# Thread: can algorithms be time-dependent

1. Greetings forum members,

I have a quick question, not too involved.

Physics employs mathematics to solve complex ideas, but it seems mathematics is not used as a process of time, meaning that the process of the mathematical equation is not a concept of "time". For instance, physics doesn't use mathematics to explain how one spatial orientation goes from time "before" to time "after" purely as a mathematical equation of spatial orientation from time "before" to time "after" "as" a concept of the flow of "time", that time can be a mathematical process of a flux/change of space by the process of time, by the process of the mathematical algorithm.

Is that right though, namely can mathematics be used as a "process" purely of time to define how space changes in time, that "time" can represent the very mathematical matrix of how space appears to transform?

(hopefully someone can understand what I am trying to say, and it's just a question, not a statement).

Thank you for any replies.  2.

3. Originally Posted by theQuestIsNotOver
Greetings forum members,

I have a quick question, not too involved.

Physics employs mathematics to solve complex ideas, but it seems mathematics is not used as a process of time, meaning that the process of the mathematical equation is not a concept of "time". For instance, physics doesn't use mathematics to explain how one spatial orientation goes from time "before" to time "after" purely as a mathematical equation of spatial orientation from time "before" to time "after" "as" a concept of the flow of "time", that time can be a mathematical process of a flux/change of space by the process of time, by the process of the mathematical algorithm.

Is that right though, namely can mathematics be used as a "process" purely of time to define how space changes in time, that "time" can represent the very mathematical matrix of how space appears to transform?

(hopefully someone can understand what I am trying to say, and it's just a question, not a statement).

Thank you for any replies.
Your question is rather confusing, so I may be missing your point. But here goes..

Mathematics considers processes that are dynamical, functions of time quite regularly. The theory of differential equations is often stated using the imagery of dynamical systems, basically differential equations with the independent variable being time. The equations themselves can be functions of time (differential equations with variable coefficients).

It is not necessary to view the independent variable in the differential equations as time, since time is a concept of physics rather than of mathematics. But it is quite often helpful to do so so as to properly engage one's intuition.

In terms of describing how space might change with time, mathematics provides the only useful way to formulate such a description. ?he entire theory of general relativity was built upon the mathematical discipline of differential geometry, an extension of what is called Riemannian geometery ( the generalization is called pseud-Riemannian geometry and is necessary to incorporate the special theory of relativity as a local case).

Physicists use mathematics in an essential way in their work. Eugene Wigner wrote an essay that you might like ot find and read called "The Unreasonable Effectiveness of Mathematics in the Natural Sciences".

Here is a quote from another outstanding physicist:

"To summarize , I would use the words of Jeans, who said that the Great Architect seems to be a mathematician. To those who do not know mathematics it is difficult to get across a real feeling as the beauty, the deepest beauty, of nature. C.P. Snow talked about two cultures. I really think that those two cultures separate people who have and people who have not had this experience of understanding mathematics well enough to appreciate nature once."  Richard P. Feynman in The Character of Physical Law  4. Thanks for your response.

You got my drift.

If I may, can I add another question: do you believe that the time it takes to perform an algorithm would depend on the mental ability of the mathematician?  5. Originally Posted by theQuestIsNotOver
Thanks for your response.

You got my drift.

If I may, can I add another question: do you believe that the time it takes to perform an algorithm would depend on the mental ability of the mathematician?
Yes.

And that applies whether you mean the time that it takes a computer programmed by a mathematician to execute an algorithm or the it takes a human mathematician to perform a calculation.

Some people are able to see the essence of a problem and solve it quickly. Some take longer. Some can't do it at all. The ability to see the essence quickly is one measure of mathematical ability. It is not the only measure.  6. So would it also be correct to suggest that an algorithm performed at the abolsute speed of mental calculation ability would/could represent the "ability"
itself to be conscious of a system presumably represented as an algorithm (such as an ultimate algorithm of space-time)?

(will get back on this thread in 8 hrs, have errands.....thank you for any replies)  7. Originally Posted by theQuestIsNotOver
So would it also be correct to suggest that an algorithm performed at the abolsute speed of mental calculation ability would/could represent the "ability"
itself to be conscious of a system presumably represented as an algorithm (such as an ultimate algorithm of space-time)?

(will get back on this thread in 8 hrs, have errands.....thank you for any replies)
You are now getting into the area of what is consciousness, how does the brain work, is it a Turing machine of some sort, etc.

I don't know and I am not convinced that anyone does.

If you really want to discuss this sort of thing you need find Roger Penrose. Or read two of his books --The Emperor's New Mind and Shadows of the Mind.

I don't know enough about this area to discuss it.  8. Originally Posted by theQuestIsNotOver
Thanks for your response.

You got my drift.

If I may, can I add another question: do you believe that the time it takes to perform an algorithm would depend on the mental ability of the mathematician?
It usually depends on the processing capabiliiities of the micro processor.   9. Originally Posted by esbo Originally Posted by theQuestIsNotOver
Thanks for your response.

You got my drift.

If I may, can I add another question: do you believe that the time it takes to perform an algorithm would depend on the mental ability of the mathematician?
It usually depends on the processing capabiliiities of the micro processor. Still, if the mind was like a biological microprocessor, would the following hold true:

an algorithm at the abolsute speed of mental calculation ability would/could represent the "ability"
itself to be conscious of a system presumably represented as an algorithm (such as an ultimate algorithm of space-time).  10. Originally Posted by theQuestIsNotOver Originally Posted by esbo Originally Posted by theQuestIsNotOver
Thanks for your response.

You got my drift.

If I may, can I add another question: do you believe that the time it takes to perform an algorithm would depend on the mental ability of the mathematician?
It usually depends on the processing capabiliiities of the micro processor. Still, if the mind was like a biological microprocessor, would the following hold true:

an algorithm at the abolsute speed of mental calculation ability would/could represent the "ability"
itself to be conscious of a system presumably represented as an algorithm (such as an ultimate algorithm of space-time).
Not really too sure a what you are talking about, maybe using some punctuation such s commas would help? Or better still giving an example in concrete terms rather than using vague il defined such as, possibly - algorithm, conscious, system, represent, space-time etc...
Also an algoritm does not have a speed no more than a shopping list has a speed.

Try asking the questin as if you were asking your grandmother.  Bookmarks
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