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Thread: the human soul? best concise description I guess

  1. #1 the human soul? best concise description I guess 
    Forum Sophomore somfooleishfool's Avatar
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    So I'm quite a logic based person, I don't place much in faith without citation or proof etc. In my mind, I don't have much trouble comprehending the odditys of the universe, most things can be explained with physics or chemistry or biology albeit sometimes a bit vaguely. But one thing that doesn't sit well with me and doesnt seem to fit in anywhere following my beliefs, is perhaps what you might call the human soul.

    When I say the human soul, I am defining this as what makes me, me, and why I am in control of my body and not yours. I am only concious of my life, and my life is the only life in the world out of the billions, that I witnessed first hand.

    Now that this is explained, I have a few issues with it. Firstly why is my "soul" (see above paragraph) in my body, there are billions of people in the world today and in the past there has been billions of people also who are since deceased. Any one of these bodys be it in the past present or even future, have no more significance than my body. So why did MY "soul" choose to inhabbit MY/this body. I just dont get it, and stemming from this I would have to ask, if my parents didnt meet or even if they had decided not to have sex the day that I was concieved (meaning the sperm that created me would never have made it to the egg that is me), then would the entirety of the universe and all time/space have gone by without me have ever being concious and ever having any awareness of any existance of anything? like, it would be as if the universe never existed at all.

    my other issue is this. what IS your "soul" anyway? is it made of matter? energy? you could recreate an entire person who would be identical in every way if you copy and pasted (lol) every one of there atoms to the space next to them, that person would be identical in every concievable way. but I would assume they wouldnt share your "soul", you wouldn't have control over there body, would they have a "soul"? so i guess the reason for most of this paragraph is for this statement, could you copy and paste your soul into the space next to you (not in the sence of making another person who is you, not your body, just your "soul" moreover projecting the question of whether the soul is made of something.

    this is possibly the biggest mystery of the universe to me, i understand noone likely has an answer to this but perhaps someone has an idea that might help me put this in context or... i duno just help me make it not SO inconsistant with the testability of the rest of the universe or what have you.

    lastly i apolagise, after a fair bit of writing i got sick of fixing up grammar

    edit: typo. "would" to "wouldn't"


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  3. #2  
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    Probably belongs in Philosphy or Relegion rather than Biology...


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    There's a ghost in the machine.
    The mark of a moderate man is freedom from his own ideas - Tao Te Ching

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    Forum Sophomore somfooleishfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeteorWayne
    Probably belongs in Philosphy or Relegion rather than Biology...
    Thank you, I would now change it if I knew how

    and "thers a ghost in the machine"? I dont see what this has to do with anything, makes no sence to me in context.
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    The OP is reminiscent of Cartesian dualism, of which one the biggest criticism comes from Gilbert Ryle with his 'ghost in the machine'.
    The mark of a moderate man is freedom from his own ideas - Tao Te Ching

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    Forum Cosmic Wizard i_feel_tiredsleepy's Avatar
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    Your notion of the soul is supernatural. Our mind is a product of our biology, not something magical apart from the body. Like Prometheus has pointed out, you're putting forward a concept of mind body dualism, which just isn't scientific.

    The "ghost in the machine" is a bit of a facetious description of mind-body dualism. Think about it, when you see a machine work, do you wonder if there is a ghost controlling the actions? We are but machines, simply by virtue of our construction we are complex self-aware machines.
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  8. #7  
    Forum Sophomore somfooleishfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_feel_tiredsleepy
    Your notion of the soul is supernatural. Our mind is a product of our biology, not something magical apart from the body. Like Prometheus has pointed out, you're putting forward a concept of mind body dualism, which just isn't scientific.

    The "ghost in the machine" is a bit of a facetious description of mind-body dualism. Think about it, when you see a machine work, do you wonder if there is a ghost controlling the actions? We are but machines, simply by virtue of our construction we are complex self-aware machines.
    Ok I guess this makes sence, but to my mind this still leaves; why am I self aware of MY machine and noone elses?
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    Ok I guess this makes sence, but to my mind this still leaves; why am I self aware of MY machine and noone elses?

    Because your 5 senses derive from tissues and organs of YOUR body and no-one else's.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tridimity
    Ok I guess this makes sence, but to my mind this still leaves; why am I self aware of MY machine and noone elses?

    Because your 5 senses derive from tissues and organs of YOUR body and no-one else's.
    It's more than five (touch is several which are quite distinct) but you quite correct. The closest sense and the one which probably creates the illusion of a "soul" is our conscience perceptions of our emotions and thoughts--almost like "we" are apart.
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  11. #10  
    Forum Sophomore somfooleishfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox
    Quote Originally Posted by tridimity
    Ok I guess this makes sence, but to my mind this still leaves; why am I self aware of MY machine and noone elses?

    Because your 5 senses derive from tissues and organs of YOUR body and no-one else's.
    It's more than five (touch is several which are quite distinct) but you quite correct. The closest sense and the one which probably creates the illusion of a "soul" is our conscience perceptions of our emotions and thoughts--almost like "we" are apart.
    I think this would all make %100 sence if I didnt exist and I didnt have a conciousness, because what you have said can explain everyones consiousness but my own. to say a thing is self aware because of its biology is just fine, but I dno... it just doesn't sit well with me that billions of bodys wer made and I was never concious of them, then this 1 was made and suddenly THAT is the one that I control, not to mention the probability of me never existing. Its a CRAZY series of unprobable events that puts my conciousness into existance (my mother meeting my father, my grandparents meeting, my g grandparents meeting etc)
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  12. #11  
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    Now lets see what we have here:

    So if we take it as the human body being just a machine and thus the sum of its parts. Do we have scientific proof that these parts are interchangeable ?

    lets say for the sake of argument that it is possible to exchange one person's amygdala with another ones. Would the person still be the same ?

    you could argue that the amygdala (or any other part of the brain) is affected with the person's memory and that it is this memory that defines a person. Does this mean that if two persons share the same memories they are the same person ?

    again for the sake of argument, lets say two persons both the same age, just awoke from a coma with total amnesia. Now to make it easier lets say they don't remember anything prior to waking up, would these two persons be the same, react the same and have the same personality if these where identical twins ?
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  13. #12  
    Forum Sophomore somfooleishfool's Avatar
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    based on what you guys are saying, could you theoretically swap your "soul" with another persons?

    For example you could just take everything that you percieve as you and put it into the other person. The technology to do this is obviously not even safe for dreaming of yet but I mean just in theory
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  14. #13  
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    Biologically, a significant portion of human behavior is regulated by hormones. There are cell's littered throughout the body, not just in the brain, which excrete hormones.
    I was some of the mud that got to sit up and look around.
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