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Thread: Things you can't live without.

  1. #1 Things you can't live without. 
    ox
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    Apart from the obvious, what are the things you can't live without?


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    nitrogen


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  4. #3  
    ox
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    I was thinking more in terms of consumer products.
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    Forum Radioactive Isotope cosmictraveler's Avatar
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    1. Clothing

    2. Toothbrush

    3. Money

    4. Credit/Debit card

    5. Dwelling to live in

    6. Car/truck/van

    7. Food

    8. Water

    9. Electricity
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  6. #5  
    ox
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    Food should be Number 1. But which food?
    I am asking this question after watching a TV program called The Men Who Made Us Spend by Jacques Perretti. The list just given would have been the normal type of answer until the consumer revolution of the 1980's, which among other things was made possible by computer software such as CAD. Things that we had no requirement for suddenly became must-have.

    BBC iPlayer - The Men Who Made Us Spend - Episode 1
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    Consumer products? None, as I am not currently being kept alive with the aid of third party hardware.
    "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." -Calvin
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    Forum Radioactive Isotope cosmictraveler's Avatar
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    Food should be Number 1. But which food?
    As long as it is included on the list it really doesn't matter which number it holds.

    The link you provided does not work in America.

    The type of food you eat would be the type that you enjoy if available.
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  9. #8  
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    An hour long discussion about marketing isn't making me learn about anything I didn't already know. We all have choices to make in life and those who market their products the best , sell the most.
    When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ox View Post
    consumer revolution of the 1980's, which among other things was made possible by computer software such as CAD
    Uh what?
    Can you give a time on that video where he claims that?
    In the '80s CAD was (extremely) rudimentary 1, I fail to see how that statement holds up.

    1 In that it did little more than put a "drawing board on a computer".
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    I think the food clothing and shelter bits are pretty obvious.
    Money? Maybe as a trade token in the modern world but that just makes it a tool for obtaining the good old food water and shelter.

    I will try a few less obvious ones.
    Modern medicine, because in todays world most of us would already be dead several times over without modern medicine like antibiotics or advanced surgery techniques.

    Waste disposal. Our population densities are high enough that without sanitation services we would succumb to diseases brought by being inundated with our own garbage. Look up the history of water treatment and Sir Joseph Bazelgette to understand my point.

    Government. Sure we might think we could do without it but the main use of government, as far as I can tell, is to keep us from all murdering each other instead of just sueing each other to death in court.
    Last edited by dan hunter; July 27th, 2014 at 02:05 AM.
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    Perhaps more in the spirit of the thread......

    my fly rods, camara and hiking boots
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    Books.
    Coffee.
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    I'm with the duck, books and coffee would be on my list, I'd also add Real Ale, cryptic crosswords and bacon sandwiches...
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    Quote Originally Posted by ox View Post
    Food should be Number 1.
    No.

    Breathable air is number one (survive only minutes without).
    Drinkable water is second (survive only days without).
    Food is third (survive only weeks without).
    Shelter/clothing is fourth -- but can be tied with second or third depending on the environment.
    Tools/weapons -- needed to protect family and procure number three (food).
    Medicine/medical care is sixth.

    All consumer products are in seventh place, meaning it would be nice to have but can live without. These consumer "creature comforts" are First World and Second World necessities, Third World luxuries, and unknown to millions of other people.

    If there is a world catastrophe, we will find out how we can survive with only the first five on this list.
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    Wishing the like button worked so I could like Chucks answer.
    He pretty much roundkicked it out of the stadium.
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  18. #17  
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    That he did, for biological needs. I believe Ox meant emotional needs. So I'll say we can't live without de-stressers: Some people smoke a joint after work, others make a habit of watching the sun set with a glass of wine. In Japan it's the half-hour soak in a deep, hot bath. Or perhaps you'd like a pint of vanilla ice cream while your eyes glaze over watching cheap sitcoms. De-stressers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pong View Post
    That he did, for biological needs. I believe Ox meant emotional needs. So I'll say we can't live without de-stressers: Some people smoke a joint after work, others make a habit of watching the sun set with a glass of wine. In Japan it's the half-hour soak in a deep, hot bath. Or perhaps you'd like a pint of vanilla ice cream while your eyes glaze over watching cheap sitcoms. De-stressers.
    Maybe love or companionship should be on the list too.
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  21. #20  
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    I'm confused.

