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Thread: Gluten sensitivity is BS??

  1. #1 Gluten sensitivity is BS?? 
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    Reference : New Scientist, 12 July 2014, page 28

    Coeliac disease is real. About 1% of humans have antibodies to gluten in their blood, though not all of them show strong symptoms of the illness. A few have strong symptoms, like abdominal bloating. Gluten is a combination of two small proteins found in wheat, rye and barley. If you have the nasty form of coeliac disease, you have to give up these foods.

    However, it has now become 'fashionable' to claim sensitivity to gluten, and gluten free foods have become a big money earning business, selling to people who probably do not need to go gluten free. About $5 billion this year.

    The problem is that NCGS (non coeliac gluten sensitivity) probably does not exist. Instead, it appears that some people are sensitive to FODMAPS (fermentable oligosaccharides, disaccharides, monosaccharides, and polyols). These are found in wheat, but in small doses. People with such sensitivity who give up wheat may show improvement, but it s not due to gluten. The thing is that FODMAPS are actually found in a wide range of foods, not just wheat. Onions, for example, contain a lot more than wheat does. Instead of giving up gluten containing foods, people with FODMAP sensitivity might do better giving up onions.

    So is there any problem giving up gluten containing foods? The answer is yes.

    Gluten itself is a valuable protein food, if you do not have coeliac disease. More importantly, though, is what foods a person turns to when giving up gluten containing foods. Many of the gluten free foods are based on starches that are higher in salt and fat, and generate more sugars in the blood. If you replace wheat, barley and rye with fruit and vegetables, that would be a step in the right direction. But most people do not. Researchers have found that those going 'gluten free' on average eat more fat, and less fibre than people who consume gluten.

    For the vast majority of people, wholemeal wheat products are a very healthy option. If you think you have gluten problems, get a blood test done for gluten antibodies. If you do not have those antibodies, there is probably very little point going gluten free, and it may harm your health.


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    I don't know for certain, but I think the gluten-free fad walks hand-in-hand with the Paleo Diet.


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    I would tend to put it more alongside organic food. But whatever, there are a lot of weird diets out there. If there is money involved, of course, there will be a lot more people pushing the diet. That is why organic food and gluten free are similar. Both make an awful lot of money for a few people.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic View Post
    I would tend to put it more alongside organic food. But whatever, there are a lot of weird diets out there. If there is money involved, of course, there will be a lot more people pushing the diet. That is why organic food and gluten free are similar. Both make an awful lot of money for a few people.
    Good point, never thought about a connection with organic. I just recall the paleo diet having something to do with the human body not having developed to ingest processed grains, modified foods, and I think starches in general. Something about how we're supposed to live off of naturally occurring foods. Poor saps, I'd love to see their faces when they dig a wild "carrot" out of the earth.
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    thank you so much for the information! this is a great post.
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    Oliya

    You are very welcome. I subscribe to New Scientist and pick up a lot of wonderful information from it. It is my pleasure to pass on whatever I think is especialy interesting. It is even more pleasurable, when I get gracious feed back like yours.
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    Quote Originally Posted by stander-j View Post
    Good point, never thought about a connection with organic.
    Don't think there's any connection there, although I do agree that gluten sensitivity has become something of a fad.
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    Quote Originally Posted by billvon View Post
    Don't think there's any connection there, although I do agree that gluten sensitivity has become something of a fad.

    The connection is that both organic and gluten free foods support mega billion dollar industries. Like the tobacco industry before them, they have billions of reasons to promote ideas that are pure bulldust.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic View Post
    The connection is that both organic and gluten free foods support mega billion dollar industries.
    OK. (Of course, that's true of just about every product in this country, including the computer you are using to post this.)
    Last edited by billvon; August 12th, 2014 at 12:08 AM.
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    I wonder if this is what is wrong with me? THE COFFEE AND GLUTEN INTOLERANCE CONNECTION| DR HAGMEYER VIDEO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4AfkiRGCQQ

