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Thread: Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe.............

  1. #1 Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe............. 
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    Physicists begin their experiments with the Hadron Collider this Wednesday ( 10/09/08 ) in Geneva....

    Here's a thoroughly interesting BBC documentary about it you can watch for free online

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00dccnr/

    lots of love Absum!

    What do you think will happen? Do you think we could all be sucked into a big hole???? Be nice wouldn't it


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    Great news isn't it ! Finally we'll be able to resolve some of the deepest questions about the Universe. Won't it be so thrilling to find a Higg's particle for the first time ! Or find a graviton ! Or even other exotic particles emerging from higher dimensions !!!


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    Yeah i think it's definitely exciting to see what they find.

    I think all this talk and scaremongering about a black hole is overreacting. Humans love drama and fear!

    Just been listening to Radio 2, apparently now it's beginning tomorrow not Wed!

    What's beginning?

    The end of the world or the beginning.
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    I think it is impossible to make black hole in the earth condition. We have so little energy for this operation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcerer
    I think it is impossible to make black hole in the earth condition. We have so little energy for this operation.
    Well this is what i said to a friend who was clued up in physics and he said that there was lots of energy packed up in just one atom that when released could be quite powerful, in just one little atom.....atom bomb for example?

    Now how many atoms are there on earth?

    Is this correct?

    And look what's happened before when they tried smashing atoms together, all sort of weird results. They have never crashed atoms together at such speed or frequency before (i don't think) so who knows what might happen.

    Still if they do make a black hole and things go 'awry' then all we will know about it is a high pitched shriek coming over the horizon and then all of a sudden we'll all become Mr & Mrs Stretch and kaboom................
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  7. #6 Re: Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe......... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absum!

    Physicists begin their experiments with the Hadron Collider this Wednesday ( 10/09/08 ) in Geneva....
    There it is!! The proof that the end is nigh.......can't you foolish people see it there?? For those with eyes to see it is blatantly obvious!! This is a COUNTDOWN to THE END 10/09/08....... and it will continue only because some evil scientists were so greedy for fame and money that they played with fire and sent the world to DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!


    ARRRGH!!!! REPENT!!!!!!


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    The most exciting thing would be to find out that we're wrong in our current model
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absum!

    And look what's happened before when they tried smashing atoms together, all sort of weird results. They have never crashed atoms together at such speed or frequency before (i don't think) so who knows what might happen.
    I suppose there are more powerful particle collisions in the sun's interior. None black hole appears there .
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    Quote Originally Posted by vanderwallis
    Great news isn't it ! Finally we'll be able to resolve some of the deepest questions about the Universe. Won't it be so thrilling to find a Higg's particle for the first time ! Or find a graviton ! Or even other exotic particles emerging from higher dimensions !!!
    I believe the construction of the LHC is a triumph because these machines will help to answer some of the most important questions in science.
    As far as the Higg's is concerned I think I am right in saying if the particle is not found, by the LHC, this does not mean it does not exist, but only that it may not exist or the LHC is not powerful enough to find it.
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  11. #10 Re: Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe......... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absum!
    Physicists begin their experiments with the Hadron Collider this Wednesday ( 10/09/08 ) in Geneva....

    Here's a thoroughly interesting BBC documentary about it you can watch for free online

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00dccnr/

    lots of love Absum!

    What do you think will happen? Do you think we could all be sucked into a big hole???? Be nice wouldn't it
    Wow, that is an awesome documentary film! Totally fascinating and riveting. I just watched the whole of it on high quality. Thanks for the video link!

    Not sure what sort of big hole you're referring to. They did mention something like that briefly in the film but just waved it aside as something most unlikely to happen.

    So with fingers crossed we should very shortly discover whether the Higgs boson exists or not. Either way (as the documentary says) will be advancement of our knowledge of the universe. If it exists, it will prove the standard model right; if not, it just means that we have to think harder and come up with something better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Halliday
    As far as the Higg's is concerned I think I am right in saying if the particle is not found, by the LHC, this does not mean it does not exist, but only that it may not exist or the LHC is not powerful enough to find it.
    The theory should have predicted the energies at which the Higgs can come into existence (if only for a fleeting moment). The LHC will produce those energies. Therefore if the Higgs boson can't be found at those energies, it will mean it doesn't exist.
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    "are available to play in the UK only"? wow, I did not know they were so nationalistic. Reminds me of the rednecks here that make songs like 'only here in America'.
    Of all the wonders in the universe, none is likely more fascinating and complicated than human nature.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence"

