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Thread: America's downfall-(Oil)

  1. #1 America's downfall-(Oil) 
    The Doctor Quantime's Avatar
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    I heard somewhere that America's oil reserves for power production deplete in 2010 or something and as a result there will be massive power fluctuations all over their country apparently this is fact but I'm not sure, is it?


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  3. #2 Re: America's downfall-(Oil) 
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by svwillmer
    I heard somewhere that America's oil reserves for power production deplete in 2010 or something and as a result there will be massive power fluctuations all over their country apparently this is fact but I'm not sure, is it?
    America has been a net importer of oil for several decades. There oil reserves will not deplete for several decades more. They reached peak production a few decades ago, so production levels are slowly falling. All in all your statement does not make much sense.


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  4. #3  
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    Oil in association with *power supply* are not compatible. Most power, if related to electrical comes from Coal Powered Plants, then to gas power followed by Nuclear and some from Wind/Solar/Tidal and other sources. The USA is the Saudi Arabia of coal with advancing technology will continuously supply more and more Power Plants. The *power grid*, is another issue, which is being worked on today.

    Since posted on Business; The USA has been an importer of oil for some time, but for reasons. Primarily the cost to drill oil, ranging from permitting to labor. BP and Exxon/Mobile and Shell now part of Royal Dutch (All publicly owned) have found it much cheaper to import oil from the giant National Oil Companies from around the world and lately from Canadian Corporations. These currently being Saudi Arabian Oil Company and Petrol Mexico and Venezuela all State owned.

    As for *Peak Oil*, this is arguably possible. However, some feel the Oil Shale/Sands of Utah/Colorado/Wyoming have into the trillion barrel potential (well over the active Canadian projects) and there are countless known reserves which cannot be drilled for political or environmental reasons. Alaska the most known, but additional reserves exist in many States or off shore in the Pacific and Gulf of Mexico.
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    what about african oil sorces? nigeria and some others are becoming bigger and bigger players in the oil market, if i'm not mistaken, with nigeria having quite large reserves
    Disclaimer: I do not declare myself to be an expert on ANY subject. If I state something as fact that is obviously wrong, please don't hesitate to correct me. I welcome such corrections in an attempt to be as truthful and accurate as possible.

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  6. #5  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KALSTER
    what about african oil sorces? nigeria and some others are becoming bigger and bigger players in the oil market, if i'm not mistaken, with nigeria having quite large reserves
    The proverbial drop in the bucket.
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    There's plenty of places to get oil, but it is a limited commodity.

    Fortunately society has the potential to slowly reduce its dependency on oil for energy, and for materials, as we turn to renewable sources of fuel and oil.

    The catch is going to find a green solution for some of the other major oil "suckers" that we have that can't readily turn to alternative fuels. The airline industry for one, and the military for another. I think I read somewhere that the latest Abrams tank variant sucks down 8 gallons of diesel per mile. As wonderful and hippie as it might be to think of plug-in tanks and bacon-grease-powered 747's, it's probably not happening any time soon.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KALSTER
    what about african oil sorces? nigeria and some others are becoming bigger and bigger players in the oil market, if i'm not mistaken, with nigeria having quite large reserves
    China has been making a lot of contracts with African countries. China also has a contract for Venezuelan oil. Of course, Anglo-American companies have their hold in Africa, but they need to consider China and its thirst for oil too (which paradoxically was created by western countries).
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  9. #8 Re: America's downfall-(Oil) 
    Forum Cosmic Wizard icewendigo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by svwillmer
    I heard somewhere that America's oil reserves for power production deplete in 2010 or something and as a result there will be massive power fluctuations all over their country apparently this is fact but I'm not sure, is it?
    The theory of peak oil is real in a sense but its been used to scare and mislead people and has originated from the Oil industry itself. There are vast Oil reserves in the Arctic, theres of oil in the caspean sea, canadian tar sands and so on. Of course the demand for oil might exceed the offer before alternative technologies are cheap and accessible, but that is Exactly what the Oil industry wants to ensure.

    They have historically under-exploited the Oil in Iraq (redline agreement) to avoid brining down the price of Oil, they want to control and reduce the flow of Oil so they can charge you through the nose for it at the pump. Their aim in Iraq is making sure that Iraq is unable to produce too much Oil and the war as been highly profitable with the price of Oil on world markets reaching several times the pre-war price. This has paid off if you look at their profiteering profits. If you think Oil is expensive wait, if Iran is bombed you'll pay even more (and theyll make more profits).

    If you see 'Who killed the electric car?' you will get a sense that Oil companies have done all they can to suppress the development of alternatives for decades, they sometimes buy a company with technology that rivals Oil to give themselves a good image only to mothball it when its no longer in the news.

