Thread: Who is greater contibutor to a technology Leonardo or Tesla?

Considering what both men have created, invented i think it is pretty hard to detemine. I am going to assume that you know what leonardo has created, so lets see what Tesla had to say.
He contributed or invented: alternating curent, wireless communication, electric motor, basics for laser and radar techonology, x-ray, neon tubes, robotics, remote control, and cellular technology.

What do you think?

Whoever wins in this debate should be the greatest inventor of them all.

Well I believe that Leonardo for his time had some revolutionary ideas (I'm sure I don't need to go into details here). The plane he designed for instance and the automated bobbin winder, the human body's anatomy as well, botany, geology. He had it all really. For the time DaVinci was ingenious and Tesla, well he was just as a brilliant ingenious operator. Both were remarkable in their ideas and inventions.

Hmmm. Double post again. I've seen your profile and you have double posted at least three threads. There is no need my friend, your post here is perfect in where it is.

Why only Leonardo and Tesla? What about others? Thomas Edison, for instance – he was also a great inventor.

Tesla and Edison were enemies. The reason Tesla was never given the Nobel prize is because Edison threatened to refuse it if Tesla got it. The reason Edison never got the prize is because Tesla threatened to refuse it if Edison got it.

Edison was a trial and error kind of inventor, so it's hard to see him as a genius on the same level as Tesla, who could envision entire inventions in his head before even beginning to build them.


Da Vinci had interesting ideas. The precursors to flintlock muskets are seen as having gotten their origins from a drawing in one of Da Vinci's notebooks. Still, not very much of what he did made it into practice, or ever became useful to humanity, so I'd vote for Tesla. (by a very small margin.)

Originally Posted by kojax

Tesla and Edison were enemies. The reason Tesla was never given the Nobel prize is because Edison threatened to refuse it if Tesla got it. The reason Edison never got the prize is because Tesla threatened to refuse it if Edison got it.

Edison was a trial and error kind of inventor, so it's hard to see him as a genius on the same level as Tesla, who could envision entire inventions in his head before even beginning to build them.


Da Vinci had interesting ideas. The precursors to flintlock muskets are seen as having gotten their origins from a drawing in one of Da Vinci's notebooks. Still, not very much of what he did made it into practice, or ever became useful to humanity, so I'd vote for Tesla. (by a very small margin.)

The only reason not very many of Leonardo's inventions made it into reality is because he concealed them. He planned on releasing his books before he died but he never had enough time. His books eventually came out centuries after he died and at that time many of the things he invented in his books were already invented by others. That being said throughout his life Leonardo was one of the most respected inventors of his time. He travelled often from country to country for jobs he had inventing and constructing objects for millitary purposes. He was a very sought after inventor. It is often questioned if he was the original inventor of the scientific method or if the person who currently holds the title is because Leonardo never let his books be public. He was actually so afraid that people would steal his ideas that he wrote his books in mirror writing and backwards to forwards.

Originally Posted by kojax

Tesla and Edison were enemies. The reason Tesla was never given the Nobel prize is because Edison threatened to refuse it if Tesla got it. The reason Edison never got the prize is because Tesla threatened to refuse it if Edison got it.

What is your source for this?? I doubt if the Nobel Prize committee would have ever taken into consideration these threats. Further Edison was a great inventor, but he was neither a physicist nor a chemist, so what prize could he ever have been considered for?

You might be right that it wasn't the actual reason. (I don't have any sources who were privy to the actual deliberations inside the Nobel prize committee), but the threats were made. Both Edison and Tesla threatened to refuse the prize if the other was awarded it.


You have to remember that the Nobel prize comittee was set up by a fellow named Nobel, the inventor of dynamite as a means of awarding exceptional contributions. Different variations on the prize are routinely given out to people who aren't scientists. Or..... do you think Al Gore deserves to stand next to people like Heisenberg and Einstein?