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  13. #12 Re: Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe......... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halliday
    As far as the Higg's is concerned I think I am right in saying if the particle is not found, by the LHC, this does not mean it does not exist, but only that it may not exist or the LHC is not powerful enough to find it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sol Hatebad
    The theory should have predicted the energies at which the Higgs can come into existence (if only for a fleeting moment). The LHC will produce those energies. Therefore if the Higgs boson can't be found at those energies, it will mean it doesn't exist.
    I am going to have to take your word for it!
    Is it not possible the theory that predicts the existence of the Higg's boson may be correct, generally, but flawed where it predicts the energies at which the Higg's will appear?
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  14. #13  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcerer
    Quote Originally Posted by Absum!

    And look what's happened before when they tried smashing atoms together, all sort of weird results. They have never crashed atoms together at such speed or frequency before (i don't think) so who knows what might happen.
    I suppose there are more powerful particle collisions in the sun's interior. None black hole appears there .
    Perhaps there is some other stronger force in the suns interior that cancels that possibility out?

    Cold Fusion - do you mean to say you can't play the documentary because you're in the U.S? No that's not fair i shall send an e mail and complain (mean capitalist bastards!) there is a web site which you can link up to another site which hides your I.P address as well as the country you are in, would that be useful? If so i will find a link to it
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    Try anonymizer(.com) ain't sure which country's proxy it'll give ya.
    If it doesn't work try some other proxy server; or jsut watch it on youtube or something.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zitterbewegung
    There it is!! The proof that the end is nigh.......can't you foolish people see it there?? For those with eyes to see it is blatantly obvious!! This is a COUNTDOWN to THE END 10/09/08....... and it will continue only because some evil scientists were so greedy for fame and money that they played with fire and sent the world to DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!


    ARRRGH!!!! REPENT!!!!!!


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  16. #15 Re: Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe......... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sol Hatebad
    The theory should have predicted the energies at which the Higgs can come into existence (if only for a fleeting moment). The LHC will produce those energies. Therefore if the Higgs boson can't be found at those energies, it will mean it doesn't exist.
    Haven’t they been trying (unsuccessfully) to look for the Higgs boson at Fermilab already? They wouldn’t be looking for it if they didn’t know that there was a chance of finding it. If what you say is correct – namely that the theory has predicted the threshold energy level for the Higgs particle – then Fermilab must already be capable of producing the required threahold energy (otherwise they wouldn’t be wasting their time trying to find the particle at Fermilab). Yet, despite the fact that they haven’t found the Higgs at Fermilab, scientists still think they can find it at the LHC with its higher energy levels – so the absence of the Higgs at Fermilab is not proof of that the particle does not exist. Hence, by estension, if they don’t find the Higgs boson later this week at LHC, it still won’t mean that the Higgs doesn’t exist. It would probably just mean, as Halliday pointed out, that you need even more energies to find it.
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  17. #16 Re: Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe......... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaneBennet
    Quote Originally Posted by Sol Hatebad
    The theory should have predicted the energies at which the Higgs can come into existence (if only for a fleeting moment). The LHC will produce those energies. Therefore if the Higgs boson can't be found at those energies, it will mean it doesn't exist.
    Haven’t they been trying (unsuccessfully) to look for the Higgs boson at Fermilab already? They wouldn’t be looking for it if they didn’t know that there was a chance of finding it. If what you say is correct – namely that the theory has predicted the threshold energy level for the Higgs particle – then Fermilab must already be capable of producing the required threahold energy (otherwise they wouldn’t be wasting their time trying to find the particle at Fermilab). Yet, despite the fact that they haven’t found the Higgs at Fermilab, scientists still think they can find it at the LHC with its higher energy levels – so the absence of the Higgs at Fermilab is not proof of that the particle does not exist. Hence, by estension, if they don’t find the Higgs boson later this week at LHC, it still won’t mean that the Higgs doesn’t exist. It would probably just mean, as Halliday pointed out, that you need even more energies to find it.
    Exactly :wink:
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    I suspect the initial results will be a readout of "42"...
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    so,this experiment is safe or not ??

    really,i`m a little bit scared....and i think this f***** experiment it`s a really big stuppid.
    none is not like God....!!!
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    wtf does this have to do with god?!
    If we all had the same mindset of yours I doubt that we even been able
    to move further than the stone age! :x
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  21. #20 Re: Hadron Collider & the birth of the universe......... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaneBennet
    if they don’t find the Higgs boson later this week at LHC, it still won’t mean that the Higgs doesn’t exist. It would probably just mean, as Halliday pointed out, that you need even more energies to find it.
    I don't think it will take a week to find it, much longer apparently.

