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View Poll Results: How similar is lucid dreaming and waking life?

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  • Exactly the same

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  • Quite similar

    2 33.33%
  • More different than similar

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Thread: Comparison of Lucid Dreaming and Reality

  1. #1 Comparison of Lucid Dreaming and Reality 
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    Hello, I'm new to this board, but philosophy is something I mull over constantly.

    I wanted to propose an interesting discussion: Is it possible that lucid dreaming is exactly the same as waking life but occurring in a different state of energy? I believe it is. In both states, you are aware of yourself and look outward towards people, events, and locations that are affected by your thoughts, beliefs, and attitudes.

    I learned more about reality through actually lucid dreaming than any attempt made in waking life.

    What do you think?

    For more information, check out the site in my sig - is it recruiting people to help contribute to and disseminate information such as this, a noble cause.


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  3. #2 Re: Comparison of Lucid Dreaming and Reality 
    Forum Masters Degree geezer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbarone
    Hello, I'm new to this board, but philosophy is something I mull over constantly.

    I wanted to propose an interesting discussion: Is it possible that lucid dreaming is exactly the same as waking life but occurring in a different state of energy? I believe it is. In both states, you are aware of yourself and look outward towards people, events, and locations that are affected by your thoughts, beliefs, and attitudes.

    I learned more about reality through actually lucid dreaming than any attempt made in waking life.

    What do you think?

    For more information, check out the site in my sig - is it recruiting people to help contribute to and disseminate information such as this, a noble cause.
    advertisement in the guise of debate:

    do you really want a discussion?


    if so here go'es

    why wouldn't your dreams be similar to reality, after all it's all you know.
    you are not going to dream about things, you absolutely never experienced, are you.
    our imaginations create scenarios from all of our experiences.
    lucid dreaming is just a little more intence, it just seems to effect the senses more, or at least we think it does.

    and this statement here "I learned more about reality through actually lucid dreaming than any attempt made in waking life." utter rubbish, if you didn't have the experience in waking life, it wouldn't be able to effect your dreams.
    and as for the poll it dont work, because a dream be it lucid or not, can be Exactly the same as reality, or Quite similar to reality or even More different than similar, it all depends on what you imagination conjours up for the night.


    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense - Buddha"
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  4. #3  
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    I see lucid dreaming as very convincing simulation, the mind (~brain) tries to the best of it's ability to create a situation which isn't real and often it does a great job. I had a couple lucid dreams in which I could fly, and the experience was really very convincing (felt a bit like zero gravity, or how I imagine zero-g would be like). But it's by definition unreal.

    Here's a comparison: first you listen to a conversation between real persons, while recording it on a tape. Later you listen to the same conversation from that tape. The second experience can be nearly the same as the first, but ofcourse there's no real conversation going on. In the same way the mind minutely records all kinds of experiences during waking life, and recreates them ("replayes the tape") while you're dreaming. The fascinating thing is that the mind can actually alter, combine and enhance the experiences it recorded earlier, often in remarkable ways. During sleep it seems the mind is able or free to do things it can't do during waking life.
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  5. #4  
    墨子 DaBOB's Avatar
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    What is lucid dreaming
    Do not try and bend the spoon. That's impossible. Instead... only realize the truth. There is no spoon. Then you'll see that it is not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself. -Spoon Boy
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  6. #5  
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaBOB
    What is lucid dreaming
    have you ever had a dream where it seemed so real, so vivid that you had to pinch yourself in the dream, you ever had a dream where you could feel the touch of another, or could smell things just like you do everyday, that is lucid dreaming, there is a sexual version that a lot of men have had.
    some people say that can make themselves lucid dream, but that is unproven, so remains in the world of the supernatural.
    lucid dreams just like ordinary dreams,(ordinary being the ones were people are faceless, its a bit haphazard if you get my drift), just happen from time to time.
    there is nothing strange about it or anything special.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense - Buddha"
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  7. #6  
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    Isn't lucid dreaming then a type of dream where you are not so deeply unconscious and the conscious mind plays a minor part in filling in the details - just a hunch, probably a lodab'locks...
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  8. #7  
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    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    some people say that can make themselves lucid dream, but that is unproven, so remains in the world of the supernatural.
    People actually can make themselves lucid dream, and it has been scientifically proven. People have communicated to the waking world while asleep to prove that it was real (using eye movements, since while dreaming your eyes still move as normal)
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  9. #8  
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    A yes, I know what you are talking about.

    I would say they no these dreams are not the same as reality. Maybe it's the same in a metaphorical sense but it is not really the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    you are not going to dream about things, you absolutely never experienced, are you.
    What about deja vu. I have had a dream of somewhere I hav enever been. I didn't think anything of it and if I had I could probably come to the conclusion that it is a construction of past experiance. The wierd thing is I went to that place a day or two later. I can't be the only person who has experianced this. Wouldn't that be creating a dream from something you didn't experiance in the past. Or maybe that's another topic.
    Do not try and bend the spoon. That's impossible. Instead... only realize the truth. There is no spoon. Then you'll see that it is not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself. -Spoon Boy
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  10. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Development
    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    some people say that can make themselves lucid dream, but that is unproven, so remains in the world of the supernatural.
    People actually can make themselves lucid dream, and it has been scientifically proven. People have communicated to the waking world while asleep to prove that it was real (using eye movements, since while dreaming your eyes still move as normal)
    can you post up a link or two then, and the name/s if possible of the scientist/s that have proven it thank you.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense - Buddha"
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  11. #10  
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    If you wanna get really deep, they are in fact exactly the same just as everything you think of and that you think actually takes place is only a memory. Think of a funny pink dinosaur, it is just as real as anything you will see/hear/grab etc.. Everything truly only exists, to us, in memory, the essence of time.