    I was blaming the milk I have in my coffee so I changed to A2 milk but the "ill feeling" I have is still persisting.
    Combination of many gluten proteins, we may not be sensitive to the main ones.
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    Robertybob

    There is very little good scientific evidence that A2 milk is of any benefit to anyone, with the marked exception of those selling the stuff. They benefit in the wallet. Like those selling organic food or gluten free food, they cherry pick and promote that cherry picked data. If you are unwell, I suggest you look elsewhere for the cause. Seeing your doctor is the best start.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic View Post
    Robertybob

    There is very little good scientific evidence that A2 milk is of any benefit to anyone, with the marked exception of those selling the stuff. They benefit in the wallet. Like those selling organic food or gluten free food, they cherry pick and promote that cherry picked data. If you are unwell, I suggest you look elsewhere for the cause. Seeing your doctor is the best start.
    The results of a study showing the benefit of A2 milk were published recently, and it was on the Google News today.
    "A2 Milk shares gain after health study - 11-Aug-2014 - NZ Business news"
    A2 Milk shares gain after health study - 11-Aug-2014 - NZ Business news

    I am enjoying taking the A2 milk but the feeling of "mild fever" I was hoping to resolve is still persisting. I have been to the doctor about it but the symptoms are so mild they sort of ignore it.
    I suppose they see the other risk factors - obesity, hypertension, lack of exercise and high cholesterol etc and they forget about my complaint.

    The thing that first struck me is how much better the coffee tastes with A2 milk. It is so much more creamy and it really satisfies your hunger. So I'm sure the extra dollar it costs is worth it to me.
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    Robbity

    If you like the taste, then buy it for the taste. On scientific studies, bear in mind the general principle.

    " If you do enough trials, every possible outcome will be seen."

    This principle is the basis for a whole heap of quackery. If you look at enough trials, you wll be able to pick one out that carries the message you want. The A2 makers have a lot of trials to refer to, and they carefully choose the ones with the outcome they want. Most of us (me too) cannot study the whole range of trials to get to a correct result, but government health professionals can. If and when you see the FDA, or the British National Health Service, or all of the equivalent services around the world recommending A2 milk, then you will know you are onto something. However, if it is a single study published by some newspaper or magazine, treat it with deep suspicion.
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    The Curtin University study, funded by NZX-listed A2 Milk and published in the European Journal of Clinical Nutrition, is the first clinical trial of A1 and A2 milk proteins on human digestion.
    So they say it was the first study, and it was done at a University, and published in what sounds like a reputable journal.
    Curtin University is in Australia.
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    Still to be treated with suspicion. Especially since it was funded by the people who stand to make money out of it.

    Wait till the major health authorities endorse it before you accept their findings as real.
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    Maybe it is just the coffee that is making you ill. Coffee is basicly toxin soup. Caffine is a poison, in high enough quantites. You might want to try not drinking coffee for a couple weeks. You will get a headache. Headache is the withdrwal symptom for caffine addiction. You may also experience sluggishness and constipation when you stop drinking coffee. Coffee is not a benign substance.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sealeaf View Post
    Maybe it is just the coffee that is making you ill. Coffee is basicly toxin soup. Caffine is a poison, in high enough quantites. You might want to try not drinking coffee for a couple weeks. You will get a headache. Headache is the withdrwal symptom for caffine addiction. You may also experience sluggishness and constipation when you stop drinking coffee. Coffee is not a benign substance.
    OK I'll give it a try.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sealeaf View Post
    Maybe it is just the coffee that is making you ill. Coffee is basicly toxin soup. Caffine is a poison, in high enough quantites. You might want to try not drinking coffee for a couple weeks. You will get a headache. Headache is the withdrwal symptom for caffine addiction. You may also experience sluggishness and constipation when you stop drinking coffee. Coffee is not a benign substance.
    Sealeaf, name a substance that is NOT a poison above a certain dosage.

