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Thread: Mental concentration

  1. #1 Mental concentration 
    Forum Radioactive Isotope
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    Apologies in advance for a very sketchy question as I would have no real knowledge of the subject but (this being a science forum) as I was reading an article about the X-ray Laser machine at Stanford University and one of the advantages of the machine was that its frequency was so high and consequently its wave length was small enough to pick out atoms and potentially electrons.

    I think the rays were described as concentrated and so the analogy occurred to me that possibly this could be involved also in mental concentration.
    Is it possible that when a mind is developed and concentrated that the brainwaves become higher frequency?

    That would presumably allow the user of the mind to study the object of his or her thoughts at a finer detail?

    Like I said I am just throwing this out .For all I know it is common knowledge or maybe just a ridiculous impossible idea...


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  3. #2  
    Moderator Moderator Cogito Ergo Sum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geordief View Post
    Apologies in advance for a very sketchy question as I would have no real knowledge of the subject but (this being a science forum) as I was reading an article about the X-ray Laser machine at Stanford University and one of the advantages of the machine was that its frequency was so high and consequently its wave length was small enough to pick out atoms and potentially electrons.

    I think the rays were described as concentrated and so the analogy occurred to me that possibly this could be involved also in mental concentration.
    Is it possible that when a mind is developed and concentrated that the brainwaves become higher frequency?

    Can you provide this article?


    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
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  4. #3  
    Bullshit Intolerant PhDemon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geordief View Post

    I think the rays were described as concentrated and so the analogy occurred to me that possibly this could be involved also in mental concentration.
    I think you are confusing "concentrating" rays i.e. by focussing them with a lens and mental concentration which have nothing in common at all...
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  5. #4  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by geordief View Post
    Apologies in advance for a very sketchy question as I would have no real knowledge of the subject but (this being a science forum) as I was reading an article about the X-ray Laser machine at Stanford University and one of the advantages of the machine was that its frequency was so high and consequently its wave length was small enough to pick out atoms and potentially electrons.

    I think the rays were described as concentrated and so the analogy occurred to me that possibly this could be involved also in mental concentration.
    Is it possible that when a mind is developed and concentrated that the brainwaves become higher frequency?


    Can you provide this article?


    http://www.nature.com/scientificamerican/journal/v310/n1/full/scientificamerican0114-64.html
    Last edited by geordief; February 4th, 2014 at 06:05 PM.
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  6. #5  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by geordief View Post

    I think the rays were described as concentrated and so the analogy occurred to me that possibly this could be involved also in mental concentration.
    I think you are confusing "concentrating" rays i.e. by focussing them with a lens and mental concentration which have nothing in common at all...
    Maybe but perhaps the mind can be concentrated at the micro level as well as the macro level . (I am not trying to appear pompous or argumentative or obscurantist -just giving you an answer which I accept may have no bearing on much)
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  7. #6  
    Bullshit Intolerant PhDemon's Avatar
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    Maybe there are invisible unicorns doing part of it in the middle level too
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  8. #7  
    Genius Duck Moderator Dywyddyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geordief View Post
    You need a subscription (which I don't) but here is the link
    http://www.nature.com/scientificamer...can0114-64.htm
    Yeah: Page Not Found.
    Very convincing.

    Quote Originally Posted by geordief View Post
    Maybe but perhaps there are different ways of concentrating the mind -at the macro or the micro level.
    Whut?
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
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  9. #8  
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    [QUOTE=Dywyddyr;522263]
    Quote Originally Posted by geordief View Post
    You need a subscription (which I don't) but here is the link
    http://www.nature.com/scientificamer...can0114-64.htm
    Yeah: Page Not Found.
    Very convincing.


    this is the link again

    http://www.nature.com/scientificamer...an0114-64.html
    Think it works now.The final "l" was missing.