    However, as far as a simple comparison, the frontal parts(most advanced parts) of the brain shutoff and do not function during dreaming(rem). I'm no expert with this sort of stuff, but I would assume the frontal parts of the brain may actually function during lucid dreaming. The weird thing about dreaming is that your are just as, if not more, active than you are when you are awake.

    The Discovery channel has a really good documentary on dreaming out called "The Secrets of Sleep" ( I can supply a torrent link to this, just pm me).
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  12. #11  
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaBOB
    A yes, I know what you are talking about.

    I would say they no these dreams are not the same as reality. Maybe it's the same in a metaphorical sense but it is not really the same.
    agreed, but to the sleeper lucid dreams appear real.
    Quote Originally Posted by DaBOB
    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    you are not going to dream about things, you absolutely never experienced, are you.
    What about deja vu. I have had a dream of somewhere I have never been. I didn't think anything of it and if I had I could probably come to the conclusion that it is a construction of past experiance.
    yes you probably saw a picture or read about it, some decriptions, can cause a very vivid image, thus making a place seem familiar
    Quote Originally Posted by DaBOB
    The wierd thing is I went to that place a day or two later. I can't be the only person who has experianced this.
    coincidences happen a lot, nothing supernatural about it.
    Quote Originally Posted by DaBOB
    Wouldn't that be creating a dream from something you didn't experiance in the past.
    no because you must have experienced it in some way, there is always a frame of reference, you could have seen it on tv in a film there is a myriad of possible scenarios you could have acquired the information, there really is no need to put a supernatural vent on it.
    Quote Originally Posted by DaBOB
    Or maybe that's another topic.
    as I said you must of got the info from somewhere, nothing supernatural about it.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense - Buddha"
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  13. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megabrain
    Isn't lucid dreaming then a type of dream where you are not so deeply unconscious and the conscious mind plays a minor part in filling in the details - just a hunch, probably a lodab'locks...
    I would say that lucid dreaming would more likely occur when your coming out of deep sleep, the transition, between sleep and waking, it does seem more real.
    yes so sounds logical to me.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense - Buddha"
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  14. #13  
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    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    Quote Originally Posted by Development
    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    some people say that can make themselves lucid dream, but that is unproven, so remains in the world of the supernatural.
    People actually can make themselves lucid dream, and it has been scientifically proven. People have communicated to the waking world while asleep to prove that it was real (using eye movements, since while dreaming your eyes still move as normal)
    can you post up a link or two then, and the name/s if possible of the scientist/s that have proven it thank you.
    Read the first Scientific History section of wiki's lucid dreaming page

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucid_dreaming

    Lucid dreaming can happen any time you're asleep, but it's mostly likely to occur in one of your REM cycles (when you are in a deep sleep).
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  15. #14  
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    The place I dreamed of was just a feild on a country road so I'm sure I never saw it anywhere before. Then again that is a pretty simple dream so I suppose it could have just felt like deja vu but not have been exactly the same.

    I think you may be right on the lucid dreaming being close to waking. I find that if I lay down for and hour during the day I am much more likely to have these dreams. I have music playing and the lights on and don't seem to be fully asleep and the dreams seem so real. The wierd one is when you wake up part way through but only so briefly that when you fall asleep again you continue the dream. Or maybe waking up was part of the dream... or maybe I never woke up... :?
    Do not try and bend the spoon. That's impossible. Instead... only realize the truth. There is no spoon. Then you'll see that it is not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself. -Spoon Boy
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  16. #15  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Development
    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    Quote Originally Posted by Development
    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    some people say that can make themselves lucid dream, but that is unproven, so remains in the world of the supernatural.
    People actually can make themselves lucid dream, and it has been scientifically proven. People have communicated to the waking world while asleep to prove that it was real (using eye movements, since while dreaming your eyes still move as normal)
    can you post up a link or two then, and the name/s if possible of the scientist/s that have proven it thank you.
    Read the first Scientific History section of wiki's lucid dreaming page

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucid_dreaming

    Lucid dreaming can happen any time you're asleep, but it's mostly likely to occur in one of your REM cycles (when you are in a deep sleep).
    I have not denied lucid dreaming actually happens, but whether people can make themselves lucid dream, and that hasn't. all that scientist Stephen LaBerge proved was that he was aware that he was dreaming.
    not that he was in control or that he made himself dream.
    so back to the drawing board.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense - Buddha"
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  17. #16  
    墨子 DaBOB's Avatar
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    I have controled myself in a dream, many times. Not sure they were "lucid" dreams though. I'll have to pay more attention next time.
    Do not try and bend the spoon. That's impossible. Instead... only realize the truth. There is no spoon. Then you'll see that it is not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself. -Spoon Boy
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  18. #17 Re: Comparison of Lucid Dreaming and Reality 
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    I've joined this a bit late.

    Quote Originally Posted by geezer
    you are not going to dream about things, you absolutely never experienced, are you...utter rubbish, if you didn't have the experience in waking life, it wouldn't be able to effect your dreams.
    Unless it's a precognitive dream. It does happen you know. I had one. Only one, but very clear and, as it turned out 18mths later, very accurate.

    Sure, since you've said what you have, you'll probably stick to your guns and say that's also utter rubbish.

    The mind is still virtually unknown to science. Question: What's consciousness? Answer: Nobody knows.
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