    While it may will be a cause, its not valid to call coffee a "toxin soup" at all
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    Actually, there is not too much wrong with coffee, as long as you take it in moderation. Moderation is defined as no more than 4 standard strength cups of coffee per day. Of all recreational drugs, caffeine is probably the least harmful. There are research studies that show moderate coffee consumption is related to lower risk for both Alzheimers and for Type II diabetes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic View Post
    Actually, there is not too much wrong with coffee, as long as you take it in moderation. Moderation is defined as no more than 4 standard strength cups of coffee per day. Of all recreational drugs, caffeine is probably the least harmful. There are research studies that show moderate coffee consumption is related to lower risk for both Alzheimer's and for Type II diabetes.
    First day without coffee. I'll go for a couple of weeks without coffee and "see" if the gluten in the coffee was an issue.
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    There is no gluten in coffee. Caffeine, yes. Gluten no.
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    Quote Originally Posted by New Scientist, 12 July 2014, page 28
    is there any problem giving up gluten containing foods? The answer is yes...

    If you replace wheat, barley and rye with fruit and vegetables, that would be a step in the right direction. But most people do not. Researchers have found that those going 'gluten free' on average eat more fat, and less fibre than people who consume gluten.

    For the vast majority of people, wholemeal wheat products are a very healthy option.
    So, I think they're saying in very fine print that yes, technically you're better off "gluten-free" BUT you are an idiot who won't eat right on such a diet; you'll go less-wrong with whole wheat.

    So, IF an individual does eat roughage, and eats any amount of fat without growing overweight, that individual needn't heed the conventional advice to eat more grain...? That advice, to eat more of something, seems intended really to mean less of some other things that are a real problem for "most people".
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic View Post
    There is no gluten in coffee. Caffeine, yes. Gluten no.
    Was it gluten like substances
    I wonder if this is what is wrong with me? THE COFFEE AND GLUTEN INTOLERANCE CONNECTION| DR HAGMEYER VIDEO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4AfkiRGCQQ
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    Gluten is a protein produced during the grinding and mashing of certain cereal crops... Coffee does NOT have gluten or Gluten like substances.
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Gluten is a protein produced during the grinding and mashing of certain cereal crops... Coffee does NOT have gluten or Gluten like substances.
    I would think the gluten in grains are produced by the plant rather than the processing.

    I don't know if there are or are not any gluten like chemicals in coffee. I'm just looking for relief from this illness I have.
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    Robitty

    If you want relief from an illness, ask a doctor. Asking idiots like me on an internet forum just makes you into another idiot like me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic View Post
    Robitty

    If you want relief from an illness, ask a doctor. Asking idiots like me on an internet forum just makes you into another idiot like me.
    I'm not asking you guys anything, it is an experiment I'm running on myself now. No coffee for 2 weeks.
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    I would like to quote a piece of an article I just read online about this.

    Let's pretend that scientists recently did a study on pollen allergies. As part of this pretend study, they put a bunch of pollen under microscopes and discovered that it was covered with teensy little bugs. The pretend-scientists removed the tiny bugs, put the bug-free pollen in a room with allergy sufferers, and found that nobody reacted. How would you expect the media to report this? The headlines would probably say something like "Pollen Allergies Actually Caused by Tiny Bugs," or "Pollen Not to Blame for Hay Fever," or maybe "IMMIGRANTS BRING DEADLY POLLEN BUGS ACROSS THE U.S.-MEXICO BORDER." You wouldn't expect the media to declare that "pollen allergies" were completely fake all along.

    But that's exactly what happened when a study this year looked at people suffering from intestinal problems that they attributed to gluten intolerance. After a three-week dietary experiment, the scientists concluded that the poop-troubled subjects' problems couldn't be linked to whether the food they were eating had gluten in it. Instead, the scientists theorized that these people's intestinal distress was probably caused by fermentable short chain carbohydrates, also known as FODMAPs. FODMAPs are pesky little motherfuckers that are not absorbed easily by the small intestine and can cause particular trouble for people with problems like IBS and Crohn's disease. FODMAPs pop up in wheat, barley, and rye, and these also happen to be the three most popular gluten-containing grains in the Western diet.

