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Thread: Who will be liable in the Oso wa state landslide

  1. #1 Who will be liable in the Oso wa state landslide 
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    Washington mudslide warned about 15 years ago by geologists | Mail Online

    Washington mudslide warned about 15 years ago by geologists | Mail Online


    SOMEONE SHOULD get sued


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  3. #2  
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    Suing isn't going to bring any lives back.

    Beside who are you going to sue. What would that help? It would likely interfere with lessons learned by other agencies similarly prone to natural disasters about information management, zoning and education of the public.


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    Geologists warned about Washington landslide 15 years ago: Before and after shots clearly show the lethal geography that has worried experts since 1999.
    In a report filed with the US Army Corps of Engineers, geologists warned of 'the potential for a large catastrophic failure' 15 years ago.

    'We've known it would happen at some point, we just didn't know when,' co-author Daniel Miller told The Seattle Times.
    Geological reports warning the hill is in imminent danger of collapse date back to the 1950s.
    But the alerts, issued by experts every ten years, went unnoticed.

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...9cDI-Fs48LXyzg


    So the people who decided to build there are themselves liable for their own ignorance.
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  5. #4  
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    Why should someone be sued?
    "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." -Calvin
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  6. #5  
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    I believe that the slide is deemed "an act of GOD"
    So sue god
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    My main objection is that its far too early.

    Law suits are intended to figure out how to compensate others for negligence and gross negligence--almost always through monetary compensation.

    It IS in the public interest to figure out why that area was so built up. Was the county and state aware of the problem and the reports showing the hazard? Did the laws not allow them to consider that hazard to restrict housing there? Was there a permit and check system in place by the county before construction (almost always yes now days)? Were people living in homes built after the restrictions were put in place and effectively grandfathered? Were any restrictions enforced?

    Rather than a law suit, which honestly aren't well suited to figure out reasons for the failure of government and public education....the public would be much better served by demanding a full investigation by the state attorney general in conjunction with other agencies--and hopefully with federal cooperation. If and only if that report suggest negligence or corruption that put people in the hazard area should any law suits be considered.

    Also, WA State does not compensate for pain and suffering...only actual cost.
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    Here, people, who choose not to think, buy or build in flood plains......................and, then it rains and rains and the water rises and rises, and they cry out for financial help.

    .............."Oh, but it was so pretty.".........
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  9. #8  
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    living on planet earth is always with risk. the earth is a dynamic planet and danger will always be present. human liabaility can probably be determined in some natural disasters but not all.
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    mud fell on road-the state didnt repair wall etc -anyone could have been killed
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    related issue

    Real Cause of Colorado Fires: Refusal to Clear Brush and Tree’s NOT Discredited “Climate Change”.


    http://capoliticalnews.com/2012/07/06/real-cause-of-colorado-fires-refusal-to-clear-brush-and-tree’s-not-discredited-“climate-change”/
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  12. #11  
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHolmes View Post
    mud fell on road-the state didnt repair wall etc -anyone could have been killed
    I suggest you actually look at some information about the disaster before posting again. That's not what happened.
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  13. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHolmes View Post
    mud fell on road-the state didnt repair wall etc -anyone could have been killed
    Bull. As clearly shown in the images of the area, that is NOT what happened
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by SHolmes View Post
    mud fell on road-the state didnt repair wall etc -anyone could have been killed
    Bull. As clearly shown in the images of the area, that is NOT what happened

    images?on tv?on internet?

    i thought i saw a road blocked on tv

    wikipedia says state route 530 is blocked for 3 miles

    a square mile of area is destroyed with mud which includes small roads -i dont see why youre disputing this-i dont get it

    this is exasperating and pointless

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washing...te_530#History

    As of March 2014, three miles of the highway are "blocked indefinitely" due to the 2014 Oso mudslide.[3
    Last edited by SHolmes; March 31st, 2014 at 05:23 AM.
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    i am in WA state too about 50 miles from the damn thing-i say the politicians did nothing and they knew

    if tiles are falling off the kingdome and killing people and the officials know of this or if they are hanging by a thread and they knew, you say no one is liable?

