LinkBack URL
About LinkBacksSo a pendulum shift begins in some dude's bathroom... I just gotta hope.
4Likes
September 9th, 2013, 09:07 PM
So a pendulum shift begins in some dude's bathroom... I just gotta hope.
Did you mean, "paradigm?"Originally Posted by MoonCanvas
777
Last edited by MoonCanvas; September 10th, 2013 at 12:16 AM.
I think you using the wrong word to make a point making your statement absurd is far more of an insult. To yourself, that is.You've captured my emphasis beautifully; I envision a world where a man dressed as a clown can become president if they are the best candidate. You can take that as an insult(if you even notice it).Did you mean, "paradigm?"
The metaphor of a swinging pendulum, in which a viewpoint, trend, fashion, etc moves from one extreme to another is a commonplace piece of rhetoric. MoonCanvas has employed it here in what seems to be a perfectly valid situation. Your objections seesm to be groundless and ill-informed.
Common enough that I have never, ever heard it used in such a fashion. Now, let's see... I was not born last night... and I'm not a young man.
So you claiming it is "common enough" impresses me not one bit.
Your use of the word, "seesm"- a word that does not exist nor have any valid reference in literature seems ignorant and ill-typed.
No, I disagree. I think that what he meant to say was a "paradigm shift." That would be far more fitting and valid for the O.P. than the claimed and supposed "common" metaphor of a "Pendulum shift" used in a manner never before encountered. In fact, "paradigm shift" is a new buzz word, these days, thanks to the T.V. show, "The Big Bang Theory."
Far more common than the never heard "Pendulum shift" you claim.
Now, if he really did mean to say a "pendulum" shift- that is fine with me. It's still funny and worthy of scorn and it's still not "common" usage. Well... except among kindergartners, perhaps.
Get off my back, John Galt. Your personal dislikes and attempts at sniping from the sidelines are unimpressive and mostly just annoying.
I'm with Neverfly here.
Pendulum swing
or
Paradigm shift
Choose one.
I too have never heard of a pendulum shift. One of those words is being used in the wrong context, so it seems.
It could also be suggested that a pendulum swing represents a shift in opinion, but only where the opinion on a certain issue often swings from one view to the opposite view... so, are views on autism swinging back and forth (pendulum swing), or are they changing from one long established view to another (paradigm shift) ??
I have seldom seen a thread that went downhill due to a small 'slip of the pen'.
The particular poster in question has a certain history that makes it very difficult to take any topic he starts seriously. Aside from on here, he complained to a nearby school board claiming they sexually harassed his daughter.
He does not have a daughter.
The man is a troll that gets off on trolling and to be honest- watching a nonsense thread he starts derail does not bother me in the least.
The particular poster in question has a certain history that makes it very difficult to take any topic he starts seriously. Aside from on here, he complained to a nearby school board claiming they sexually harassed his daughter.
He does not have a daughter.
The man is a troll that gets off on trolling and to be honest- watching a nonsense thread he starts derail does not bother me in the least.
Yet, I do not think that he derailed the thread:
I did not say he derailed it. I was saying that I do not care in the least that I derailed it. Derailing a MoonCanvas thread improves it.
At this point, you're maintaining the "derail" by pointing out the enmity between Galt and I. You really should leave that between him and I.
If you don't like what I said to him; Tough.
Google "pendulum shift." Absolutely nothing comes up other than a single company's name.
whoops
Sure.
It is only a bit odd to display it in a public thread whilst simultaneously asking to ignore it.
*Moon makes typo, Neverlogic has excuse to ignore valid argument
Whenever I made good points in the autism thread, my opposition went off topic. It's called an apologist.
Not odd at all considering that is not quite how I worded it. I did not ask you to ignore it.
Fact is that J.G. jumped my case, as he often does, in an attempt to find ways of claiming that I'm ignorant- as he often does. Maybe it does not bother you, since it's not you that has to put up with it.
I dislike that behavior and I said so. You wanted to jump in on it and I told you if you dislike it, "tough." No one asked you to ignore it. I pointed out that you were prolonging it, is all.
And Mooncanvas, you have employed neither logic nor good points.
I think I brought up the vast similarities between severe autism and mental retardation, then posters began talking about their personal therapy experiences. It's a logical assumption for me to assume that others subconsciously went off topic when they were bested. I counted at least 3 instances.
I also recall suggesting that Asperger's and high intelligence are fundamentally the same thing(evolutionarily novel traits and social awkwardness are proven to be strongly correlated to intelligence) but everyone either ignored or never realized I mentioned it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conditi...trum_disorders
I haven't watched your video because I cannot do so at this point in time. If you are trying to suggest, and that's how it sounds, that severe Autism is just mental retardation, then I'm sorry to burst your bubble - but correlation is not causation. If I am correct in what you are implying, then you just got bested yourself... By the laziest browse that ever was. If not, my apologies for making the assumption, please state your case.