    They say it takes the collider a month to cool down to the right temperatures to begin with the experiments and they don't expect to publicize the results for another four years (If we're all still here by then of course)
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    it`s stupid....why mass-media do public this informations,when they know the population global is so seized with fear ....?!?!?!


    Lpear Hanuka,i`m not crazy,but i just not understand....and i`m not stupid or silly....if you think that i`m very sorry for you.
    it`s my opinion about this experiment and you have to respect this !!
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    It's disappointing, im unable to watch the live webcast due to the mass viewers, so when is the next beam injection?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miss17
    it`s stupid....why mass-media do public this informations,when they know the population global is so seized with fear ....?!?!?!


    Lpear Hanuka,i`m not crazy,but i just not understand....and i`m not stupid or silly....if you think that i`m very sorry for you.
    it`s my opinion about this experiment and you have to respect this !!
    Please stop worrying.

    What is the point of worrying? It is wasted effort.

    Stop listening to scare-mongers in the media.

    For some weird reason us humans love hype, melodrama, and fear-mongering!

    Look at all the HOOHARR with the Millennium 'bug'! Was it as chaotic as people expected?

    Look at all the widespread panic with the Trinity test of the first atomic bomb in 1945 which people feared might ignite the atmosphere! Did it?

    People have been predicting doomsday and the end of the world since dot, and some silly buggers who thought the world might end tomorrow have even killed themselves the day beforehand en-masse!

    I can now envisage that there will be more widespread panic in four years time on December 20th with the Mayan calendar malarchy!
    And everyone will wake up on Dec 22nd and wonder what on earth was all the fuss about!

    Humans and the irrational. I hate the media because they are the worst fear-mongers and they have a lot to answer for.

    Is life really that dull that the only way we can stir up excitement in it is to predict the world is going to end tomorrow?

    Really live each day is like your last anyway! Why not? You might suddenly wake up and do something better with it than worry worry worry about tomorrow!

    Do some research. (of a reputable source and preferably more than one)

    I am no physicist, but instead of going in a panic, i go out and find out the truth.

    The truth is that there is a weak possibility that these experiments will destroy the planet.
    I trust the physicists, they are trained in what they are doing.

    Do you think they want to destroy the planet?

    http://news.cnet.com/8301-11386_3-10036245-76.html

    http://blog.wired.com/geekdad/2008/0...rge-hadro.html
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    Absum!,tks for your answer....you have right. :-D

    this is it...if i had to die...i want to die on motocycle another passion]
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  26. #25  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miss17
    Absum!,tks for your answer....you have right. :-D

    this is it...if i had to die...i want to die on motocycle another passion]
    Motorcycle deaths per mile travelled are something like one hundred times greater than airtravel. It is just about the unsafest from of travel in existence apart from riding a pig naked through Mecca. If you are dumb enough to indulge in that risk then there is no way you should be worrying about the LHC.
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  27. #26  
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    So....











    We're still here then.
    "For as long as the world shall endure, the honour and the glory of Mexico-Tenochtitlan must never be forgotten."
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    Do you think they want to destroy the planet?
    ....yes.



    We're still here then
    i don't think they are going to do the real test for a couple of weeks yet.


    i would be all for for this test, if humans were alone on the planet.

    but, i donno.
    even a chance of a chance of eradicating all known life in the universe...

    better be worth it.

    "I'd rather an asteroid, due for collision,
    than know the planet got f##ked by the human condition."
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    Hmmm. I must admit I'm only vaguely aware of the objections - something about turning Earth into a black hole?

    Given the source (in this instance Johnny Vaughn on the crappy radio at work this morning) I'm not going to get myself too het up about it. If Johnny Vaughn has his doubts then sign me up. Then again I made a special effort to eat more beef and eggs during the food scares relating to the same, so I've probably got some sort of James Dean chromosome. Which probably isn't a good thing.

    Fingers crossed for dark matter by the end of the week, especially as it's my birthday soon.

