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Thread: some questions

  1. #1 some questions 
    Forum Senior anand_kapadia's Avatar
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    I am poor in chemistry. so you might feel these questions stupid ones.
    1-Does carbon or hydrogen ever make ionic bonds.
    2-How can one a.m.u of oxygen molecule that is 18 grams and one a.m.u of co2 that is 44 grams have the same volume 22.4 litres according to Gay Lussac's law.
    Thanks


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  3. #2  
    Forum Professor leohopkins's Avatar
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    Im sorry that im unable to answer all your questions with any kind of efficiency, what I can tell you though is that Ionic bonds only form between metallic and non-metallic elements. I "think" that hydrogen CAN act as a non-metal in chemical bonding to form an ionic bond. In this case I think it has a -1 charge and is called a Hydride. As for Carbon, im not entirely sure. Carbon is not classed as being a metal I dont think and im not enitrely sure that it bonds with any metals; although I could be wrong. In the normal sense of carbohydrates / CO and CO2, CFC's etc, It will form a covalent bond.

    As for your other question, im not sure what an a.m.u is so I will attempt to answer your question, of course if im wrong im sure I will soon be corrected. but lets look at it from this way:

    22.4 Litres of oxygen is 18 grammes, yes ?
    22.4 Litres of CO2 is 44 grammes.

    The carbon in the CO2 molecule has a larger atomic mass and therefore is heavier than the oxygen atoms. Maybe there is your answer ?


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  4. #3  
    Forum Senior anand_kapadia's Avatar
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    If hydrogen forms an ionic bond will it take electrons or lose electrons. If it loses it will become an electromagnetic radiation. As i think so. Ya it can take electrons but can anybody suggest me an ionic compound which it forms.
    a.m.u here means atomic mass unit.
    My question is how 44 grams od CO2 and 18 grams of O2 have same volume.
    Thanks for the else answers.
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  5. #4  
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    A "hydride" is a proton with a charge of -1. It can be involved in ionic bonds.
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    Forum Sophomore Matt Lacey's Avatar
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    The ideal gas law makes assumptions so 1 mole of 2 different gases don't have _exactly_ the same volume. It's good enough for simple models though. But still, O2 has a molecular mass of 32, not 18 and is not massively different in shape and size to CO2, so they have similar molar volumes at least.

    As has already been said, hydride exists and forms ionic compounds like NaH, however H+ doesn't form ionic compounds. Carbon doesn't form ionic bonds (at least naturally), however it is possible to make synthetic carbocations or carbanions and trap these for a short time at least, but you won't find these in nature.

    Carbon does form carbon-metal bonds though, there's a whole science of organometallic chemistry out there devoted to it.
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    Forum Senior anand_kapadia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scifor Refugee
    A "hydride" is a proton with a charge of -1. It can be involved in ionic bonds.
    Hydride is just a proton so is not an electromagnetic radiation as beta rays.
    Which type of bond is formed in Co2 and CO molecules.
    Thanks for the else answers matt.
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  8. #7  
    Forum Sophomore Matt Lacey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anand_kapadia
    Quote Originally Posted by Scifor Refugee
    A "hydride" is a proton with a charge of -1. It can be involved in ionic bonds.
    Hydride is just a proton so is not an electromagnetic radiation as beta rays.
    Which type of bond is formed in Co2 and CO molecules.
    Thanks for the else answers matt.
    Nope, hydride isn't a proton - it's a proton with 2 electrons (instead of 1 for hydrogen). I don't know what you're on about with electromagnetic radiation though.

    CO2 and CO are both covalently bonded molecules.
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  9. #8  
    Forum Senior anand_kapadia's Avatar
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    CO2 and CO are both covalently bonded molecules.
    can you explain me the bond formation in it.
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  10. #9  
    Moderator Moderator AlexP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Lacey
    As has already been said, hydride exists and forms ionic compounds like NaH, however H+ doesn't form ionic compounds.
    Wouldn't HF be ionic? E.N. difference of 1.76, i believe that's sufficient for an ionic bond.
    "There is a kind of lazy pleasure in useless and out-of-the-way erudition." -Jorge Luis Borges
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  11. #10  
    Moderator Moderator AlexP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anand_kapadia
    CO2 and CO are both covalently bonded molecules.
    can you explain me the bond formation in it.
    Covalent bonds occur between two atoms that have similar electronegativities. They 'share' electrons. So, in CO<sub>2</sub> the oxygen attracts carbon's electrons, and at the same time, carbon attracts the two oxygens' electrons. For all atoms involved, this counts as having a complete octet (filled valence shell, so it's stable). CO works the same way, except it's a bit more complicated, having multiple resonance structures... It shifts between having a single, double, and triple bond, very very rapidly, so that its really like having an average of all three bonds, as far as strength and length goes. Hope I did a good job explaining... Basically, for covalent bonds, just remember that electrons are shared, that's the basic concept behind it...

    As for the gases... I don't know anything about Gay Lussac, but one mole of a gas, regardless of what gas it is, occupies 22.4 liters.
    "There is a kind of lazy pleasure in useless and out-of-the-way erudition." -Jorge Luis Borges
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  12. #11  
    Forum Sophomore Matt Lacey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chemboy
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Lacey
    As has already been said, hydride exists and forms ionic compounds like NaH, however H+ doesn't form ionic compounds.
    Wouldn't HF be ionic? E.N. difference of 1.76, i believe that's sufficient for an ionic bond.
    It's not quite that simple - have a look at this page on van Arkel-Ketelaar triangles

    http://www.meta-synthesis.com/webboo...triangles.html

    HF is similar to water, covalently bonded, forms linearly H-bonded chains and is a liquid at room temperature I believe.
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  13. #12  
    Forum Senior anand_kapadia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chemboy
    Quote Originally Posted by anand_kapadia
    CO2 and CO are both covalently bonded molecules.
    can you explain me the bond formation in it.
    Covalent bonds occur between two atoms that have similar electronegativities. They 'share' electrons. So, in CO<sub>2</sub> the oxygen attracts carbon's electrons, and at the same time, carbon attracts the two oxygens' electrons. For all atoms involved, this counts as having a complete octet (filled valence shell, so it's stable). CO works the same way, except it's a bit more complicated, having multiple resonance structures... It shifts between having a single, double, and triple bond, very very rapidly, so that its really like having an average of all three bonds, as far as strength and length goes. Hope I did a good job explaining... Basically, for covalent bonds, just remember that electrons are shared, that's the basic concept behind it...

    As for the gases... I don't know anything about Gay Lussac, but one mole of a gas, regardless of what gas it is, occupies 22.4 liters.
    thanks for the explanation.
    Is the bond formation in CO due variable valencies of C.
    Can you post me a link where i can read bond formation in detail.
    Thanks.
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  14. #13  
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    `CO has two double bonds and one co-ordinate bond.oxygen is electron rich so it donates a pair of e- to carbon to satisfy tetravalency of Carbon.The double bond satisfies the valency of O.
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