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Thread: Forces throughout universe?

  1. #1 Forces throughout universe? 
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    on earth's gravity discussion people said earth's gravity gets weaker and weaker but affects the whole universe

    that means one electron can affect another electron on the opposite side of the universe right? it would be insignificant but it still exists

    if these 2 electrons were alone in the universe they should eventually touch because of gravity's attraction right?

    does the same go for the other 3 forces?


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    Quote Originally Posted by brody View Post
    on earth's gravity discussion people said earth's gravity gets weaker and weaker but affects the whole universe

    that means one electron can affect another electron on the opposite side of the universe right? it would be insignificant but it still exists

    if these 2 electrons were alone in the universe they should eventually touch because of gravity's attraction right?

    does the same go for the other 3 forces?
    Actually they would repel each other since electromagnetism is many orders of magnitude stronger than gravity.


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    gravitational, electric, and magnetic forces are long range

    the strong force is short range.
    Last edited by granpa; November 22nd, 2011 at 09:42 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeteorWayne View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by brody View Post
    on earth's gravity discussion people said earth's gravity gets weaker and weaker but affects the whole universe

    that means one electron can affect another electron on the opposite side of the universe right? it would be insignificant but it still exists

    if these 2 electrons were alone in the universe they should eventually touch because of gravity's attraction right?

    does the same go for the other 3 forces?
    Actually they would repel each other since electromagnetism is many orders of magnitude stronger than gravity.
    of course thank you. change that to a proton and an electron
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    i don't get this. if a singularity has infinite mass therefore it has infinite gravity then if one exists the entire universe has infinite gravity?
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    black holes dont have infinite mass
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    Quote Originally Posted by brody View Post
    i don't get this. if a singularity has infinite mass therefore it has infinite gravity then if one exists the entire universe has infinite gravity?
    A singularity has infinite density, not infinite mass.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wilson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by brody View Post
    i don't get this. if a singularity has infinite mass therefore it has infinite gravity then if one exists the entire universe has infinite gravity?
    A singularity has infinite density, not infinite mass.
    ok that makes more sense. not sure how something could physically have infinite density but okay
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    bear in mind that black holes are defined by their event horizons and not by their singularities.
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    The idea that black holes have infinite density results from using general relativity without taking into account quantum theory. Inside a black hole it is necessary to use both theories together. Unfortunately they can't be made to work together, so no one knows what is really going on inside a black hole.
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    ^^what he said^^
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    In this case, having a mathman doesn't help, since the math explodes
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    Actually what if black holes doesn't have gravity at all ?
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    They do. Massive ones have lots of it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by brody View Post
    i don't get this. if a singularity has infinite mass therefore it has infinite gravity then if one exists the entire universe has infinite gravity?
    I have just finished reading a fantastic book called " Black Holes A Traveller`s Guide " written by Clifford A Pickover. The book was published in 1996, but as far as I can tell, the information is still very much up to date. Everything is explained in laymen`s terms and a further reading list, is given at the end of the book. There is a piece about the author on Wikipedia.

    Clifford A. Pickover - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Last edited by Dave Wilson; November 25th, 2011 at 01:22 PM. Reason: Used wrong quote.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wilson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by brody View Post
    i don't get this. if a singularity has infinite mass therefore it has infinite gravity then if one exists the entire universe has infinite gravity?
    A singularity has infinite density, not infinite mass.
    I have just finished reading a fantastic book called " Black Holes A Traveller`s Guide " written by Clifford A Pickover. The book was published in 1996, but as far as I can tell, the information is still very much up to date. Everything is explained in laymen`s terms and a further reading list, is given at the end of the book. There is a piece about the author on Wikipedia.

    Clifford A. Pickover - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeteorWayne View Post
    They do. Massive ones have lots of it.
    What is with massiveness and gravity not all black holes are massive they are denser and why is that only massive objects should have gravity and in fact black holes are not an object at all it is hole in the space fabric right and its empty there's nothing so there isn't any way in which gravity is produced or it doesn't have gravitons which is said to be the carrier of gravity. Then how come we say that black holes have gravity .
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    you are right that one electron can affect another electron on the opposite side of the universe(insigificantly) only if universe exist..but if you think about only two electrons in the universe then your question is philosophical because we know that from current theoies that mass(energy) tells space how to curve or the curvature of the universe is created by mass and the insigificant mass of electron can't create universe.i believe in science so i feel we can never imagine the condition you created if you want to imagine such condition then you should be inside universe, so then what about you isolation of two electrons in the universe??? sorry if i misunderstood your question..
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    And also one thing if two electrons only exists in universe then the size of universe must be extremely small and to predect what would happen in such case you need to have unified theory,which we dont have righ't now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rohith View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MeteorWayne View Post
    They do. Massive ones have lots of it.
    What is with massiveness and gravity not all black holes are massive they are denser and why is that only massive objects should have gravity and in fact black holes are not an object at all it is hole in the space fabric right and its empty there's nothing so there isn't any way in which gravity is produced or it doesn't have gravitons which is said to be the carrier of gravity. Then how come we say that black holes have gravity .
    Every black hole has a finite, well defined mass, and therefore exhibits a finite, well defined gravitational force, just like any other material object. They are not just "holes" in space, even if they are called "black holes".
    The reason why only objects with mass have gravity is that mass ( or, more precisely, energy ) is the source of the gravitational field. No mass/energy = no gravitational field
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    Black holes, suspicious of some type of robbery of light, could in fact be exclusion zones of reflection of the very thing we use to measure their exi8stence........light, that can't go any further becuase it's dealing with pockets of space that have no end. Superhighways of space, right? Just like the reality we live in, only more......"specific"....
    Last edited by theQuestIsNotOver; December 4th, 2011 at 06:45 AM.
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    They could be, but they're not.
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    Yeah. We both know that. It's a road trip no one has been on.

    Are you a believer in pure theory..........?
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    Quote Originally Posted by saurab dulal View Post
    And also one thing if two electrons only exists in universe then the size of universe must be extremely small and to predect what would happen in such case you need to have unified theory,which we dont have righ't now.
    Who says anyone would need a unified theory? In the first place, there wouldn't be anyone around to think about it. In the second place such a simple universe ought to be duck soup: the two electrons would simply be departing from each other. We would have almost a single-dimension universe that would suffice for everything it contained. I have only one question: since there would be nothing else in existence to get in the way, wouldn't the electrons remain forever departing at their original maximum velocity due to inertia even though the ever-dwindling repulsion had grown into infinitesimality? How puzzling it would be for us if we could be there to somehow detect just one of them, and how could we ever determine that it was moving, or if it was, could we ever divine why? There would be no reference point in sight from which to gauge its travel or velocity. What a shame that there would be no one to ponder. It would be a world without wars, hunger, stupidity, evil, or democrats.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense." --Buddha (563BC-483BC)
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