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Thread: First experiments and results of CERN

  1. #1 First experiments and results of CERN 
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    Every one knows about which will be the first experiments and expected results of LHC-CERN.

    And when the most important results?...Existence of Higgs bosón (?)

    It seems that the next 4 July will be some news...about Higgs boson...Do you know anything?


    Last edited by dapifo; June 25th, 2012 at 03:07 PM.
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
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  3. #2  
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    The LHC has been running for about 3 years, so all the experiments have been running.


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  4. #3  
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeteorWayne View Post
    The LHC has been running for about 3 years, so all the experiments have been running.
    One year at half and one stopped (?)

    Do you know any important result till now?

    The experiments about Higgs Boson are done...and nearly they will give the results (4th of July?).
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
    "Science does not know its debt to imagination". Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Why settle with the known models and patterns (but not underlying laws) of Our Universe , if we might understand them better if we could puzzle out them from outside its limits?"
    (The common sense)
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  5. #4  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
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    Creating a quark-gluon plasma was one of the more interesting things so far: ALICE - A Large Ion Collider Experiment

    And the LHCb experiment is generating some interesting results (most of which are way over my head!): LHCb - Large Hadron Collider beauty experiment
    ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat
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  6. #5  
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strange View Post
    Creating a quark-gluon plasma was one of the more interesting things so far: ALICE - A Large Ion Collider Experiment

    And the LHCb experiment is generating some interesting results (most of which are way over my head!): LHCb - Large Hadron Collider beauty experiment
    So until now very specific experiments for experts....nothing that could be undertud for normal people.

    Will see the Higgs boson experiment....during next days...
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
    "Science does not know its debt to imagination". Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Why settle with the known models and patterns (but not underlying laws) of Our Universe , if we might understand them better if we could puzzle out them from outside its limits?"
    (The common sense)
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  7. #6  
    Forum Senior TheObserver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dapifo View Post
    So until now very specific experiments for experts....nothing that could be undertud for normal people.
    Its a particle accelerator dude, it wasn't built to help normal people understand things. The experiments that are done using it are FOR experts.
    MeteorWayne, Strange and adelady like this.
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  8. #7  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
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    Don't forget that there are some very cool things being done outside of the LHC. The OPERA experiment looking at neutrino oscillations is one. And the ALPHA experiment which is trying to trap enough antimatter to measure its properties is pretty exciting (Home | ALPHA Experiment).
    ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat
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  9. #8  
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    And prove or disprove the existence of the Higgs boson...

    On July 4 they celebrate the International Conference on High Energy Physics (ICHEP 2012) in Australia where they present the latest results obtained in the experiments ATLAS and CMS of the Large Hadron Collider (LHC) and the scientific community speculated that, at that meeting, CERN made ​​the announcement of the discovery that of the Higgs boson....

    ...will see !!!
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
    "Science does not know its debt to imagination". Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Why settle with the known models and patterns (but not underlying laws) of Our Universe , if we might understand them better if we could puzzle out them from outside its limits?"
    (The common sense)
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  10. #9  
    Comet Dust Collector Moderator
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    Yes the news from 6 months ago suggested that they should have sufficient data analyzed by then....or not.
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  11. #10  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dapifo View Post
    So until now very specific experiments for experts....nothing that could be undertud for normal people.

    Will see the Higgs boson experiment....during next days...
    I doubt that many "normal people" understand much about the Higgs boson. I certainly don't!
    ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat
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  12. #11  
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strange View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dapifo View Post
    So until now very specific experiments for experts....nothing that could be undertud for normal people.

    Will see the Higgs boson experiment....during next days...
    Will see the Higgs boson experiment....during next days...
    I doubt that many "normal people" understand much about the Higgs boson. I certainly don't![/QUOTE]

    Really I donīt understand why it is so important and "popular" to demostrate the existence of the Boson de Higgs... I allways thought and understud that it was the elemental particle were was the "mass" of every thing.

    But reading more about it, it is not the only one which has mass. And other Boson (W y Z) has also mass...so (?).

    It seams that is more a problem of defining the different particle physics models (?).

    If it doesnīt exist only means that the "standar model" is not good, and that has to be diffined other alternative models (??)
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
    "Science does not know its debt to imagination". Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Why settle with the known models and patterns (but not underlying laws) of Our Universe , if we might understand them better if we could puzzle out them from outside its limits?"
    (The common sense)
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  13. #12  
    Forum Professor pyoko's Avatar
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    If you want "popular science nifty facts" type science results, go to something like this (not LHC, by the way):

    Atom Smasher Sets Guinness Record for Hottest Man-Made Temperature | RHIC | LiveScience

    If you want science, then stop waiting for the news of a miracle particle that you don't even understand the premise of and read into the very tedious details.
    It is by will alone I set my mind in motion.
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    Really I donīt understand why it is so important and "popular" to demostrate the existence of the Boson de Higgs...
    What you have to remember is that a lot of people are absolutely fascinated hearing about or seeing things they'll never get to do or see or understand in their own lives.