    In other words, people with IBS are probably going to feel better on a gluten-free diet; they're just wrong about why they feel better. They're mixing up the bad effects of one weird food part with the bad effects of a different type of food part that often occurs alongside it. Pretty simple. You'd think the news would report it like that, right?






    From Cracked.com
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  30. #29  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robittybob1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Gluten is a protein produced during the grinding and mashing of certain cereal crops... Coffee does NOT have gluten or Gluten like substances.
    I would think the gluten in grains are produced by the plant rather than the processing.

    I don't know if there are or are not any gluten like chemicals in coffee. I'm just looking for relief from this illness I have.
    No, it is not produced by the plants, at all. And it is not produced by coffee plants, which are angiosperms, but by only certain grasses, which are monocots. your coffee does not have gluten in it.
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    Daecon

    If you had read the original post, you would realise that FODMAPS are found in many foods as well as wheat, barley and rye. For example, they are found in much larger amounts in onions than in wheat, barley and rye. While giving up wheat, barley and rye will give some relief from FODMAP sensitivity, giving up onions will be even better.

    This is why it is important to nail down causes, and not just come up with misleading generalisations suggesting knowing the cause is unimportant. The reference you posted might suggest that it does not matter that it is a FODMAP sensitivity rather than a gluten sensitivity. But it matters a great deal, since the optimal treatment is quite different.
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    Well Cracked is a comedy website and not a science one (and it was about news headlines and sloppy reporting rather than Gluten itself), but I see what you're saying.
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    With claims of allergies and sensitivities becoming so common, I sometimes wonder if it isn't a socially acceptable way to say one just doesn't like a certain food. It got so I dreaded potlucks or office parties because I couldn't come up with a single recipe that didn't have some banned substance in it. And I also think it may cause people to start taking genuine anaphylactic allergic reactions less seriously. According to a recent study published in The Journal of the American Medical Association, nearly a third of people living in the U.S. believe they have a food allergy, but only 4% actually do.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robittybob1 View Post
    I wonder if this is what is wrong with me? THE COFFEE AND GLUTEN INTOLERANCE CONNECTION| DR HAGMEYER VIDEO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4AfkiRGCQQ

    I was blaming the milk I have in my coffee so I changed to A2 milk but the "ill feeling" I have is still persisting.
    Combination of many gluten proteins, we may not be sensitive to the main ones.
    HAH I love this. Robitty, you should probably check into your sources a little better. Someone making youtube videos in a Doctor's coat should be the first clue that this video is nonsense. Secondly, if you look what D.C. stands for after his name, it's a "Doctor of Chiropractic"which of course is pseudoscience. You can be a chiropractor in less time than it takes me to get a bachelors in anthropology, never mind the 6-8 years of grad school I probably will be doing after my undergrad.

    Never mind the fact that he is making this video representing this own corporation that supports all sorts of psuedoscience: Naperville Institute for NeuroMetabolic Solutions | Natural Holistic Treatments for Chronic Disease
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReligionOfTheSemites View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Robittybob1 View Post
    I wonder if this is what is wrong with me? THE COFFEE AND GLUTEN INTOLERANCE CONNECTION| DR HAGMEYER VIDEO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4AfkiRGCQQ

    I was blaming the milk I have in my coffee so I changed to A2 milk but the "ill feeling" I have is still persisting.
    Combination of many gluten proteins, we may not be sensitive to the main ones.
    HAH I love this. Robitty, you should probably check into your sources a little better. Someone making youtube videos in a Doctor's coat should be the first clue that this video is nonsense. Secondly, if you look what D.C. stands for after his name, it's a "Doctor of Chiropractic"which of course is pseudoscience. You can be a chiropractor in less time than it takes me to get a bachelors in anthropology, never mind the 6-8 years of grad school I probably will be doing after my undergrad.