    Edit: Oh... just noticed:
    Quote Originally Posted by Absum!
    I can now envisage that there will be more widespread panic in four years time on December 20th with the Mayan calendar malarchy!
    Probably true, though for what it's worth (a bit as Mesoamerica is kind of my thing) it really is a load of balls for a variety of reasons. Aside from the wealth of 2012 pronouncements deriving from interpretation by idiots like Terrance McKenna, it all depends upon how one chooses to calculate said calendar. Crucially there's about three different dates one can arrive at depending upon how one accounts for whatever system the Maya used to compensate for the true length of a solar year. If I remember correctly the 2012 date comes from a calculation which assumes the Maya had no equivalent of a leap year correction, which is patently untrue (as it is also for the Mexica). Sorry, bit off topic but there you go...
    "For as long as the world shall endure, the honour and the glory of Mexico-Tenochtitlan must never be forgotten."
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    Quote Originally Posted by War Arrow

    Given the source (in this instance Johnny Vaughn on the crappy radio at work this morning) I'm not going to get myself too het up about it. If Johnny Vaughn has his doubts then sign me up. Then again I made a special effort to eat more beef and eggs during the food scares relating to the same, so I've probably got some sort of If I remember correctly the 2012 date comes from a calculation which assumes the Maya had no equivalent of a leap year correction, which is patently untrue (as it is also for the Mexica). Sorry, bit off topic but there you go...
    No not off topic. It's interesting. And it will be amusing to watch and listen to the media and peoples hysteria yet again as the date predicted draws near. (Facts don't seem to matter with human irrationality, they get a date fixed in their mind and then all they need is the media to keep fanning the flames)

    The best advice i like to try to follow, is simply to live each day as if it was your last, then you can't go far wrong, at least you will make the effort and do life the honour of actually living and not just simply existing.

    Gurdjieff suggested that it would be good if all humans knew the exact year, day and hour of their death. Can you imaging how people would live their lives differently if they did not take the gift of life so much for granted?

    Yes we are still here...........surprise surprise

    P.S Ophilolite what a vision to have first thing in the morning!
    Riding a pig naked through Mecca!! I shall put that on my list of 'things to do before i die'!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absum!
    P.S Ophilolite what a vision to have first thing in the morning!
    Riding a pig naked through Mecca!! I shall put that on my list of 'things to do before i die'!
    Probably immediately before you die.
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    i think its important to point out that the media sells news. if they can make something out of nothing, they will, cause the money they make is real.

    i view the media more as a source of entertainment than a source of information. cause thats the way they view themselves. though its hard to blame them, as its the viewers who make this choice.

    oh and war-arrow, isn't the 2012 mayan calender thing only supposed to mean the end of the age of picies and the start of aquarius? all i would assume from this that its a way of breaking up a really long solar cycle into really long months.

    or do people really entertain the horoscope idea that somehow we are controlled by , or a part of, this solar cycle?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Quote Originally Posted by Absum!
    P.S Ophilolite what a vision to have first thing in the morning!
    Riding a pig naked through Mecca!! I shall put that on my list of 'things to do before i die'!
    Probably immediately before you die.
    What a way to die!

    Better than laying on a death bed reciting the Koran........
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrighthand

    or do people really entertain the horoscope idea that somehow we are controlled by , or a part of, this solar cycle?
    it is quite possible that people do.

    And It is quite possible that people are.
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrighthand
    oh and war-arrow, isn't the 2012 mayan calender thing only supposed to mean the end of the age of picies and the start of aquarius? all i would assume from this that its a way of breaking up a really long solar cycle into really long months.

    or do people really entertain the horoscope idea that somehow we are controlled by , or a part of, this solar cycle?
    Not really but yes, sort of. They measured (well, in so much as they did the maths) and had names for improbably long periods of time, and the one coming up in [2012 or possibly 2017 or maybe the other date I can't remember] is just the end of a particularly big 'un. There's also Mayan legends about there being a limited number of ages to the world (four or five depending upon where you look) though I think the rest has been down to people with too much time on their hands (and for whom Mayan culture is not sufficiently exciting in itself, hence the need to sex it up a bit) adding myth 1 to myth 2 to get myth 5, if you see what I mean.

    As for the horoscope thing - without a time machine I wouldn't like to say (at least not beyond each bit of the calendar being associated with one presiding Deity or another). Personally I think their idea of fate was slightly different to the one attached to horoscopes etc, more akin to celestial serving suggestions than destiny set in stone etc.

    Anyway, day two and we're still here! :-D

    I'm guessing the panic was due to particles with mass being sped up to near light speed, increased mass: instant black hole. Is that kind of it?
    "For as long as the world shall endure, the honour and the glory of Mexico-Tenochtitlan must never be forgotten."
    - Chimalpahin Quautlehuanitzin
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