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Thread: Censoring Female Sexuality

  1. #1 Censoring Female Sexuality 
    Moderator Moderator Cogito Ergo Sum's Avatar
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    In a nutshell:
    "Until this year, all state schools in Israel used the same science books. Heading into the new school year, however, that will no longer be the case, as the government has decided that religious schools deserve their own science books, which will be dumbed down for students' spiritual protection."


    In practice, the chapters about reproduction are deleted, together with references to menstruation, STDs and pregnancy prevention.
    This implies that:
    "at no point during their schooling will religious students learn about reproduction from a scientific standpoint, unless they take biology in high school."


    Ms. Gal-On, chairwoman of the social-democratic party in Israel, stated in Haaretz (Israeli newspaper):
    "More than 200,000 children today are in the state-religious education system, which is 200,000 future citizens of the State of Israel who will grow up with ignorance and with the sense that the human body, or to be more specific, the body of the woman, is something dirty."


    The ignorance will cause severe damage in the state of Israel. I am inclined to state that teen pregnancy rates will rise, the incidence of STDs will peak,...
    This gesture, which is a compliance for a religious group, could be beneficial for one's religious beliefs, but it neglects the need for education.

    What do you think?


    Source:
    Israel Alters Science Textbooks For Religious State Schools, Deleting All the Icky Female Bits


    Last edited by Cogito Ergo Sum; September 14th, 2013 at 10:25 AM. Reason: Spelling error.
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    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  3. #2  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
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    Am I surprised that religion is encouraging ignorance?
    No.

    Do I think it's a good thing?
    No.

    I think there is a saying about it: "Ignorance; we've tried that before and it didn't work."

    Sometimes I wish they would simply deny germ theory and do us all a favour.


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  4. #3  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
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    Any and all censorship is evil.
    Ignorance seems a damned peculiar target to aim for.
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  5. #4  
    Life-Size Nanoputian Flick Montana's Avatar
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    What do I think?

    I think it is absolutely, utterly, and completely shameful to deny someone education or lie to them in order to protect your personal interests.
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  6. #5  
    Moderator Moderator Cogito Ergo Sum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    What do I think?

    I think it is absolutely, utterly, and completely shameful to deny someone education or lie to them in order to protect your personal interests.

    One can even ask if this decision violates Article 26 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights:
    "(1) Everyone has the right to education. Education shall be free, at least in the elementary and fundamental stages. Elementary education shall be compulsory. Technical and professional education shall be made generally available and higher education shall be equally accessible to all on the basis of merit."

    "(2) Education shall be directed to the full development of the human personality and to the strengthening of respect for human rights and fundamental freedoms. It shall promote understanding, tolerance and friendship among all nations, racial or religious groups, and shall further the activities of the United Nations for the maintenance of peace."

    "(3) Parents have a prior right to choose the kind of education that shall be given to their children."
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    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  7. #6  
    Forum Sophomore Nisslbody's Avatar
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    Shameful. Absolutely shameful.
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  8. #7  
    AI's Have More Fun Bad Robot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Sometimes I wish they would simply deny germ theory and do us all a favour.
    Those pesky germs are not a theory anymore, but I suppose they could remove all microscopes and then claim they don't exist.
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  9. #8  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RedPanda View Post
    Sometimes I wish they would simply deny germ theory and do us all a favour.
    Those pesky germs are not a theory anymore, but I suppose they could remove all microscopes and then claim they don't exist.

    Well, they already censored the information about STDs, thus it takes a small step towards censoring bacteriology as a whole.
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    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  10. #9  
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    I'm also worried about this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    "at no point during their schooling will religious students learn about reproduction from a scientific standpoint, unless they take biology in high school."
    There's an option to not take biology?
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  11. #10  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by billvon View Post
    There's an option to not take biology?
    Is there an option to take biology?
    Maybe only boys are allowed to take biology.
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  12. #11  
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    In this case it's not only supporting ignorance...it's likely to increase STDs, unwanted teenage pregnancy, and sexual abuse of children.
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  13. #12  
    ...matter and pixie dust wegs's Avatar
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    I've never before agreed with every single person within a thread, but today...is one such day! Sexuality is not shameful, and teaching kids that it is, will cause them to develop an unhealthy outlook of it as they enter adulthood. Just what the world needs, more adults with oddball hangups and perversions due to the misconceptions of sex they learned about as children. :/
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  14. #13  
    ▼▼ dn ʎɐʍ sıɥʇ ▼▼ RedPanda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    Those pesky germs are not a theory anymore...
    Just in case you didn't realise, 'germ theory' is an actual term.
    Germ theory of disease - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    but I suppose they could remove all microscopes and then claim they don't exist.
    If they leave reason behind, then anything is possible.
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  15. #14  
    Anti-Crank AlexG's Avatar
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    "at no point during their schooling will religious students learn about reproduction from a scientific standpoint
    They'll learn about it from the practical standpoint.
    Its the way nature is!
    If you dont like it, go somewhere else....
    To another universe, where the rules are simpler
    Philosophically more pleasing, more psychologically easy
    Prof Richard Feynman (1979) .....