Edison and Tesla Win Nobel Prize in Physics
Literary Digest, December 18, 1915:

Announcement is made in the daily press that the Nobel prize for great discoveries in physics is to be awarded this year to two Americans -- Edison and Tesla -- and the chemistry prize to another American, Prof. Theodore W. Richards, of Harvard. The physics award, we are told editorially by The Electrical World (New York, November 13), will give especial satisfaction to the engineering profession, to which both the recipients have rendered distinguished service, tho the successes of both in contributing to the advances of pure science have been no less notable.

The article goes on to list the most notable accomplishments of these men. But, you will search in vain for the names Edison and Tesla on a list of Nobel Prize winners. The above-mentioned article was an error. Edison and Tesla never did win the Nobel Prize.

http://www.jimloy.com/physics/edison.htm

Edison did not invent much. He hired inventors, owned their inventions, patented them in his name. He did "invent" the world's first industrial research lab. Tesla once worked for him.

Originally Posted by kojax

You might be right that it wasn't the actual reason. (I don't have any sources who were privy to the actual deliberations inside the Nobel prize committee), but the threats were made. Both Edison and Tesla threatened to refuse the prize if the other was awarded it.


You have to remember that the Nobel prize comittee was set up by a fellow named Nobel, the inventor of dynamite as a means of awarding exceptional contributions. Different variations on the prize are routinely given out to people who aren't scientists. Or..... do you think Al Gore deserves to stand next to people like Heisenberg and Einstein?

Al Gore did not win a Physics or Chemistry prize!

My personal opinion - Telsa

Hmmm this is a tough choice - I wouls have to say, from my own bias - Tesla - but it is a tough call.

Originally Posted by Pong

Edison did not invent much. He hired inventors, owned their inventions, patented them in his name. He did "invent" the world's first industrial research lab. Tesla once worked for him.

Oh, really? thanks to let me know about this.

Tesla is the Greatest Genius! I know of many geniuses that have lived,but none compare to the works of an unknown Nikola Tesla.His inventions are a reality today,and will be for many years.Some of his inventions are A/C Polyphase System,Radio,Remote control,X-Ray,Fluorescent lights,Microwave,Robotics,Logic Gate(computers)Tesla coil(television),Etc,etc,etc.Just see his lifes work to understand his Genius.The very principle of your mobile you use today is based on his wireless discoveries.
Now lets look at what actually exists in the world as in "inventions"?Ask yourself what is the most amazing invention of the world?Not just theories and nonesense,but actual theories that have lead to something amazing?Lets first look at Da Vinci.Sure he was interested in many things,and had many ideas,but nothing of any use today that would amaze me.His drawings of aeroplanes were like the ones you see in old films,where they resemble flapping wings.Practically they just couldn't fly.Now for Newton,what did he invent?His idea that what goes up must come down?Gravity?Where is the genius in that?Did you know that even his theory on Gravity cannot be proved.Thats all it is an idea,but has no explanation in the way it works.He has proved nothing with his Gravity theory!
Great genius is from those,where ones theory leads to creation!
There is no genius in an idea that doesn't work,or something that has not been explained and put to use as Newtons gravity theory.
So tell me what did Newtons theory lead to?What did he create?
The theory of gravity is still not understood!
Now ask yourself what is the most amazing invention of the world?I would say that 8 out of 10,whatever you choose as some great invention that is in existence,some part of Tesla would have to be there!
That's why I have chosen Tesla.
Da Vinci? Hmmm, What did he invent? Fantasies in his brain?
And Edison?
Well his inventions today are obsolete,primative contraptions!

Each ime I read of Tesla in this forum his list of accomplishments grow.

Originally Posted by kris12

What do you think?

Well, both of them are excellent if we consider the centuries they lived in. It would be nice to create gold like Leonardo did , and it would be nice to live in a world Tesla was thinking about. Leonardo extended the scope of his interests really wide, while Tesla was sticked to electricity and energy. He was the pioneer of free energy. Leonardo questioned the order of the solar system, while Tesla questioned Einstein's theory of relativity, space curvature, speed of light, gravity etc. Both of them are covered with mysticism.

