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Thread: Rib cage protection against gunfire

  1. #1 Rib cage protection against gunfire 
    Forum Ph.D. Raziell's Avatar
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    In movies when people are shot in the heart, the bullet almost always hits.

    But when looking at a picture this puzzled me: http://www.chromatographyonline.com/lcgc/data/articlestandard/rnweb/362004/120214/01.jpg

    I
    t seems the ribcage from the front, puts up a pretty decent protection from bullets. And from the side, maybe a 50% coverage. Im guessing that since the ribs are round - that would be counterprotective. As a bullet - at high speed - even if it does hit the rib, could ricochet into the heart.

    Ofcourse movies isnt depicting reality, I realize that. But in reality, does the ribcage protect that much? From the picture the rib cage seem to be a pretty damn good internal armor. Maybe Im missing something here, arent bones as hard as I thought or what?


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  3. #2  
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    I think our bone are not that hard. For example: slaughterhouse cut animal bone all the time, I never heard people had problem with cutting/crushing bones...


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    Ya you need to take the ribcage out and replace it with a titanium armature. Not surprised that it will be possible in 10 or 20 years.
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    Cooking Something Good MacGyver1968's Avatar
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    Compared to the KE of a bullet, the ribs offer little protection. You also have to consider wound cavity that the bullet creates when it enters the body:

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  6. #5  
    Forum Ph.D. Raziell's Avatar
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    I guess the human skeleton needs an evolutionary upgrade fast to keep up with technology >.<

    My question is more than solved atleast.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raziell View Post
    I guess the human skeleton needs an evolutionary upgrade fast to keep up with technology >.<

    My question is more than solved atleast.
    The problem occurs when the bullet penetrates the body. If it doesn't it's ok but if it does, all the force is distributed in the r direction so the focus is to prevent the bullet from penetrating.
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  8. #7  
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    I have seen a bullet stopped by bone a couple times. Neither was good for the target.
    First case over weight adult female shot in the back with .45cal colt auto round. no exit wound, xray shows slug to be under the skin on her abdomin. Most of the bullet energy was absorbed by the T12 vertabrae, reducing it to fine bone fragments. The bullet then bounced between her skin and chest wall until it reached a point 180degrees from the entry wound but without damaging her vital organs. Other than her spine of course, that was cut totally.
    case two; adolescent male despondent over failing to graduate with his class put .22 rifle to the bridge of his nose and pulled the trigger. Bullet passed between the hemispheres of his brain and lodged under his scalp. The neuro surgeon, one of the world's great assholes, told his parents, "If your son lives till morning he will be a vegetable for the rest of his life" ( I was there I heard it.) The boy walked out of the hospital six weeks later.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sealeaf View Post
    I have seen a bullet stopped by bone a couple times. Neither was good for the target.
    First case over weight adult female shot in the back with .45cal colt auto round. no exit wound, xray shows slug to be under the skin on her abdomin. Most of the bullet energy was absorbed by the T12 vertabrae, reducing it to fine bone fragments. The bullet then bounced between her skin and chest wall until it reached a point 180degrees from the entry wound but without damaging her vital organs. Other than her spine of course, that was cut totally.
    case two; adolescent male despondent over failing to graduate with his class put .22 rifle to the bridge of his nose and pulled the trigger. Bullet passed between the hemispheres of his brain and lodged under his scalp. The neuro surgeon, one of the world's great assholes, told his parents, "If your son lives till morning he will be a vegetable for the rest of his life" ( I was there I heard it.) The boy walked out of the hospital six weeks later.
    Hey, better give bad news and then rejoice at the good news than to give false good news and then dispair to the real bad news.
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    I think bullet are purposely made to be blunt & weak so that it exploded inside flesh & bone.

    If its hard and sharp, it might just go thru? and the victim can continue fighting.
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  11. #10  
    Cooking Something Good MacGyver1968's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msafwan View Post
    I think bullet are purposely made to be blunt & weak so that it exploded inside flesh & bone.

    If its hard and sharp, it might just go thru? and the victim can continue fighting.
    This is the exact reason the Colt 1911 .45ACP was created. The enemy would charge, and the Army's .38's would just go right through them, and they'd keep coming. A bigger, slower round could deliver all of it's energy to the target, and knock them on their ass. It's one reason I selected a .45 in my zombie apocalypse load out. On the other end of the scale, you have the FN fiveSeven. Which fires what is essentially a cut-down 5.56mm rifle bullet. A bullet designed for high speed and penetration power....specifically soft body armor.

    More about the 1911:
    American units fighting Moro guerrillas during the Philippine-American War using the then-standard Colt M1892 revolver, in .38 Long Colt, found it to be unsuitable for the rigors of jungle warfare, particularly in terms of stopping power, as the Moros had very high battle morale and frequently used drugs to inhibit the sensation of pain.[9] The U.S. Army briefly reverted to using the M1873 single-action revolver in .45 Colt caliber, which had been standard during the late 19th century; the heavier bullet was found to be more effective against charging tribesmen.[10] The problems prompted the then–Chief of Ordnance, General William Crozier, to authorize further testing for a new service pistol.[10]
    Following the 1904 Thompson-LaGarde pistol round effectiveness tests, Colonel John T. Thompson stated that the new pistol "should not be of less than .45 caliber" and would preferably be semi-automatic in operation.[10] This led to the 1906 trials of pistols from six firearms manufacturing companies (namely, Colt, Bergmann, Deutsche Waffen und Munitionsfabriken (DWM), Savage Arms Company, Knoble, Webley, and White-Merril.[10]
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  12. #11  
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    Ok, this make sense why people choose weapon...
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  13. #12  
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    The info regarding .45 cal auto development is correct, or at least agrees with what I have been told. It does not follow that heavy bullets are necessarily better in a self protection fire arm. I like a .22 lr round in a hand gun. I am unlikely to be facing Moro tribesmen or zombie hoards. My potential assailent is likely to be far less motivated. A gun I am actualy comfortable shooting and that I can actually hit a target with makes more sense to me.
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    Arm chair commando types always argue the effectiveness of caliber... Some preach .45 or .357. Others preach 9mm... Still others argue about the design of the rounds themselves from Hydra-shok to full metal jacket to gold dot with a tungsten penetrator. In my not very humble opinion the round does not mean squat if you cannot put it on target. And I can kill you as easilly with a .22 as with a .50
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