    Otherwise I found it by googling "berrah bucksbaum x-ray machine" -top result in the returns.
    Last edited by geordief; February 4th, 2014 at 06:22 PM.
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  10. #9  
    Bullshit Intolerant PhDemon's Avatar
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    ...and it makes no mention of "concentration" at all so what are you on about?
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  11. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    Maybe there are invisible unicorns doing part of it in the middle level too
    I think it is accepted that mental activity changes the brain architecture.Is the electro magnetic frequency the same at all areas of the brain ?(I accept my ignorance in this regard -I am only asking )

    If the architecture changes through learning does the frequency of the brain waves in the particular location also change ?

    Do brain waves even have frequencies? -again I don't know myself.
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  12. #11  
    Bullshit Intolerant PhDemon's Avatar
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    Not my area of expertise but your questions have nothing to do with the article you posted. Or maybe you can tell me what you think x-ray lasers have to do with mental activity, brain architecture or brain waves. (clue: nothing)
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  13. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    ...and it makes no mention of "concentration" at all so what are you on about?
    I thought it did but in any case it said something similar in so many words.

    To quote from my first post "I think the rays were described as concentrated" so maybe I was extrapolating -but not too much.

    It says that the wavelength of the x-rays are so small that the atoms (and potentially the electrons ) leave a shadow.
    To me that reminded me of a concentrated beam of light (and that is when perhaps I went off at a tangent in my own mind and wondered if the mind's attention could be similarly (not in the same identical way) focused.

    It is just an idea .I am not writing a thesis.
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  14. #13  
    Bullshit Intolerant PhDemon's Avatar
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    It's barely even an idea, it's an incoherent mish-mash of unrelated concepts.
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  15. #14  
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    It's barely even an idea, it's an incoherent mish-mash of unrelated concepts.
    Well I won't argue with you.
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  16. #15  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDemon View Post
    It's barely even an idea, it's an incoherent mish-mash of unrelated concepts.
    PhDemon, do you have to denigrate everyone who posts here in a manner that fails to meet your standards of scientific publishing excellence? The OP has made it repeatedly clear that they are just throwing an idea out there and asking if it might have any merit. A polite explanation of why it is flawed would be better than the sarcasm and presumption that the man is an idiot.

    We should be encouraging people who come and in an open and honest way ask for an evaluation of their ideas, ideas that they freely confess may be nonsense. Your posts alternate between really useful, helpful items, to ones as on this thread where you act like a bastard.

    I am posting this absolutely in my role as a member, not as a moderator. If you feel I am out of line, or the attack unjustified, I urge you to report the post.
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  17. #16  
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    There is no link at all between brain activity and x-ray focus. Brain activity consists of electro-chemical impulse transmission along neurons, plus assorted purely chemical changes. Focusing the mind is still just that electro-chemistry at work. X-ray focus is another thing entirely.
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  18. #17  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    The difficulty with your idea geordief is that you are confusing metaphor and analogy with reality. The map is not the territory and a napkin doodle is not a map.
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  19. #18  
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    Well I think it is right to say every analogy is flawed to a degree -they are just starting points.


    But if you are saying that my idea was extremely poorly prepared (with no real personal input )I will be glad to agree.


    On the other hand I think that electro magnetic waves do occur in the brain and I have read that they do have a role in the organisation of the mind (so it may not be just a symptom of neural activity)


    I read that in this blog (only after I started this thread) on the web and its author ,Jon Lieff has contributed to Scientific American for what that is worth.


    This is it
    Synchronous Brain Waves, Correlate of Consciousness | Jon Lieff M.D.


    I don't know if the points he is making have any connection with the point I am no longer promoting but I am sure it is a lot more interesting ( points that struck me were
    "Waves Measure Millions of Neurons at Once" ; "we cannot yet measure individual neuron cycles. " and also "there is still no way to conceptualize how electromagnetic waves related to the interplay of neurons could create subjective experience.")






    But I won't be contributing to this thread any more as don't need any more egg on my face and I also realise I am hopelessly unqualified to do so.
    Last edited by geordief; February 5th, 2014 at 08:08 PM.
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