    snohomish county- what a fraud - Wikipedia says the previous county executive was fired and had an affair and the new one is a democrat and seems to know nothing and that guy died in the jail there with the milk allergy and no one got sued or was fired --that place is corrupt i think and so is king county with voter fraud- stealing the election from Rossi in 08
    Last edited by SHolmes; March 31st, 2014 at 05:31 AM.
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  16. #15  
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHolmes View Post
    i am in WA state too about 50 miles from the damn thing-i say the politicians did nothing and they knew

    if tiles are falling off the kingdome and killing people and the officials know of this or if they are hanging by a thread and they knew, you say no one is liable?

    snohomish county- what a fraud - Wikipedia says the previous county executive was fired and had an affair and the new one is a democrat and seems to know nothing and that guy died in the jail there with the milk allergy and no one got sued or was fired --that place is corrupt i think and so is king county with voter fraud- stealing the election from Rossi in 08
    There was a catastrophic collapse of the hillside, thats a LITTLE BIT MORE then just "mud fell on the road".

    The kingdom was a private venue and has no relation to the subject at hand. Also the deaths were during cleanup of the tiles in a crane accident and not caused by the falling tiles.

    Ah yes, because its obviously democrats faults that this happened. NO its not.

    Rossi lost by a fair vote, it was not stolen.
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

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  17. #16  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paleoichneum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by SHolmes View Post
    i am in WA state too about 50 miles from the damn thing-i say the politicians did nothing and they knew

    if tiles are falling off the kingdome and killing people and the officials know of this or if they are hanging by a thread and they knew, you say no one is liable?

    snohomish county- what a fraud - Wikipedia says the previous county executive was fired and had an affair and the new one is a democrat and seems to know nothing and that guy died in the jail there with the milk allergy and no one got sued or was fired --that place is corrupt i think and so is king county with voter fraud- stealing the election from Rossi in 08
    There was a catastrophic collapse of the hillside, thats a LITTLE BIT MORE then just "mud fell on the road".

    The kingdom was a private venue and has no relation to the subject at hand. Also the deaths were during cleanup of the tiles in a crane accident and not caused by the falling tiles.

    Ah yes, because its obviously democrats faults that this happened. NO its not.

    Rossi lost by a fair vote, it was not stolen.
    i watch TV too and im in WA so i think i know how bad it is

    well i guess democrats aren't litigious only if its there issue like when Gore "won in Florida"

    i give up on this post -youre an argumentative Democrat -its very clear

    i say people will get sued bigtime
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  18. #17  
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    Someone should get punished (as in go to prison) ...

    ... and normally I would say that it's the ones (ie, Oso employees) who issued the construction permits because the US Army Corps of Engineers must have told Oso of these dangers, and then Oso simply turned around and allowed people to build there. However, Oso is a CDP (Census-Designated Place), whatever that is — apparently a so-called unincorporated area.

    And so, maybe the failure lies with county officials. For example, usually the land must pass a "perc" test to ensure the septic system will function properly. Well, whoever requires perc tests for properties in Oso would most likely be the one responsible to refuse land owners their building permits.

    Maybe this is one of those lawless instances where responsibilities slipped through the cracks in the system; then the responsibility is on the owners of the properties.
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  19. #18  
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrmonroe View Post
    Someone should get punished (as in go to prison) ...
    You mean the County for not issuing permits in the 1960s and 1970s when many of these homes were built? Before permits were even required.
    Do you think the people who issued them are still alive?
    Do you think the county should have had people forcibly removed?

    Here's an old home listing:
    31227 East Steelhead Drive, Arlington WA - Trulia

    That's why these things need to be investigated, well before people jump to conclusions or play Monday morning quarterback.

    Look again at this area. Not there were no houses built on the slide side of the river. The wiped out homes were across the river, some by hundreds of yards.

    Washington mudslide warned about 15 years ago by geologists | Mail Online
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  20. #19  
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    Quote Originally Posted by holmes
    i watch TV too and im in WA so i think i know how bad it iswell i guess democrats aren't litigious only if its there issue like when Gore "won in Florida"i give up on this post -youre an argumentative Democrat -its very cleari say people will get sued bigtime
    This has nothing to do with politics or the party affiliation of anyone Holmes. Please stop trying to make it such. As noted by lynx the average age for the houses was from the 60s so way before anyone that is currently in office. This is a discussion forum, people will disagree with you if you don't like that then this is not the place for you. Just like with your assertions about bees and light bulbs
    If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -Thorin Oakenshield

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    Quote Originally Posted by SHolmes View Post
    i thought i saw a road blocked on tv
    Well, if you thought you saw something on TV, that's better than a peer-reviewed study right there. Case closed.
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  22. #21  
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrmonroe View Post
    Someone should get punished (as in go to prison) ...
    Fair enough. The people who are the most immediately culpable are the people who bought homes in a risky area. Going to be a hard sell though.
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  23. #22  
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    Quote Originally Posted by billvon View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jrmonroe View Post
    Someone should get punished (as in go to prison) ...
    Fair enough. The people who are the most immediately culpable are the people who bought homes in a risky area. Going to be a hard sell though.
    what a sick attitude-the streets are there -and the houses -so if someone is just driving around looking at houses to buy they desreve no protection?or the man from out of town who went there to fix a hot water tank--?

    dont they post signs in unsafe ares where they ski or hike?

    Risk of slide ‘unforeseen’? Warnings go back decades | Local News | The Seattle Times



    Daniel Miller, a geomorph*ologist, also documented the hill’s landslide conditions in a report written in 1997 for the Washington Department of Ecology and the Tulalip Tribes. He knows the hill’s history, having collected reports and memos from the 1950s, 1960s, 1980s and 1990s. He has a half-dozen manila folders stuffed with maps, slides, models and drawings, all telling the story of an unstable hillside that has defied efforts to shore it up.

    these people work for the state? -we pay them but just get reports but no action?
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  24. #23  
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    they should have at least posted warning signs
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  25. #24  
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    Thanks for doing a bit of research and getting closer to the facts.
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  26. #25  
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    Sorry, I thought the houses were much more recent. The limitation of action surely has expired.

    Interesting, I once bought a home that turned out to be in a 100-year flood zone, so I had to obtain flood insurance. In a flood (ie, from a swollen river/lake/etc), one had time to get out, and the authorities will also come and take you, and the flood insurance was only for property damage, if I remember correctly. The feds have even mapped 500-year flood zones.

    Yet, Oso has a known but unpredictable danger that can just as easily cause loss of lives, not just property damage. This is like building in a neighborhood that suffers from sinkholes, or a neighborhood that's in the shadow of a smoldering volcano, or a neighborhood that's in an avalanche zone, etc. Unless someone buys the property outright, the bank would at least have an interest in the safety of the property.

    Perhaps there should be some sort of repository of information about the geological dangers, and not just flood zones, but mudslides and the others that I've mentioned.

    However, I think mostly this is what can happen where people live in an area without a local government. They are "roughing it" — which is exciting — but also taking a chance.

    My friend (a "survivalist") is "roughing it" out in the middle of nowhere in New Mexico and is actually within a township, although he lives [way] out of town. If his house catches fire, he better be able to put it out because it will burn down by the time the town's fire engine gets there, if it can make it down miles of the dirt road that he lives on. Heaven help him if he has a heart attack.
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    i would think that one of the main reasons for gov is to approve where its safe to live and work

    they close stuff if its unsafe for human habitation like a house full of trash and chemicals etc
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  28. #27  
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHolmes View Post
    i would think that one of the main reasons for gov is to approve where its safe to live and work

    they close stuff if its unsafe for human habitation like a house full of trash and chemicals etc
    I think you should be in charge of evicting everyone from tornado alley, all flood plains, anywhere near enough to fault lines to cause property damage, near volcanic activity (sorry Hawaii), or along the coasts where a tsunami could wipe them out.

    Once that's sorted, get back to us.
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  29. #28  
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    i read this newspaper article

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/27/sc...rain.html?_r=0

    Washington has many landslides. but looks like a beautiful place to live. beauty has a hidden price ?

    Lynn Highland, a geographer with the United States Geological Survey, said that Washington ranks with Oregon and California as the states with the most landslides. But actual statistics on the numbers of slides annually are spotty, because most are small and occur in remote areas.
    Experts say a combination of factors make Washington so prone to slides: steep terrain; complex geology, including the changes wrought during the most recent Ice Age; weather; earthquakes and volcanoes; and even its popularity.
    “Our state has been called the poster child for geological hazards,” said Pat Pringle, a professor at Centralia College in Centralia, Wash.
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