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Thread: control?

  1. #1 control? 
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    We are coded to respond in certain ways to different environments, so they way we behave is predetermined(no free will?). Although not coded physical things also can also be predetermined due to certain laws. Anyway I'm just wondering if anything is actually by chance or if you replayed the big bang exactly you would get the same result.


    just wondering
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  3. #2  
    Forum Sophomore biohazard87's Avatar
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    First of all, thats assuming that there was without a doubt a big bang.

    So first of all, the natural responses that people are programed with

    A) do not deal with every possible situation we go through
    and
    B) do not always govern our actions. There are lots of occasions in which humans, do not do what they are naturally programed to do. I bet you do it every day. Do you put on clothes every morning? Thats not a naturally programed behavior, its a learned social behavior. Neither is "exersize," the natural program is survival of the fitest, and in the natural kingdom, beings stay fit by eating others, or by not getting eaten.

    Back to my first comment that you are assuming that there was a big bang, I said this because you are combining two non-agreeing idealologys. What I mean is that predestination is usually considerded a religious idea, where-as the big bang is more in evolution theorys.

    Maybe next time you should be a little more specific about what you mean.


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    WYSIWYG Moderator marnixR's Avatar
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    i would have thought that quantum physics alone would have put paid to the idea of a deterministic universe
    if we can't predict when e.g. an individual radio-active atom will decay, how can we predict where and when any part of the genome will be damaged by radiation or chemicals ? that's why mutations happen in a random fashion in relation with the its survival value for an organism

    so much for determinism - the clockwork universe is dead, and has been for a long time
    "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." (Philip K. Dick)
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  5. #4  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marnixR
    so much for determinism - the clockwork universe is dead, and has been for a long time
    God created the universe and its laws.
    The universe evolved and complexity emerged.
    Intelligence arose and the universe was thus able to contemplate itself.
    It turned to God and said "Is this a joke? Are you winding me up?"
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  6. #5  
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    (rofl). i accept that clothes aren't natural behavior but our code for instance decides how well we learn to dress ourselves when young, if we take too long and cause stress to our parents then they may decide to leave (due to their personalized ability to cope(code)). I suppose im going into the whole domino effect here and that if you understood how they fell over you could predict the rest.
    I don't know much about radioactive decay but is it that it will never be possible how to work out when the atom will decay or is there just no way yet? My way of thinking was that in the way we can predict the angle of refraction from the angle of incidence then similarly we could predict non natural things if we completely understood it all. I suppose you could put a religious spin on it by saying that God can predict things because he completely understands it.
    just wondering
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    We cannot make measurements within the system we are measureing, without changing the system.
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  8. #7  
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    ok so there may be a pattern its just that we cant measure to find out right?
    just wondering
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  9. #8  
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    Like a wave function, there is always a probability of outcomes or patterns. One can not know the outcome that was chosen with certainty, unless one enters the equation and makes a measurment, therefore altering the system.
    Why did God give me nipples?
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  10. #9  
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    ok but assuming you could take the measurement without altering the system( this does sound religous) would it be fair to say that the results could be predicted. What im wondering is if anything is actually chance or random or if its all predictable if you take everything into account. For instance could you predict the earth being formed if you knew the trajectory of the sepparate parts as well as gravity, velocity and such. Is it chance that you chose that path or could you have predicted it if you completedly understood how their brain would work?
    just wondering
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