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Thread: Why arent Screws more standard?

  1. #1 Why arent Screws more standard? 
    Forum Cosmic Wizard icewendigo's Avatar
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    Im not talking about exotic applications,

    but most screws Ive ever seen in my life could have been designed with one and the same screw-driver type indentation, but instead you have all sorts of types, line, plus sign, square, hexagon, for no apparent reason?


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  3. #2  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard icewendigo's Avatar
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    but why didnt they transition out of slotted screws and make all screws whichever is more practical between Phillips or Square, and make it a standard?


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  4. #3  
    Brassica oleracea Strange's Avatar
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    I wouldn't be surprised if Philips and Pozidriv, say, had patents on their designs. They each persuaded particular manufacturers to license their design and so you end up with multiple varieties. It wasn't important enough for a standards body (or government) to step in and impose a single solution. As they say, the nice thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from.
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  5. #4  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard icewendigo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strange View Post
    I wouldn't be surprised if Philips and Pozidriv, say, had patents on their designs. They each persuaded particular manufacturers to license their design and so you end up with multiple varieties. It wasn't important enough for a standards body (or government) to step in and impose a single solution. As they say, the nice thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from.
    Yeah that sounds likely. Unfortunate since it virtually forces millions of people to needlessly buy/use multiple screw drivers or additional screw driver heads for No functional advantage(most non specialized home users) and results in waste of resources and factory processing activity (but then its similar to cyclical consumption tendencies and the other wastes of the current monetary system).

    thanks for he responses guys, I understand how we got here, it would be nice if they made a few less types
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  6. #5  
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    I'm glad there are alternatives to the Philips. Those things are terrible if you have to apply any kind of torque. I've read they were actually designed so that the bit would slip out before it applied too much torque when using machines for assembly. There are better methods of limiting torque nowadays. I don't like the hex, or Allen screws in the smaller sizes, because they round off too easily. I don't see much to choose between square and star drives. I would be just as happy if they standardized on one or the other. Still, I don't think it's any big deal, as you don't ordinarily buy the whole screwdriver, but just the interchangeable bits, which are pretty cheap.
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    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives

    I've always kept a large assortment of different bits- often sold in complete sets handy.
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  8. #7 Screw Drivers 
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    I was perusing your comments on screwdrivers. I am very new, so please be patient with me. *S*...I am theatre arts by profession. One of my issues with the Phillips was noted, in that you have no torque, which I find so true. I also have found if your Phillips does not fit PRECISELY in the slots you have even LESS torque. Then there is the square and the hexagon. Ok...do they really make a difference in support of the screw? Mahalo.
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    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    I was perusing your comments on screwdrivers. I am very new, so please be patient with me. *S*...I am theatre arts by profession. One of my issues with the Phillips was noted, in that you have no torque, which I find so true. I also have found if your Phillips does not fit PRECISELY in the slots you have even LESS torque. Then there is the square and the hexagon. Ok...do they really make a difference in support of the screw? Mahalo.
    A hexagon would be an Allen screw. I think you probably mean the Torx or star drive. Yes, it makes a big difference if you are using those or square drive instead of a Philips. If you are driving these into wood with a cordless drill, you need to make sure you have the torque setting right. If it's too high, you'll drive it right in and probably split the wood.
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  10. #9  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Mahalo Harold14370 I have heard my late father speak of an Allen screw and probably fetched one for him at one time or two. However, in regards to the wood, if it is a very hardwood...i.e. teak, oak, mahagony, would that also apply?
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    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Mahalo Harold14370 I have heard my late father speak of an Allen screw and probably fetched one for him at one time or two. However, in regards to the wood, if it is a very hardwood...i.e. teak, oak, mahagony, would that also apply?
    I can't say I have a whole lot of experience putting screws into hardwood, but I guess you could split them if you are working with a thin piece of wood or putting the screw near the edge of a board. I'd drill a pilot hole and countersink the screw, and you shouldn't have much of a problem.
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  12. #11  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    *chuckle*Hardwood is HARD WOOD!! Trust me on this one. I don't believe you could split it unless...you drilled in a "knot", but agree with possibly a screw very near the edge. Thanks for your feedback...This forum is foreign to me. *S*......I could perhaps teach you how to sing! I appreciate the feedback...interesting that their is no Arts in these forums...*S*..as we have created many mysteries of science and physics and pyrotechnics in art, theatre, music, dance, improv....we are an "unknown and unlimited" *Science of Human Behavior in portraying a person you are not." I appreciate your time *S*
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    It is softwood that does not split easily. Hardwood does split easily, however.
    Similar to a gem that is hard and gold that is soft- hit each with a hammer and see which will break.

    As a man that has worked wood for about twenty years, I can assure you that hardwood requires drilling a hole before using a screw.
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  14. #13  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard icewendigo's Avatar
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    Hi babe, btw Hawaii is among my favorite places (on the planet).
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  15. #14  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by icewendigo View Post
    Hi babe, btw Hawaii is among my favorite places (on the planet).
    I am not sure I am doing this right..I am a theatre nerd for pete's sake and I love Hawai'i *S*...I live on the Big Island which has 11 different climates, volcanoes, snow skiing, surfing in the afternoon , great fishing, snorkeling, golf (my passion) and I love it...this Island is different...it isn't very populated....as for the volcano....you can walk and hike through one of the craters...a lava tube....the steam vents and the lava flows are amaing! I mean you see a sign for 1903 and next to it is a sign for 2007..amazing place...and the botanical gardens and the waterfalls...ok *L* I am done!
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  16. #15  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    and goodnight...I am up way too late *S*Thank all of your for your kindness *S*
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neverfly View Post
    It is softwood that does not split easily. Hardwood does split easily, however.
    Similar to a gem that is hard and gold that is soft- hit each with a hammer and see which will break.

    As a man that has worked wood for about twenty years, I can assure you that hardwood requires drilling a hole before using a screw.
    I prefer other kinds of joinery for hardwood - what little I have done. That stuff's expensive, and I don't have a lot of confidence in my rudimentary woodworking skills.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold14370 View Post
    [
    I prefer other kinds of joinery for hardwood - what little I have done. That stuff's expensive, and I don't have a lot of confidence in my rudimentary woodworking skills.
    Very true. I prefer the dovetail for hardwoods.
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  19. #18  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    I think I stand corrected. Reflecting back on splitting firewood.....hardwood even when wet is easier to split, and fir or pine much more difficult. Fir or pine when dry, however, are easily split as is hardwood, with the exception of either if they are extremely knotty. My father was an airplane tech for the US Gov for 33 years, and built furniture and clocks. He never used nails in his furniture, he used wooden dowels, but I cannot in all honesty tell you if he drilled holes for the dowels or not.
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    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    I think I stand corrected. Reflecting back on splitting firewood.....hardwood even when wet is easier to split, and fir or pine much more difficult. Fir or pine when dry, however, are easily split as is hardwood, with the exception of either if they are extremely knotty. My father was an airplane tech for the US Gov for 33 years, and built furniture and clocks. He never used nails in his furniture, he used wooden dowels, but I cannot in all honesty tell you if he drilled holes for the dowels or not.
    Oak is easy to split, but that doesn't necessarily apply to all hardwoods. If you needed something that didn't split, like for a wagon wheel hub, you could use elm, which is another hardwood.
    Yes, your dad drilled holes for his dowels.
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  21. #20  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    Mahalo...I am not familiar with elm trees. I am with Redwood, Oak, Madrone, Cedar, Fir and Pine. Thanks....I thought Dad drilled the holes for his dowels. Thanks for the confirmation.
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    We used to have a lot of elm around here. They were probably more common than any other tree. If you tried to split it, like for firewood, it was really difficult, because the grain twists around in all directions through the trunk. Most of the elm got wiped out by Dutch Elm disease. I'm starting to see a few elms sprout up again. I don't know if they'll make a recovery, or get hit with another wave of Dutch Elm.
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  23. #22  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    With knots in the trees, splitting can be tough. I no longer split wood. Thank ya geezus....but I am also familiar with alder, weeping willows, palm, ficus, and kiawi.......I really hope your elms recover! We had that with one of the native trees here and also the koa wood trees!! Monkeypod is awesome!
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  24. #23  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    http://i410.photobucket.com/albums/p...26969486_o.jpg one of the small trees Mainland golf course...this is a small redwood....I'm in the white shoes
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  25. #24  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    As a geologist I'd like to say a word for the hammer and its sidekick, the nail.
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  26. #25  
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    Straight slot screws may not work well with power drivers, but straight edge screwdrivers are useful multitask tools. About half the time I pick up a strait edge screwdriver I am using it to pry on something rather than turning a screw. Try opening a paint can with a phillips, allen, star, or square drive screwdriver and you quickly see why straight edge drivers are the most common unpowered screwdriver type.
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  27. #26  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
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    I concur Mr. Danahanegan. I have used them for many purposes.
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  28. #27  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strange View Post
    I wouldn't be surprised if Philips and Pozidriv, say, had patents on their designs. They each persuaded particular manufacturers to license their design and so you end up with multiple varieties. It wasn't important enough for a standards body (or government) to step in and impose a single solution. As they say, the nice thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from.
    I happen to have a pozi/flathead, great for torque and speed......

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  29. #28  
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    except if you are a 95 pound woman who works out and the Phillips plain sucks as a screwdriver!! I cannot get enough torque with it...while a flat screwdriver...I can write my own ticket!
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