    So its not that theres not enough Oil, its just that alternatives are not receiving the same benefits as Big Oil gets, if the multi-billion dollars spent on the War in Iraq were spent on development of electric cars and cheap effective solar panels, Oil would be almost obsolete. Oil corporations are like drug dealers, they want a captive addicitve market dependant on a ressource they CONTROL, they dont want use to use solar energy, its free, they cant charge you for it. :wink:

    Airlines are the ones that really need the oil imo, until systems to rapidly devide water into oxygen and hydrogen can be devised, or other rocket fuel alternatives, oil will likely be the best way to fuel jets for a long time to come.

    As for tanks, I think they can be powered by electric motors in the foreseeable future. The electric motor requires less maintenance and is much more silent/stealthy (given you can typically hear todays tanks at a significant distance). They could construct mobile power generators to recharge the tanks.
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  10. #9  
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    Anyone with a crtical mind, or a little knowledge will recognise that icewedigo's post is largely bollocks.
    If I have time I'll later post for those of you who are either gullible or ignorant an explanation of why I say that.
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  11. #10  
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    It is a logical assumption though Ophiolite.

    PS What does anthropogenic mean?
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  12. #11  
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    Truth be told, it doesn't matter.

    Whether the oil supply is moderately accurate, or completely inaccurate (I don't think it will ever be accurate), it makes little difference.

    In the short term we really do need to get away from using fossil-fuels as fuels. At the very least we should be focusing on ways to get completely away from using oil (not to mention other natural finite resources) to power our static environment (ie cities, homes, factories, etc). Energy-consuming locations that are static are perfectly suited for alternative power sources, mainly because they're static, and the power source doesn't have to be attached. Getting a car or a tank or a jet to run on an alternative power source requires that you in some way incorporate that technology into the vehicle itself. With a home, the home isn't generating its own power, and doesn't need to.

    In the long term, if we find we have oil for four-hundred years of growth and use (and somehow avoid the environmental consequences of doing so), we will only find ourselves right back in this same predicament. As with all things, it is best to tackle the problem now, than wait till it's the eleventh-hour.

    So we can gripe all day about the lunacy of OPEC and the petroleum industry...but to what end?

    We've got oil, it's served its purpose, but now we are both technologically advanced enough, and stable enough, to start thinking about other sources for our power.
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  13. #12  
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    Ice; Since I agree with your optimism on the potential availably of oil, its hard for me be critical of your seeming rant against Industry, assuming however its the US.

    Iraq's potential reserves are pretty well known. Although not all confirmed and certainly not currently available, these reserves are said to rival that of Saudi Arabia, additionally is said to be high quality light/sweet. When conditions allow these fields will be developed with an infrastructure to support the activity. Remember these field are in Western Iraq, no where near a shipping point or the pipe lines now used.

    Saudi Arabia, according to the Heads of the US Giants, during a Congressional Hearing last year, sets the price for its oil each month. That price is good for that month. All else including speculations are secondary to that price. Exxon, BP, Chevron have no say in this price. Big finds, climate condition and so on effect speculation prices, however when that months activity is over (around 20-25th) the next months options kick in.

    JP 2-3--4, (jet fuel) whatever used today is a very high quality fuel, using mostly GE engines which are designed to use these fuels. I have no idea what your Tank comments mean. Diesel however which is very much like what we call fuel oil and used for nearly all trucks and a good many cars. This the most used and least refined and environmentally most destructive. Additionally trucks average no more than 7 MPG.

    Alternative energy is highly subsidized by government and speculated on by many investors. Most Wind/Solar/Nanotech/Battery(electrical)/biofuel companies do not, have not made any money, which many will fail first.
    I have problems with Ethanol, even at 10% for various reasons. Effects on other corn product cost and transporting the product to where used, just a couple. IMO, more should be done with sugar beets which in many locations could have 2 crops per years, or from the by products of feed lots.

    One last note; The electric car is not dead. Nearly all fork lifts in the US, many local delivery trucks and even some taxi cabs are NOW battery powered...
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  14. #13  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard icewendigo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Anyone with a crtical mind, or a little knowledge will recognise that icewedigo's post is largely bollocks.
    If I have time I'll later post for those of you who are either gullible or ignorant an explanation of why I say that.
    I m waiting to have your analysis as I am apparently gullible and ignorant, I look forward for you to share your knowledge
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  15. #14  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by icewendigo
    Quote Originally Posted by Ophiolite
    Anyone with a crtical mind, or a little knowledge will recognise that icewedigo's post is largely bollocks.
    If I have time I'll later post for those of you who are either gullible or ignorant an explanation of why I say that.
    I m waiting to have your analysis as I am apparently gullible and ignorant, I look forward for you to share your knowledge
    Yours was a lengthy post, with so many inaccuracies that it merits a full and proper deconstruction. I shall not disappoint you.
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  16. #15  
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    US army is going to upgrade the M1 with a new engine which uses 35% less fuel.
    when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth
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  17. #16  
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    Quote Originally Posted by dejawolf
    US army is going to upgrade the M1 with a new engine which uses 35% less fuel.
    Wow. So we get from 8 gallons per mile to about 5.5 gallons per mile. That means they're doing just slightly better than the combined consumption of the engines of a 747.
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