    Das ist nicht nur nicht richtig, es ist nicht einmal falsch!"
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  16. #15  
    has lost interest seagypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexG View Post
    "at no point during their schooling will religious students learn about reproduction from a scientific standpoint
    They'll learn about it from the practical standpoint.
    They probably have access to cable. So reality tv will be their teachers.
    Speaking badly about people after they are gone and jumping on the bash the band wagon must do very well for a low self-esteem.
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  17. #16  
    Moderator Moderator Cogito Ergo Sum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seagypsy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by AlexG View Post
    "at no point during their schooling will religious students learn about reproduction from a scientific standpoint
    They'll learn about it from the practical standpoint.
    They probably have access to cable. So reality tv will be their teachers.

    Israel has a history with censorship, yet it is not clear of human reproduction is also banned from the tv.
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  18. #17  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
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    Perhaps, the following may shed some light into the reasoning behind the censorship?

    American Jewish Fertility by Religious Current Religious Sect

    Average No. of Children per Woman

    Ultra-Orthodox 6.72

    Modern Orthodox 3.39

    Conservative 1.74

    Reform 1.36

    Secular 1.29

    Israel's Demographic Miracle - inFocus Quarterly Journal

    That Israel's exceptional fertility stems from religious commitment rather than ethnicity is suggested by the enormous contrast between orthodox and secular Jewish birth rates in the United States. Nowhere is the fertility gap between religious and non-religious more extreme than among American Jews. As a group, American Jews show the lowest fertility of any ethnic group in the country. That is a matter of great anguish for Jewish community leaders. According to sociologist Steven Cohen, "We are now in the midst of a non-Orthodox Jewish population meltdown… Among Jews in their 50s, for every 100 Orthodox adults, we have 192 Orthodox children. And for the non-Orthodox, for every 100 adults, we have merely 55 such children." Reform and secular Jews average one child per family; the Modern (university-educated) Orthodox typically raise three to four children, and the ultra-Orthodox seven or eight."

    The American data suggest an explanation of fertility similar to what is encountered in Israel: the stronger the Jewish commitment, the more likely Jews are to have children. Living in Eretz Yisrael is one of the strongest manifestations of Jewish commitment, such that Israeli Jews within a broad spectrum of religious observance have as many children as the most religiously engaged American Jews. As unique as the Jews are among the world's people, their fertility in the State of Israel is also unique among the nations, and cause for optimism about the future of Am Yisrael.

    (justaguess)
    Last edited by sculptor; September 8th, 2013 at 02:36 PM.
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  19. #18  
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    I don't really see the connection. While lack of sex education might bring a few more children, does the Jewish community really want them to start having kids at 13, 14 years old about the time of their bar mitzvah. Or having more STDs, some of which bring sterility. Or making them more vulnerable to sex abuse. That's a damn poor trade off by any reasonable standards--but I guess that standard often doesn't apply to fundamentalist religious thinking.
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  20. #19  
    Moderator Moderator Cogito Ergo Sum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    but I guess that standard often doesn't apply to fundamentalist religious thinking.

    Is that not an oxymoron?
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  21. #20  
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    Who needs weapons of mass destruction when you have religion. Religion is the Intellectual genocide which will doom our species.
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  22. #21  
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    Shameful.
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  23. #22  
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    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Shameful.
    Religion? Or the claim made about religion? joc
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  24. #23  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    The ignorance will cause severe damage in the state of Israel. I am inclined to state that teen pregnancy rates will rise, the incidence of STDs will peak,...

