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  1. #1 since project 
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    Time sensitive! 8th grade science project on manipulating a magnetic field to move by using electrolysis. My daughter's science project on manipulating a magnetic field to move through electrolysis works. I need to know how and why so I can help her. Neither of us knows exactly what is happening in the process. No one else seems to know either. Could anyone please help? Her rough research paper is due Tuesday, 11/28/2017. The whole project is not due till February. I went to the University weeks ago and cannot seem to reconnect with the Professor for help. I'll give you what he asked for and maybe you could please help?


    Salt water electrolyte.


    Dye #1:
    Water H20
    Propylene Glycol C3H8O2
    Yellow 5 C16H9N4Na3O9S2
    Blue 1 C37H34N2Na2O9S3
    Citric Acid C6H8O7
    Sodium Benzoate C7H5NaO2


    Dye #2:
    Water H20
    Propylene Glycol C3H8O2
    Yellow 5 C16H9N4Na3O9S2
    Blue 1 C37H34N2Na2O9S3
    Citric Acid C6H8O7
    Propylparaben C10H12O3


    The #1 works and dye #2 does not. She needs to know how and why.
    My knowledge of chemistry is limited to a semester in college. Every time I try to find answers, I end up with more questions. I have never seen this before.
    She calls it a "Magnetic Field Motor" because it works on the principle of Lorentz force.
    I can figure out that the sodium ion in dye #1 is the key but struggling with the Chemistry and Physics to explain simply and still be correct.


    I get the complexities of both chemistry and physics. I get the science of saying “initiate” rather than “start”. I need “start” as much as possible. I need simple terms an 8th grader can understand. I get how complex this is and the answer can be pretty involved. It looks very simple but it is far from simple.


    I need a dumbed down answer and some technical appropriate for 8th grade.


    The salt water is prepared in a petri dish.
    A neodymium magnet is at the center.
    The dye is added.
    The copper electrodes are placed mid way at the edges of opposite sides of the dish. Imagine a line cutting the dish and magnet in half.
    Electric current is applied and the reaction begins.
    Lasts about 30 to 45 seconds and up to a minute.
    Begin again.


    Thank you!


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  3. #2  
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt1066 View Post
    Time sensitive! 8th grade science project on manipulating a magnetic field to move by using electrolysis. My daughter's science project on manipulating a magnetic field to move through electrolysis works. I need to know how and why so I can help her. Neither of us knows exactly what is happening in the process. No one else seems to know either. Could anyone please help? Her rough research paper is due Tuesday, 11/28/2017. The whole project is not due till February. I went to the University weeks ago and cannot seem to reconnect with the Professor for help. I'll give you what he asked for and maybe you could please help?


    Salt water electrolyte.


    Dye #1:
    Water H20
    Propylene Glycol C3H8O2
    Yellow 5 C16H9N4Na3O9S2
    Blue 1 C37H34N2Na2O9S3
    Citric Acid C6H8O7
    Sodium Benzoate C7H5NaO2


    Dye #2:
    Water H20
    Propylene Glycol C3H8O2
    Yellow 5 C16H9N4Na3O9S2
    Blue 1 C37H34N2Na2O9S3
    Citric Acid C6H8O7
    Propylparaben C10H12O3


    The #1 works and dye #2 does not. She needs to know how and why.
    My knowledge of chemistry is limited to a semester in college. Every time I try to find answers, I end up with more questions. I have never seen this before.
    She calls it a "Magnetic Field Motor" because it works on the principle of Lorentz force.
    I can figure out that the sodium ion in dye #1 is the key but struggling with the Chemistry and Physics to explain simply and still be correct.


    I get the complexities of both chemistry and physics. I get the science of saying “initiate” rather than “start”. I need “start” as much as possible. I need simple terms an 8th grader can understand. I get how complex this is and the answer can be pretty involved. It looks very simple but it is far from simple.


    I need a dumbed down answer and some technical appropriate for 8th grade.


    The salt water is prepared in a petri dish.
    A neodymium magnet is at the center.
    The dye is added.
    The copper electrodes are placed mid way at the edges of opposite sides of the dish. Imagine a line cutting the dish and magnet in half.
    Electric current is applied and the reaction begins.
    Lasts about 30 to 45 seconds and up to a minute.
    Begin again.


    Thank you!
    I think we need to know more about what is being done here. When you say No 1 "works" while No 2 doesn't, what do you observe to happen in each case?

    I agree it looks significant that Na benzoate is ionic while propylparaben is not, being an organic ester. So one would expect when current flows, sodium ions would move toward the cathode and benzoate ions toward the anode, whereas propylparaben won't move at all.

    Ions in motion in a magnetic field will experience a force perpendicular to their direction of travel. Is this what you see? Is it a colour separation from a green mixture into yellow and blue or something? It would help to know what the yellow and blue substances are. They seem to be ionic as well (contain Na) which is baffling me a bit.


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