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Thread: Society vs Health

  1. #1 Society vs Health 
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    In the media, we are constantly told to exercise, eat right and make healthy choices. This would be easy of this were encouraged though. I could be watching a show about healthy eating then there will be McDonald's commercials 30 seconds later. My school said that they would take a "new initiative" to offer healthier choices for food. I never eat cafeteria food anyway, so I don't care. I was in a rush this morning and I ddn't bring food to school. I usually don't eat lunch anyway, but I was unusually hungry today so I decided to go to the cafeteria to buy some food. The specials today were cream of mushroom soup (high fat), cinnamon sticks covered in icing, and chicken burgers. I figured these chicken burgers would be okay since the school is supposedly encouraging healthy living. I was wrong. Society is always telling people to slim and fit but when it comes to offering choices, nothing is done about it. Here is a picture to prove my point:

    This is "healthy" because it has chicken in it:


    There was no other options. I'm trying to lose weight and this crap is being thrown in my face all of the time. I have resisted and I thought that food was so gross that I couldn't finish it anyway. It's the classic "it's cool to be slim and you get to party and drink beer". How does a person with a genetic structure that makes them have poor metabolism cope?

    I'm ranting again, oh well.


    Peace

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  3. #2  
    Forum Masters Degree invert_nexus's Avatar
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    You know what amazes me about the way that school cafeterias work nowadays? Many of them don't even cook for themselves anymore. They ship in Pizza Hut and McDonalds and Taco Bell. What kind of idiotic crap is that? How can anyone be ok with this notion of feeding our children fast food. School cafeterias are, in many instances, the only venue that many children have in which to eat healthy. They come from unhealthy homes where their parents are overweight and have no idea how to feed themselves or their children. Cafeterias should follow strict health guidelines.

    A problem with this, I should imagine, is that many children would rather abstain from eating in the cafeteria and would truck down the street to eat the local fat food junk shop rather than eating cafeteria food if it wasn't smothered in sugar and lard.

    But, the point is that it is possible to cook healthy and tasty, but it's not cheap, is it? It's no coincidence that it's often the poor who are obese.


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  4. #3  
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    Especially Western society is full of mutually exclusive philosophies. And we are so used to this that -- at least at first, before we set our mind in running -- we find it normal. There should be democracy everywhere.
    And so this crooked kind of thinking metastasizes (yes, thank you, Abraxas) onto all fields of life.

    We are thoroughly trained to not frown upon detecting contradictions -- even though our mind is originally set to detect them, and resolve them.

    Why this fear of detecting contradictions and resolving them?
    Why is one branded as "critical", "non-democratic", "causing trouble" -- if one merely states the obvious?
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  5. #4  
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    There is a dutch journalist who has lived a couple of months exclusively on McDonalds food without gaining weight. It's not as much as the food, but the selection, the overall diet that matters.

    McDonalds food is actually more expensive than a 'healthy' prepared meal. Poor people are, on average, less intelligent than rich people and more prone to not investigating what they eat, and believing commercials.

    I'm not shifting blame here, simply making observations. In my eyes, there is nothing wrong with obesity unless those people experiencing are bothered by it. And if that is the case, they can change it.

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  6. #5  
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    Quote Originally Posted by HomoUniversalis
    There is a dutch journalist who has lived a couple of months exclusively on McDonalds food without gaining weight. It's not as much as the food, but the selection, the overall diet that matters.
    There is also Tracy Boulian, who lived on nothing but McDonald's for 30 days (for a documentary; Super Size Me). During this time he gained 30 lbs., his cholesterol went through the roof, and I believe he had to be admitted to a hospital. This shows just how terrible fast food is for us. It makes me glad I haven't eaten at McDonald's in about 7 years.

    Quote Originally Posted by Closet Philosopher
    There was no other options. I'm trying to lose weight and this crap is being thrown in my face all of the time. I have resisted and I thought that food was so gross that I couldn't finish it anyway. It's the classic "it's cool to be slim and you get to party and drink beer". How does a person with a genetic structure that makes them have poor metabolism cope?
    I know there is no miracle diet, but in my experience this is about the best I have found: Not eating meat can have a dramatic effect on weight loss. I was a vegatarian for about 6 mo. before I was forced to start eating meat again after losing 25 lbs. (This was not intentional as I was only 160lbs to start with.). I found that eating large amounts of vegetables, particularly the green leafy ones, will fill up your stomach rather quickly.
    I ate large amounts of fruit, nuts, vegetables, and grains, also cheeses and other dairy while I was a vegetarian. I am also a very active person which contributed even further to the weight loss.

