Thread: Two Men Walk In To A Bar

Two men walk in to a bar and talk about tonight's game.

What occurred ?

A lot more than meets the eye. A lot more.

Consider :

There is an consciousness within one ape communicating with a second consciousness within a second ape.

The content of the communication is explicitly about sport, however at the psychological level unconscious motivations are causing the urge to communicate ... both the sender and recipient of each communication do not know these urges, what is being communicated beneath the content, and what the effect is on the recipient or themselves. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

A single message from a consciousness must be formulated using an faculty called the mind that uses symbols to represent entities in reality. The mind uses symbols to represent entities in reality because it cannot use those entities directly. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

A single message is transmitted first through the biological senses then the outer world mediums before it is gathered by the biological senses of the second ape and passed to the awareness there. There is no directness of the communication and everything outside the consciousness could be mimicked and is therefore uncertain. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

The consciousnesses sit opposite each other observing the other. What do they see ? They see their friend opposite, in the past. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

They transmit symbols to each other. They assume the other sees the same meaning for a symbol, when if fact that might not be the case. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

They look in each other's eyes and smile, they are enjoying the conversation. A complex species based body language is being transmitted and received. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

Each consciousness feels strongly attached to his body. He looks at his hand and thinks this is my hand, this is me ... however his hand has been completely replaced over the last 2 years as the cells have changed. He is 40 years old now, this is his 20th hand. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

Each consciousness feels strongly attached to his body. When there is damage to the skin he takes it to the doctor to get patched up. In actuality the doctor cannot fix the damage : the doctor stitches the skin together so that the consciousness's body itself can seal the skin at the molecular level. The consciousness says thank you to the doc.

As he walks down the road the consciousness is proud of his body and what he has done to it. Throughout his body countless millions of operations (chemical, physical, biological) are occuring without his knowledge. The body beats its heart, and breathes its lungs. The consciousnesses are unaware of this.

Yeah it's really hard talking to an attractive potential mate, with all the above shouting in mind. What an existential relief it is to gain immortality through children.

It's kinda funny, I feel sorry for work gloves. The dead leather cannot heal. So I rather use my living hands, since hands last forever.

I work in construction and notice little decisions workers make, revealing their philosophy. It really saddens me to find a builder closed up a wall over bad job, as if his grandkids won't someday open that wall and know grandpa by the contents. On the other hand, I mostly work on old houses so I'm enjoying good company and paying it forward.

My mother's in a garden club. These ladies tour around "prying into each other's back yards". It's all symbolic, and they know it. Native plantings mean one thing, strawberries another. She's in the hardy perennials group, and specializes in prairie grasses. Her crowd effectively boycotts those nasty topiary people.

I guess there are other golden threads, right in front of me I don't see. But I feel I've connected enough.

"They were regular in being gay, they learned little things that are things in being gay, they learned many little things that are things in being gay, they were gay every day, they were regular, they were gay, they were gay the same length of time every day, they were gay, they were quite regularly gay"
- From Miss Furr and Miss Skeene by Gertrude Stein

These posts give me more of a headache than reading Gertrude Stein.

Okay, concretely then: Can you add more to us than we've given? If you can't account, pleading its intangible, I'd say you're taking us for granted and living irresponsibly.

Though I'd still guess you're a plus.

Originally Posted by Pong

..

How about those Bears !!

So much for my stab at grandiose. So what were you trying to say rideforever?

Originally Posted by Pong

So much for my stab at grandiose. So what were you trying to say rideforever?

What was I trying to say !!!! What were you trying to say ?

! ha ... you seemed to be disapproving of my post in a sarcastic and complicated way ... you could have just said "f*ck you" ... it's faster.

If you have any other contributions, well I am all ears.

No, I'm genuinely curious. 'Though let's confess tiredsleepy does have a point. I won't have any other contributions until I know what we're talking about.

Okay, well what did you think about what I posted ?

It's funny, tiredandsleepy's post. He is saying he does not want to communicate - it's an oxymoron or ironic isn't it. "I don't want to communicate" ... don't you ? sure ?

So, I found it a bit tough writing that post ... it's a difficult thing to describe.

It seems that on very many levels a man does not know what is occurring. And this does not occur to him in general.

We can, if we focus our attention, understand certain things about what is occuring. I have learnt the things I described in that post mainly through science.

But ... still I carry on regardless.

For example, this entire Forum "The Science Forum" indicates a certain high minded ideal. But ... what is really occurring ?

"Well I post of the Science Forum because I am ... ... ... "

- really ? are you sure ? perhaps you should not be so hasty to declare that you know what you are doing.

Can you accept being ignorant? I mean you no different than you are, but oblivious to "what is really occurring"?

Personally I don't mind being a tool. It seems like the natural progression. We emerged from things - wouldn't it be a shame if nothing emerges from us?

Can I accept being ignorant ?

Again I think the situation is not what it seems. We think we are ignorant when we are not. Or, we have the possibility of being not ignorant. It's pretty strange really.

Our minds might have been designed just to assist evolution, but we can use them to see other things. Perhaps we just haven't taken the time to let what we see sink in.

Doesn't everyone have the feeling that something is going on. That there is something just below the surface that he is not quite getting. You catch yourself at times : "why did I just do that ?", "what am I really trying to do here ?"

It seems like everyone is trying to be not ignorant, but they just don't have the tools.

It's like there has been heavy fog for a long time, but it is starting to clear, and you see the ground in patches - the fog is clearing. You see the ground but you aren't quite sure what you see, and then you are back in the fog again so you can forget about it for a while ... but something is nagging at you ... what did you see ?

One may have too many epiphanies. Then too much to consider at once, right? And how many parallel levels can you speak or act on? Anyway one can't improve much by micromanaging what's done unconsciously, unless it's broken. I say let things that work by themselves, work.

Yeah man I dig that. Far too many things to think about ... but what happens if you try without thinking ?

Sounds weird doesn't it ... but I am a scientist so let's go discover.

What about observing the fact that something is happening though you are unaware of it.

I enjoy learning how to learn. What I find is that most of the process of learning is something you are unaware of. Yet, while I'm learning I can be distinctly aware that the learning is taking place. I couldn't tell you where the information is, what it looks like, or how it's stored, recalled, or integrated; yet I am aware that these processes are taking place.

This is the basis of meditation.