You should be careful with such assumptions. Imagine you're at a party and you start drunkenly making a speech about Obamacare. People might say, "Just ignore him." Clearly, they were not ignoring you because you bested them.
You think you brought up vast similarities; yet, the two are still vastly different.
Evidence of such correlation required.
I'm really glad you brought this up. Going by what you've shown, autism is just a blanket term for many different mental illnesses. It cannot be proven that someone with Fragile X syndrome has autism as a separate disorder since the symptoms overlap, such as the case with Kim Peek, who's autopsy revealed he had Fragile X syndrome. Let's pretend for a moment you did cure Kim Peek's autism(social inability); if he'd still have mental retardation and limited logical ability, then clearly he'd remain socially disabled. The only possible outcome is that you somehow increased his overall intelligence to a level that allows him to possess average social abilities, and this goes against the accepted concept of autism; "autism is a lack of emotional intelligence, not general intelligence".Conditions comorbid to autism spectrum disorders - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I haven't watched your video because I cannot do so at this point in time. If you are trying to suggest, and that's how it sounds, that severe Autism is just mental retardation, then I'm sorry to burst your bubble - but correlation is not causation. If I am correct in what you are implying, then you just got bested yourself... By the laziest browse that ever was. If not, my apologies for making the assumption, please state your case.
Let's pretend you had the ability to alter the universe in any way you desired. How would you go about curing Kim Peek's autism symptoms without resorting to increasing his cognitive abilities and without removing his Fragile X syndrome traits?
Intelligence & Evolutionarily Novel Traits:You should be careful with such assumptions. Imagine you're at a party and you start drunkenly making a speech about Obamacare. People might say, "Just ignore him." Clearly, they were not ignoring you because you bested them.
You think you brought up vast similarities; yet, the two are still vastly different.
Evidence of such correlation required.
Intelligent people have 'unnatural' preferences and values that are novel in human evolution
Liberals and atheists smarter? Intelligent people have values novel in human evolutionary history, study finds
The intelligent are evolutionary deviants? | The Mind Game
Intelligence & Social Awkwardness:
Correlation between intelligence and social deficiency - Psychology Wiki
I'm not entirely sure FG and Fragile X are exactly the same thing... Can you confirm this? Even so, the question is loaded. Peek had a deformed brain. Fragile X is considered to be the cause of up to 5% of cases of Autism, however, one does not need to be mentally retarded to exhibit severe Autism. Even if the symptoms are similar you cannot say that Severe Autism is simply caused by mental retardation. Feral children, for instance, have exceptional difficulty integrating into human society - is that because they're mentally retarded, or is it because they didn't have the opportunity to fully learn a language? Would that not imply that failure to adopt suitable socialization skills by a certain age makes it difficult for an individual to integrate, learn, and eventually become a fully independent individual? Could you not then come to the rational conclusion that if a child has severe autism, and never learns to communicate adequately, that they might exhibit signs similar to a child that has the fragile X mutation?I'm really glad you brought this up. Going by what you've shown, autism is just a blanket term for many different mental illnesses. It cannot be proven that someone with Fragile X syndrome has autism as a separate disorder since the symptoms overlap, such as the case with Kim Peek, who's autopsy revealed he had Fragile X syndrome. Let's pretend for a moment you did cure Kim Peek's autism(social inability); if he'd still have mental retardation and limited logical ability, then clearly he'd remain socially disabled. The only possible outcome is that you somehow increased his overall intelligence to a level that allows him to possess average social abilities, and this goes against the accepted concept of autism; "autism is a lack of emotional intelligence, not general intelligence".Let's pretend you had the ability to alter the universe in any way you desired. How would you go about curing Kim Peek's autism symptoms without resorting to increasing his cognitive abilities and without removing his Fragile X syndrome traits?Conditions comorbid to autism spectrum disorders - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia I haven't watched your video because I cannot do so at this point in time. If you are trying to suggest, and that's how it sounds, that severe Autism is just mental retardation, then I'm sorry to burst your bubble - but correlation is not causation. If I am correct in what you are implying, then you just got bested yourself... By the laziest browse that ever was. If not, my apologies for making the assumption, please state your case.