Frankly, I think Tesla rules because I'm living in a world which is mostly invented by him, because he opened some amazing questions and (above all) because I'm stunned with his work, really... He explained electricity as a fluid. Tesla was talking about ether fluid (and that we can get free energy from ether), while Einstein claimed that ether does not exist at all. Today we can say that ether DOES EXIST. According to Tesla, luminiferous ether fluid is the most probable medium filling the space and the most important discovery for humans will be to discover what electricity really is.

Originally Posted by JustMe

... He explained electricity as a fluid. Tesla was talking about ether fluid (and that we can get free energy from ether), while Einstein claimed that ether does not exist at all. Today we can say that ether DOES EXIST. According to Tesla, luminiferous ether fluid is the most probable medium filling the space and the most important discovery for humans will be to discover what electricity really is.

Actually.... James Clerk Maxwell is the one described electricity as being similar to a fluid. Most of Maxwell's equations are adaptations of things taken from fluid dynamics, and then modified to make them properly fit observation. So, at most, Tesla had an interesting spin on an old idea, if he was talking about ether fluid.

Originally Posted by Megabrain

Each ime I read of Tesla in this forum his list of accomplishments grow.

He had over 700 patents.

Originally Posted by kojax

Actually.... James Clerk Maxwell is the one described electricity as being similar to a fluid. Most of Maxwell's equations are adaptations of things taken from fluid dynamics, and then modified to make them properly fit observation. So, at most, Tesla had an interesting spin on an old idea, if he was talking about ether fluid.

Tesla's ether was neither the "solid" ether with the "tenuity of steel" of Maxwell and Hertz, nor the half-hearted, entrained, gaseous ether of Lorentz. Tesla's ether consisted of "carriers immersed in an insulating fluid", which filled all space. Its properties varied according to relative movement, the presence of mass, and the electric and magnetic environment.

Originally Posted by kojax

People didn't like Tesla, because he very arrogant, always throwing it in everyone's face that he was smarter than them. The fact is was true didn't help. It just made the problem worse.

I've read a lot of books about Tesla (most of them in english language) and I don't know what is the source for the text above. Tesla had some weird trips like taking a table for one person in the restoraunt or his well known jerbs fobia, but he wasn't arrogant. Well, he was arrogant to some people like Edison who didn't payed Tesla for improving his DC system, or to Marconni who has stolen 17 of Tesla's patents to make a radio. Every action has a reaction. How would you feel in the same situation? Perhaps others envied Tesla too?

Originally Posted by kojax

If the people of his day could attribute an accomplishment to anyone else other than him, I get the impression they would do so.

All people or just few people?

Well, here are the facts:
1. T.Edison (already invested a lot of money in his inefficient DC system to electrify the world)
2. J.P.Morgan (owns a steel company and able to produce wires for electric transmission)

Then Tesla came up with AC system and wirelles electric transmission.

We can also involve other names in the story (but it will probably make a lot of noise here):
1. Henry Ford (car industry, by 1932 Ford controlled over 1/3 of gasoline engine production worldwide)
2. Rockefeller or whoever (oil monopoly)

Then Tesla came up with electric car. These days, Google co-founders are pumping money to make Tesla Roadster.

Why is so hard to accept that lots of Tesla's ideas were simply unacceptable by the powerfull businessmen of that time? It is very possible. People can hate him, talk that he was arrogant or whatever, but this guy pioneered second industrial revolution.

Originally Posted by JustMe

Originally Posted by kojax

Actually.... James Clerk Maxwell is the one described electricity as being similar to a fluid. Most of Maxwell's equations are adaptations of things taken from fluid dynamics, and then modified to make them properly fit observation. So, at most, Tesla had an interesting spin on an old idea, if he was talking about ether fluid.

Tesla's ether was neither the "solid" ether with the "tenuity of steel" of Maxwell and Hertz, nor the half-hearted, entrained, gaseous ether of Lorentz. Tesla's ether consisted of "carriers immersed in an insulating fluid", which filled all space. Its properties varied according to relative movement, the presence of mass, and the electric and magnetic environment.

If he made improvements, I can see how that would count as an accomplishment. Is there a name for his particular version of the theory? If it's Tesla, it might be worth reading.

