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Thread: Global Warming is not human fault

  1. #1 Global Warming is not human fault 
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    Let's try to discuss that human is not guilty for temperature raising on Earth. We always try to blame somebody or something but not trying to realize that we are living on living planet. I believe that Earth is highly adoptive and tiny humans are not capable to injure mother Earth in any matter. It's Earth that created us and we are just part of her.
    We must realize that changeable climate conditions have created life, and if it was stable, unchanged for billions of years it would be planet just like Mars. So, why do we panic about few degree of Celsius that the temperature has changed? Because we are scared. And when we are scared we try to blame somebody. It's not solution.

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    I guess you would happily walk out into the path of an articulated truck travelling at sixty miles per hour. I mean otherwise you'd just be showing you were scared and wind up blaming the truck driver for delaying your crossing of the road.


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  4. #3  
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    Quote Originally Posted by TruePath
    I guess you would happily walk out into the path of an articulated truck travelling at sixty miles per hour. I mean otherwise you'd just be showing you were scared and wind up blaming the truck driver for delaying your crossing of the road.
    I believe that I was misunderstand... To be more precise: for Europeans America is mostly responsible for global pollution. And what now? They are sitting in corner and waiting for America to do something. If they don't do anything Europeans could say that they are not guilty if the Earth became unsuitable for living and everybody dies...
    It is obviously necessary for all the humanity to find solution how to survive than to be so meticulous

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  5. #4 Re: Global Warming is not human fault 
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    Quote Originally Posted by nogard76
    Let's try to discuss that human is not guilty for temperature raising on Earth. We always try to blame somebody or something but not trying to realize that we are living on living planet. I believe that Earth is highly adoptive and tiny humans are not capable to injure mother Earth in any matter. It's Earth that created us and we are just part of her.
    We must realize that changeable climate conditions have created life, and if it was stable, unchanged for billions of years it would be planet just like Mars. So, why do we panic about few degree of Celsius that the temperature has changed? Because we are scared. And when we are scared we try to blame somebody. It's not solution.

    http://en-zone-savelifeonearth.blogspot.com
    I assume you will find out the answer with in 100-200 years if you live and the technological advancements continues.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nogard76
    I believe that I was misunderstand... To be more precise: for Europeans America is mostly responsible for global pollution.
    Fact: Europe is doing more about countering global warming than the US.
    Fact: on a per capita basis the US is contributing far more to global warming than any other nation.
    Fact: on an absolute scale America contributes a very sizeable chunk of greenhouse gas pollution.

    Europe is not sitting on its arse, but is saying "why the hell should we carry the economic burden of reduicng emissions when you bastards wont."

    But I'm not European, so what do I know.
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    think you will find, political and economical motivations of governments in many European Nations, lay at the route of decisions made. anything that can slow down the US GDP and economic structure will benefit, many of those same countries, who claim being green.

    it would serve no purpose for the US or these European Nations to set by, thinking the GW issue was whats said. the US will not sign Keota, allowing our industry to suffer and yet allow China and India to continue with their practices unabated. US enterprise is already producing product in these nations, which have fewer restriction on business than here. labor cost, given the credit, is not the only reason, industry can and will move. oil companies can design, build and produce refineries which are desired and promoted by many countries for a fraction of what it would cost in any state, much less the populated bigger ones with some labor.

    i find the truck analogy interesting, but its a truth that people will blame the truck. nature in this case is the truck and people are trying to blame her for all the ills, THOUGHT to exist. mankind, the man in this case, has no business trying to cross the trucks path. its a mighty big truck.

    conservation, keeping things green, water streams pure, garbage off the streets and sewage purification plants working all all good things which few would suggest we stop. vibrant economies and living standards are also good but for some reason a few very vocal voices are trying to make these things bad. oil based products are good things, have done much to make all societies what they are today. other pending problems, make a need for alternative energy attractive. as oil cost increase these alternatives will take hold and bring some cost down. its cost effective to produce million of a units that are wanted, but not so to produce a few which may or may not be accepted.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TruePath
    Quote Originally Posted by nogard76
    I believe that I was misunderstand... To be more precise: for Europeans America is mostly responsible for global pollution.
    Fact: Europe is doing more about countering global warming than the US.
    Fact: on a per capita basis the US is contributing far more to global warming than any other nation.
    Fact: on an absolute scale America contributes a very sizeable chunk of greenhouse gas pollution.

    Europe is not sitting on its arse, but is saying "why the hell should we carry the economic burden of reduicng emissions when you bastards wont."

    But I'm not European, so what do I know.
    fact is Europe, build more nuclear power plants than the US, has less natural resources to mine or process than the US, grows far less food products and virtually no meat products compared to the US...

    fact is mankind in total produces 5% of all greenhouse gases that are in the lower atmosphere. nature 95%. then the largest contributors are those with the best forest, most active volcanoes, most animals and life that breaths. that figure i am unaware of.

    fact is our atmosphere is 77% nitrogen, 22% oxygen, .045 CO2 with a trace of many others including methane. this is a total and would be very hard to figure just who does what when.

    fact is no country, including the US, is NOT giving some thoughts to the theories suggested by a few. there is simply no acceptable reason to go overboard.

    i am proud to be American, just as proud to be in the world community and wish the best for all....
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    Right, another round of are we? aren't we?