    Your brain? Love? Water? I thought ox said:

    Quote Originally Posted by ox View Post
    I was thinking more in terms of consumer products.
    Are we talking about things which are manufactured?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ox View Post
    Food should be Number 1.
    If he meant only consumer products then why did ox (the creator of this thread) make this post?
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  23. #22  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chucknorium View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ox View Post
    Food should be Number 1.
    If he meant only consumer products then why did ox (the creator of this thread) make this post?
    Maybe he meant processed food? I have no idea.
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  24. #23  
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    I did say apart from the obvious, such as fire, air, earth, food and water which would have been the reply from most humans who have ever existed. I meant as in consumer products since the consumer revolution of the 1980's which provided everyone even in the poorest countries with things they didn't realise they needed before. The case of computing is one such example. Only a few decades ago it was calculated that the world only needed 5 computers. Now it's more like 5 billion.
    An example raised in the TV documentary was the phone upgrade. Some people will queue for hours or even days to be the first to get their hands on the latest in the line of continued obsolescence. One guy forked out much money just for the slightly different design and colour. Thinking about it now I fell for that sort of thing once when I should have known better.
    Apart from that, then hiking boots, Naxos cd's, chocolate bars, TV (I've tried to live without it but for me it's sadly difficult).
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  25. #24  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dywyddyr View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ox View Post
    consumer revolution of the 1980's, which among other things was made possible by computer software such as CAD
    Uh what?
    Can you give a time on that video where he claims that?
    In the '80s CAD was (extremely) rudimentary 1, I fail to see how that statement holds up.

    1 In that it did little more than put a "drawing board on a computer".
    After 33 minutes of the video the attention turns to Mike Riddle the inventor of AutoCAD. Not having used CAD or AutoCAD I can't elaborate further.
    AutoCAD - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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  26. #25  
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    What do car crashes, bad breath, cholesterol, and ageing have in common? Project fear into the population and you have something you can't live without.

    The Men Who Made Us Spend - Episode 2 - YouTube
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  27. #26  
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    Quote Originally Posted by ox View Post
    After 33 minutes of the video the attention turns to Mike Riddle the inventor of AutoCAD. Not having used CAD or AutoCAD I can't elaborate further.
    AutoCAD - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    They're both (the interviewer and the interviewee) vastly overstating/ oversimplifying the case.
    Apart from the fact Autocad was, for the first few years after its introduction, more or less confined to very large firms (due to cost of the required infrastructure - computers in the early 80s weren't big in industry) and was more or less mainly for architectural work (building design) being able to change a design "easily" 1, 2 doesn't mean that it's any cheaper, or easier, to put into production.
    Changing the design means changing the machine tooling, changing the work flow, changing the...
    Design is one small part of getting something to market.

    1 Don't get me started.
    2 In fact (especially these days) having CAD means that the design process is extended, and is rarely as quick [to manufacture] as it used to be. Mainly because, in the "old days" of paper and board a workable design was accepted almost as soon as it appeared. Using CAD much time is spent (wasted) "exploring options" 3 to tweak the damned thing until it's "perfect". Oh, and THEN it gets sent off for numerous interminable analyses to see how it will perform.
    3 As in when the PHB says "What happens if we move that bit a couple of millimetres to the left and turn that bit through 90 degrees?". After 10 or so reiterations of this procedure the only logical response is "I smack you in the face and then go for a coffee until you come to your senses".
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