    What do you think?
    Sounds like a self solving problem, to me...
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  25. #24  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jocular View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Shameful.
    Religion? Or the claim made about religion? joc
    See post #1
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  26. #25  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
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    They'll have to ban kids from having access to communication devices. I hope the religious schools realize that the kids are more in tune with the world than they are. It's not hard here to figure out who's a real pain in the government's ass.
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  27. #26  
    Moderator Moderator Cogito Ergo Sum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    They'll have to ban kids from having access to communication devices. I hope the religious schools realize that the kids are more in tune with the world than they are. It's not hard here to figure out who's a real pain in the government's ass.

    Not only that, but one can also ask why female sexuality is banned, while male sexuality is not.
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

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  28. #27  
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  29. #28  
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    Quote Originally Posted by billvon View Post
    I'm also worried about this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    "at no point during their schooling will religious students learn about reproduction from a scientific standpoint, unless they take biology in high school."
    There's an option to not take biology?
    Heck... even in the educational system I partake in biology is required.
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  30. #29  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zinjanthropos View Post
    They'll have to ban kids from having access to communication devices. I hope the religious schools realize that the kids are more in tune with the world than they are. It's not hard here to figure out who's a real pain in the government's ass.

    Not only that, but one can also ask why female sexuality is banned, while male sexuality is not.
    Another good point.
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  31. #30  
    Forum Freshman jgoti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    I don't really see the connection. While lack of sex education might bring a few more children, does the Jewish community really want them to start having kids at 13, 14 years old about the time of their bar mitzvah. Or having more STDs, some of which bring sterility. Or making them more vulnerable to sex abuse. That's a damn poor trade off by any reasonable standards--but I guess that standard often doesn't apply to fundamentalist religious thinking.
    I think the main purpose of controlling their sexuality is that you've got them under your thumb because you can make them feel guilty for nothing. The goal is ignorance itself, even if it backfires in any way. Who cares?

    In Spain, despite all our rapid social changes, sexuallity was still slightly taboo right up to the mid '80s, to the point that there was even a silly TV show called "Let's Talk about Sex" which was meant to be a bit naughty or daring.

    It's simply a waste of mental energy to debate on something so natural, but when a society has been under the clergy's influence for 40 years, it remains in an infantile state. And that's what they want.
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  32. #31  
    Forum Masters Degree LuciDreaming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgoti View Post
    It's simply a waste of mental energy to debate on something so natural, but when a society has been under the clergy's influence for 40 years, it remains in an infantile state. And that's what they want.
    To be clear this will not affect the whole of Israeli society. I lived in Israel for 15 years and I believe the percentage of Orthodox Jews in the population is about 20%. The secular and even religious but not strictly orthodox will not be exposed to this nonsense.
    "And we should consider every day lost on which we have not danced at least once. And we should call every truth false which was not accompanied by at least one laugh" Nietzsche.
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  33. #32  
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuciDreaming View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jgoti View Post
    It's simply a waste of mental energy to debate on something so natural, but when a society has been under the clergy's influence for 40 years, it remains in an infantile state. And that's what they want.
    To be clear this will not affect the whole of Israeli society. I lived in Israel for 15 years and I believe the percentage of Orthodox Jews in the population is about 20%. The secular and even religious but not strictly orthodox will not be exposed to this nonsense.
    That's good to know but, when it comes to religion, even a minority can exert as much pressure -or at least make as much noise- as a much larger group. Just think of creationists putting their foot through the (school) door.

    I've never been to Israel. Do the secular and religious people respect or perhaps tolerate this stuff?
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  34. #33  
    Forum Masters Degree LuciDreaming's Avatar
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    The Orthodox will follow this to the letter. I think its fair to say that even secular Jews are more respectful of religion than the average secular British person - they value and respect the biblical foundations of the rituals and traditional holidays even as non-believers. As opposed to here where Christmas is a gift giving time for secular individuals for example. However, the secular schools and even the religious but non-Orthodox schools teach science as science.

    The Orthodox have influence over every day life especially in matters of religious holidays observance - Yom Kippur for example is non-negotiable - everything closes for 24 hours (except emergency services). But I think its safe to say that this sort of teaching will be kept within the Orthodox community only. In a lot of respects the Israeli population are streaks ahead of the West in terms of female equality - at least that was my experience - so I doubt this will have any influence outside the Orthodox community.
    "And we should consider every day lost on which we have not danced at least once. And we should call every truth false which was not accompanied by at least one laugh" Nietzsche.
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