Notices
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Worldwide Vegetarianism No Fauna?*

  1. #1 Worldwide Vegetarianism No Fauna?* 
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Driving in my car
    Posts
    4,844
    If every person in the world decided they would no longer eat meat and taking into account man's propensity for adapting the world to suit the need, then what happens to animal populations? In this case I'm envisioning a world where traditional livestock, poultry, etc. animals are allowed to roam free. If we change our eating habits are we risking destroying more animals by means other than slaughtering for food?

    *Not sure if this is a biology or discussion question


    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope skeptic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    4,843
    Depends on how people and governments behaved.

    In the short term, we could see the extinction of domestic breeds of animals. Whether they would be replaced by an equivalent number of wild animals is still moot.


    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    984
    If we were pushed to vegetarianism by overpopulation and the need for us all to eat lower on the food chain then very likly there would be no room left wild animals and little for domestic food animals. This presumes that there would be some humans who would be rich enough to afford meat, so there would be some meat production. However, if either because the government or some moral quasi religious force made it impossible for anyone to have what everyone could not, then we would have to use all avilable resources to grow edible plants. I can't see that happening. Humans are just too nasty. There would be a thriving black market in human meat long before that.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Driving in my car
    Posts
    4,844
    Quote Originally Posted by Sealeaf View Post
    , if either because the government or some moral quasi religious force made it impossible for anyone to have what everyone could not, then we would have to use all avilable resources to grow edible plants.
    That scenario, it seems to me at least, is not one that appears to be beneficial to animal populations. I'm visualizing a time when crop protection becomes a deadly competition between us and other plant eaters for not only the bounty but the land space itself . If significant numbers of plant eaters are destroyed then I think it would have major negative consequences on predator populations also. I'm not saying that conditions today are more than ideal for animal populations but a totally vegetarian world might be worse.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope skeptic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    4,843
    That is also an unlikely scenario.
    If people were vegan, enough food can be grown by intensive hydroponics to feed an adult on 100 sq. metres. If we assume the United Nations 'most probable' scenario, the world will peak at 10 billion and then remain close to that level afterwards. To feed 10 billion requires a trillion sq. metres or a million sq kms.

    The world has 14 million sq. kms of arable land (approx.) So we need to use only one fourtheenth of what is available, using the most intense system of agriculture.

    That means heaps of good land left over for forests and wild life. Only of we continue to eat lots of meat and farm extensively, will wildlife be at risk.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    984
    We need to consider human nature before we make these optimistic predictions. Humans will not be willing to all live on a subsitence diet. We will kill each other before we will give up our hamburgers. We will do what we have done in the past. In times of scarsity we practice a division of labor. The poor do the starving and the rich do the eating.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Moderator Moderator
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    city of wine and roses
    Posts
    6,222
    "We will kill each other before we will give up our hamburgers"

    I find this incomprehensible. We grew up with a strongly meat based diet in a community that wasn't in the least surprised if you had meat at every meal. But we ate sensibly. My mother, and all the other women I knew, could make a leg of lamb roasted for Sunday lunch serve four of us for 4 or more meals. One hot roast dinner, one cold meat with salads, one shepherd's pie, one of lamb fritters - and maybe school lunch with lamb in a sandwich. I did much the same with my own family but a different assortment of recipes with the added bonus of using the bone as well to make stock for soups and casseroles. (And before we hear anything about 'lack of time' nowadays, both I and my mother worked - full-time - while doing so.)

    And my daughter in turn managed to turn an impoverished household of grumpy blokes who were always hungry for 'lack of money for food' combined with physically demanding work into contented, well nourished specimens. Their moans about having only enough money for a kilo of mincemeat were silenced by ample meals of tasty food.

    It's not about moving to a 'subsistence' diet. It's about abandoning wasteful food habits.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope zinjanthropos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Driving in my car
    Posts
    4,844
    Quote Originally Posted by Sealeaf View Post
    We will do what we have done in the past. In times of scarcity we practice a division of labor. The poor do the starving and the rich do the eating.
    At first I was concerned about the future of animal species, now I have reason to think about us. It appears that if veggie lovers wish to grow food then they'll need to strike a deal with the landowners. Once that's done I guess the next question is whether people will be able to afford the food.
    All that belongs to human understanding, in this deep ignorance and obscurity, is to be skeptical, or at least cautious; and not to admit of any hypothesis, whatsoever; much less, of any which is supported by no appearance of probability...Hume
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9  
    Moderator Moderator
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    city of wine and roses
    Posts
    6,222
    It appears that if veggie lovers wish to grow food then they'll need to strike a deal with the landowners.
    That's really an issue only if you insist on lots and lots of grain as the basis for your diet, and if you are thinking of vegan rather than vegetarian diets. Legumes, mushrooms and chooks can form the basis for a nutritious diet that also maintains the land. There are many dairy and meat cattle farmers who are now adding chicken raising to their budgets and their land management tools. Vegetarians who include eggs and dairy protein products in a vegetable based rather than grain based diet can live quite healthy lives.

    And there are other 'near' vegetarian diets that include fish or crustaceans. I'm quite taken with the idea of a 'self-fertilising' system that involves fish tanks and hydroponic circulation of the 'enriched' water as fertiliser for vegetables. Much neater and much, much quieter than chooks roaming around digging up your seedlings. Though they're ace as simultaneous pest controllers / fertilser spreaders in nut or fruit orchards after harvest.
    "Courage is what it takes to stand up and speak; courage is also what it takes to sit down and listen." Winston Churchill
    "nature is like a game of Jenga; you never know which brick you pull out will cause the whole stack to collapse" Lucy Cooke
    Reply With Quote  
     

Similar Threads

  1. Heys guyz! have you heard of Researchers Worldwide?
    By shahid.parvez in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: April 24th, 2011, 12:09 PM
  2. Vegetarianism
    By DaBOB in forum Philosophy
    Replies: 105
    Last Post: June 20th, 2007, 11:09 AM
  3. Computer Science jobs Worldwide
    By juice99 in forum Computer Science
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: April 4th, 2007, 11:29 PM
Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •