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Thread: Credibility

  1. #1 Credibility 
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    Regarding sources principally- Prince has elected to start this thread in Environmental Issues but it is common enough generally- what makes a given source trustworthy?

    An obvious first question is "Cui bono?", or "Who benefits?" If something is obviously advertising commercial propaganda we know to take claims with the proverbial "grain of salt".

    What else fosters credibility or the opposite side of the influence, dotcomrades?


    The bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet notwithstanding go out to meet it.- Thucydides
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    Veracity Vigilante inow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Finger Prince View Post
    what makes a given source trustworthy?
    A history of presenting very accurate information and performing self-corrections in those instances where necessary.

    Now, if only you would stop posting in illeist prose like Elmo or Dobby the house elf, perhaps you would have more of item listed your thread title among the membership here.


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  4. #3  
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    He has a point Finger, you don't come off as credible and won't ever be taken seriously until you end the silly 3rd person game--even when making otherwise excellent postings.
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  5. #4  
    Time Lord Paleoichneum's Avatar
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    Agreed, you make god posts at times, but they all loose credibility due to the third person prose you put them in.
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

    The needs of the many outweigh the need of the few - Spock of Vulcan & Sentinel Prime of Cybertron ---proof that "the needs" are in the eye of the beholder.
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  6. #5  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Agreed, you make god posts at times, but they all loose credibility due to the third person prose you put them in.
    So you value more the style than the substance, how very sad. Here is nice quote maybe appropriate to topic, thanks for playing, dotcomrades:

    "Objectivity cannot be equated with mental blankness; rather, objectivity resides in recognizing your preferences and then subjecting them to especially harsh scrutiny — and also in a willingness to revise or abandon your theories when the tests fail (as they usually do)." — Stephen Jay Gould

    Prince is indebted to TSF for this discovery, long live TSF!!!

    Edit: In this sad and war weary post-Watergate, post-Pentagon Papers, post 09-11-2011 world, is there more a generalized distrust of authority per se? Paradoxically, phrase "conspiracy theory" seems to send many discussions down metaphorical rabbit hole, despite fact that conspiracies are very common phenomena, e.g. extramarital affairs, insider trading, surprise birthday parties, organized crime syndicates, list goes on.

    Endorsing official line vs "conspiracy theory" creates possibly false dichotomy and may well obscure real issue, not so?
    The bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet notwithstanding go out to meet it.- Thucydides
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  7. #6  
    Time Lord Paleoichneum's Avatar
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    Purposely posting in a manner that has been noted by a number of forum members to be detracting and then using "dotcomrade" which is very reminiscent of the red-scare/McCarthy era "comrade" moniker is not exactly trying to make people listen to you though.
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

    The needs of the many outweigh the need of the few - Spock of Vulcan & Sentinel Prime of Cybertron ---proof that "the needs" are in the eye of the beholder.
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  8. #7  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    He has a point Finger, you don't come off as credible and won't ever be taken seriously until you end the silly 3rd person game--even when making otherwise excellent postings.
    Perhaps one day Prince will be able to testify before Congress as did this Elmo, make of it what you will, heheheheh...

    Elmo Testifies Before Congress - Lowering the Bar

    Again, credibility? Truth is indeed stranger than fiction, and with that, dear dotcomrades, a very good night to you all.

    Perhaps Paleo prefers to be called "dotcommunist"? Let a poll be conducted!

    P.S. Paleo, Union of Soviet Socialist Republics is defunct, hence no threat, of historical interest only, much like a certain Senator from Wisconsin.

    McCarthy is a fascinating case in the credibility study- initially he had a great deal, but lost it suddenly. Thanks to Paleo for bringing this most interesting case up!
    Last edited by The Finger Prince; August 28th, 2011 at 11:45 PM. Reason: Afterthoughts and due credit to collaborator!
    The bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet notwithstanding go out to meet it.- Thucydides
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  9. #8  
    Time Lord Paleoichneum's Avatar
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    Somehow I doubt it and I have a feeling they would ask you to communicate as a grownup, rather then as a preschool aged puppet on a tv show.

    The German Reich is also defunce but somehow I dont think you wold like being calleda derivation of followers of that counrty political party. names do not loose all historical baggage if the country/group they are associated with is defunct.
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

    The needs of the many outweigh the need of the few - Spock of Vulcan & Sentinel Prime of Cybertron ---proof that "the needs" are in the eye of the beholder.
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  10. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Finger Prince View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    He has a point Finger, you don't come off as credible and won't ever be taken seriously until you end the silly 3rd person game--even when making otherwise excellent postings.
    Perhaps one day Prince will be able to testify before Congress as did this Elmo, make of it what you will, heheheheh...