    Fact : We don't know for sure (100%) if its man made or natural.
    The recent UN report on climate change (which was made by 2,500 INTERNATIONAL scientists) stated that it was highly likely to be man made. That also means that its unlikely but still possible to be natural, which in turn means we still don't know for sure.

    As conspiracy theory's go......

    think you will find, political and economical motivations of governments in many European Nations, lay at the route of decisions made. anything that can slow down the US GDP and economic structure will benefit, many of those same countries, who claim being green.
    I think its more likely that Elvis is still alive and America didn't go to the moon.

    -------------

    The U.S under Clinton, did sign the kyoto agreement but didn't ratified it because they didn't want to be tied down to an agreement that could damage their economy and because it didn't include set targets and timetables for developing as well as developed country's.
    But they are doing their bit though..... http://www.state.gov/g/oes/rls/fs/46741.htm

    Europe is also taking some action on climate change, such as (as jackson mentioned) replacing coal power stations with nuclear power stations when they need replacing, which i think is a good thing. But speaking as a British citizen and therefor a European, Europe could and should be doing more, much of what people have heard from the E.U is nothing more than hot air.

    Unless the U.S and the E.U do more nobody is going to be able to convince India, China, Russia or Brazil to build a clean economy while they are growing.

    Maybe we should all take a leaf out of Australia's book.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asi...ic/6378161.stm

    --------

    nogard76, yes the planet has always had climate changes and you are right to point out that this has helped create life, life will go on, humans will still be here. But its the suffering it could cause, the possible loss of life and a change (lowering) in our standard of living which is our main concern.

    To be more precise: for Europeans America is mostly responsible for global pollution.
    It is, the U.S produces 36% of the worlds green house gases. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3143798.stm
    The E.U is not far behind though on 22%, then China, Russia, Japan and then India.
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  10. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat1981(England)
    much of what people have heard from the E.U is nothing more than hot air.
    EUREKA, we have just discovered the cause of global warming, it's the politicions
    Come see some of my art work at http://nevyn-pendragon.deviantart.com/
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    LOL, you could be on too something there Nevyn.
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  12. #11  
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    Thank you, i was think that too... 8)
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    Politics, politics...
    Politicians protects economy, most powerful people on the planet are created by economy, and they dominate over politicians. That's closed circle and you can always blame them but it cannot be changed, at least not as fast as it is necessary. Probably it will last longer than humanity...
    I see that everybody on this forum is revolted that nothing really is doing to save the earth. (No, not to save the Earth but to save humans. Earth will survive, it will stay where it is now and we are going to struggle to survive.)
    But, look where every debate goes (like this one I started). Everybody tries to point the finger in somebody! What is the point of it? How can anybody dare to blame somebody else when every tiny human on this planet contribute in polluting? Why is everybody trying to pretend smart with some statistics, and nobody is smart enough to say: And the answer is...! Is it so hard? If we cannot find answer now, how are we going to when it will be worse?

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    There will never be a solution until the majority of people really care about it. Government and lawmakers don't care unless the people do too. And most people don't care because it's a "down the road" problem, not something that affects their daily lives. So I wouldn't be surprised if there was no significant improvement until there is a serious problem.
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    the point is, there is no solution unless man is responsible. if what is going on or this minor upswing in temperatures, is a cycle and not some man made entity, then whats to fix, if we could.

    in Europe you pay very high fuel taxes. this was intended to keep you off the roads also to pay to fix those roads or build new ones. you need to see just where this money is really going and then say GW is not political.
    we also try to control people with taxes, but transportation is vital to our economy, which is given credit to possible election to office. our smokes and beer cost are 75% taxes and fuel still just 50% or so. governments will always tax where they can give cause.

    most surveys i have seen show the US contributions at 25% or less. i am sure i can find sites on man made GW, showing how the US is responsible for all GW, even if indirectly.

    on Australia's mandates for bulbs; this is bad precedent. if allowed to happen there is no limit to what can and WILL be mandated, in the future.
    take a short course on Cuban History, and get my point.