Autism is not theorized to be culturally influenced, yet your example relies on cultural influences such as language(correct me if I'm wrong). The "failure to adopt suitable socialization skills by a certain age" must be due to non-cultural issues in order for your point to be valid, and I do not see enough evidence to suggest we have intelligent individuals without proper socialization skills, let alone for non-cultural reasons.I'm not entirely sure FG and Fragile X are exactly the same thing... Can you confirm this? Even so, the question is loaded. Peek had a deformed brain. Fragile X is considered to be the cause of up to 5% of cases of Autism, however, one does not need to be mentally retarded to exhibit severe Autism. Even if the symptoms are similar you cannot say that Severe Autism is simply caused by mental retardation. Feral children, for instance, have exceptional difficulty integrating into human society - is that because they're mentally retarded, or is it because they didn't have the opportunity to fully learn a language? Would that not imply that failure to adopt suitable socialization skills by a certain age makes it difficult for an individual to integrate, learn, and eventually become a fully independent individual? Could you not then come to the rational conclusion that if a child has severe autism, and never learns to communicate adequately, that they might exhibit signs similar to a child that has the fragile X mutation?I'm really glad you brought this up. Going by what you've shown, autism is just a blanket term for many different mental illnesses. It cannot be proven that someone with Fragile X syndrome has autism as a separate disorder since the symptoms overlap, such as the case with Kim Peek, who's autopsy revealed he had Fragile X syndrome. Let's pretend for a moment you did cure Kim Peek's autism(social inability); if he'd still have mental retardation and limited logical ability, then clearly he'd remain socially disabled. The only possible outcome is that you somehow increased his overall intelligence to a level that allows him to possess average social abilities, and this goes against the accepted concept of autism; "autism is a lack of emotional intelligence, not general intelligence".Let's pretend you had the ability to alter the universe in any way you desired. How would you go about curing Kim Peek's autism symptoms without resorting to increasing his cognitive abilities and without removing his Fragile X syndrome traits?Conditions comorbid to autism spectrum disorders - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia I haven't watched your video because I cannot do so at this point in time. If you are trying to suggest, and that's how it sounds, that severe Autism is just mental retardation, then I'm sorry to burst your bubble - but correlation is not causation. If I am correct in what you are implying, then you just got bested yourself... By the laziest browse that ever was. If not, my apologies for making the assumption, please state your case.
The Fragile X mutation is not diagnosed by traits alone, it's diagnosed(and confirmed) by a very specific X-chromosome defect.
Right, but Peek is believed to have had FG, NOT Fragile X - unless you can confirm they are, in fact, one and the same.
No-one is talking about a cultural influence... We're strictly speaking about the effects of failing to acquire language, and how it too can be detrimental to cognitively "normal" humans. People with Autism have a neurological problem that impairs their social abilities. Therefore, the impaired social abilities put them at a disadvantage in acquiring language - which can lead to a failure to acquire. There are developmental consequences to this, however intelligent the individual.
Language acquisition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I got the 2 confused, it was indeed FG syndrome and not Fragile X syndrome. Though it doesn't change my question.
Disclaimer: I'm going by the context of the link you gave me. I take issues with diagnosing babies who don't babble as autistic, as I've known one person who supposedly never spoke until 6 but was discovered to have the language skills of a college student. I find it far more likely babies who "lose language" are really just refusing to speak because they're observing their surroundings, whereas ones who really can't speak are just genuinely retarded. Also, nobody ever mentions what the exact neurological problem is.
In a nutshell: Failure to acquire knowledge could be an intellectual issue.
Update- It is commonly recognized that a positive relationship exists between language ability and mental ability. Of course, 'autism' is meant to be a deviation from this. However, those diagnosed with Asperger's seem to be gifted when it comes to speech articulation, in spite of the fact they're on the autism spectrum.
Last edited by MoonCanvas; September 12th, 2013 at 02:15 AM.
Please bring further questions or arguments to the autism debate thread(on this same site): 'Autism' Is Discrimination
I'm not watching some YouTube video of what appears to be a homeless man in a shower curtain. Is there any chance you could summarize his points and back it up with evidence?
I think your comment has been made many times by many people, but each time, I do provide evidence(which is ignored so the comment can be made again). I presume the further evidence I provide will either be ignored or excused, and if it's excused then they'll provide no evidence for their claims(such as "using logic to deduce emotions doesn't count").
This good-looking individual's video, well, is a video. I'd hate to have to speak about it without you having watched any of it, but whatever. Mental retardation is compared to autism, with given visuals(footage of 'autistic' kids) and feedback on each one's behavior.
Evidence is the high rate of people diagnosed with autism who have mental retardation, 80% according to a center that researches autism. And when there's no mental retardation, there's no evidence to suggest poor social skills are consistently linked with autism symptoms, or else the users of Wrong Planet(autism forums) who took the "social intelligence" test(created by Harvard) would not have any above-average scorers. Some users scored very high despite having been diagnosed with autism.