    Never mind the fact that he is making this video representing this own corporation that supports all sorts of psuedoscience: Naperville Institute for NeuroMetabolic Solutions | Natural Holistic Treatments for Chronic Disease
    As I said I spent two weeks drinking tea only and no coffee, to test my own reaction to that change.
    The lack of coffee seemed to affect my energy levels I had 2 weeks of feeling sluggish but the feeling of mild illness never disappeared so I've gone back to drink coffee again.
    So it mattered not whether he was a doctor of BS or not, I ran my own "trial".
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  36. #35  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robittybob1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ReligionOfTheSemites View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Robittybob1 View Post
    I wonder if this is what is wrong with me? THE COFFEE AND GLUTEN INTOLERANCE CONNECTION| DR HAGMEYER VIDEO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4AfkiRGCQQ

    I was blaming the milk I have in my coffee so I changed to A2 milk but the "ill feeling" I have is still persisting.
    Combination of many gluten proteins, we may not be sensitive to the main ones.
    HAH I love this. Robitty, you should probably check into your sources a little better. Someone making youtube videos in a Doctor's coat should be the first clue that this video is nonsense. Secondly, if you look what D.C. stands for after his name, it's a "Doctor of Chiropractic"which of course is pseudoscience. You can be a chiropractor in less time than it takes me to get a bachelors in anthropology, never mind the 6-8 years of grad school I probably will be doing after my undergrad.

    Never mind the fact that he is making this video representing this own corporation that supports all sorts of psuedoscience: Naperville Institute for NeuroMetabolic Solutions | Natural Holistic Treatments for Chronic Disease
    As I said I spent two weeks drinking tea only and no coffee, to test my own reaction to that change.
    The lack of coffee seemed to affect my energy levels I had 2 weeks of feeling sluggish but the feeling of mild illness never disappeared so I've gone back to drink coffee again.
    So it mattered not whether he was a doctor of BS or not, I ran my own "trial".
    A trial that was based on utter nonsense, which we told you was utter nonsense.

    You were also told to see your doctor if you feel ill, have you done so?
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

    The needs of the many outweigh the need of the few - Spock of Vulcan & Sentinel Prime of Cybertron ---proof that "the needs" are in the eye of the beholder.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    A trial that was based on utter nonsense, which we told you was utter nonsense.

    You were also told to see your doctor if you feel ill, have you done so?
    It is an "illness" where you feel 99% right instead of 100%. Too mild for a doctor to even believe there is anything amiss. Blood tests are fairly normal. They have nothing to go on.
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    Then why did you decide that gluten was causing the issue, and why did you cut out a non-gluten containing food, rather then the breads and similar grain products that do have gluten.
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Then why did you decide that gluten was causing the issue, and why did you cut out a non-gluten containing food, rather then the breads and similar grain products that do have gluten.
    I cut out coffee, regardless of whether there was gluten in it or not, for it was often around 4 PM that I feel the worst and by then I'm loaded with coffee. It has nothing to do with gluten, I was just looking at coffee.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robittybob1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Then why did you decide that gluten was causing the issue, and why did you cut out a non-gluten containing food, rather then the breads and similar grain products that do have gluten.
    I cut out coffee, regardless of whether there was gluten in it or not, for it was often around 4 PM that I feel the worst and by then I'm loaded with coffee. It has nothing to do with gluten, I was just looking at coffee.
    Bull, I refer you to your posts #10 and #20, where you stated it was "gluten" in your coffee that was making you feel ill.
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  41. #40  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Robittybob1 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Then why did you decide that gluten was causing the issue, and why did you cut out a non-gluten containing food, rather then the breads and similar grain products that do have gluten.
    I cut out coffee, regardless of whether there was gluten in it or not, for it was often around 4 PM that I feel the worst and by then I'm loaded with coffee. It has nothing to do with gluten, I was just looking at coffee.
    Bull, I refer you to your posts #10 and #20, where you stated it was "gluten" in your coffee that was making you feel ill.
    I'd be surprised if I did mean that then. I might have used it loosely based on the video that was talking about "gluten" mimicking chemicals in coffee according to the presenter.
    Move on please, I'm over it.
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