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  1. #1 An Evolution Question as Well... 
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    I ws going to post this in the thread below me, but i was worried i would be blamed for hijacking someones thread.

    My question is very simple: Have we ever observed evolution, in the sense we have objectively watched a prokaryote or Eukaryote evolve into something either more or less complex? I know we have prokaryote systems, so have we seen one of them transmutate into something more complex?


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    Forum Cosmic Wizard paralith's Avatar
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    I recommend you start with some reading:

    29 Evidences for Macroevolution

    Observed Instances of Speciation

    More Observed Speciation Events

    The simple answer is yes, we have most certainly observed evolution in our lifetimes in many species, but large-scale complex changes take much larger time scales, and require the right environmental conditions. Our planet is currently quite full of eurkyotes - not a lot of niches left for the generation of new eukaryotic-like organisms that won't be quickly filled by existing eukaryotes.


    Man can will nothing unless he has first understood that he must count on no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth.
    ~Jean-Paul Sartre
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  4. #3  
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    Quote Originally Posted by paralith
    I recommend you start with some reading:

    29 Evidences for Macroevolution

    Observed Instances of Speciation

    More Observed Speciation Events

    The simple answer is yes, we have most certainly observed evolution in our lifetimes in many species, but large-scale complex changes take much larger time scales, and require the right environmental conditions. Our planet is currently quite full of eurkyotes - not a lot of niches left for the generation of new eukaryotic-like organisms that won't be quickly filled by existing eukaryotes.
    So, evoluton is no longer a theory, but a proven fact? I will read the links, thanks!!
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  5. #4 Re: An Evolution Question as Well... 
    Forum Cosmic Wizard spuriousmonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames
    I ws going to post this in the thread below me, but i was worried i would be blamed for hijacking someones thread.

    My question is very simple: Have we ever observed evolution, in the sense we have objectively watched a prokaryote or Eukaryote evolve into something either more or less complex? I know we have prokaryote systems, so have we seen one of them transmutate into something more complex?
    change in complexity isn't evolution. It only sometimes is.
    "Kill them all and let God sort them out."

    - Arnaud Amalric

    http://spuriousforums.com/index.php
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    Forum Freshman dickies994's Avatar
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    Ring species of salamanders in California is a perfect example of speciation that is taking place right now.
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  7. #6 Re: An Evolution Question as Well... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by spuriousmonkey
    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames
    I ws going to post this in the thread below me, but i was worried i would be blamed for hijacking someones thread.

    My question is very simple: Have we ever observed evolution, in the sense we have objectively watched a prokaryote or Eukaryote evolve into something either more or less complex? I know we have prokaryote systems, so have we seen one of them transmutate into something more complex?
    change in complexity isn't evolution. It only sometimes is.
    Though, mind you my friend, i did also add something less complex...
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  8. #7 Re: An Evolution Question as Well... 
    Forum Cosmic Wizard paralith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames
    Quote Originally Posted by spuriousmonkey
    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames
    I ws going to post this in the thread below me, but i was worried i would be blamed for hijacking someones thread.

    My question is very simple: Have we ever observed evolution, in the sense we have objectively watched a prokaryote or Eukaryote evolve into something either more or less complex? I know we have prokaryote systems, so have we seen one of them transmutate into something more complex?
    change in complexity isn't evolution. It only sometimes is.
    Though, mind you my friend, i did also add something less complex...
    Even a single-celled modern eukaryote is a good deal more complex at the cellular level than a prokaryote.
    Man can will nothing unless he has first understood that he must count on no one but himself; that he is alone, abandoned on earth in the midst of his infinite responsibilities, without help, with no other aim than the one he sets himself, with no other destiny than the one he forges for himself on this earth.
    ~Jean-Paul Sartre
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  9. #8  
    Time Lord Paleoichneum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames
    Quote Originally Posted by paralith
    I recommend you start with some reading:

    29 Evidences for Macroevolution

    Observed Instances of Speciation

    More Observed Speciation Events

    The simple answer is yes, we have most certainly observed evolution in our lifetimes in many species, but large-scale complex changes take much larger time scales, and require the right environmental conditions. Our planet is currently quite full of eurkyotes - not a lot of niches left for the generation of new eukaryotic-like organisms that won't be quickly filled by existing eukaryotes.
    So, evoluton is no longer a theory, but a proven fact? I will read the links, thanks!!
    Might I add to your reading list:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evoluti...heory_and_fact

    Evolutions has been regarded as both for many many years.
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  10. #9  
    Moderator Moderator TheBiologista's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames

    So, evoluton is no longer a theory, but a proven fact? I will read the links, thanks!!
    A theory is a collection of related facts, connected by a framework of laws. It's been a "proven fact", in as much as that exists in science, for a very very long time.

    The wikilink above explains better.
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  11. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBiologista
    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames

    So, evoluton is no longer a theory, but a proven fact? I will read the links, thanks!!
    A theory is a collection of related facts, connected by a framework of laws. It's been a "proven fact", in as much as that exists in science, for a very very long time.

    The wikilink above explains better.
    Thank you Bio, and everyone previously!
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  12. #11 Re: An Evolution Question as Well... 
    Forum Cosmic Wizard spuriousmonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames
    Quote Originally Posted by spuriousmonkey
    Quote Originally Posted by Manynames
    I ws going to post this in the thread below me, but i was worried i would be blamed for hijacking someones thread.

    My question is very simple: Have we ever observed evolution, in the sense we have objectively watched a prokaryote or Eukaryote evolve into something either more or less complex? I know we have prokaryote systems, so have we seen one of them transmutate into something more complex?
    change in complexity isn't evolution. It only sometimes is.
    Though, mind you my friend, i did also add something less complex...
    You have, but change in complexity doesn't exclude the concept of a trend towards less complexity.

    Mostly the complexity stays the same. Humans now aren't more or less complex than the humans of a thousand years ago.
    "Kill them all and let God sort them out."

    - Arnaud Amalric

    http://spuriousforums.com/index.php
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    There was an article in Scientific American a few years ago about African cichlid fishes. It mentions one population which, over a period of 100 years, observed by successive biologists, became reproductively separated from its parent population. Over that time, both colour pattern and behaviour changed, and now it will not breed with members of the original population, which is a definition of a separate species.
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  14. #13  
    Forum Freshman dickies994's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skeptic
    There was an article in Scientific American a few years ago about African cichlid fishes. It mentions one population which, over a period of 100 years, observed by successive biologists, became reproductively separated from its parent population. Over that time, both colour pattern and behaviour changed, and now it will not breed with members of the original population, which is a definition of a separate species.
    It is true I had to read two of the research journals about it for a class.
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