speak of this fulminate it might explode in air flight..
    Depression is the uncertainty of the unknown, I know one day I'll die so I'm happy.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  29. #28  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    951
    Sounds like a great way to get the ATF on your ass--good luck
    Reply With Quote  
     

  30. #29  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    36
    Yes, because if I was actually planning an attack of some kind, I would use a bow and arrow. Again, its for a fantasy/sci-fi novel I'm writing. Probably I'll just end up making up some substance instead of drawing on real-world compounds, but I thought I'd try to see if there was an easy fit.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  31. #30  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Apocalyptic Paradise
    Posts
    6,613
    Instead of friction with the air- why not some other mechanism to set the flame alight?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  32. #31  
    Forum Ph.D. stander-j's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Winnipeg
    Posts
    854
    Hmm, well if you were to take a route where the arrow head is made, or is coated, with a substance that reacts with oxygen or the air. What if the quiver had an oil resevoir at the bottom, protecting the arrow heads from reacting with oxygen when not in use? Is it possible for a layer of oil to protect the tip while the an archer nocks the arrow, which then runs off and permits the arrow to ignite once it has been loosed? Does anyone know if something like that would work for the OP?
    Lanfear likes this.
    "Cultivated leisure is the aim of man."
    Reply With Quote  
     

  33. #32  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    951
    white phosphorous in a glass capsule on the tip , wont burn on the way but makes a hell of a fire when it hits
    Reply With Quote  
     

  34. #33  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by Strange View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrPiano View Post
    Does anyone know of a substance that bursts into flames upon impact, then?
    Primary explosives such as the fulminates.
    Of course you'd better be gentle with that arrow before firing...
    ---

    Maybe you tip the arrow with any of a number of pyrophoric substances that are dangerous in most contexts. The trick then is the quiver... make it a specialized device filled with something like *kerosene, which won't react with your arrowhead, but will rapidly evaporate leaving the head exposed in flight.

    Another idea might be to have an explosive or incendiary device at the arrow tip, which is specifically engineered to be sensitive to electrical triggering. Have a little piezoelectric material sandwiched between the head and shaft, so upon impact a spark is generated for ignition. You'd need some kind of arming-safety in the quiver though...

    edit: @Stander-j: I think *kerosene is a better choice... oil would tend to leave a lasting coating that wouldn't come off reliably in flight.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  35. #34  
    New Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    4
    Here is another idea:

    Have two reactives inside the shaft separated by a thin glass structure, so that when the arrow accelerates abruptly (when being shot) the compression along the shaft breaks the barrier and the reactives mix.

    I'm not sure how strong is the acceleration an arrow is subject to when it's fired, but I guess it's powerful enough to break a lid that would otherwise be safe in the quiver.
    Lanfear likes this.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  36. #35  
    Genius Duck Moderator Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    11,707
    One nitpick: a bow/ arrow is not "fired".
    One shoots a bow, or looses an arrow.
    "Fire" applies to, strangely enough, firearms.
    Lanfear likes this.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
    Reply With Quote  
     

Similar Threads

  1. Were Medieval arrows tipped with metal points?
    By icewendigo in forum History
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: February 19th, 2013, 01:58 PM
  2. spark
    By sabari raja in forum Electrical and Electronics
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: November 1st, 2012, 04:50 PM
  3. The Spark of Life
    By ClaimingLight in forum Philosophy
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: June 7th, 2012, 07:53 PM
  4. Vacuum Spark Gap
    By drumfunk in forum Electrical and Electronics
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: April 4th, 2009, 12:48 AM
  5. Broken Arrows
    By Vaedrah in forum Politics
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: August 27th, 2008, 05:37 PM
Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •