Notices
Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Euler diagrams. Confusing...can someone explain this exercise in my book? No answer key so I don't get it :(

  1. #1 Euler diagrams. Confusing...can someone explain this exercise in my book? No answer key so I don't get it :( 
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    hi again, sorry if I ask a lot of questions but I go to school online and have to self study everything.
    it sucks if the book copy given does not have any answer key to check if my answers are correct...

    is this correct?
    a)some nutritious food taste bad.
    some nutritious food are expensive.
    therefore, no expensive food taste bad.

    my answer is that it is not valid? is this correct?

    b) some UC students are rich.
    Some rich students do not study hard.
    therefore, some UC students do not study hard.

    my answer is that it is not valid...is this correct?

    please guide me. I appreciate any thought on this. drawing euler diagrams with these two syllogisms with "some" mostly in it makes it difficult to verify...


    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    anyone? please? TT^TT


    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope MagiMaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    3,440
    This forum isn't active enough for you to get a response in 2 hours most of the time.

    Also, it helps if you show how you arrived at your conclusions so we can point out where you've made a mistake, if you've made a mistake.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by MagiMaster View Post
    This forum isn't active enough for you to get a response in 2 hours most of the time.

    Also, it helps if you show how you arrived at your conclusions so we can point out where you've made a mistake, if you've made a mistake.
    I see. Okay I'll screenshot the euler diagram I tried to make. ^^
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    106
    I think you are correct in both cases.

    In the first case, there is a set of nutritious foods and a set of bad tasting food.
    These sets overlap.
    There is then a set of expensive foods that overlaps the set of nutritious foods.
    It is possible for all three sets to overlap.

    So false.

    In the second case, there is again 3 sets, which may, or may not all overlap.

    So false again.

    (my apologies if I have broken protocol with this answer. Anyway, I might be wrong )
    Last edited by Warron; January 22nd, 2014 at 09:03 AM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    hi, here's the link for my solution in the first problem
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/115165345@N05/12087767756/
    Last edited by royalityqueen; January 22nd, 2014 at 09:45 AM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    Last edited by royalityqueen; January 22nd, 2014 at 09:46 AM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    tell me if the way I draw these diagrams is wrong. I appreciate any corrections so that I can learn as well as explanations ^^
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Warron View Post
    I think you are correct in both cases.

    In the first case, there is a set of nutritious foods and a set of bad tasting food.
    These sets overlap.
    There is then a set of expensive foods that overlaps the set of nutritious foods.
    It is possible for all three sets to overlap.

    So false.

    In the second case, there is again 3 sets, which may, or may not all overlap.

    So false again.

    (my apologies if I have broken protocol with this answer. Anyway, I might be wrong )
    Hi! thanks a lot for your response exactly. there are cases where it may or may not overlap. it's just that...it's math so @_@ I have to verify it with other people.

    and since I'm an online student..help is scarce lol XD

    (why am I not gifted in this subject -sob- TT^TT grr even physics and chemistry ...have been complicated because of math)
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    106
    I can't see those links, but then I am on very tenuous satellite internet connection.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Warron View Post
    I can't see those links, but then I am on very tenuous satellite internet connection.
    gah I made the settings public for those from google drive...wonder why it isn't working.
    updated the links using flickr lol
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    bump..if that's allowed
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #13  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    106
    They look like Venn diagrams to me. Looking at the first case, you could represent the situation by only considering those subsets of expensive food and bad tasting food that are within the overall set of nutritious food, showing how the subsets can overlap.


    In the second case, you could represent the subsets of UC students and lazy students that fall within the overall set of rich students, showing how the two don't necessarily overlap.


    I hope I am helping here. I'm sure that there are others more skilled than I am but I think that what I have said will produce Euler diagrams rather than Venn diagrams.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #14  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Warron View Post
    They look like Venn diagrams to me. Looking at the first case, you could represent the situation by only considering those subsets of expensive food and bad tasting food that are within the overall set of nutritious food, showing how the subsets can overlap.


    In the second case, you could represent the subsets of UC students and lazy students that fall within the overall set of rich students, showing how the two don't necessarily overlap.


    I hope I am helping here. I'm sure that there are others more skilled than I am but I think that what I have said will produce Euler diagrams rather than Venn diagrams.
    omg. they do like venn diagrams @_@. nodnod I get them much better now. I'll make another one and can you double check? XD

    btw I dunno if you have the answer to this but I had a previous forum here...
    Here's the textbook questions
    Draw an appropriate Venn diagram for each of the set relations below. Assume sets A and B are non-empty and unequal.
    a) B-A = null
    b) A U B = B
    c) A - B = A
    what I end up making here are euler diagrams...but what's needed is venn. If you have an idea please enlighten me

    PS. you're helping me bigtime *thumbs up*
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #15  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    four | Flickr - Photo Sharing!here's the one the you suggested
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #16  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    106
    Sorry. I'm too rusty. I'm sure some of the maths gurus could do this, but perhaps they are a little homework shy.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  18. #17  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    106
    UC= set of rich UC students
    X = set of rich lazy students

    Similar for the other diagram.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  19. #18  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Warron View Post
    Sorry. I'm too rusty. I'm sure some of the maths gurus could do this, but perhaps they are a little homework shy.
    Naww it's aright ^^
    Quote Originally Posted by Warron View Post
    UC= set of rich UC students
    X = set of rich lazy students

    Similar for the other diagram.
    Ahhh got it. Thanks Warron!~
    Reply With Quote  
     

  20. #19  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope MagiMaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    3,440
    Start with a generic Venn diagram and label the three circles. Then use what you're told to work out which intersections must be or cannot be empty. Then decide whether or not you can deduce the final statement given what the other statements told you.
    Reply With Quote  
     

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 4
    Last Post: September 21st, 2013, 07:17 PM
  2. flipflop state diagrams
    By fine in forum Electrical and Electronics
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: May 26th, 2013, 02:33 AM
  3. Euler's Equation and the Reality of Nature.
    By socratus in forum Mathematics
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: February 15th, 2013, 12:02 AM
  4. Euler reciprocity relation (origin?)
    By Libb Thims in forum Mathematics
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: December 28th, 2011, 02:05 PM
  5. Euler's formula
    By thyristor in forum Mathematics
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: May 13th, 2009, 03:30 PM
Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •