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Thread: Oscar Pistorius

  1. #1 Oscar Pistorius 
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    My first reaction was that Pistorius's story was not credible. It doesn't make sense to start blasting away at a noise in your house, especially if there are others in the house and you have not verified their whereabouts.

    On the other hand, things might be different in South Africa, where people may have reason to be jumpy. One hears stories about people murdered in their beds.


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  3. #2  
    Forum Professor river_rat's Avatar
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    Sadly this is just one example of a long list of cases where someone shot first before accurate identification and ended up killing a loved one here in sunny South Africa. You must remember that there is a sense (justified or not) of extreme paranoia with respect to crime amongst the middle and upper class here - we live in secure estates or closed off neighbourhoods surrounded by high walls, barbed wire and electric fences. We have armed guards responding to our household alarms and CCTV cameras monitoring our houses.

    This is the nation where someone invented a flamethrower to roast suspected hijackers alive remember.


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    As is often the case with technical subjects we are presented with an unfortunate choice: an explanation that is accurate but incomprehensible, or comprehensible but wrong.
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    Administrator KALSTER's Avatar
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    Just as river_rat says.

    I don't live in a gated community. People have broken into my house, but only stole a phone, probably because they fled over the back fence when we stopped at the gate.

    I was watching Lost late one night in the living room, when I heard something in the kitchen. There I caught three burglars just as they were about to climb through the window where they had broken off the burglar proofing. Being a largish guy I gambled and aggressively yelled "Hey!", whereupon they scattered. I have been on edge ever since. I frequently investigate "weird" noises at night.

    You constantly hear stories of people being the victims of violent crime. One guy was shot and killed in the back as he was trying to escape from burglars just one street over in my neighbourhood, less than 200m away. A friend became aware of burglars in his house and despite having a gun under his pillow, he decided it would be safer to pretend to be asleep, even as the burglars were right next to his bed and moving around the house. Thankfully nothing violent happened. My neighbour also let out a scream in terror one night when he saw a would-be burglar looking at him through the window as he was about to close his eyes to go to sleep. Etc, etc, etc.

    I am not yet convinced that he is innocent, but him being terrified at the thought of a burglar in his house? I can fully identify with that.
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  5. #4  
    Life-Size Nanoputian Flick Montana's Avatar
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    The idea of firing through your bathroom door at a noise without investigating a LITTLE further strikes me as odd. A simple, "Is someone there?" might have been called for.
    "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." -Calvin
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  6. #5  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flick Montana View Post
    The idea of firing through your bathroom door at a noise without investigating a LITTLE further strikes me as odd. A simple, "Is someone there?" might have been called for.
    Yep, but if you are genuinely panicked, then that behaviour is entirely possible.

    I have a feeling he'll walk with a charge of involuntary manslaughter and get a suspended sentence.
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

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    I was watching the news when they broke the story over here and there was alot of emphasis about how he kept a machine gun by his bed and that he was terrified of burglars, so I don't think his version of events is that far fetched, this being said the police seem to be convinced he's guilty. What does seem a bit strange though about this case is the fact of no real motive, at least none that seems plausable. Ok sure people fall out but this doesn't mean you go and shoot your partner, so if they are really to convince a jury he is guilty I think they're going to need more than that.
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  8. #7  
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    Being a track fan, this case really disappoints me. I really liked Oscar Pistorius.

    As far as him being guilty, he would get out on a technicality. It was in his home, and the gun was legal.
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  9. #8  
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    There’s a lot of news of violence in South Africa recently. There was the shooting dead of miners by police, then this Oscar Pistorius incident, and just in the last couple days a man was handcuffed to the back of a van and dragged to his death.

    Why so much trouble in the country? It seems there’s not less of it after the end of apartheid than before.
    Last edited by Nehushtan; March 1st, 2013 at 12:48 AM.
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  10. #9  
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    And South Africa is one of the African Nations you wan to live in.
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  11. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold14370 View Post
    My first reaction was that Pistorius's story was not credible. It doesn't make sense to start blasting away at a noise in your house, especially if there are others in the house and you have not verified their whereabouts.
    No it doesn't make any sense, but you are sober, and drug free. There's speculation about the pair having consumed a fair amount of alcohol that night, and some allegation that steroids may have been found. I presume these details will be examined further once the court case comes up. I can't believe he got bail though, given the .38 he used was unlicensed, he may be a danger to himself if he has other firearms at other addresses.
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    Forum Radioactive Isotope cosmictraveler's Avatar
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    His home has an active security alarm system that never went off showing that there was never a break in so how did he imagine that someone got into his home without setting off that alarm system. That system was monitored 24/7 by a private security company and they showed no intrusion on the night in question. So if there was no alarm to notify him there was a intruder why did he even think that there was one? It would seem clear to me that he only wanted to find a way to kill his wife for whatever reasons he might have had to get rid of her and it looks like he will get away with it.
    Last edited by cosmictraveler; March 1st, 2013 at 11:28 AM.
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  13. #12  
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    One of the most dangerous things is a man on the edge of panic.

    You can't predict what he will do.
    But it is gonna be damned fast and powerful.
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  14. #13  
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    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    One of the most dangerous things is a man on the edge of panic.

    You can't predict what he will do.
    But it is gonna be damned fast and powerful.
    Well I would certainly agree there, I just still can't also see how the the police's allegations that he murdered his girlfriend in a cold blooded premeditated way is plausable. I mean if he wanted to kill her there must have been a thousand ways of doing it that were less likely to see him arrested for it, than to shoot her on valentines day and then admit to shooting her, it's not even like they were married, if they had problems they could have just split up so why kill her? None of that makes any sense at all. Then on the other hand he has a perfectly plausable senario. I just can't see how any jury could possibly be convinced beyond reasonable doubt that he deliberately set out to kill her.
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  15. #14  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
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    It's a wonder she ever got up in the middle of the night for a pee without getting shot.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
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  16. #15  
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    I once had an alsatian sheperd dog named duke
    and it didn't matter who it was, If i was asleep
    and someone got up to pee in the middle of the night
    he wouldn't let them back in
    ..............
    One time, he stopped my first wife in the hallway, and put his teeth around her arm, and pulled her down to a sitting position,
    then sat in front of her facing her, and when she raised her voice to call out to me, he bared his teeth and growled in her face.
    I awoke to her almost whispered singing of my name, sat up, and called the dog, and she followed him into the bedroom.

    I'd much rather have a dog than a loaded weapon.
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    yeh, me too---on the face of it, but we do not know the depth
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  17. #16  
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    I can take on and take down a dog. I cannot dodge bullets.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neverfly View Post
    I cannot dodge bullets.
    Then you need to go and see Morpheus for a bit more training.
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  19. #18  
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    Or provide me with a sword about 8 inches wide...
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  20. #19  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neverfly View Post
    I can take on and take down a dog. I cannot dodge bullets.
    with Duke, you'd have to be damned fast--he could have snaped your leg bones like a twig.
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  21. #20  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    One of the most dangerous things is a man on the edge of panic.

    You can't predict what he will do.
    But it is gonna be damned fast and powerful.
    Well I would certainly agree there, I just still can't also see how the the police's allegations that he murdered his girlfriend in a cold blooded premeditated way is plausable. I mean if he wanted to kill her there must have been a thousand ways of doing it that were less likely to see him arrested for it, than to shoot her on valentines day and then admit to shooting her, it's not even like they were married, if they had problems they could have just split up so why kill her? None of that makes any sense at all. Then on the other hand he has a perfectly plausable senario. I just can't see how any jury could possibly be convinced beyond reasonable doubt that he deliberately set out to kill her.
    We don't have juries though. The judge will have to be convinced that it was premeditated. I can't see that happen either. I still predict involuntary manslaughter.
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  22. #21  
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    Quote Originally Posted by sculptor View Post
    One of the most dangerous things is a man on the edge of panic.

    You can't predict what he will do.
    But it is gonna be damned fast and powerful.
    And he was very much on the edge of panic:

    Pistorius is jumpy. In an article for The Times of London, Fay Schlesinger and Rick Broadbent wrote:

    The sprinter has spoken of his excess energy, his determination and his recklessness - the keys to his success, but also the reason he has lived on a knife edge.
    He goes to bed as early as 8pm but struggles to sleep. After he got rid of his television and set his phone to turn off automatically he would read books voraciously. He told The New York Times that when a house security alarm went off recently, he grabbed the gun he kept by his bed and crept downstairs. It turned out to be nothing.
    In November, he tweeted about mistaking his washing machine for a burglar. (“Nothing like getting home to hear the washing machine on and thinking its an intruder to go into full combat recon mode into the pantry!” he wrote) A few weeks before he shot Steenkamp, he almost shot a friend in a restaurant when a gun he was holding accidentally discharged.
    Because you know, looking at each others loaded guns in a busy restaurant is what people do...?

    While it may have been a case of mistaken identity [at the moment we can only go by what the media shows us and the amount of over blown hype coming out of this case is extraordinary, especially when you consider at first it was initially reported that they were heard fighting and then gun shots], I do wonder at the mental state of someone who would quite literally, shoot at shadows and noises in the middle of the night.

    However I have to disagree with you that you cannot predict what someone on the edge of panic can do. I think the writing was on the wall for a long time with Pistorius, he has a known and documented history of pulling his gun first. In his case, I do think it is not a matter of 'if' but a matter of 'when' he would eventually kill someone.
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  23. #22  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope sculptor's Avatar
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    Tranquille
    thanx for the depth
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  24. #23  
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    Quote Originally Posted by KALSTER View Post
    We don't have juries though. The judge will have to be convinced that it was premeditated. I can't see that happen either. I still predict involuntary manslaughter.
    I didn't know that about juries, I think it is often to easy to just assume that all the english speaking countries operate the same way.
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