Mental Retardation & Autism: Autism FAQs | UNLV Center for Autism Spectrum Disorder
WrongPlanet's Social Intelligence Scores: any aspie take the social iq quiz? - General Autism Discussion
I think the guy in the video has Asperger's
Your comment has annoyed me enough to go and admit I'm the guy in the video. These labels are inaccurate, pointless, and most importantly not real health problems. I know odd behavior is already looked down on whether the label exists, but now there's a copout to demonize me.
I had already figured out that much, I was just picking on youThat has annoyed me enough to go and admit I'm the guy in the video.
I had a feeling, but I still feel stupid for even bringing it up.I had already figured out that much, I was just picking on youThat has annoyed me enough to go and admit I'm the guy in the video.
So why the subterfuge? It's that kind of approach to a discussion that gets you written off very quickly. If you had just said, "Watch this quick video I made regarding my feelings toward the diagnosis of autism" I would probably have watched it. Instead, you alluded to it just being some random guy on YouTube (my life isn't long enough to endure every random guy on YouTube's videos) with, I could only assume, no credentials or reputation within the medical field.
Credentials and reputation? No different than judging someone by the color of their skin. It's the message that counts. When I hear the term 'professional' being tossed around, I typically don't take people seriously.So why the subterfuge? It's that kind of approach to a discussion that gets you written off very quickly. If you had just said, "Watch this quick video I made regarding my feelings toward the diagnosis of autism" I would probably have watched it. Instead, you alluded to it just being some random guy on YouTube (my life isn't long enough to endure every random guy on YouTube's videos) with, I could only assume, no credentials or reputation within the medical field.
I guess I can be faulted for not revealing it was me in the video. At least I won't be seen as a "troll" anymore since I'm no longer anonymous.
Let's rewind here again: Someone acts as if I provide no evidence for my claims, I provide satisfactory evidence, the evidence is entirely ignored because it's too valid to refute, a few days pass, someone acts as if I provide no evidence for my claims. Rinse wash repeat.
For once I'd like just one acknowledgement that I backed up a particular claim with supporting evidence. I showed an autism-forum thread where high-functioning autistics(without mental retardation) scored way above average on a 'social intelligence' test designed by Harvard, and I showed the strong statistical correlation between autism and mental retardation. This post seems pretty dickish, but this is getting tiresome(and now that I said 'tiresome' you'll say dealing with me is tiresome[well you'd of said that had I not typed these sentences that are in parenthesis]).
Is one of the diagnostic indicators of autism focusing on one particular thing rather than the greater whole?
If I understand that indicator as a definitive determinant, the swing vs. shift part of this thread certainly seems to apply?
You'd have to rephrase that for me, does not compute with Moon.
I am not responsible for any lack in your education. However, on the off chance that for once you will actually admit you are mistaken (or ignorant) here are three examples out of the thousands I might have pulled from the internet.Common enough that I have never, ever heard it used in such a fashion. Now, let's see... I was not born last night... and I'm not a young man.
Viewpoint:
JSTOR: An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie
Trend:
The cycles of history U.S. political pendulum due to swing left | Other Views | The News Tribune
Fashion:
The Fashion Pendulum | White Lies Knits!
I rather doubt your posts are free of occasional typing errors. For someone who "was not born last night" you do display unusually immature behaviour. Really, get over yourself.Your use of the word, "seesm"- a word that does not exist nor have any valid reference in literature seems ignorant and ill-typed.
Perhaps you can redeem yourself by apologising to MoonCanvas.
You are responsible for accusing ignorance regularly even when you've got to bend reality a bit in order to make it fit from your personal vendetta. See below...
Wrong. You see, you cannot just take something that doesn't quite fit and claim it magically fits if you refuse to back down. Pretending I will refuse to admit to my error (or ignorance) when none of what you posted shows any common usage of Pendulum Shift to talk about a change in the general idea or viewpoint of society. What you posted does not support your claim.
I have no reason to do so. He agreed that he picked the wrong word.
You're the one stubbornly trying to fit a square peg into a round hole, here. Claiming that Pendulum swinging is the same as pendulum shift (Which grammatically is nonsense anyway, a pendulum does not shift) is much like saying "Jimmy crack eggs and I don't care" is a common expression or "jumping to a concussion" is a common expression. Neither of them are.
I really do wish the forum software allowed me to put you on ignore. These last two posts were a total waste of time and are fueled not by science or discussion but by our ego's. You tell me to just stop- yet You Started the crap- as is usually the case. YOU need to just stop and stop indirectly accusing the rest of us of being too stupid to plainly see the way you accuse me of doing what you actually do.
Grow up.
My apologies, member Neverfly.
| « What caused the development of Gary Ridgway's psychopathy? | Improving the Online Data Repository » |
| Bookmarks |
Bookmarks |