    !
    Yes, but your posting style gives you LESS credibility than Elmo
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  11. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeteorWayne View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Finger Prince View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Fox View Post
    He has a point Finger, you don't come off as credible and won't ever be taken seriously until you end the silly 3rd person game--even when making otherwise excellent postings.
    Perhaps one day Prince will be able to testify before Congress as did this Elmo, make of it what you will, heheheheh...!
    Yes, but your posting style gives you LESS credibility than Elmo
    All the same, credibility is much like philosopher's stone of alchemical fame, with it all things are possible. Literally hundreds of billions of dollars are spent on advertising every year, the prize is HUGE. It does not take genius to discover truth, clown or even little child can say "Emperor is naked!" So, distinguished visitors to thread, perhaps redirect your attention to title topic rather than unimportant faults of your mostly modest dotcomrade, unless you wish to spend all night channeling Prince's former spouse on subject.
    The bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet notwithstanding go out to meet it.- Thucydides
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  12. #11  
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Finger Prince View Post
    So, distinguished visitors to thread, perhaps redirect your attention to title topic rather than unimportant faults of your mostly modest dotcomrade, unless you wish to spend all night channeling Prince's former spouse on subject.
    Was the very first reply inadequate in any way?
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  13. #12  
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    No, but seems to have gone off on tangent- good to be seeing you, it has been too long. Anyway, insistence that a certain person CONFORM to a communally accepted but essentially arbitrary standard in order to earn or retain credibility is from Roman "decorum", to be fit, in other words. People have an age old tendency to listen to and accept better those with whom they identify. This is a rhetorical characteristic of "ethos", for those unfamiliar with terms, as your humble narrator was until recently.

    "Pathos" is arguing from emotion, even that goes on in out little dotcommunity, if merciless ridicule and flaring tempers can be considered emotion, yes?

    Finally comes "logos" or logic, but this is often of limited utility, exception being when claims made are internally contradictory, contrary to accepted "facts", or remarkably improbable, which last may explain sudden decline of Senator McCarthy.

    All are welcome to comment and in fact most welcome to do so, long life and good health regardless.
    The bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet notwithstanding go out to meet it.- Thucydides
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  14. #13  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Somehow I doubt it and I have a feeling they would ask you to communicate as a grownup, rather then as a preschool aged puppet on a tv show.

    The German Reich is also defunce but somehow I dont think you wold like being calleda derivation of followers of that counrty political party. names do not loose all historical baggage if the country/group they are associated with is defunct.
    Point accepted, but members of Federal legislature have themselves sometimes used illeism, notably former Senator Bob Dole. Term "comrade" was around long before Karl Marx and may very well persist after Marxism is utterly forgotten, only time will tell, no disrespect intended. Prince's harmless idiosyncrasy has good but very private reasons behind it, and he asks only for modicum of tolerance from esteemed peers on TSF. He is here to learn according to his needs and to contribute according to his abilities. Third Reich was, as all must know, rabidly anti-Communist and in fact, identified as "monarchist" in literature of the day- ironic, no?
    The bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet notwithstanding go out to meet it.- Thucydides
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  15. #14  
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    Al right, Prince has me convinced. I might still make the occasional joke, but only in jest.

    Credibility is something that is earned, but we all still have shorthand criteria that is looked for in order to infer probational credibility. Sorry to say, but your referring to yourself in the third person and with the use of terms like "dotcomrade", you will fail the initial scrutiny of many. You might gain it back after the person in question has read a few more of your posts, but then you have the constant burden of having to break through the initial impression. This can only be a hindrance to effective discussion, in my opinion, and a time waster. Are the private gains you get from your posting style really worth it?
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

    "Gullibility kills" - Carl Sagan
    "All people know the same truth. Our lives consist of how we chose to distort it." - Harry Block
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  16. #15  
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    It would appear that while some paste eaters are illeist's, not all illeist's are paste eaters.
    Anyhow, third person self reference does seem consistent with a handle like "The Finger Prince".
    And being called "Dotcomrade", what's really awful about that?
    I was some of the mud that got to sit up and look around.
    Lucky me. Lucky mud.
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  17. #16  
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    Prince's posting style is an idiosyncrasy, no more.
    For me credibility=reference from at least one external source already taken as credible. Preferably multiple credible sources.

    Sort of the contagion theory of credibility?
    “Just think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are even stupider!”-George Carlin

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