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Thread: does calculation have anything to do with our awareness?

  1. #1 does calculation have anything to do with our awareness? 
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    In brief:

    Does our ability to calculate have anything to do with our ability to be aware.........to be conscious...........like if we didn't have arms with fingers, would have we counted to 10?


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  3. #2  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard spuriousmonkey's Avatar
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    If I am not mistake parrots can count to 10. Without fingers.


    "Kill them all and let God sort them out."

    - Arnaud Amalric

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  4. #3  
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    and from what family of trained insect by human with 10 fingers are you?
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    Forum Ph.D. GhostofMaxwell's Avatar
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    My guess is a fruit fly crossed with Ronald MacDonald.
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  6. #5  
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    ...........I'm impressed.

    (time waits for no man...........)
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  7. #6  
    Forum Ph.D. GhostofMaxwell's Avatar
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    Does that mean you want me?
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  8. #7  
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    do you think even the money you would have would be enough (as your friends would think)?

    ....you know..........to at least explain them......
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  9. #8  
    Forum Ph.D. GhostofMaxwell's Avatar
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    You are talking about evaluating your theory? I dont know that my expertise is good enough for that particular request. Besides I have assignments and deadlines approaching.

    Sorry.
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  10. #9 hello, 
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    awareness and consciousness in human is dependent on an area called reticular formation in the brain stem. To be exact, it is located in the central portion of the brain stem. That's why we loose consciousness when that area is damaged or hit by some force. (Sleep centers are also located nearby.)

    Calculations are a function of cerebral cortex. Mainly in the left cerebral cortex.

    So these two things are two different functions all together.

    Numeral system is an entity made my humans to declare counting operations. Counting does not necessarily mean declaring numbers from 1 to 10. It has a broad meaning.
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  11. #10  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard icewendigo's Avatar
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    I realize that cells are not aware themselves to begin with, but in a way its funny that they are not aware of the existence of the person they are part of, if they had a perspective, from their perspective we would not exist nor would most of our world (we are aware of an incoming car on a road but each cell as no clue, not even the brain cells that are part of sensing and processing the information).

    I sometimes wonder if human societies or humanity as a whole can 'experience' some form of consciousness that is beyond our ability to detect as individuals. In such a case the counciousness might envolve not just humans but the stuff we use such as books(info), roads, etc.
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  12. #11 Re: does calculation have anything to do with our awareness? 
    Forum Freshman Aures's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by streamSystems
    like if we didn't have arms with fingers, would have we counted to 10?
    We would have noticed our two stumped arms and figured binaries instead.
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  13. #12 Re: does calculation have anything to do with our awareness? 
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aures
    We would have noticed our two stumped arms and figured binaries instead.
    There are 10 kinds of people in the world: those who understand binary and those who don't.
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  14. #13 Re: does calculation have anything to do with our awareness? 
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aures
    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Quote Originally Posted by Aures
    We would have noticed our two stumped arms and figured binaries instead.
    There are 10 kinds of people in the world: those who understand binary and those who don't.
    Saw that quote on bash.org the other day. What's the relevance?
    The relevance to the thread is as a lighthearted, but apposite interlude in a serious subject, much like the drunken porter scene in Macbeth just after he has murdered the King.

    If you are asking the nature of the joke, then: the phrase 'there are 10 kinds of people' will be read as 'there are ten kinds of people'. We then follow with a list of only two kinds of people. But two is 10 in binary.
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  15. #14  
    Forum Freshman Aures's Avatar
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    Yeah, I figured late and took off my post, you replied nevertheless. :P
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  16. #15 Re: hello, 
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    Quote Originally Posted by pulasthi
    awareness and consciousness in human is dependent on an area called reticular formation in the brain stem. To be exact, it is located in the central portion of the brain stem. That's why we loose consciousness when that area is damaged or hit by some force. (Sleep centers are also located nearby.)

    Calculations are a function of cerebral cortex. Mainly in the left cerebral cortex.

    So these two things are two different functions all together.

    Numeral system is an entity made my humans to declare counting operations. Counting does not necessarily mean declaring numbers from 1 to 10. It has a broad meaning. (emphasis mine - paralith)
    I agree. A study was conducted using monkeys that showed they can "order numerosities;" or basically, count. They were shown different images, each containing a different number of shapes, and they were able to order the images from least amount of shapes to highest amount of shapes. The shapes themselves were varied in many different ways to make sure the monkeys weren't going by some different visual measure other than number of shapes. And these were monkeys, not apes. Do you think monkeys are conscious the way humans are?
    Man can will nothing unless he has first understood that he must count on no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth.
    ~Jean-Paul Sartre
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