    Now that I am eating meat again, I have brought my weight back up to about 150 lbs and I find that I can not eat as much as before. This tends to suck when I go out drinking as I am often uncomfortably full after about 4 beers.
    - sploit -
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  7. #6  
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    HomoUniversalis,


    In my eyes, there is nothing wrong with obesity unless those people experiencing are bothered by it. And if that is the case, they can change it.
    How CAN they change it?

    Many obese people are bothered by their obesity, yet see no way to change it -- they persist in that state for years.
    Will you say they aren't bothered enough by their obesity, this is why they don't do something about it?
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  8. #7  
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    Quote Originally Posted by sploit
    I know there is no miracle diet, but in my experience this is about the best I have found: Not eating meat can have a dramatic effect on weight loss.
    I was a vegetarian for over a year. It really didn't make a very noticeable difference for me. Other people I know said that it was the best thing they ever could have done. I had to eventually quit because being a woman, I am prone to iron deficiency and my iron levels were low, so I started eating meat again (to be honest, I missed it too). I found that I did eat less than before and that I favored healthier foods more but it didn't contribute to significant weight loss.

    I used to be much heavier than I am now. I changed all of my habits and I lost weight (also getting tratment for another disorder helped too...).

    What makes me so angry is the fact that society is being separated int two categories: the beautiful and everyone else. I know this has existed for quite some time in human history, but it is being pushed even more in modern times. The problem arises when I will see TV shows or commercials with 85 lb women dancing with buff men and having a great time, then a Pizza Hut ad. It's the obvious contradiction that is confusing.

    Okay, I'll admit that I used to be obese. I lost weight through semi-healthy means and I became quite a good athlete. I was always a bit bigger than the other girls, but as soon as I lost weight and became more attractive, I noticed an obvious difference in the way I was treated. I would get invited to more parties, I'd be in the "in-crowd" which made me more social and the positive cycle continued. Then when I'd go to parties, we'd drink beer and coolers (which are very high-calorie) and order fatty foods. Everyone was able to pig out but me. If I even look at pizza, I gain weight.

    Anyway, my point is that we are all told that we are supposed to be health nuts, but it is not promoted in everyday life. What makes me even more angry is that skinny people who can eat whatever they want look down on the larger people who have disorders or different genetic structures. I do agree that a lot of fat people are fat simply because they don't diet, but this can be corrected by society.

    Ah, yes.... remebering good times. Since then, I've had a knee injury, gained a lot of weight (which I officially lost in its entirety yesterday) and changed schools (so I could work and go to school at the same time). When I gained weight, I saw how there is such an amazingly clear barrier between the people. It's a frustration, that's all.

    I think the McDonald's 30 day trials will all depend on the type of person that is doing it. I knew people at my old school who ate Big Macs every day during their break (literally, every day) and they were very slim. I knew that I would beat them in a cholesterol test anyday, but that doesn't matter.

    I know we are trained to follow the leader. I stray away from it. This has gotten me in some trouble over the years, but I'm satisfied with myself... I just laugh at the world that I unfortunately have to live in.
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  9. #8  
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    Sploit,

    ... I find that I can not eat as much as before. This tends to suck when I go out drinking as I am often uncomfortably full after about 4 beers.
    That's because your stomach is smaller. The stomach shrinks if you eat less over longer periods of time; consequently, you get the feeling of being filled sooner.


    * * *


    Closet Philosopher,


    I was a vegetarian for over a year. It really didn't make a very noticeable difference for me.
    I first even gained weight as I became vegetarian. I had to go back to eating at least some kinds of meat, as I was anemic.


    What makes me so angry is the fact that society is being separated int two categories: the beautiful and everyone else. I know this has existed for quite some time in human history, but it is being pushed even more in modern times.
    Not just pushed -- but *punished*.


    Anyway, my point is that we are all told that we are supposed to be health nuts, but it is not promoted in everyday life.
    The general formula goes like this: When you're healthy, health is said to be the most important thing. When you're sick, work/looks/etc. is the most important thing.


