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Thread: The Destructive power of Natural Selection

  1. #1 The Destructive power of Natural Selection 
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    The Neo-Darwinists love to claim how natural selection is
    a "creative" agency that weed outs the bad and promotes
    the good.

    The actual reality, which they are oblivious to, is that
    natural selection is a fundamentally destructive force.

    A new WWF report shows that species and ecosystems
    are verging on extincition due to the enhanced survival
    and reproductive success of mankind.

    But before you shed a tear for the pandas or the hippos
    , remember that we all share the same planet and the
    same destiny.

    Our "success" is but short-lived.

    The WWF says that "reduced biodiversity means millions
    of people face a future where food supplies are more
    vulnerable to pests and disease."

    Over population has led to overgrazing and desertification,
    overfishing means that we will suffer from a shortage of
    protein in our diet as fish go extinct.

    Water and energy shortages, compounded by climate
    change will push us towards increasing conflict and
    wars, famine and disease.


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  3. #2 Re: The Destructive power of Natural Selection 
    WYSIWYG Moderator marnixR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliopolis
    The Neo-Darwinists love to claim how natural selection is a "creative" agency that weed outs the bad and promotes
    the good.
    not so - natural selection can be a creative force, but does not necessarily have to be so
    after all, things in nature just happen, nature doesn't care what the outcome is

    + for every winner there will be a loser
    + just because you've been a winner doesn't mean you're bound to stay a winner

    that's what neo-darwinism says - your portrayal has creationist features to it, i.e. setting up a strawman and when you've knocked down the strawman claim that you've the argument


    "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." (Philip K. Dick)
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  4. #3 Re: The Destructive power of Natural Selection 
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    Quote Originally Posted by marnixR
    Quote Originally Posted by Heliopolis
    The Neo-Darwinists love to claim how natural selection is a "creative" agency that weed outs the bad and promotes
    the good.
    not so - natural selection can be a creative force, but does not necessarily have to be so
    after all, things in nature just happen, nature doesn't care what the outcome is

    + for every winner there will be a loser
    + just because you've been a winner doesn't mean you're bound to stay a winner

    that's what neo-darwinism says - your portrayal has creationist features to it, i.e. setting up a strawman and when you've knocked down the strawman claim that you've the argument

    If I let the tasks that run on my PC compete for shared resources
    on the principle of natural selection, what will the result be?

    I'll tell you: deadlock. With no scheduler to organize and synchronize
    there is an impasse, just as you would expect to see in a population
    where variants compete with each other as the selective pressures
    change as well.

    Your winner - loser argument doesn't hold water. If one variant
    monopolizes the genotype this destroys diversity and disturbs the
    balance that holds an ecosystem together. As I pointed out, we
    as humans are victims of our own success. We have reproduced
    and survived to such an extent that we cannot sustain ourselves
    and must fight over scarce resources. The result is that we are
    pushing ourselves to extinction. So we will lose to our own winning.

    And please: spare the "C" name-calling.
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  5. #4  
    WYSIWYG Moderator marnixR's Avatar
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    i'm afraid that your simile with a PC doesn't hold true - a PC can only run in a well-defined environment, exactly the opposite of the free-for-all we see i nature around us

    which is the difference between a designed object and a complex environment where order can spontaneously arise as an emergent property

    + i didn't call you a creationist, just that your approach is at times reminiscent of their tactics, which apart from the strawman includes the argument from disbelief and the false simile
    "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." (Philip K. Dick)
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  6. #5 Re: The Destructive power of Natural Selection 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heliopolis
    The Neo-Darwinists love to claim how natural selection is
    a "creative" agency that weed outs the bad and promotes
    the good.
    What does bad and good mean in that context? Morals & ethics? Adaptability? Performance? Efficiency?

    The actual reality, which they are oblivious to, is that
    natural selection is a fundamentally destructive force.
    A simple life form will have built into its DNA, similar to a computer virus, a "copy me" program, which inherently guides the life form to seek out the resources around it to make another version of itself.

    Two things occur through this process. The first is that the resources required to make another copy of the life form have decreased. Resources are usually finite in their capacity, hence will eventually run out over time unless they're self-sustaining.

    The second is that since the resources have decreased, the life form must now seek further geographical areas to find more resources to carry out it's "copy me" program, hence it must begin to evolve in order to maintain it's resource supply.

    Long story short is that if the life form becomes so successful at utilizing resources to copy itself, it will eventually get to the point where the resources can no longer sustain the life forms.

    It's all rather... pedestrian.
    Religious Fundamentalist Club - Member #1.
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  7. #6 Re: The Destructive power of Natural Selection 
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    If I let the tasks that run on my PC compete for shared resources
    on the principle of natural selection, what will the result be?
    If I put a tooth under my pillow the tooth fairy gives me money or when I fart it smells like roses. Please pick your poison. If you could put a computer in, oh say the middle of the Gobi dessert or the Congo and I mean just place it there…are ya with me…maybe another computer…no lets make it four, for god's sake they would have to reproduce and all…and your little computers could create a little computer population then and only then would your statement be a grain of sand in validity’s beaches!
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  8. #7  
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    Natural selection as "creative" is a subjective consideration as is it's "destrcutive" nature. Talk science - noty our obvious biases.
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