Originally Posted by kojax

People didn't like Tesla, because he very arrogant, always throwing it in everyone's face that he was smarter than them. The fact is was true didn't help. It just made the problem worse.

I've read a lot of books about Tesla (most of them in english language) and I don't know what is the source for the text above. Tesla had some weird trips like taking a table for one person in the restoraunt or his well known jerbs fobia, but he wasn't arrogant. Well, he was arrogant to some people like Edison who didn't payed Tesla for improving his DC system, or to Marconni who has stolen 17 of Tesla's patents to make a radio. Every action has a reaction. How would you feel in the same situation? Perhaps others envied Tesla too?

Originally Posted by kojax

If the people of his day could attribute an accomplishment to anyone else other than him, I get the impression they would do so.

All people or just few people?

Well, here are the facts:
1. T.Edison (already invested a lot of money in his inefficient DC system to electrify the world)
2. J.P.Morgan (owns a steel company and able to produce wires for electric transmission)

Then Tesla came up with AC system and wirelles electric transmission.

We can also involve other names in the story (but it will probably make a lot of noise here):
1. Henry Ford (car industry, by 1932 Ford controlled over 1/3 of gasoline engine production worldwide)
2. Rockefeller or whoever (oil monopoly)

Then Tesla came up with electric car. These days, Google co-founders are pumping money to make Tesla Roadster.

Why is so hard to accept that lots of Tesla's ideas were simply unacceptable by the powerfull businessmen of that time? It is very possible. People can hate him, talk that he was arrogant or whatever, but this guy pioneered second industrial revolution.

I think businesspeople worried he'd change technology too fast for the economy to adjust. Economies have to move slow, or else loans go into default. If you borrow a million dollars to set up a DC power system, and Tesla shows up one day with AC, that could mean somebody just lent out a very large amount of money they're never going to see again.

Sorry I edited out those quotes. I'm trying to avoid making conversation stoppers, unless I've got a really good link or something. I once knew of this really great site that had press releases from Tesla himself, but I lost it, and I can't find it again. If I do, I will so totally link it, then you can decide for yourself if he was arrogant or not.

Originally Posted by kojax

If he made improvements, I can see how that would count as an accomplishment. Is there a name for his particular version of the theory? If it's Tesla, it might be worth reading.

The name of the theory is "The Dynamic Theory of Gravity".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_theory_of_gravity
http://www.scribd.com/doc/2295208/eB...ory-of-Gravity (read the second paragraph).

Originally Posted by kojax

I think businesspeople worried he'd change technology too fast for the economy to adjust. Economies have to move slow, or else loans go into default. If you borrow a million dollars to set up a DC power system, and Tesla shows up one day with AC, that could mean somebody just lent out a very large amount of money they're never going to see again.

Tesla's problem is related to monopolies. Economy have to move, I agree, but in order to move faster it must get rid of the monopolies. Monopoly is a bad thing for economy. We all know what happened to stock market in 1929 because of the banks and loans, and what happened to stock market these days. Even today, I doubt that there is economy in the world which will be able to avoid instant bankruptcy if you cut off taxes coming from oil. Thats why oil is so important. Any future fuel we are going to use will follow the same concept unless we change something in economy globally. In other words, capitalism.

Originally Posted by kris12

Considering what both men have created, invented i think it is pretty hard to detemine. I am going to assume that you know what leonardo has created, so lets see what Tesla had to say.
He contributed or invented: alternating curent, wireless communication, electric motor, basics for laser and radar techonology, x-ray, neon tubes, robotics, remote control, and cellular technology.

What do you think?

Whoever wins in this debate should be the greatest inventor of them all.

Obviously Tesla wins above them

Da Vinci was not really anything special just someone who had lots of interesting drawings, designs and ideas but he never really transformed the world, he just speculated things and had a high level of creativity

Tesla on the other hand changed the world forever, virtually all modern technology arises from something Tesla did 100 years ago. Tesla also had a high level of creativity.

Tesla for instance spoke of things similar to the internet back in the 1900s...he said something like there could be a machine that transmits images and information all across the world.

So based on accomplishments and creativity I would say Tesla