    What makes me even more angry is that skinny people who can eat whatever they want look down on the larger people who have disorders or different genetic structures.
    That's because those skinny people think that their being skinny is essentially their own doing, and that they are to take full credit for it. How they came to this conclusion ...
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    I tell yah, I just love Italian and Mexican food. The more cheese the better. Nothing like chemicals that make you feel good. Hot spicy Mexican food with a ton of cheese and enough spice to make those endorphins kick in, top that all off with a good dark beer. Will I die at a younger age, perhaps. Will I enjoy my life now, yes.

    On another note I stay away from visible animal fat and processed foods.

    Give me a bottle of wine and some good Italian.

    Fast food sucks, I've never had any that made me feel good.
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  11. #10  
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    Here's an easy way to lose weight.

    Go through chemotherapy.

    In a single month, I lost more than 10 pounds without even exercising. It's rather interesting to have to work hard to eat enough. I'm just nauseated by the sight of food. Even the pizza place owner was all "OMG! What happened to you! You look malnourished!" :?

    As for the rest of ye unfortunates who don't have cancer, how about the classic, hard way? Here goes.


    The Candy-Ass Go Home Regime

    DISCLAIMER: I am not a dietician. You've been warned. So don't sue me. Ask a dietician or doctor if this is good and safe before trying.

    Yep. The hard way. This takes willpower. This isn't for the weak. Wimps and candyasses can just all go home, because this is only for the hardass folk who mean serious business.

    We'd all be healthier if we permanently switched to this regime, but hey, humans are weak.

    Now commit yourself to it and STICK to it. It might take years before the toxic junk is flushed completely out of your body and mind. Well, grit your teeth, soldier.

    Exercise: Every day. At least 30 minutes of cardiovascular workout at least as strenous as a normal jog. Stretch first. Those two are mandatory. Then, on top of that, do some hiking, yoga, aerobic dancing (so just close the shades and turn on the workout video ... who cares if the neighbors see you dancing around in front of the tv?), running, treadmilling, weight lifting, or the entire works. Don't strain yourself, and always warm up, but work a sweat every day. This part is so crucial.

    Meat group: No red meats, ever. Only white meat. Avoid ALL animal fat. That's right. No chicken skin for you. Peel all skin off poultry. Just eat meat that has absolutely no fat. Hey, I said this was the "hard way". Yes, your meat's going to be boring and dry. So put a tiny bit of seasoning on it and just leg it, soldier. If you REALLY want to lose weight and be healthy.

    Dairy group: Don't you dare drink any milk that isn't plain white unsugared skim. No-fat (lowfat won't cut it) yogurt without a zillion tons of sugar is acceptable. Absolutely NO dairy product with fat or tons of sugar in it. No, I'm sorry, Hershey chocolate milk is no longer for you.

    Fruits group: Only have the fruit itself. Absolutely no fruit juices except perhaps half a glass of OJ in the morning, but avoid that too. Gateway temptation to sugary drinks. Many fruit juices have got as much sugar in them as Nestea.
    Absolutely make sure fruit is a significant part of your daily diet. An orange a day, perhaps, for starters.

    Vegetables group: Go for raw vegetables only. Plenty of leafy greens. Carrots. Celery. Cucumber. Bean sprouts. Broccoli. Salads should be at lunch and dinner.
    NO DRESSING. Not more than a single tablespoon of dressing. Don't you DARE. Salad drenched with five gallons of dressing is known as "junk food for vegetarians."
    And finish all those veggies.

    Grains group: Only consume carb-y material that has fiber or protein. Absolutely NOTHING that isn't whole-grain or nutritious (empty carbs don't count). So avoid white rice, white bread, potatoes, sweet potatoes, all pasta, the sort of bread used in pizza or garlic bread, etc. Go for whole grain bread or rice that's a mixture of grains and stuff (like barley "rice" with beans, peas, brown rice, whole grain rice etc).

    Miscellaneous: Multivitamins each day, preferably with a vitamin C supplement. No alcohol. People will recommend light drinking, but this is bull and ignore them. If you have "just one", that'll lead to the dreaded "just one more." Then you're a goner. Also, don't rely on smoking or any drugs whatsoever to lose weight.
    ABSOLUTELY NO SWEETS, DONUTS, DEEP-FRIED FOODS, CHIPS, OR ANY OF THAT TRASH.