    if anyone really thinks the past was better for the environment, i would suggest a trip to the back woods of any third world nation. oxen carry the goods from village to village, no one cleans the roads and those ox create more CO2 and methane than any car, per mile. the towns are serviced by horse drawn carts and the smell equals any feed lot.
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    Another theory concludes that now we are leaving in an interglacial period after a small Ice Age (17-18th. centuries). And now climate is returning on its beginning.
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    if govenments seriously wanted to go green, then they would introduce a green tax discount for those that did;people who go green getting council tax discounts rather than imposing taxes on the people that don't
    Come see some of my art work at http://nevyn-pendragon.deviantart.com/
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  18. #17  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nevyn
    if govenments seriously wanted to go green, then they would introduce a green tax discount for those that did;people who go green getting council tax discounts rather than imposing taxes on the people that don't
    i dislike the idea, but in the US, you can receive tax credits on many items considered Green. hybrid cars and some items by the fed and many states give extended credits for a number of things. mandates are involved indirectly through requirements of efficiency. the housing industry has a Green house, which they are trying get established into the tax breaks.
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    Lets start with the fundamentals... What is global warming? Global warming is the tempurature on earth going up. DUH. But what causes it? Well, greenhouse gas emmisions as most people know. What are greenhouse gasses? A wide range of gasses that are in our atmosphere like CO2. How do greenhouse gasses affect global warming? When the suns rays hit the earths surface some bounces off. When it bounces off our greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere trap most of the suns rays, but also some escapes. The bottom line is that the more greenhouse gasses are in our atmosphere the more rays get trapped and the warmer the earth gets.

    Even if the global warming is natural, people are speeding up that natural process. Everyday we throw TONNES of CO2 into our atmosphere. Cars. Power Plants. Manufacturing Plants. The list goes on and on. Even without measuring CO2 levels we know we are putting a lot in the atmosphere and it is quite clear that we are having an effect.

    We each have to play a part in fixing this. And I agree, if enough people speak out then politicians will have to answer. But why are they so reluctant to do something without us first telling them.

    Millions of dollars are spent on industries that produce greenhouse gasses. Many of these industries are big contributers to econonmies across the globe. Governments are afraid their economy will be ruined by shutting down the companies and this is the biggest reason why governments have trouble committing to solutions to global warming. But I think this obstacle is easily avoidable. Instead of putting money into those industries, put money into companies that could find a way to do the same thing but cleaner. This will help in 2 ways. Firstly, there will be research done in cleaner products and secondly, companies who have been getting less money from the government will feel pressured into cleaning up their act so they could get more money.
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    Yes, i agree. No government has ever stayed in power if the counties economy is performing poorly, and we already have the technology to stop our contributions to global warming, but implementing them would slow down their economy's. Unless someone provides 100% prof that the current global warming is man made they will continue to do nothing. In the mean time we must all play our own part by minimising our own contribution to the problem.
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    good idea, lets go with the fundamentals...

    GW is not a man made phenomenon. nor is man the cause for cold spells, the rain outside my window or the blizzards in Wyoming. weather patterns, or if you prefer nature is and man cannot control nature. crops, people and vacation plans are destroyed daily but nature.

    mans contributions to the CO2 and harmful elements in our atmosphere is part of 5% of the .045 % total of what is in the atmosphere and nature contributes 95% of this same .045. ours them about the same as throwing a bucket of water in the ocean during a thunder storm.

    of mans contributions, industrial is near the bottom of the list. agriculture contribute the most, ironically creating the food and oxygen we seem to require. if you want a major contributor, try adding all the living things that breath in air and breath out CO2. Best remember however that this is food for all that requires CO2 to breath (so to speak) and produce that foods and oxygen. if anything maybe a little concern should go to the lack of supply of CO2, for this purpose.

    the range of elements in the atmosphere we breath are not that many. nitrogen 77%, Oxygen 22% as said CO2 .045 and traces of a few others.
    talk about tons??? 99+% has nothing to do with any theory of GW.

    with all mans demonstrative action; quality of life, life spans, mortality rates and many nice things are at all time global highs. there are 800 families with untold species in each alive and doing just fine. this also is thought to be at an all time planet high. this is as true in the oceans as it is on land. oceans are 70% of the planets service. Man with all its efforts has a sparse existence on 15-20%. life, sparse or in quantities well above mans, occupies all the surface.

    you have no idea, how much has been spent on cleaning up so many things and paid for by the people already and this will continue. probably at faster rates than if extremist would leave well enough alone. nuclear power, has no competitors for efficiency or environmental adaptations but a forbidden entity for those that prefer an issue, not a cure....
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  22. #21  
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackson33
    Quote Originally Posted by TruePath
    Quote Originally Posted by nogard76
    I believe that I was misunderstand... To be more precise: for Europeans America is mostly responsible for global pollution.
    Fact: Europe is doing more about countering global warming than the US.
    Fact: on a per capita basis the US is contributing far more to global warming than any other nation.
    Fact: on an absolute scale America contributes a very sizeable chunk of greenhouse gas pollution.

    Europe is not sitting on its arse, but is saying "why the hell should we carry the economic burden of reduicng emissions when you bastards wont."

    But I'm not European, so what do I know.
    fact is Europe, build more nuclear power plants than the US, has less natural resources to mine or process than the US, grows far less food products and virtually no meat products compared to the US...
    Never before so few words annhilated such amount of credibility in such utter way...
    “If the misery of the poor be caused not by the laws of nature, but by our institutions, great is our sin.” -Charles Darwin
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