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Thread: How can non living things convert into life ?

  1. #1 How can non living things convert into life ? 
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    How life can arise from inorganic matter. Although we cannot completely deny it what how it is logically
    acceptable. Our sense, consciousness are just a product of inorganic matter.

    How simply non living matter like oxygen, hydrogen, iron, or other can have capacity of having consciousness and sense with time and conditions?

    This theory clearly predicts a non living matter can be converted into living ones with sense following conditions and time. As all happened is with laws and there are laws in nature with whom non organic matter can be converted into human being.

    HOW IT IS POSSIBLE ????????????????
    SO STRANGE??????????????????


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  3. #2  
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAJ_K View Post
    How life can arise from inorganic matter. Although we cannot completely deny it what how it is logically
    acceptable. Our sense, consciousness are just a product of inorganic matter.

    How simply non living matter like oxygen, hydrogen, iron, or other can have capacity of having consciousness and sense with time and conditions?

    This theory clearly predicts a non living matter can be converted into living ones with sense following conditions and time. As all happened is with laws and there are laws in nature with whom non organic matter can be converted into human being.

    HOW IT IS POSSIBLE ????????????????
    SO STRANGE??????????????????
    Our best hypothesis is that life is an emergent phenomenon. A molecule can exhibit more complex behavior than the individual atoms that comprise it. Proteins in particular can exhibit an amazing variety of sophisticated behaviors. Continue that line of reasoning up the hierarchy and you end up with everything from Bozo to Beethoven. It is unnecessary to invoke vitalism.


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  4. #3  
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    No doubt our best hypothesis predicts it, but sense and consciousness is not just a complex behavior of a dead matter but
    something much more. I have no faith in Vitalism. An unlimited space with limited/unlimited matter-energy and this dead Universe has laws which allow creation of sense,feelings and consciousness really strange and logically unacceptable although may be true. or may not be.
    Fundamental law of Universe is nothing is produced or destroyed in Universe ,just converted, changed chemically or physical properties means if sense arose from dead matter some link must be present in pre converted state i.e. dead matter.
    Presentation of Sense in Dead Universe really surprising!!!!!!!!!!
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  5. #4  
    Genius Duck Moderator Dywyddyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAJ_K View Post
    Fundamental law of Universe is nothing is produced or destroyed in Universe
    Not quite correct.

    just converted, changed chemically or physical properties means if sense arose from dead matter some link must be present in pre converted state i.e. dead matter.
    Presentation of Sense in Dead Universe really surprising!!!!!!!!!!
    Nope, "sense" isn't a "physical object" so it doesn't have to be present. Consciousness, likewise, is an emergent property (so far as we know) therefore it doesn't have to "pre-exist" before life.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
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  6. #5  
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    yes it is not a physical property and can not exist in pre state but it is completely acceptable that
    there are strict laws that allow creation of sense in dead matter .
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    Laws change the stages of matter -dead to live. Some link should not be present ?
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    The difference between religion and science is that science admits that it does not know the answer (all it can do is give a reasonable best guess).

    In a way, life is special indeed. Howerver, it is perhaps a bit arrogant of conscious life forms (us) to assume there is something special about life in the sense that there is a sharp line between life and non-life. Viruses are in that grey area between the two. Although it is too simplistic to say that viruses are merely gentical material wrapped in a double membrane - they aren't much more than that.
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  9. #8  
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    While we do not know for sure how non living material forms life (abiogenesis), there is a lot of research data that is highly suggestive. Here is one of the more likely models.
    The Origin of Life - Abiogenesis - Dr. Jack Szostak - YouTube
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  10. #9  
    ***** Participant Write4U's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAJ_K View Post
    yes it is not a physical property and can not exist in pre state but it is completely acceptable that
    there are strict laws that allow creation of sense in dead matter .
    It has emerged as a property of complexity from what must be extremely simple laws, because almost everything we can imagine actually already exists or will exist in the future. Bohm calls it The Implicate (Potential).

    But check out out this brainless sentience. This is a collection of amoebae. Who does the thinking? At what stage is there an intelligence?

    How Brainless Slime Molds Redefine Intelligence [Video]: Scientific American

    p.s. IMO. Life begins when chemical reactions become able to cause more chemical reactions, until the entire system becomes dependent on the functions of it's individual parts. The organism has acquired Life. DNA is one blueprint for sentient life. Cosmological constants are blueprints of potential for life.
    Last edited by Write4U; February 21st, 2013 at 02:06 AM.
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  11. #10  
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    Non living materials are converted to living material every day. It is an on going process. Green plants use water, CO2 and energy from the sun to make sugar. Sugar is an organic molecule that can fuel life processes.
    The idea that there is a clear deviding line between "Alive" and "not alive" is an illusion fostered by our point of view. We are looking "from the top down" on the process of life forming. We need to twist our minds around to the point of view of chemicals in the primoidial ocean/ swamps of a pre life earth. That is, look at the processes "from the bottom up". There is no goal of becoming alive. Chemical compounds form and dissipate. Those that are more resistent to dissipation naturally become more numorous simply because they have not fallen apart as quickly as other compounds. This is "evolution" at the inorganic to the organic chemical stage. Slowly the environment becomes rich is organic chemicals.
    Consider an energy rich sugar molecule in a solution of various chemicals. There is a certain risk of it being reacted on and its load of energy lost and used to fuel some sort of reaction. If however it bonds to another sugar and becomes a bisaccaride it does not react as easily. As a trisaccraide it is still less easily reacted. So there is "evolutionary" pressure for the sugars to form chains. We call chains of sugars "carbohydrates" these include cellulose and starches which are very stable molecules compared to sugars.
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  12. #11  
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    No doubt evolution from simplex to complex and more complex is most acceptable for us.
    But it is really surprising for me as sense and conciseness are just a product of matter process .
    In this sense, we have clear laws in Universe with whom non living matter can be converted into full fledged intelligent human beings .
    There may be something out of human brain, it may be so strange (Religious & other man made things are under the human brain ) Although at present evolution is best option we can accept. Sense and consistences & infinite history-future of space are two things that are really to surprising , confusable and unbelievable.
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    Well, if you're talking about the possibility of turning non-living material such as the television or the table and giving them properties such as independent thinking it has already been established and are shown in a few examples in robots when a robot killed his own creator in Russia.. Self-awareness might be possible in the foreseeable future'

    Physical emotions like hate, anger, depression might not be possible to feel but to show, robots might be able to become angry, happy and such but regarding their further abilities to feel the emotion like us humans might not be possible.. Though some things might change in the future.
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