    Fail to control that temptation and you might as well call it quits; you haven't got the guts for this.

    Water: Drink tons of it. Don't you dare touch anything other than plain water. Even if it's no-calorie, no way. Learn to love plain water or you'll be tempted, with that no-calorie drink as a "gateway" temptation, to reach for sugary drinks. Drink plenty of PLAIN water.

    AFTERBURN: After you reach your target weight, maybe relax a little bit on the Meat Group and Dairy Group, and have a pastry or something every week or so to treat yourself (the philosophy behind "treating" yourself to an ice cream or a sugary danish is absolutely fatal to your desire for weight loss, in case you're interested), but KEEP EVERYTHING ELSE. Make this your permanent diet. Continue your daily exercise routine; don't you dare slack off even a single day. Make it a part of your life.

    There. I think that routine's been around for a while already; I don't think I invented it.
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  12. #11  
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    Interesting diet. Personally, I'm all too happy about my own shape, apart from that part that I would like to regulate my own food-patterns more. I find that my muscle growth is halted by irregular food patterns. You can't control everything though.

    How CAN they change it?

    Many obese people are bothered by their obesity, yet see no way to change it -- they persist in that state for years.
    Will you say they aren't bothered enough by their obesity, this is why they don't do something about it?
    Now, there are people who are 'big-boned'. People who simple can't help being fat. However, this does not apply to the larger part of those who are overweight or obese. Those people can in fact change themselves through their own behavioral patterns. They can change, but they naively believe that a simple two-week diet or a cocktail will help them.
    Perhaps they are not bothered enough by their obesity. At least, they do not know how to vent that frustration. Their frustration should be a motivator to stop eating, not a motivator to eat more, as is often the case.

    Now, I have a rapid metabolism, and can eat, eat and eat some more. In my way of life, this is rather annoying, since I burn fat at such a rapid speed, that I have to eat incredibly regular to have enough sugar in my body to produce energy, and my life is not regular enough to eat on a timeclocked basis.

    Now, I have learned to live with this. I am happy with who I physically am, and I will except the consequences when I happen to die at age 50. I don't whine about it when I have a headache from a sugarshortage during training.

    Either accept you being powerless (due to weakness or force majeure), or change it. I despise victims.

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  13. #12  
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    People who simple can't help being fat.
    There's a suicidal way to help out people who absolutely can't lose weight, but would die in 5 years.

    Gastric bypass surgery is very dangerous, I hear, and will kill you slowly in a decade or so. Trade in 5 years of life for 10+ years of life.
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  14. #13  
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    Now, I have a rapid metabolism, and can eat, eat and eat some more. In my way of life, this is rather annoying, since I burn fat at such a rapid speed, that I have to eat incredibly regular to have enough sugar in my body to produce energy, and my life is not regular enough to eat on a timeclocked basis.
    Oh, how SAD for you :wink:

    Zero, I eat a similar diet to the one that you suggested, except it is even more strict. I eat mostly salads with fat and sugar free dressings which is basically vinegar and garlic, whole grain pastas, skim milk, very little red meat etc. I do not eat ice cream, cake, candy and all that other crap. I don't even like it anymore after stopping it altogether. If I had a normalmetabolism, I'd weigh 120 lbs. Unfortunately, I have been cursed with a bad metabolism. Ever since I've lost a lot of weight, I'm falling into the semi-attractive category. Mopst fat people I know are fat because they are too stupid to resist cake and pop. The only time I digress from my siet will be once a week where I go out and drink, but I can't give up my social life altogether (I don't even eat cake at birthdays for candy at Christmas). It's too bad that I have to bring salad from home that is limp and browning by the time I eat it, but that's life.

    I just thought I'd mention something funny that happened last Friday... A person ahead of me in the cafeteria line (a tacher who is known to be a bit loud-mouthed) told the cafeteria lady that her food tastes like crap and that the food has gotten progressively worse ofver the course of the year. Teh cafeteria lady turned pink and glanced over at me, who was smiling, trying no tto say anything because I was ready to add to the teacher's comment as well. Three people started laughing and I joined them. I couldn't hold it in so I laughed as well. Anyway, I hope the food will improve and I might give it a second try if there is ever a whole-wheat sandwich, until then I will only go in there to laugh at the oily pizza bagels and poutines and pick up a diet coke or water bottle.
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  15. #14  
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    A person ahead of me in the cafeteria line (a tacher who is known to be a bit loud-mouthed) told the cafeteria lady that her food tastes like crap and that the food has gotten progressively worse ofver the course of the year.
    It's interesting how the workers in these cafeterias often fall prey to a sort of 'good enough for government work' scenario. They become complacent over time and start believing that you'll just take whatever they're offering because you have no choice.