    Remote jungles or icy wastes, cute animals (or ugly, powerful, venomous, tiny, clever, strange, huge, friendly, ferocious or hard-working animals), same thing for plants, astronomy, space flight, physics, psychology, medicine - both the oddities and the research, microscopic particles or bacteria. All these things and hundreds more. People never lose the capacity for wonder and awe when looking at the natural world.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
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  15. #14  
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyoko View Post
    If you want "popular science nifty facts" type science results, go to something like this (not LHC, by the way):

    Atom Smasher Sets Guinness Record for Hottest Man-Made Temperature | RHIC | LiveScience

    If you want science, then stop waiting for the news of a miracle particle that you don't even understand the premise of and read into the very tedious details.
    Yhanks for this WEB so interesting.

    I will propos there my theory abour the "Universe is like a 3D Rainbow". and possibly I will have more success that in the present FORUM.
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
    "Science does not know its debt to imagination". Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Why settle with the known models and patterns (but not underlying laws) of Our Universe , if we might understand them better if we could puzzle out them from outside its limits?"
    (The common sense)
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  16. #15  
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adelady View Post
    Really I donīt understand why it is so important and "popular" to demostrate the existence of the Boson de Higgs...
    What you have to remember is that a lot of people are absolutely fascinated hearing about or seeing things they'll never get to do or see or understand in their own lives.

    Remote jungles or icy wastes, cute animals (or ugly, powerful, venomous, tiny, clever, strange, huge, friendly, ferocious or hard-working animals), same thing for plants, astronomy, space flight, physics, psychology, medicine - both the oddities and the research, microscopic particles or bacteria. All these things and hundreds more. People never lose the capacity for wonder and awe when looking at the natural world.
    OK...OK...All you say is very nice, but I see that you do not know why it's so interesting to show (see) the Higgs Boson.
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
    "Science does not know its debt to imagination". Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Why settle with the known models and patterns (but not underlying laws) of Our Universe , if we might understand them better if we could puzzle out them from outside its limits?"
    (The common sense)
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  17. #16  
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    it's so interesting to show (see) the Higgs Boson.
    Wrong. I'm not in the least interested. Hand me a science magazine and I'll hand it right back if all the main articles are on particle physics or cosmology or half a dozen other topics that bore me rigid.

    I confess to being interested in the LHC as an engineering exercise. Now that's fascinating.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
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  18. #17  
    Universe Supervisor dapifo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adelady View Post
    it's so interesting to show (see) the Higgs Boson.
    Wrong. I'm not in the least interested. Hand me a science magazine and I'll hand it right back if all the main articles are on particle physics or cosmology or half a dozen other topics that bore me rigid.

    I confess to being interested in the LHC as an engineering exercise. Now that's fascinating.
    What do you mean with "I confess to being interested in the LHC as an engineering exercise"?
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking". George S. Patton
    "Science does not know its debt to imagination". Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Why settle with the known models and patterns (but not underlying laws) of Our Universe , if we might understand them better if we could puzzle out them from outside its limits?"
    (The common sense)
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  19. #18  
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    I happily read articles on the various technical problems with building and operating the LHC. I find articles like this much more interesting than stuff about the particles themselves. LHC boosts energy to snag Higgs

    This is not the best example of the sort of thing I mean but it'll do for now.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
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  20. #19  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dapifo View Post
    What do you mean with "I confess to being interested in the LHC as an engineering exercise"?
    Look at this: Short Sharp Science: Live blog: Higgs hunt results from CERN

    Is that not an awesome piece of engineering?
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  21. #20  
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    This is more along the lines I was thinking of. The Large Hadron Collider Is Cool - YouTube

    or this Catalyst: Smashing Atoms In CERN - ABC TV Science

    I suppose I've become pretty fed up with kids being taught at high school that science is all about having an idea and 'developing' it. When students bring their dreadful textbooks and woolly-headed assignments to me for a tuition session I really have to bite my tongue.

    I like to see stuff about science that emphasises that it's really about attention to detail, accurate record-keeping, maths, cooperative teamwork - and engineering. Real scientists, unlike the fantasies taught by teachers who aren't science graduates, spend a great deal of their time designing, building and testing the equipment required to do the observations and recordings they need.

    Science is engineering a lot of the time.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
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  22. #21  
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    Quote Originally Posted by adelady View Post
    Science is engineering a lot of the time.
    Not in geology. We have all the work done in advance by God. We just study the result. It's much simpler that way.
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  23. #22  
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    Not in geology.
    Well, not a lot. Even some of the 'observational' sciences like geology have areas where scientists need to design equipment though. Geology solved a lot of those drilling and coring things a good while ago. But some of the remote sensing, ground penetrating, satellite and radar equipment had to be specifically designed or at least re-jigged to be useful for geology.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
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  24. #23  
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    No, no. That geophysics. Those people are weird. Some of them don't even get piles.
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  25. #24  
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    OK, OK. Geology is just boots, picks and hammers.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
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