    I have to say that back in my school days, the cafeteria food was actually pretty good. I ate it every day, until I started smoking and had to spend lunch sucking down butts with the bad boys and girls rather than eating. I can't say for sure how nutritious and following health guidelines it might have been (although I suspect that it was up to par) but it was tasty.

    However, a few years later, the kids in my school went on strike because the food had become worse and worse and worse. On days when they would have rolls, they would be still doughy and stretchy. Other examples of how horrible the food had become was explained to me as well which I can't remember the specifics of. Anyway. The kids went on strike. They organized and refused to eat the cafeteria food.

    The situation improved quickly.

    The funny thing is that I got this information from my little brother and his friends but my little brother grew up in California and he told me that the food that everybody was complaining about as so awful and disgusting was heaven compared to the crap he was fed in California schools. He didn't know what they were complaining about.

    It just goes to show that perspective shines its light on all things.
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  16. #15  
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    It doesn't matter what you put into your body as long as you get the nutrition you need for a healthy nervous system, enzyme production and energy requirements. Eating like a bird can do more damage than good. A lot of those skinny attractive people you see are in as poor shape as the fat obese ones. So first thing is to dispense of the idea that being able to eat more is somehow a good thing. You do it to keep alive and healthy.

    Eating too little at large intervals will cause your metabolism to slow.

    Lack of exercise will cause it to slow.

    There are limits to your natural metabolism, but once you get down to a healthy weight (not necessarily slender!!) a combination of regular exercise, proper diet and restraint will keep you operating better than any of the skinny ricecakes you see on cosmo.

    Not to sound like a crackpot, but edgar cayce offered some sound nutritional advice for his time:
    http://www.edgarcayce.org/th/tharchi...e1/issue1.html (make sure you read the acid alkaline stuff)
    http://www.edgarcayce.org/health/dat...a/therapy.html

    It's the classic "it's cool to be slim and you get to party and drink beer". How does a person with a genetic structure that makes them have poor metabolism cope?
    By not being so attached to the concept of self(which is more of a disease than alcoholism in N America). You are what are.

    Yet another thing to make me sound like a weirdo- corpse medidation:
    http://buddhism.about.com/cs/meditation/a/Corpse.htm
    -- it also acts as an antidote to lust and, more widely, sensual desire.
    http://www.geocities.com/akselsogsta...meditation.htm

    I used to be so chubby and slow that I couldn't even run 1k. That was five years ago. Nowadays my friends call me 'runner'. I'm in the best shape of my life, training for my first marathon. Anyone can get to this level, just stay motivated and don't stop until you get to your goal. I know how hard it can be...

    As for the whole social thing... remember that people don't drink alcohol or gorge on crap for the taste. When they do it alone, its to seek a release from tension and transitory happiness. When they do it socially, its to conform. Both are dumb. If you find it so hard to say no then your commitment and resolution isn't very strong, is it?
    where oh where is sciforums?
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  17. #16  
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    sometimes i think the media are the ones that are really in control of the world/modern society and "they" - whoever "they" may be - want us to be fat and unhealthy because of numerous reasons, mainly consumerism reasons....it is impossible to switch on the tv without seeing junk food being advertised, they tempt us in many ways - uv seen the adverts - they associate chocolate with love, wimby burgers with youth etc etc etc
    i also think we have been "trained" or conditioned to eat far larger portions than actually needed. it started with our parents and our parents parents etc forcing us to finish whats on the plate...and that started with convinience reallly, family are together at certain times only and thats when u have 1 big meal, 1 shot just like that instead of snacking on fruits and veggies throughout the day. its so much cheaper to cook veggies than it is to buy a burger and it can be so tasty! but ja, my original point - and plz tell me what u think- the media, either a puppet for some larger org, or the media itself , want us to be unhealthy and to self-destruct for some or other reason....
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